Technical weight loss question

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missfitbrat
missfitbrat Posts: 4 Member
in Health and Weight Loss
I’m trying to gain the best understanding.

I’m 37, currently 150lbs (goal of 135 again) and I workout at least 5 days a week. Recently, I fell off pretty hard and didn’t pay attention to what I ate or drank, thus the weight gain while remaining active at least 3 days a week.)

Doing the basic calculations for BMR, the number I got was 1439. Assuming 3-5 days of moderate activity, put me at 2,222 TDEE. Assuming more intense activity, it’s 2437.

I’ve been weight training 6 days a week, tightened up my food intake, sticking to no fast food, no alcohol, just paying more attention again.

MyFitnessPal recommended 1200 a day. Is this assuming that I’m not active?

Secondly, if BMR is around 1434, will eating less than that put my body into panic mode and it will hold the weight? I know not go under 1200 but I wasn’t sure if 1200 was an okay number if my particular guesstimate for BMR was 200 higher.

Third, I know Apple Watches and the like are not totally accurate, I have an exercise goal of 30 minutes at least (typically go over that. Workout for 45-60 minutes plus) and I have set a “move goal” on my watch to 500 active calories, which I close daily. TDEE is roughly the same considering purposeful activity and just daily living, so about 2200 makes sense. If I want to lose weight, shouldn’t I eat about 1700 a day? Would eating 1200 a day make it so I lose 2 lbs a week or would this put me in a detriment and my body will think I’m starving and try and hang on to everything that I eat?

Ultimately, I wanna know if 1200 is safe and once I reach my goal weight, would I then recalculate based on my goal weight and eat whatever calories to maintain minus a 1 or 200 just in case to maintain? I know 1200 isn’t sustainable long term and I just want to always be aware of where I need to be.

Thank you!

Replies

  • Retroguy2000
    Retroguy2000 Posts: 1,514 Member
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    MFP gives you a calorie estimate based on the entries you give it, including whether your regular daily activity (not workouts) is sedentary or more active, and based on the weight loss you said you want.

    How do you know what your BMR is? That's presumably an estimate from some calculator.

    As mentioned above, this close to your target weight you should be looking to lose 0.5 pounds per week max, which is a deficit of about 500 calories from your TDEE (including workouts).

    I don't think there's an issue with being below your BMR while you have plenty of fat. Don't quote me on that. It's moot anyway since a 500 deficit from your TDEE, factoring in all your workouts too, should have you well above that range.

    You can redo your MFP goals any time to change those settings and weight loss targets.
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 32,166 Member
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    Listen to that nice, smart @Bronty3 up there ^^.

    MFP gave you 1200 because you said you wanted to lose 2 pounds a week. That's not a good idea, healthwise. Much too aggressive.

    MFP will assume you're active if that's what you put in your profile as your activity level . . . so what did you put in your profile? MFP expects you to set your activity level based on your life outside of intentional exercise, then carefully estimate your exercise calories (such as by synching your Apple watch to MFP) and eat those calories back, too.

    Then, you follow that recommendation for 4-6 weeks, and compare your average weekly weight loss to your goal weight loss rate, and adjust your calorie goal if needed to keep your actual weight loss rate sensibly moderate. MFP's estimate is just a starting point. (I assume you're probably not in menopause yet, so if you have menstrual cycles, compare your weight at the same relative point in at least two different monthly cycles to get your average weight loss number. (Hormonal water weight fluctuations will be more distorting otherwise.)

    Implicitly, that answers your question about maintenance: The best method for estimating maintenance calories is to use your own data. If you find your Apple watch's total daily calories to be reasonably accurate for you, you can follow its recommended calories.

    Best wishes for success!

    P.S. That "body holds onto calories if you eat too little" idea is a myth. If you severely under-eat, you can become fatigued and moved less, either in subtle way or a dramatic way or both, so burn fewer calories than you'd expect. Also, the stress from undereating can cause extra water retention that shows up on the scale and deceives you. But your body doesn't store calories as fat when you're starving. Think about it: If it did, the many people around the world who sadly die daily from salvation would be fat when they died. They aren't. They're skin and bones.
  • missfitbrat
    missfitbrat Posts: 4 Member
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    I am so grateful for all your responses! I did notice that the app said “default goal” was 1200. I went from 165 to 133 in about 5.5 months and I am 5’4” so some of my skin seemed a little loose, especially under my chin if I turn my head a certain way (hated it) and even in my stomach area. I worked out 6 days a week and also did intensive cardio. It was my first weight loss journey after my divorce so I went all in. I was happy, but I wasn’t sure what to do afterward and when I got to where I felt comfortable, I thought I had to remain at 1200 and remain overactive otherwise I would gain weight. I didn’t, nor did I lose weight per se but absolutely did notice that I couldn’t get stronger to save my life then I questioned how sustainable that look would be if this is what it takes to keep it.

    I’m trying to have a better, healthier grasp and understanding for sure. The pandemic threw a wrench into a lot of it and while I did pretty well the last couple of years, in this last 6-8 months, I’ve really stopped prepping and planning and drinking a lot more and allowing fast food consumption one at least a twice a week basis. I always say you can’t outwork a bad diet and we all know that’s true. I continued to remain active but not as intensely, didn’t weight train for about a month and instead participated in group workouts that incorporated HIIT style and some light weight but body weight for the most part. Unfortunately, slowly but surely I just got softer and puffier. It clicked one day that I don’t like how I feel and I want to focus on my nutrition and get back to where I was before but to do it correctly this time because I knew there must be an easier way without having to overdo it. It shouldn’t be super hard, it should be easier if I have a grasp.

    Maybe I’ll have to explore the profile more because I don’t remember giving it an activity style. My job is very sedentary (I’m a stenographer) but I am still participating in group training three days a week for 45 minutes, but 6 days a week at 5 am, I am actually weight training all the key body parts to maintain my strength that I built up in the last year (little weaker right now but can feel it returning that I’m back at it.)

    So the main question was answered for sure. I definitely don’t want to lose too fast and have aesthetic consequences or physical/internal ones.

    To answer about the BMR number, I did use various site calculators and then found a formula: 655 + (4.35 x weight in pounds) + (4.7 x height in inches) – (4.7 x age in years)

    Then multiplying that number by a level of activity number… moderately active being 1.55 and that’s how I came to the 2222. I know that’s just an assumed figure, but the 1400 number did come up in several of the calculators and while I’m very active, I’m saying it’s moderate just in case there are some days that the workout isn’t so great, etc. just to be fair to myself… I definitely think I’m a lot more active than the average person, though.

    All very helpful information. Not in menopause. I’m still trying to figure out what the right balance of food is to hit my macro numbers just right so I can stick to that schedule daily… then I understand there’s a certain time that hen to eat certain things that I gotta figure out next!

    I just didn’t understand the calculator on this and if I truly needed to be in that much of a deficit or if that wouldn’t help. Super appreciate all the guidance, really!

    Thank you all so much.
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 32,166 Member
    edited December 2022
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    missfitbrat wrote: »
    I am so grateful for all your responses! I did notice that the app said “default goal” was 1200. I went from 165 to 133 in about 5.5 months and I am 5’4” so some of my skin seemed a little loose, especially under my chin if I turn my head a certain way (hated it) and even in my stomach area. I worked out 6 days a week and also did intensive cardio. It was my first weight loss journey after my divorce so I went all in. I was happy, but I wasn’t sure what to do afterward and when I got to where I felt comfortable, I thought I had to remain at 1200 and remain overactive otherwise I would gain weight. I didn’t, nor did I lose weight per se but absolutely did notice that I couldn’t get stronger to save my life then I questioned how sustainable that look would be if this is what it takes to keep it.

    I’m trying to have a better, healthier grasp and understanding for sure. The pandemic threw a wrench into a lot of it and while I did pretty well the last couple of years, in this last 6-8 months, I’ve really stopped prepping and planning and drinking a lot more and allowing fast food consumption one at least a twice a week basis. I always say you can’t outwork a bad diet and we all know that’s true. I continued to remain active but not as intensely, didn’t weight train for about a month and instead participated in group workouts that incorporated HIIT style and some light weight but body weight for the most part. Unfortunately, slowly but surely I just got softer and puffier. It clicked one day that I don’t like how I feel and I want to focus on my nutrition and get back to where I was before but to do it correctly this time because I knew there must be an easier way without having to overdo it. It shouldn’t be super hard, it should be easier if I have a grasp.

    Maybe I’ll have to explore the profile more because I don’t remember giving it an activity style. My job is very sedentary (I’m a stenographer) but I am still participating in group training three days a week for 45 minutes, but 6 days a week at 5 am, I am actually weight training all the key body parts to maintain my strength that I built up in the last year (little weaker right now but can feel it returning that I’m back at it.)

    So the main question was answered for sure. I definitely don’t want to lose too fast and have aesthetic consequences or physical/internal ones.

    To answer about the BMR number, I did use various site calculators and then found a formula: 655 + (4.35 x weight in pounds) + (4.7 x height in inches) – (4.7 x age in years)

    Then multiplying that number by a level of activity number… moderately active being 1.55 and that’s how I came to the 2222. I know that’s just an assumed figure, but the 1400 number did come up in several of the calculators and while I’m very active, I’m saying it’s moderate just in case there are some days that the workout isn’t so great, etc. just to be fair to myself… I definitely think I’m a lot more active than the average person, though.

    Don't stress about it. Run the N=1 experiment based on that estimated starting point for at least one menstrual cycle, then check results and adjust if you need to. The calculators give pretty close estimates for most people, but a few people will fall a bit higher or lower enough to notice, and a very rare few people will be quite surprisingly different from the estimate.

    That's the nature of statistical estimates, and that's all the calculators give you. (That's all a fitness tracker like your Apple watch gives you, too: A statistical estimate. It's just a little more personalized because it has more data, but it's still an estimate, because one can't measure calorie burn - yet, anyway - outside of a metabolic lab.
    All very helpful information. Not in menopause. I’m still trying to figure out what the right balance of food is to hit my macro numbers just right so I can stick to that schedule daily… then I understand there’s a certain time that hen to eat certain things that I gotta figure out next!

    You don't need to be exact on macros. Close is fine, especially if a little high one day, a little low another day, so that you're averaging out around your goals over a day or few. It needn't be obsessively exact.

    Treat protein goal as a minimum, fats as a minimum, eat plenty of varied, colorful veggies & fruits, come close to your calorie goal, and you'll be OK.

    You can tweak the default macro percents if you want to, as you learn more about nutrition, or based on how you feel. (Satiation and energy level primarily.)

    Since you're lifting and wanting to gain muscle, protein is especially important (though other nutrition isn't irrelevant of course). As a rough rule of thumb, 0.6-0.8g protein per pound of goal weight is a reasonable minimum for most people (it's roughly equivalent to 0.8 to 1g per pound of lean mass, for quite a range of people). If your goal weight is 135, that'd be 81-108g daily.

    If you want something more structured than a rule of thumb, there's this evidence based calculator and guide that explains it:

    https://examine.com/protein-intake-calculator/
    https://examine.com/guides/protein-intake/

    For most people, that calculator's recommendations will overlap or at least be close to the rule of thumb, IME.

    That food/macro timing thing: Mostly, no. For the typical person, even one with athletic goals, compliance and practicality - what one can happily stick with to get good overall nutrition on average over a day or few - is far more important than any tiny theoretical advantage from any kind of tricky timing.

    Just my opinion, but I'd suggest not letting things like this become an obsession. Mental health is important, too, as is a balanced life - enough time, energy and attention for all the things important to us, which usually extends well beyond diet and exercise.
    I just didn’t understand the calculator on this and if I truly needed to be in that much of a deficit or if that wouldn’t help. Super appreciate all the guidance, really!

    Thank you all so much.

    You've got this!
  • missfitbrat
    missfitbrat Posts: 4 Member
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    @AnnPT77

    Thank you so much. As you can tell, I’ve got a little obsessive/addictive personality 😂 I do appreciate my perfectionist side to a degree. It can make me neurotic but I’m working on it. When I start to do something, I think about it from all angles and I want to know how it works (I’ve always warned employers that I will ask them random questions about things that connect to my job but not necessarily what I need to worry about or do because I like to know how it all connects) it helps me.

    I’m happy to know that close is okay and doesn’t need to be exact. I have set up my C/F/P ratio to 40/25/35. My macros I’ve figured out the last two days hit it like 40/27/34 so I’m right on target for sure. That’s about 1610 calories per day and I’ll start there and see how I do.

    I definitely agree about mental health and just having a life. One of the biggest reasons I refused to commit to gym life, etc, was my ex husband was a bodybuilder. He would spend 5 hours a day at the gym like it was his actual job and eat dry food — chicken, salad, etc. I felt like having a decent looking body would mean no fun and it turned me off to the idea because that looked like torture. I respect those who can get on stage but I know I don’t want to and never will. Once I achieved my weight loss four years ago, I definitely allows myself to a cheat Sunday each week and that was great for me. I was in the best shape of my life and having the time of my life.

    I’m super stoked to do it again and have more fun with it than I did before. Thank you for the links and I absolutely am going to research a little more and following the weight loss check around menstrual time too.

    Again, thank you so much for your patience with me and explaining so clearly!
  • Jthanmyfitnesspal
    Jthanmyfitnesspal Posts: 3,521 Member
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    @AnnPT77 always has great info.

    @missfitbrat : I just add that you can play with the formulas at a number of websites, including MFP. One page that shows the formulas is:

    https://www.calculator.net/calorie-calculator.html

    I suggest ignoring all advice on that page and just use it to do the calculation. MFP will give pretty near the advice of the Mifflin-St Jeor version.

    Note that your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE, the calories you burn in a day) is estimated from your Basal Metabolic Rate (BMR, the calories you would burn if you were in a coma lying in bed) by multiplying by an "activity factor" that varies from 1.2 (20% increase over BMR) to up to 2.0 (100% increase over BMR). The activity factor is supplied by you, so you can get almost any number you want! Although this seems kind of loosy-goosy, if you put in reasonable estimates, the numbers are pretty reasonable.

    Your deficit is calculated as (-500kcals per day) per (pound per week) you want to lose. I suggest keeping the deficit below 25% of TDEE. Thus, since your TDEE is 2200, keep your deficit below 550kcals. @Retroguy2000 suggests choosing -250 kcals per day, which is quite sustainable and is fine advice, particularly if you are going to be focusing also on fitness, which is hard if your deficit is very large.

    Best of luck!
  • missfitbrat
    missfitbrat Posts: 4 Member
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    @Jthanmyfitnesspal thank you for the advice and resource too! This is all very helpful. Should I just ignore the exercise calories MFP wants to give me to eat back? I have my intake now up to 1610 per day… and after working out today, it’s telling me I have “800 calories left,” I don’t wanna eat anymore since I feel pretty good and I’m ready for bed but I don’t wanna dip too hard either. If I stick to 1610 with my activity, I am hoping I should be okay.
  • 2016goalreached
    2016goalreached Posts: 43 Member
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    @missfitbrat, I have similar stats - 5'4", 149 lbs, 41 years old. Would love to get down to 135 or below by April 12 when I'm having a tummy tuck and breast lift surgery! You are way more active than I am. You are motivating me to get active! Let me know if an accountability buddy is of interest to you!
  • Jthanmyfitnesspal
    Jthanmyfitnesspal Posts: 3,521 Member
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    @missfitbrat : Sorry for the late reply. If 1610kcals per day is MFPs advice for "sedentary" and "losing 1lb per week," AND you are reasonably careful about logging AND you use fairly conservative estimates for exercise calories, then you can eat back some, most, or all of your exercise calories. Or, you can leave a few on the table for days where you want to eat a little more. (E.g., a holiday party.)

    Of course, the final answer is your weight trend. I suggest weighing every day in the morning after the toilet. Average over many days (5 to 10, I do it by eye) and watch the trend, ignore the bumps (which can be hard). That will tell you more than any other formula!

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