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weight lifting exercises are more important to losing weight than diet

atlas_star
atlas_star Posts: 2 Member
edited July 2 in Debate Club
Strength training with less cardio (~30min) is a bigger influence on maintaining muscle in a calorie deficit than macros.

You can have super high protein, excellent macros in a deficit and still lose muscle. The effect of diet in preserving muscle is miniscule in comparison to the lifting weight components.

If you lift weights, you'll preserve muscle even if your diet isn't perfect.

Lots of cardio and a deficit isn't the way to go. Lifting weights is non-negotiable. Losing muscle should be avoided at all costs as it affects and impedes all aspects of weight loss.

source: says me

Replies

  • sollyn23l2
    sollyn23l2 Posts: 1,755 Member
    atlas_star wrote: »
    Strength training with less cardio (~30min) is a bigger influence on maintaining muscle in a calorie deficit than macros.

    You can have super high protein, excellent macros in a deficit and still lose muscle. The effect of diet in preserving muscle is miniscule in comparison to the lifting weight components.

    If you lift weights, you'll preserve muscle even if your diet isn't perfect.

    Lots of cardio and a deficit isn't the way to go. Lifting weights is non-negotiable. Losing muscle should be avoided at all costs as it affects and impedes all aspects of weight loss.

    source: says me

    I mostly agree when it comes to preserving muscle. But I'd say they're equally important, as they work in tandem. If you lift weights, but eat in too steep of a calorie deficit with not enough protein, you're likely going to lose a fair amount of muscle, because your body won't be able to keep the muscle without sufficient protein. Same thing for weight training. You can eat all the protein, but if you're not weight training, your body will just turn it to fat.
  • evileyefirefly
    evileyefirefly Posts: 322 Member
    I'd say they are both important. Strength training is needed to build muscle which will burn more calories over time, and you need the muscle. However cardio is important as well for your health and is still very good at calorie burn. You really need both for optimal loss/health. I tend to do circuit training with weights to get both together. (High rep/lower weight, 30sec rest between machines)
  • lynn_glenmont
    lynn_glenmont Posts: 10,092 Member
    Sufficient calories, sufficient protein, sufficient progressive resistance training, and sufficient rest are all limiting factors.

    Think of them like four different essential amino acids. You're only going to build protein until you've used up one of them. After that, it doesn't matter if you still have some of the other amino acids leftvover.
  • Adventurista
    Adventurista Posts: 1,768 Member
    edited July 3
    For diabetes, combo workout of cardio followed by strength has a 24 hr or longer enduring beneficial impact on blood glucose...

    as does muscle mass.

    Cardio is important for endurance and heart/cardio health... and 10 mins vigorous cardio such as a brisk walk can help to lower the spikes in glucose after eating.

    So i would fall in with both cardio and strength are important/essential, together at times, but also either kind separately as well for particular focus/priority on issues.
  • gerrieryba
    gerrieryba Posts: 2 Member
    Through calorie deficit and cardio focused exercise, I lost the weight I wanted to lose, especially around my middle. And, I have been sustaining that weight for awhile. However, with age and hormone changes, I have noticed muscle mass loss and the resulting weakness in my endurance sports from that loss. I, like the OP, decided I needed to swap out high cardio focused workouts (distance running) for weight focused strength training and swap out a more carb focused diet for a protein focused diet. I have been loving the look ( noticable muscle and tone)and feel (power) of that switch. Unfortunately, I gained 7 pounds, and not all of that 7 pounds is muscle. I have my soft pillowy belly back and the resulting tightness of my waist bands around my middle. My thoughts are I should add back some of my running for at least a few times a week but not the distance I had been doing. 3 miles 2-3 times a week should be fine at the calories I currently consume and time I have with weight lifting. In conclusion, based on my experience with this topic, I agree with the OP to a point. Their opinion works for me at this stage in my life but it would not have 10+ years ago. Also I found ommiting all-together my idea of high cardio (running) wasn't such a good idea for me and my idea of fittness so I am bring it back to a much lesser degree.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,982 Member
    Barcherik wrote: »
    Strength training really is crucial for preserving muscle, especially when you’re in a calorie deficit. A while back, I got caught up in doing tons of cardio while trying to lose weight. I was seeing the scale drop, but I noticed I was losing strength and muscle tone, which was super frustrating.
    Yes a STRENGTH training or RESISTANCE training program is important for health and muscle retention. One doesn't ALWAYS have to lift weights to do this since bodyweight and HIIT exercises are also resistance training and helps to preserve muscle. Look at sprinter's bodies. Or that of a gymnast or rock climber. There are so many ways to still involve resistance training into a routine without having to lift weights.


    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 40 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 34,203 Member
    edited November 5
    Barcherik wrote: »
    Strength training really is crucial for preserving muscle, especially when you’re in a calorie deficit. A while back, I got caught up in doing tons of cardio while trying to lose weight. I was seeing the scale drop, but I noticed I was losing strength and muscle tone, which was super frustrating.

    Yes, true if a person defines strength training in a much broader way than usually is true for those saying "strength training is essential".

    @Nossmf is right: Anything that challenges current strength is "strength training". It needs to keep challenging current strength as strength increases, in order to keep strength increasing (i.e., incorporate progressivity). If those conditions are met, muscle mass will increase . . . eventually. Weight training and proper bodyweight training are the most efficient modalities for meeting those conditions.

    That said, most of any extra muscle mass I have compared with others in my demographic came from "cardio" in the form of rowing, on water and machine . . . and I do have more than average. It was a slow route to that outcome, but it wasn't my goal, it was just a nice side effect.

    There's also reasonable research suggesting that aerobic exercise helps avoid or minimize muscle loss during weight loss. For example:

    ". . . both endurance- and resistance-type exercise help preserve muscle mass during weight loss, and resistance-type exercise also improves muscle strength."

    Source: "Preserving Healthy Muscle during Weight Loss" from the journal Advances in Nutrition

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28507015/

    That's a random example; there are others.

    Weight lifting or bodyweight exercise is more efficient at doing this, too, of course. I recommend that people do some during weight loss, along with some cardiovascular challenge. Even the cardio IMO is not so much for weight loss but for health, and ideally for enjoyment. It's just a bonus that it lets us eat a few more calories - and get better nutrition if we make good choices - while losing at the same sensibly moderate rate.

    Dividing exercise activity into strict categories of "strength training" vs. "cardio" loses a lot of nuance that matters in real life.

    P.S. Too-fast weight loss pace will tend to cause "losing strength and muscle tone". Exercise of many types helps minimize that downside, and strength challenge helps most. But losing weight fast is a Bad Plan for other reasons, not just loss of strength and muscle tone.
  • PAV8888
    PAV8888 Posts: 14,242 Member
    edited November 13
    atlas_star wrote: »
    weight lifting exercises are more important to losing weight than diet
    No, they are not.
    atlas_star wrote: »
    Strength training with less cardio (~30min) is a bigger influence on maintaining muscle in a calorie deficit than macros.
    assuming you're keeping within a semi sane range of values for both then one can plausibly be more immediately impactful ... So sure!👍
    atlas_star wrote: »
    You can have super high protein, excellent macros in a deficit and still lose muscle.
    Uh-huh. Sounds good to me👍
    atlas_star wrote: »
    The effect of diet in preserving muscle is miniscule in comparison to the lifting weight components.
    You can lift till the cows come home and you're in hospital but if you eat, say, 800 Cal a day, you don't preserve **kitten**. Now, if you're arguing that 2 hours at the gum are a metric crapton more useful than worrying about 150g vs 188g of protein, I'm all with ya!
    atlas_star wrote: »
    If you lift weights, you'll preserve muscle even if your diet isn't perfect.
    You'll do that anyway with a wide variety of activities and a wide variety of diets. Maybe not as optimally, but, most certainly to within normal non athletic human physiological parameters.
    And depending on starting and ending points, this will probably be more than good enough even if it is less than optimal.

    Encouraging something positive and helpful is good. Catastrophising/fear mongering about not doing it... yeah: nope
    atlas_star wrote: »
    Lots of cardio and a deficit isn't the way to go. Lifting weights is non-negotiable. Losing muscle should be avoided at all costs as it affects and impedes all aspects of weight loss.
    Really?
    I can think of a lot of reasons why I might want to avoid losing muscle but impeding all aspects of weight loss is not what first comes to mind.

    losing weight can be done in many ways that improve your health with an infinite amount of negotiating of your non negotiables.

    I would worry about health in general which would be driven by getting weight in control assuming we're having this discussion because it's out of control. This means getting my food and psychological issues in some semblance of order. Then about ensuring I had adequate sleep and cardio and was engaging in strength maintaining or building activities. And then I would worry about optimizing my additional training.

    In the end no exercise at all is required to manage weight. It doesn't mean that it isn't both helpful and beneficial. Nor that I'm not personally using it as a component and even driver to maintain the weight I lost. But it isn't the main driver for weight loss. It's a side quest and not the main game.

    source: says me

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