Lean gains program question for lifting newbie

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Luluetduet8
Luluetduet8 Posts: 49 Member
in Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
Hey all! I hope you’re doing well on this fine Saturday. I need some guidance on my next phase of training. I’m a female, age 29. Recently I did a cut to reach 16% BF. I weigh somewhere around 100-107 pounds (I haven’t checked for a couple of weeks, but will be getting a hydrostatic measurement or w/e it’s called next week) Once I hit that target of 16%, which should be fairly soon, I was going to start on my next phase of glow up by building more muscle. I already have some muscle since I’ve always been active, but I would like more definition than what I’ve seen after this cut.

I’m not in any particular rush. At this point I just work out every day and enjoy a general progression towards something. I’m also vain and I’m always aiming to look hot AF :p I don’t have a goal of how much muscle I want to gain. I just want more definition without having to drop to an unhealthy amount of body fat and I want to look good.

So here’s my question. How the ef do I do that?! Haha do I need to bulk? If so how much of a calories surplus is required at minimum if I’m not in a rush? Could I theoretically add 100 calories above
Maintenance and do a lean bulk? Would a recomp work where I just lift at maintenance? I feel like I don’t need to recomp at 16% lol

Or maybe in order to gain muscle I have to bite the billet and start at 250 cal above maintenance and just deal with the fact that I’ll have to cut more periodically than I would like…

What do y’all think?

Also I was planning on doing Michael Mathews program or Strong curves since I happen to have both of those books…

Replies

  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Since 16% for a female will be fighting some desires by body to be higher anyway, attempting recomp will likely be painfully slow if any, as body is just not going to want to lose more fat to supply general energy needs as it uses your food intake to help build muscle.

    100 cal extra is within margin of error probably, and body will likely just cause you to move a tad more and use it up anyway - so probably not enough for goals. 250 at minimum.

    A good established program like that will be good. Actually, required.
    You'll want the body building program more than strength training - as you can gain strength without adding on much muscle, and it sounds like that's what you want - more.
    Perhaps starting with strength just to tap out the muscle you got quickly, get the moves down if not already, ect.
  • Luluetduet8
    Luluetduet8 Posts: 49 Member
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    heybales wrote: »
    Since 16% for a female will be fighting some desires by body to be higher anyway, attempting recomp will likely be painfully slow if any, as body is just not going to want to lose more fat to supply general energy needs as it uses your food intake to help build muscle.

    100 cal extra is within margin of error probably, and body will likely just cause you to move a tad more and use it up anyway - so probably not enough for goals. 250 at minimum.

    A good established program like that will be good. Actually, required.
    You'll want the body building program more than strength training - as you can gain strength without adding on much muscle, and it sounds like that's what you want - more.
    Perhaps starting with strength just to tap out the muscle you got quickly, get the moves down if not already, ect.

    @heybales question…what’s the difference between body building and strength??? Are you familiar with Michael Matthews to know which one his program focuses on? I had no idea there was a difference.

  • cupcakesandproteinshakes
    cupcakesandproteinshakes Posts: 1,096 Member
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    OP to answer yr question about programmes Mike Matthew’s and strong curves are kinda similar apart from sc has more lower body focus. I’ve done both.it’s just down to personal choice. If u want booty then try sc. Mike’s programme can be run 3 4 or 5 days a week and sc is either 3 or 5 days if I recall.
    Fwiw I think there are better options out there but plenty of folks here have got good results with those programmes as beginners and post-beginners so I’m not knocking them.
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Luluetduet8 wrote: »
    heybales wrote: »
    Since 16% for a female will be fighting some desires by body to be higher anyway, attempting recomp will likely be painfully slow if any, as body is just not going to want to lose more fat to supply general energy needs as it uses your food intake to help build muscle.

    100 cal extra is within margin of error probably, and body will likely just cause you to move a tad more and use it up anyway - so probably not enough for goals. 250 at minimum.

    A good established program like that will be good. Actually, required.
    You'll want the body building program more than strength training - as you can gain strength without adding on much muscle, and it sounds like that's what you want - more.
    Perhaps starting with strength just to tap out the muscle you got quickly, get the moves down if not already, ect.

    @heybales question…what’s the difference between body building and strength??? Are you familiar with Michael Matthews to know which one his program focuses on? I had no idea there was a difference.

    I am not familiar with it - but programs usually use the correct terms.

    Body building is for adding more muscle, strength is for adding strength.

    Obviously there is overlap, body building will add strength since you have more muscle, strength will eventually add more muscle since you are attempting to lift more.

    But hypertrophy for body building has more volume than adding weight to the bar for strength.

    And during a bulk you want to add muscle.

    Think of where the whole cutting & bulking came from - body building, show prep.

    Now look at most of your strength competitions, max weight lifted - body physique isn't usually 1st place in goals.
  • Chieflrg
    Chieflrg Posts: 9,097 Member
    edited July 2021
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    200-250 above maintenance is a reasonable start to discover your weight gain. If you eant to start at 100cal surplus, you could obviously.

    I'm in the camp Strong Curves isn't a choice I would recommend as there are better options out there. M.Mathews I'm not familiar with so undecided. If you responded well to either previously it wouldn't be unreasonable to run either assuming the volume/intensity is appropriate.

    Any well written program will have both strength & hypertrophy dosed. Also using some form of auto regulation with proper load management is ideal IMHO.

  • Luluetduet8
    Luluetduet8 Posts: 49 Member
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    Chieflrg wrote: »
    200-250 above maintenance is a reasonable start to discover your weight gain. If you eant to start at 100cal surplus, you could obviously.

    I'm in the camp Strong Curves isn't a choice I would recommend as there are better options out there. M.Mathews I'm not familiar with so undecided. If you responded well to either previously it wouldn't be unreasonable to run either assuming the volume/intensity is appropriate.

    Any well written program will have both strength & hypertrophy dosed. Also using some form of auto regulation with proper load management is ideal IMHO.

    Can you clarify what you mean by auto regulation with proper load management?
  • jseams1234
    jseams1234 Posts: 1,218 Member
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    Luluetduet8 wrote: »
    Chieflrg wrote: »
    200-250 above maintenance is a reasonable start to discover your weight gain. If you eant to start at 100cal surplus, you could obviously.

    I'm in the camp Strong Curves isn't a choice I would recommend as there are better options out there. M.Mathews I'm not familiar with so undecided. If you responded well to either previously it wouldn't be unreasonable to run either assuming the volume/intensity is appropriate.

    Any well written program will have both strength & hypertrophy dosed. Also using some form of auto regulation with proper load management is ideal IMHO.

    Can you clarify what you mean by auto regulation with proper load management?

    It's been a "buzzword" for a number of years, but here is as good explanation as any by Eric Helms.

    https://www.strongerbyscience.com/autoregulation/
  • Luluetduet8
    Luluetduet8 Posts: 49 Member
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    Fascinating! Thank u!
  • Silkysausage
    Silkysausage Posts: 502 Member
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    Took me 3 years to figure out that eating is where it's at, I did a bit of a dirty bulk this time because I like food...so fat gain was sizeable but only on the stomach.

    I was eating around 300+ cals because chocolate trifle is crack.

    You have to monitor after a good month to see if you're gaining 0.5lbs a week, the recommended lean gain.

    With lifting programmes I followed the same 4 day upper/lower for 2 years with good results but as a newbie with good gains I stuck with a modest cal surplus.

    I write my own lifting regimes now using what suits me best with regards to mind to muscle connection, modifications for personal ROM and enjoyment. I don't flat bench nor do I deadlift because I don't need to or have a desire to.

    Progressive overload, consistency, working the muscle at least twice per week, sleep, protein, good food and rest will reap the rewards. No 'wonder' supplements, dry scooping pre workout or doing fancy lifting techniques needed.
  • Chieflrg
    Chieflrg Posts: 9,097 Member
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    Luluetduet8 wrote: »
    Chieflrg wrote: »
    200-250 above maintenance is a reasonable start to discover your weight gain. If you eant to start at 100cal surplus, you could obviously.

    I'm in the camp Strong Curves isn't a choice I would recommend as there are better options out there. M.Mathews I'm not familiar with so undecided. If you responded well to either previously it wouldn't be unreasonable to run either assuming the volume/intensity is appropriate.

    Any well written program will have both strength & hypertrophy dosed. Also using some form of auto regulation with proper load management is ideal IMHO.

    Can you clarify what you mean by auto regulation with proper load management?

    Helms' article link a very good write up for auto regulation.

    When speaking of load management it's basically accounting for all the useful stress both internal & external from training and even non useful stress from life when we optimize it.

    Using both together is extremely useful for short and long term progress and lowers injury risk.

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