Runners World advice to overweight new runners - HIIT

BerryH
BerryH Posts: 4,698 Member
edited October 6 in Fitness and Exercise
I thought I'd share this and see what my fellow runners think about this as a plan for beginners. It's so different from C25K and my advice to newbies (When you start out, it’s HARD! Even if you think you’re fit, running is so different to anything else you’ve done before you will get out of breath quickly. Stick with it. Can’t manage a minute? Go slow. Still can’t? GO SLOWER!) that I'd be interested to see what you think.
Coaches have traditionally started with the softly-softly approach with overweight runners, but research shows that short, hard bursts are more effective for weight loss and building functional strength.

Canadian researchers found that while moderate exercises burn twice the calories of high intensity interval training (HIIT), the latter burns more subcutaneous fat [the stuff close to the skin's surface]. The high intensity stimulates your metabolism and creates an excess post-exercise oxygen consumption that increases calorie burn for 48 hours after the session, apparently. Translation: bye-bye doughnut gut. And the bonus is it takes less time.

"The key is intensity, regardless of impact," explains Jamie Atlas, a coach with 20 years' experience training marathon champs and recreational runners in Colorado (bonzabodies.com). "An easy going approach doesn't teach the body to run, but teaching someone to run in fast 20-second blocks means they'll run with good stride length, not with a slow shuffle."

So is there a risk if you haven't exercised before? The good news is that "if you're unconditioned, you'll lack the muscle to drive your heart rate to a dangerous level over a 20-second sprint," he says.

But too much running, too soon, is bad news. "Getting an overweight person to run a mile equates to around 1,500 strides, and each stride loads around three times their body weight," says James Dunne, sports injury rehabilitation specialist from Kinetic Revolution (kinetic-revolution.com). "In an overweight individual, the return in calories burned through running one mile definitely does not justify the cost in terms of impact loading and overuse of certain muscle groups."

It's a case of short and sweet. If you have any health concerns, though, consult your GP before embarking on an exercise programme.
The Training Schedule

The good news is, it's only 20-30 seconds at a time. The bad? It has to feel hard. The power walk sessions will boost your exercise tolerance without high impact.

Week 1
Run 1: 6x30sec, 2min rest
Run 2: 6x30sec, 2min rest
Run 3: Power walk 30min

Week 2
Run 1: 8x30sec, 90sec rest
Run 2: 8x30sec, 90sec rest
Run 3: Power walk 40min

Week 3
Run 1: 8x20sec, 1min rest
Run 2: 8x20sec, 1min rest
Run 3: Power walk 45min

Week 4
Run 1: 10x30sec, 2min rest
Run 2: 10x30sec, 2min rest
Run 3: Power walk 50min

Week 5
Run 1: 10x30sec, 90sec rest
Run 2: 10x30sec, 90sec rest
Run 3: Power walk 55min

Week 6
Run 1: 10x20sec, 1min rest
Run 2: 10x20sec, 1min rest
Run 3: Power walk 60min

Full article and workout here:
http://www.runnersworld.co.uk/weight-loss/bespoke-body-in-six-weeks/7714.html
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Replies

  • gailduncan
    gailduncan Posts: 35 Member
    Thanks for posting. I've been looking for something to change up my routine and have always been interested by HIIT but never found anything planned out as well as that is.
  • skinnyeascolady
    skinnyeascolady Posts: 287 Member
    I always wondered how to just get started. I am over weight by over 50 pounds. So this to me sounds like a well thought out plan. I could do this while walking my dog in the morning before work. I will print it off and get started. Thanks for the post. I always gave up so quickly because I was doing to much to soon. This is do able.
  • ooOOooGravy
    ooOOooGravy Posts: 476 Member
    This is interesting, i love Runner's World articles! I completed C25K about 2 months ago, and now regulaly run 5K and also long runs of 8-10Ks, and do high intesity interval running (speed work) on a weekly basis. Do you think that this programme would have been better to start with then move on to, say week 3 or 4 of C25K?

    I know C25K is more about getting you running for a certain period and/or distance, do you think that this will achieve the same out come? as it seems to be designed to make you lose fat (very good for this website, i must say) and not to actually running over a time or distance.

    Just wondering for advise to others on starting to run?

    As a side note, the "thing" that drove me on during my initail weeks of C25K (until i got to the point where i loved getting out and running, no matter how far it was), was the thought that doing this i will one day make it to 5K without stopping or walking. Do you see a simular drive or movitation in this?
    :)
  • goldfinger88
    goldfinger88 Posts: 686 Member
    I'm not a runner but I've read enough studies to know that short bursts of activity are superior to long, boring, useless efforts whether it's weight lifting or running. The human body is designed to function in spurts, not like a herd of zebra.
  • BerryH
    BerryH Posts: 4,698 Member
    Interestingly this "Plan A" is designed "to build strength, prep your body for running and lose a stone in six weeks" then followed by the "Plan B" which is basically a C25K plan for people who've started some running.

    I expect when I weighed 14 stone going at HIIT speed might have killed my knees and lungs if I'd never run a step before. BUT maybe if I'd started burning fat and getting a longer, faster running stride I wouldn't have spent these 15 years as a runner going quite so painfully slowly?
  • BerryH
    BerryH Posts: 4,698 Member
    I'm not a runner but I've read enough studies to know that short bursts of activity are superior to long, boring, useless efforts whether it's weight lifting or running. The human body is designed to function in spurts, not like a herd of zebra.
    Like everything, it depends on your goals. It might help you burn fat faster, but it wouldn't get you round a 5K race until you'd built some endurance.
  • taramaureen
    taramaureen Posts: 569 Member
    Very interesting article. I've always like HIIT training. It helped me lose a lot the first time around. I now do some high intensity intervals as a warm up to strength training. I can see how both this program and C25K are effective.
  • ahamm002
    ahamm002 Posts: 1,690 Member
    HIIT is a great way to burn fat, build muscle, and improve VO2 Max. However, with short intervals like this, you really have to work hard for those 20-30 seconds. While this program is likely very effective, I would definitely be concerned about injury in new runners doing all out sprints. If not for the risk of injury, I'd 100% endorse this regimen.

    If you want to do all out 20-30 second intervals, I think that biking (or running up hill) is safer. When I do running intervals I usually do longer (1 minute) sub-maximal intervals. But that's because I have pulled a hamstring muscle several times in the past and can't risk doing that again.
  • lifeskittles
    lifeskittles Posts: 438 Member
    I'm not a runner but I've read enough studies to know that short bursts of activity are superior to long, boring, useless efforts whether it's weight lifting or running. The human body is designed to function in spurts, not like a herd of zebra.
    Like everything, it depends on your goals. It might help you burn fat faster, but it wouldn't get you round a 5K race until you'd built some endurance.

    Actually HIIT also improves anaerobic as well as aerobic activity...Meaning it would improve running long distance as well as short distance.
  • engineman312
    engineman312 Posts: 3,450 Member
    HIIT is an excellent way to build running strength/endurance. so many people are put off of running because they think they need to go out there and run an hour right off the bat. but you can build up to it.


    to the poster(s) that said they are over weight, i would advise that you do what i did. i started off bike riding first. i dropped a lot of weight and built my cardio strength for about 8 weeks before i started running. easier on the knees.
  • RonSwanson66
    RonSwanson66 Posts: 1,150 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html
  • lifeskittles
    lifeskittles Posts: 438 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html

    I improved my 2 mile run time from 19:30 to 15:45 doing HIIT training as opposed to my previous endurance training as well as lost body fat in the process. The calorie burn might not be overly significant compared to steady cardio but If it leads you to being able to run longer and faster I'm not sure how it's overrated...
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
    Interestingly this "Plan A" is designed "to build strength, prep your body for running and lose a stone in six weeks" then followed by the "Plan B" which is basically a C25K plan for people who've started some running.

    I expect when I weighed 14 stone going at HIIT speed might have killed my knees and lungs if I'd never run a step before. BUT maybe if I'd started burning fat and getting a longer, faster running stride I wouldn't have spent these 15 years as a runner going quite so painfully slowly?

    Most of these articles sound like they are written by fit people who have never been overweight, and, from what I can tell, have never worked with deconditioned, overweight individuals. Even this article is trying to have it both ways--in the beginning glorifying HIIT and then doing the CYA move by warning about excess impact.

    And the idea of doing sprints at first to develop a better stride? Absolute f--king nonsense. Guess how much weight you lose nursing a torn hamstring?

    These articles are classic examples of what happens when a monthly running magazine starts running out of ideas and desperately wants to appear "trendy".

    Now, the flip side is that, yes, too many people get caught up shuffling along, doing the same types of runs every day, and do not see the improvement they expect.

    Varying your training stimulus (not necessarily the activity, and, NO, not "muscle confusion"), is absolutely necessary for sustained success. And highER intensity interval training is a crucial part of any training program.

    But a beginning runner can do just fine with moderate intervals, stride training, some hill work, etc. There is absolutely NO need to jump right into hard interval sprint work. Zero. None.

    When done properly, and when the body is ready for it, HIIT can be a powerful training tool. But like any powerful intervention, it is best applied in controlled doses.
  • ahamm002
    ahamm002 Posts: 1,690 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html

    HIIT isn't superior to endurance because of overall calories burned. HIIT is superior because it induces an "anabolic response" in your body, which stimulates muscle growth and fat burning. Whereas, long slow endurance cardio tends raise your cortisol, which is your body's main stress hormone. Cortisol stimulates fat deposition and muscle catabolism.
  • em9371
    em9371 Posts: 1,047 Member


    As a side note, the "thing" that drove me on during my initail weeks of C25K (until i got to the point where i loved getting out and running, no matter how far it was), was the thought that doing this i will one day make it to 5K without stopping or walking. Do you see a simular drive or movitation in this?
    :)

    i would say it can be used for eventually running say a mile or a 5k. I have been doing treadmill intervals for the last few weeks, when I first started I could only just run 1 min, yesterday I did 7 mins without stopping, so it obviously helps with endurance :)
  • ahamm002
    ahamm002 Posts: 1,690 Member
    Actually HIIT also improves anaerobic as well as aerobic activity...Meaning it would improve running long distance as well as short distance.

    HIIT will help your long distance running somewhat. However, long distance runners need to focus on doing lots of endurance cardio too. That's because there are different types of muscle fibers. HIIT won't stimulate the slow twitch muscle fibers like endurance cardio does.
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html

    I improved my 2 mile run time from 19:30 to 15:45 doing HIIT training as opposed to my previous endurance training as well as lost body fat in the process. The calorie burn might not be overly significant compared to steady cardio but If it leads you to being able to run longer and faster I'm not sure how it's overrated...

    It's overrated when it is being hyped as the "one true faith" answer for everything from weight loss to hemorrhoids, and when deconditioned individuals in their 40s who are 200 lbs overweight are being told to do "wind sprints".

    Keep in mind: "overrated" does not mean "ineffective". It just means......well, overrated. I would recommended that you follow the link and spend some time on that website. Once you are there, you might find you want to stay awhile.
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html

    HIIT isn't superior to endurance because of overall calories burned. HIIT is superior because it induces an "anabolic response" in your body, which stimulates muscle growth and fat burning. Whereas, long slow endurance cardio tends raise your cortisol, which is your body's main stress hormone. Cortisol stimulates fat deposition and muscle catabolism.

    Yeah because marathon runners, triathletes, cyclists, etc are just SOOOOOO obese.
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
    HIIT is an excellent way to build running strength/endurance. so many people are put off of running because they think they need to go out there and run an hour right off the bat. but you can build up to it.


    to the poster(s) that said they are over weight, i would advise that you do what i did. i started off bike riding first. i dropped a lot of weight and built my cardio strength for about 8 weeks before i started running. easier on the knees.

    "Building up to it" is not HIIT training. It's more interval training. For beginning runners, interval training is HIGHLY effective. As you suggest, it is always easier to break things down into smaller, more manageable chunks at first. It's safer, usually more comfortable, builds self-confidence, etc. But that is a far cry from "going all out for 20-30 sec", which is HIIT.

    People may think I am being too picky about semantics, but there is a definite difference.
  • DoingItNow2012
    DoingItNow2012 Posts: 424 Member
    bump. at work, need to read more. was planning on doing c25k.
  • engineman312
    engineman312 Posts: 3,450 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html

    I improved my 2 mile run time from 19:30 to 15:45 doing HIIT training as opposed to my previous endurance training as well as lost body fat in the process. The calorie burn might not be overly significant compared to steady cardio but If it leads you to being able to run longer and faster I'm not sure how it's overrated...

    It's overrated when it is being hyped as the "one true faith" answer for everything from weight loss to hemorrhoids, and when deconditioned individuals in their 40s who are 200 lbs overweight are being told to do "wind sprints".

    Keep in mind: "overrated" does not mean "ineffective". It just means......well, overrated. I would recommended that you follow the link and spend some time on that website. Once you are there, you might find you want to stay awhile.

    agreed. like with everything, moderation. i like HIIT for 1-2 runs a week, and i do one long distance run a week. i'm actually going to try HIIT for the first time on the spinning machine today.
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
    I'm not a runner but I've read enough studies to know that short bursts of activity are superior to long, boring, useless efforts whether it's weight lifting or running. The human body is designed to function in spurts, not like a herd of zebra.

    The last time I looked in the mirror, my *kitten* didn't have black and white stripes and neither does my physiology.
  • BerryH
    BerryH Posts: 4,698 Member
    Most of these articles sound like they are written by fit people who have never been overweight, and, from what I can tell, have never worked with deconditioned, overweight individuals. Even this article is trying to have it both ways--in the beginning glorifying HIIT and then doing the CYA move by warning about excess impact.
    I interned (as an adult career changer) at Runner's World UK, and I can tell you they have absolutely no insight into overweight wannabe runners, or what "slow" means to mere mortals. They completely left me standing at a so-called encouraging beginner's lunchtime run. A team of them had just run across Russia! They shared an office with Men's Health and the office kitchen held nothing but lentil soup and protein shakes.
  • ahamm002
    ahamm002 Posts: 1,690 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html

    HIIT isn't superior to endurance because of overall calories burned. HIIT is superior because it induces an "anabolic response" in your body, which stimulates muscle growth and fat burning. Whereas, long slow endurance cardio tends raise your cortisol, which is your body's main stress hormone. Cortisol stimulates fat deposition and muscle catabolism.

    Yeah because marathon runners, triathletes, cyclists, etc are just SOOOOOO obese.

    1.MOST OF THEM DO SOME FORM OF RESISTANCE TRAINING TOO! Otherwise their muscles slowly vanish. Yes, even the leg muscles. EDIT: AND ALL OF THEM DO INTERVAL TRAINING TOO, UNLESS THEY'RE IDIOTS.

    2. Of course they're not fat, cortisol doesn't magically create fat out of thin air. It's just one more factor out of your body's chemical soup that pushes extra calories more toward fat instead of muscle.
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html

    I improved my 2 mile run time from 19:30 to 15:45 doing HIIT training as opposed to my previous endurance training as well as lost body fat in the process. The calorie burn might not be overly significant compared to steady cardio but If it leads you to being able to run longer and faster I'm not sure how it's overrated...

    It's overrated when it is being hyped as the "one true faith" answer for everything from weight loss to hemorrhoids, and when deconditioned individuals in their 40s who are 200 lbs overweight are being told to do "wind sprints".

    Keep in mind: "overrated" does not mean "ineffective". It just means......well, overrated. I would recommended that you follow the link and spend some time on that website. Once you are there, you might find you want to stay awhile.

    agreed. like with everything, moderation. i like HIIT for 1-2 runs a week, and i do one long distance run a week. i'm actually going to try HIIT for the first time on the spinning machine today.

    That's the balance that I always advocate. Sometimes it sounds like I am anti-HIIT, but I am actually trying to just put things in perspective.

    I find it ironic that my general training advice hasn't changed that much in 25 years (because human physiology hasn't changed either). The difference is that, 15-20 years ago, I had to emphasize HIIT and other forms of interval training because the prevailing fad was the Covert-Bailey-Better-Butter-Burning, long endurance "fat burning" workout. Now that so many people are randomly jumping and running around, I have to spend more time pointing out that endurance training has some benefits as well (pssst--it can even improve your HIIT workouts).

    plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose
  • RonSwanson66
    RonSwanson66 Posts: 1,150 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html

    HIIT isn't superior to endurance because of overall calories burned. HIIT is superior because it induces an "anabolic response" in your body, which stimulates muscle growth and fat burning. Whereas, long slow endurance cardio tends raise your cortisol, which is your body's main stress hormone. Cortisol stimulates fat deposition and muscle catabolism.

    Stop making things up.

    HIIT won't build muscle, this is done via progressive resistance and a caloric surplus, nor will steady-state induce catabolism (unless you're training like an endurance athlete). To induce a catabolic response requires a much longer period of cardio than your typical trainee is likely to engage in.
  • lifeskittles
    lifeskittles Posts: 438 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html

    I improved my 2 mile run time from 19:30 to 15:45 doing HIIT training as opposed to my previous endurance training as well as lost body fat in the process. The calorie burn might not be overly significant compared to steady cardio but If it leads you to being able to run longer and faster I'm not sure how it's overrated...

    It's overrated when it is being hyped as the "one true faith" answer for everything from weight loss to hemorrhoids, and when deconditioned individuals in their 40s who are 200 lbs overweight are being told to do "wind sprints".

    Keep in mind: "overrated" does not mean "ineffective". It just means......well, overrated. I would recommended that you follow the link and spend some time on that website. Once you are there, you might find you want to stay awhile.

    Its not overrated at all. It's a very good thing to include in any training plan. Of course you need to incorporate endurance runs into your exercise, if not anything to vary things up a little. Do I think someone who is obese should start out with HIIT? Probably not. Do I think it's a good way to improve or maintain muscle? Hell yeah. I read that website and it isn't anything I haven't heard before. That's all fine and dandy but I prefer to base my knowledge off of personal experience rather than some article.

    http://www.crossfitsantarosa.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/marathon_sprinter.jpg


    ^ ^^^^^
    Just saying.
  • amyindm
    amyindm Posts: 93 Member
    I'm not a runner but I've read enough studies to know that short bursts of activity are superior to long, boring, useless efforts whether it's weight lifting or running. The human body is designed to function in spurts, not like a herd of zebra.

    The last time I looked in the mirror, my *kitten* didn't have black and white stripes and neither does my physiology.

    Ha! Thanks for making me smile this morning. Regardless of how humans might be designed to function, I love endurance sports. I miss being able to run after having hip surgery and look forward to someday getting back to those long runs.
  • ahamm002
    ahamm002 Posts: 1,690 Member
    HIIT is the single most overrated method in the fitness world today.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/steady-state-versus-intervals-and-epoc-practical-application.html

    HIIT isn't superior to endurance because of overall calories burned. HIIT is superior because it induces an "anabolic response" in your body, which stimulates muscle growth and fat burning. Whereas, long slow endurance cardio tends raise your cortisol, which is your body's main stress hormone. Cortisol stimulates fat deposition and muscle catabolism.

    Stop making things up.

    HIIT won't build muscle, this is done via progressive resistance and a caloric surplus, nor will steady-state induce catabolism (unless you're training like an endurance athlete). To induce a catabolic response requires a much longer period of cardio than your typical trainee is likely to engage in.

    Wow, you must not know anything. HIIT has been shown in peer reviewed literature to increase testosterone and build muscle.
  • jetscreaminagain
    jetscreaminagain Posts: 1,130 Member
    This is interesting. I think I'm the only person on this site for whom c25k kindda sucked. That was a couple years ago and it was too easy and then all of a sudden too hard. I tried it then under the theory that I'd try to get hooked on running and eventually look like a runner. Didn't work.

    This year I started with weights and 20 min HIIT. At first, I avoided using running for the cardio but after a bit I couldn't get the intensity jump roping or jumping jacking. So I started running my intervals. Then I liked running and ultimately started a running training program with speed intervals and LSD runs. Eventually I was able to run for an hour.

    Without meaning to apparently I did what the article suggested and it worked like a charm. I love running now and nearly cried when the doctor told me to lay off for six weeks (during lovely fall weather) after my epic treadmill fail. I think I'll come back with intervals and then a 10 k training plan. Meanwhile, weights.
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