Potentialy ignorant but sincere question!?lol!
Tracyrocksss
Posts: 45
I have often read about questions regarding people who have stopped losing weight/reaching a plateau/etc. wondering if they are "eating too little" and I have even heard experts say that, yes, they sometimes need to up their calories for a bit to jumpstart weight loss again............................
I just need to know-- if this DOES happen at some point, to me, can I not just continue to be stubborn/vigilant and continue eating fewer calories with the thought that EVENTUALLY and inevitably, the weight WILL continue to come off!!???? I mean, if not, how do people starve to death!??? Their bodies don't hold on to fat because they aren't taking in enough calories! I guess I understand that maybe people need to up calories a bit to "rev up metabolism" etc.--- but.......I dunno...with me, it seems I will be most successful ( thinking longggggg term..I have a LOT to lose) if , once I become accustomed to following my strict calore guidelines and trust myself not to overeat, to just CONTINUE taking in lower calorie totals, and just being patient that my body had no CHOICE but to eventually start to resume the weight loss again at some point.....Does this make sense to anyone!??? I guess I am comparing it to to an alcoholic who feels like they aren't progressing mentally as well as they could, and who take advice that they need to "have a couple of beers" to rev up their resolve...I mean- I TOTALLY understand that is NOT the same thing at all-( although they are both addictions)----I am just saing that I might have a difficult time trusting myself to "fall off the wagon" in being steadfast with my routine lower calorie allotment and feel like it would just somehow sabotage my effortst at being disciplined and make it more difficult to continue with my "tenacity" to take in the lower calories that I so painstakingly adjusted myself to in order to lose weight! Guidance!!????lol...
I just need to know-- if this DOES happen at some point, to me, can I not just continue to be stubborn/vigilant and continue eating fewer calories with the thought that EVENTUALLY and inevitably, the weight WILL continue to come off!!???? I mean, if not, how do people starve to death!??? Their bodies don't hold on to fat because they aren't taking in enough calories! I guess I understand that maybe people need to up calories a bit to "rev up metabolism" etc.--- but.......I dunno...with me, it seems I will be most successful ( thinking longggggg term..I have a LOT to lose) if , once I become accustomed to following my strict calore guidelines and trust myself not to overeat, to just CONTINUE taking in lower calorie totals, and just being patient that my body had no CHOICE but to eventually start to resume the weight loss again at some point.....Does this make sense to anyone!??? I guess I am comparing it to to an alcoholic who feels like they aren't progressing mentally as well as they could, and who take advice that they need to "have a couple of beers" to rev up their resolve...I mean- I TOTALLY understand that is NOT the same thing at all-( although they are both addictions)----I am just saing that I might have a difficult time trusting myself to "fall off the wagon" in being steadfast with my routine lower calorie allotment and feel like it would just somehow sabotage my effortst at being disciplined and make it more difficult to continue with my "tenacity" to take in the lower calories that I so painstakingly adjusted myself to in order to lose weight! Guidance!!????lol...
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I have been right there with you and had the exact same thought process. Upon further research and advice, I realized my protein levels were too low. So I kept the same calorie intake but way upped my protein. Totally helped!! I started losing again and still am. I love how MyFitnessPal gives you the pie graph to show you your %. Keep an eye on that and good luck!0
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Its basically to do with your metabolism, basically eating to few calories will cause it to stall or slow right right down, by giving your body a short sharp increase it basically kick starts the system again into running properly.
Hope that helped0 -
Eat too little and weight loss will slow down to a point, not stop. I'm sure you can beat yourself into submission like you describe its probably not a good idea though. Best to work with the body and not against it.0
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Haaa-- Care-thanks--I am glad I am not the ONLY one who has thought about this! It really IS a legitimate question, ya know!?? Seems a lot of people have peeked in on the question and might be scratching their head ( about my question if they have NVER thought about it, or about the answer!!lol) I am glad I am not alone in my confusion...haaaaa0
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Your metabolic rate is determined by the exercise you're doing. If you are exercising, you will lose weight if you stick to your meal plan. Some days you will not meet your caloric goal. Some days you will not exercise. (Might be several days in a row...hormones can do that to me, at least!) It's a matter of consistency, and getting back to what you should do as soon as you can talk yourself into it.
Yes, too little calories will slow down your metabolism. Up it again with exercise. Bottom line? Weight loss = more calories out than in.
If you don't exercise and instead choose to just eat less, your body's goal will be to survive, not lose weight. In that case, your body holds on to the fat stores because that's "quick energy" which might be needed later to move you around just enough to survive to get to the next meal. It might make the scale drop temporarily, but it won't work, long term. Eat right, and move it.0 -
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Hey, Chariless-(((ha--thanksss))))) I guess I don't see it as "beating myself into submission ( haaaaaaaa- although it FEELS like that is exactly what I needed to do to get to the low point that brought me here...thank GOD for self admonishment in my opinion or I would be downing a box of Ding DIngs as we speak)
but I think it is just, as I said, I simply may not TRUST myself to stray from a calorie regimen that I have managed to control.....I KNOW it is all about fear of being out of control......which is a whole OTHER issue with weight loss/weight gain, huh??? I am not afraid to be honest and say that it is going to take a good long while to "trust myself" again....So difficult.....0 -
Less important to lose weight drastically, more important to be kind to your body. Sure, you could heavy restrictively but quite honestly...if your intention is to do that to lose weight and then continue to do that once your body has asked you not to, you have a few more issues to deal with than just dropping a few LBS. Ask yourself why you want to lose weight so quickly and why you care so little about your body. Working WITH your body will always result in the most successful weight loss with the most long-term results. Good luck and stay safe!0
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Your degestive system has it's own 'brain' that allows it to make decisions and find the most efficient way to digest foods without involving you in the decision. They actually call it a 'second brain' (look it up, seriously it's crazy). If you eat the exact same food all the time, your digestive system will find the most efficient way to get all the nutrients out of it. You can trick it by changing things up every now and then. Nobody digests anything at the exact same rate. Even you will digest the same things at a different rate over time.0
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The plateau will come and that is when " change " will be needed. Do NOT " fall off the wagon " ... you will need to change your food intake by category not so much calories. The idea is to burn more than you intake. Regardless of your current weight at that time ... you will need to look at your regimen and tweak it ... maybe by just adding more protein as suggested above, or it may be something completely different to jumpstart your metabolism. I have hit several plateaus and made adjustments to my foods I eat as well as my exercise routine. Just remember ... this isn't a diet, it's a lifestyle. Do what makes you happy and only eat what tastes good to you ! There are sooooo many healtyh foods that are great tasting and soooooo beneficial to your body. We often struggle with right and wrong and make the mistake of comparing ourselves to others. You will find your way ... YOUR way and what works for you.
PS ~ No question is ignorant ... information is the most valuable tool in our journey ! Good Luck and keep up the good work !0 -
Very, very interested to see the replies to this! Painfully slow weightloss here, but sticking to the basic, balanced 1200 cals...0
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just keep eating the amount you are, try aiming for 40%carbs 40%protein and 20% fat intake, and if you have the time available during the day, try eating 5-6 mini meals rather than the regular 3 meals a day with maybe snacks (i'm just guessing that's your regular routine as it is most peoples'..lol). just make sure your net calories is too low, i can't stress that enough! good luck:)0
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"Living With Obesity At 700 Calories Per Day!
By: David Greenwalt
I want you to consider a common female client. She's a woman about 5'5" and 185 pounds. A combination of a mostly sedentary lifestyle, quick-fix, processed foods and consistent excessively low calories has resulted in an incredibly stubborn fat loss scenario. Not only has it created a stubborn fat loss scenario but her ability to add body fat is remarkably strong.
Most would believe there is simply no possible way she could be 185 pounds eating mostly low calories. While it's true the average obese American created their own obesity by being a huge over consumer, a sedentary glutton if you will, many are able to maintain their level of obesity with the following formula in very precise ratios: starvation + binges + sedentary lifestyle.
An initial review of this woman's calories indicates she is just above starvation level in the 400-700 per day range. The food choices are mostly protein in this case (low-carb is all the rage you know) and there are virtually no vegetables or fruits to speak of.
Five or six days per week the calories remain low in this range, however, there are nighttime binges from time to time and weekend binges where carbs loaded with fat (doughnuts, rolls, cookies, pizza etc.) are consumed.
So while the calories are very low the majority of the time, there are one to two days per week where this isn't always the case. Even so, the nighttime binges and weekend slack offs don't amount to what you might presume would be thousands of extra calories, thus explaining the 185-pound body weight.
Very few foods are prepared from home. There are lots of fast foods being consumed. Convenience and taste rule.
I must say. Early on in my coaching and teaching career this woman was a real head scratcher for me. Isn't it calories in and calories out? Even if she's not active she's starving!
How in the heck does she stay at 185 eating an average, including all binges, of maybe 750 calories per day? She's frustrated beyond belief. She sees her friends and coworkers eating more and weighing less. Is she simply unlucky? Is everyone else blessed? And what in the world is she supposed to do to fix this, if it can be fixed?
Why Is She Not Losing Weight?
First, let me tell you why she's not losing weight. Then I'll tell you what she has to do to fix the situation. With a chronic (months and months) intake of less than 1000 calories per day and a 185-pound body weight her metabolism is suffering greatly. It's running cool, not hot. It's basically running at a snail's pace.
Think of it this way. Her metabolism has matched itself to her intake. She could, indeed, lose body fat but she's in that gray area where she is eating too few calories but not quite at the concentration-camp level yet.
If she were to consume 100-300 calories per day her body would have virtually no choice but to begin liberating stored body fat. This is NOT the solution. It's unhealthy and, in fact, quite stupid.
Today's society is about speed. We no longer have to wait for the oven to warm our food because we have microwaves ready to do the work in less time. The same is not true when it comes to fat loss.
Not only has her metabolism matched her intake, her body has maximized production of enzymes that are designed to help store any additional calories as fat. Anytime additional, immediately-unnecessary calories are consumed the enzymes are there and waiting to store the additional calories as fat. Her body is starved nutritionally and it has one thing on its mind - survival.
Being mostly sedentary, her metabolism (hormones play a large role here) can do a pretty good job of keeping things slow enough so that the pathetically low calories she's consuming are just enough to maintain.
But since certain enzymes are elevated, waiting for more calories so more bodyfat can be stored, every nighttime binge or weekend mini-feast will contribute to fat stores.
So on the days she's not bingeing her body does not lose fat, or if it does, it's very little. And on the few days or times she does binge a bit her body is quite efficient at storing fat. So, while she may lose a smidge of fat from starving it is quickly replaced with every binge.
Remember, these binges aren't a gluttonous 4000-calorie feast. Oh no, a binge might be 4-5 cookies worth about 500-700 calories. Nevertheless, since the binge foods are mostly carbs and fat it's very easy for the enzymes to shuttle the dietary fat into stored body fat. It's what they were designed to do.
So, What's The Solution?
Well then, now that we presumably know some valid reasons why she's not seeing a scale change and definitely no body fat change how do we fix her? We have to do something she's going to freak out over.
We have to get her eating more. Not only do we have to get her eating more but more of the right, whole foods need to be eaten. Foods lower in fat that aren't as easily STORED as body fat have to be consumed. And we have to warn her.
A Discouraging Start
We have to warn her that since she's been sedentarily living on protein with binges of carbs and fats she is likely to see a weight gain right away. It's true.
Once we begin really feeding her body with nutritious carbohydrates so she can become more active, her glycogen-depleted body will hang on to some of those carbohydrates (in skeletal muscle and liver) so she has stored energy for activity.
When her body hangs on to those carbohydrates it has no choice but to hang on to more water too. For every gram of glycogen (stored carbs) she stores she'll hang on to three grams of water.
This is not a negative response by the body but it will be interpreted by her as quite negative when she steps on the scale.
It's quite likely she'll see a five to seven pound weight gain when she really starts eating properly again. This weight gain will remain for one to three weeks before it starts moving in the other direction.
For argument's sake let's assume my Calorie Calculator and Goal Setter at Club Lifestyle suggests a 1500-calorie per day average in week one for a one-pound loss per week. First, she is going to freak out about this many calories.
For months she's been eating less than 1000 and usually around 400-700 in one to three feedings total per day. To her 1500 calories is a ton of food. And if she even begins to eat less fast and packaged-foods it will be a ton of food.
There is no doubt whatsoever that she will resist the increase. This resistance may take one to three weeks to overcome. During this period no weight loss will occur. She is too fat already in her mind and believes it will only hurt her to increase her food intake.
I mean, after all, isn't that how she got fat to begin with? In her early stages of fat gain this was probably true. She overconsumed. But as I've said already, that's not why she's staying heavy.
In addition to a freaked-out mindset about adding more food to her already overfat body she will simply find that it's all but impossible to eat four or more times per day.
She's just not hungry at first. Makes sense when you think about it. Why would she be hungry three hours after eating a 300-calorie, balanced breakfast? Her body is used to 400-700 calories per day!
So, even though she gets a plan and begins using my nutrition analyzer to log foods and meals she finds after having a balanced breakfast of 250 calories she couldn't force herself to eat meal number two on time.
It'll take several more days of realizing what is going on and being one-hundred percent honest and diligent with her logging and planning before she begins to eat her meals as planned no matter what - even if she's not hungry.
By now two to four weeks have passed and the only thing she's seen on the scale is it going up--not very encouraging if I say so myself.
Raising The Grade
After the first two to four weeks have passed she's probably beginning to consume her meals as planned although not quite like an "A" student yet. That is coming. She feels better because she's working out and is more active.
And she feels like she has more energy throughout the day because she's feeding her body more calories and the right kinds of calories.
She has finally begun eating the right kinds of fast foods (low in fat, moderate in protein) and less packaged food overall. She is making more meals from home and taking them to work for lunch rather than always grabbing something quick from a vending machine or the break room that always has some treat another employee brought in.
After another two weeks or so she's moved from a "B" grade to more consistent "A"s. She's planning her days one day ahead in the Nutrition Analyzer; she's consuming fresh veggies and fruits on a daily basis.
Her calories are almost ALWAYS in line with what is recommended by my Lean Account and she has seen her first signs of the scale moving in the right direction.
She is now dropping from 190 pounds (her high after reintroducing food and carbohydrates again) to 189.3! "Progress at last!" she says. In actuality, the entire process was progress. But that's not how she saw it in the beginning.
With a total of two to four weeks of increased caloric intake behind her and eating more consistently the right kinds of foods her metabolism has truly begun to rebound.
She didn't kill it as she thought. She only wounded it. And since our metabolisms are like kids (they are quite resilient) and she doesn't have thyroid issues or diabetes or any known wrench that could be thrown into the spokes of fat loss, she will begin, for the first time in months or years, to see results that make sense and that one would expect of someone who is active (30-60 minutes five or more days per week) and consuming a caloric intake of 1300-1500 calories per day.
Butterfly Effect: The Basics Of The Thyroid - Part 1.
Avoiding Sabotage
This process is in no way easy. I think you can see a plethora of ways it could be screwed up, sabotaged, given up on too early and so forth.
A key to success for this very common woman (men too) is not giving up too soon, having faith in the fix, and moving sooner rather than later to the increased, quality food intake.
It's going to take effort to overcome the mental hurdles of eating more food as well as the increase in scale weight that is going to occur in weeks one to three or so. It's disheartening, however, to charge hard down the weight-loss field only to get to the one-yard line and decide it's time to quit.
Don't Let Your Metabolism Fall.
Many don't realize they only had one more yard to go and they'd have had a touchdown. You gotta hang in there with this plan. It's going to take some time for the glycogen levels to be replenished and level out. It's going to take some time for mental adjustments to occur.
It's going to take some time before hunger signals are restored to anything close to normal. It's going to take time for the metabolism to rebound and not be in its protective mode.
Giving A Stubborn Body The Message
In certain, very stubborn cases, it may be necessary to eat at a eucaloric (maintenance) or hypercaloric (over maintenance) level for a few weeks to ensure the metabolism does get the signal that everything is alright and you aren't going to kill the body.
Remember, your body could care less about your desire for fat loss. It just wants to survive.
Some Take-Home Points
The most common cause of obesity is Americans are sedentary overeaters/drinkers. Nothing in this article should be construed as to say that under eating is the root cause of obesity. It's not.
It IS common for many men and women to be under eating with sporadic binges as I described here. This creates a perfect environment for continued obesity even if total caloric intake is quite low on average.
Low-carb followers or "starvers" WILL see the scale go up when calories are consumed at reasonable levels again and carbohydrates are reintroduced. Live with it. Deal with it. It's going to happen. 98% of the gain will be water.
The time it takes for mental acceptance and other adjustments to occur will vary but one should expect a two to four week window for these things to take place. Being forewarned with an article like this may speed this process up some.
Once the right types of foods are consumed and the right caloric intake is consumed and the right ratios of carbohydrates, proteins and fats are consumed on a consistent basis, then, and only then, will metabolism begin to be restored and the key to fat loss be inserted into the lock with a noticeable drop in the scale resulting.
This may take an additional two to four weeks to occur. Your metabolism is never dead or broken for good. But it may take several weeks of proper eating and activity for it to be restored.
From day one, until the first, noticeable drop in the scale occurs may be four to six weeks--maybe one to two weeks longer. Those who give up on the one-yard line will never see the scale drop as will occur when intelligent persistence and consistency over time are adhered to.
David Greenwalt"0 -
Haaa-- Care-thanks--I am glad I am not the ONLY one who has thought about this! It really IS a legitimate question, ya know!?? Seems a lot of people have peeked in on the question and might be scratching their head ( about my question if they have NVER thought about it, or about the answer!!lol) I am glad I am not alone in my confusion...haaaaa
Hehe I have thought about it plenty! Lots of well meaning people comment when I complete my daily food diary. "You're going to put your body in starvation mode" "just work out more!"
Kind of hard for me since I have ms and just riding a stationary bike for 50 minutes a day is exhausting in itself.I usually come within 100-200 calories of my goal. I just choose not to eat back my calories for working out, why scold me like a child? Right now I am doing a challenge and have to keep my food diary open. This is the last week. As soon as it's over I'm locking it. lol0 -
sra---- that all makes total sense......:) SO much to think about!! I guess I have always just relied on my "stubborness" to lose weight ( think anorexia in my early college days.....:( ) and I have never attempted to do it "the right way".....................The ONLY time I have ever lost weight in my life was when I was walking about 5 miles a day and eating precious little. I looked FANTASTIC but...uhhh--- I was quite ill/dizzy/unhappy......I need to remember all of that as I try my damnedest to do this THE RIGHT WAY........
I think the shame/ self-defeatedness that coems with arriving at a weight like this makes "drastic measures" to stay disciplined seem like a good idea......like maybe for a week....or two weeks.....But I KNOW that is not the answer.....and of course, not an idea to even toy with.....Realistic news is that there is only ONE way to do it--just as you said---eat reasonably, and move more.......
I won't hesitate to say that I AM the total mess when it comes to getting this underweigh ( misspelling intended...:) but God helo me, I am here and I am not gong to mask ANY feelings/questions I am having, and I thank GOd I have found somewhere where I can be myself and people understand......(((((((Thank you)))))))xoxoxoxoxo0 -
Great advice. I will keep it in mind myself. Thank you for sharing this. :flowerforyou:0
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I completely agree with you awkwwward. Treating your body in a way that puts it in survival mode is not a wise thing to do for long term weight loss and HEALTH.0
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I have often read about questions regarding people who have stopped losing weight/reaching a plateau/etc. wondering if they are "eating too little" and I have even heard experts say that, yes, they sometimes need to up their calories for a bit to jumpstart weight loss again............................
I just need to know-- if this DOES happen at some point, to me, can I not just continue to be stubborn/vigilant and continue eating fewer calories with the thought that EVENTUALLY and inevitably, the weight WILL continue to come off!!???? I mean, if not, how do people starve to death!??? Their bodies don't hold on to fat because they aren't taking in enough calories! I guess I understand that maybe people need to up calories a bit to "rev up metabolism" etc.--- but.......I dunno...with me, it seems I will be most successful ( thinking longggggg term..I have a LOT to lose) if , once I become accustomed to following my strict calore guidelines and trust myself not to overeat, to just CONTINUE taking in lower calorie totals, and just being patient that my body had no CHOICE but to eventually start to resume the weight loss again at some point.....Does this make sense to anyone!??? I guess I am comparing it to to an alcoholic who feels like they aren't progressing mentally as well as they could, and who take advice that they need to "have a couple of beers" to rev up their resolve...I mean- I TOTALLY understand that is NOT the same thing at all-( although they are both addictions)----I am just saing that I might have a difficult time trusting myself to "fall off the wagon" in being steadfast with my routine lower calorie allotment and feel like it would just somehow sabotage my effortst at being disciplined and make it more difficult to continue with my "tenacity" to take in the lower calories that I so painstakingly adjusted myself to in order to lose weight! Guidance!!????lol...
I understand. I know I'm not going to be very popular with this statement, but the concept of "starvation mode" is too much of a simplification of what really occurs biochemically to be thoroughly validated. Some aspects are correct, namely, decreasing one's lean mass by eating too few calories will also reduce one's basal metabolism; however, in a normal metabolism the body decreases fat stores when overall calories are decreased. The concept of eating more calories to drop more weight has some clout, but it's not quite that simple. As a general rule, the more one eats, the higher one's metabolism is. Heavier people typically burn more calories than lighter people.
Also, you do not have to "keep your metabolism running" by eating several times a day. The body is constantly using energy and it is always a mixture of lipids and glucose and amino acids. The body responds to reduced energy intake by SPARING protein.
Get online and search Google books for some medical biochemistry texts and try to get the chapters on ketosis, fatty acid oxidation, glycolysis and krebs cycles (it's free but you might have to sort through some pages). It is technical but it is a step in the right direction for understanding what really takes place biochemically in the face of energy reduction.0 -
David----THANKSSSSSS for posting your article! And SOSOSOSOSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSs much of it makes sense! I will certainly take note of what I read and keep that in mind as I find my way...Makes SO much sense--Thank you
I have to say that the term "sedentary glutton" sort of made me cringe...I may very well HAVE been as you labeled people like myself, but I guess I still don't have to welcome such labels and may even feel comfortable with saying I find it offensive....I am sure you didn't mean it to be ( or maybe you did!!??) but, I myself have always liked to choose "kindness" over rightness. I would prefer being labeled as a "great human being who needs to make better choices" Anyone with me!????:)
And Hope! I don't even know HOW to "close" my food diary! How do you do that!??? I would prefer keeping it cloed, especially till I am "humming" on here, you know!??:)0 -
Thanks, Muffett! ((hugs)))0
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A very clever friend of mine once told me that if I did plateau, simply to up my exercise a little and be patient, and there was no need to start eating more! The extra exercise will jump start things.
Remember this is a marathon not a sprint. I was frustrated at first that I was exercising and eating right and losing only 1lb a week but now for me that is awesome. In less than a year I'll be my goal weight!
Do whatever feels right for your body and you, there are many "experts" who will tell you what to do, but all our bodies work in different ways and what works for some doesn't always work for others.0 -
kapeluza - Thanks for posting that article. I was one of those people who was holding onto my weight by that process, though completely unknowingly because I wasn't counting calories and was eating foods that were not calorie dense. Once I started counting calories and realized how little I was consuming, I upped my intake. I don't like the way people throw around the advice to "listen to your body" all the time. For a heck of a lot of us, if we were listening to our bodies in the first place, we wouldn't be where we are, and now they're so damaged that they tell us the wrong thing. Sure, my body was telling me it wasn't hungry when I was eating 800 calories a day, doesn't mean it was getting what it needed to be healthy.0
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Thanks, Miss Sassy! Continued success to you!! And YESSSSSSSSSSSSS-exactly-- I am trying to see this as a LONG HAUL...a LIFESTYLE--and nto a sprint....and I think for me to be int he right mindset myself, if I DO ever reach a plateau, I may need to try several diff thigns to see what works best for me...:)xoxoxo0
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kapeluza - Thanks for posting that article. I was one of those people who was holding onto my weight by that process, though completely unknowingly because I wasn't counting calories and was eating foods that were not calorie dense. Once I started counting calories and realized how little I was consuming, I upped my intake. I don't like the way people throw around the advice to "listen to your body" all the time. For a heck of a lot of us, if we were listening to our bodies in the first place, we wouldn't be where we are, and now they're so damaged that they tell us the wrong thing. Sure, my body was telling me it wasn't hungry when I was eating 800 calories a day, doesn't mean it was getting what it needed to be healthy.
If all of us HAD actually listened to our bodies, we would not be in this situation....we would have stopped eating when our bodies told us we were full!!!!0
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