High protein problems - anyone else?

Aineko
Aineko Posts: 163
edited December 18 in Food and Nutrition
Given that my (new) doctor was completely useless regarding this issue, I thought I might try my luck here.
I noticed that when I try to increase proteins to account for more than ~25% of my calories I get some weird symptoms after couple of days. I start getting gastric pain that could be anything from aching liver to ulcer-in-the-making, and also very acidic urine (to the point where it becomes very uncomfortable to go the loo).
When I mentioned this to my new (obviously badly chosen) GP and asked what might be causing these, she gave me an annoyed look and said "I cannot answer that question!" with a tone as if I asked her to look into her crystal ball instead of giving me her professional opinion :angry: . Then she compared it to lactose intolerance. Well, I'm not really sure about that since I'm not talking about bloating/gasses or an inability of my digestive system to process proteins, but something that looks more related to kidney/liver function...
Anyway, I got her to do kidney/liver tests and I'll have the results next week. If that all comes out fine I guess I'll just stick to 25% protein or less. But I was wondering if anyone else had similar experience with high protein diets? Thanks!

Replies

  • mrswoc
    mrswoc Posts: 11 Member
    How high protein are you talking? I have to take in 95 grams of protein daily. Are you doing more than that?
  • Quel1970
    Quel1970 Posts: 91 Member
    I feel 100 times better if my protein intake is higher than my carb intake (diagnosed as hypoglycemic at age 15). HOWEVER, it takes my body a while to adjust. No gastric issues (actually, better) but other stuff ie: strong urine odor , very shaky if my carbs get to low, etc. For me I have to increase my water intake, include some cranberry juice/chews, and keep my sodium up (sounds crazy but it helps ME).
  • misskerouac
    misskerouac Posts: 2,242 Member
    Btw food intolerances are related to your liver. So it might be something worth looking into. I have many food intolerances and feel much better now that I know what not to eat.

    Also wanted to add I thought I had a stomach ulcer my GP treated me for it, still had bad stomach aches (not gassy just pain) turns out it was my intolerances
  • hheater
    hheater Posts: 52 Member
    It may very well depend on the kinds of proteins you're eating. Animal proteins, though they can be beneficial, are difficult for your body to process...so if you're loading up on these, I'm not surprised that you're having a few digestion problems. Have you tried getting the majority of your protein from plant sources? Legumes, nuts, seeds, quinoa...etc?
  • Bevkus
    Bevkus Posts: 274 Member
    Agree with the smelly pee

    Also...do you have regular BMs? When you go High protien/low carb your stools change..you often go LESS frequently and they can become harder and bigger when you do go. Lots of high protien/low carb people can suffer boughts of constipation. This might be a source of dicomfort for you..have you noticed changes in that department?? Drink Lots of water on high protien, and i mean lots!!!!!
  • Tunia85
    Tunia85 Posts: 212 Member
    High protein & low-carb diets can cause your body to go into a dangerous metabolic state called ketosis since your body burns fat instead of glucose for energy. During ketosis, the body forms substances known as ketones, which can cause organs to fail and result in gout, kidney stones, or kidney failure. Ketosis may shed weight, but it's also associated with headaches, irritability, nausea, kidney trouble, and heart palpitations. Ketones can also dull a person's appetite, cause nausea and bad breath. Ketosis can be prevented by eating at least 100 grams of carbohydrates a day. (WebMd)

    I was on a high protein diet and my doctor also warned me about the buildup of uric acid, which might be the cause of your symptoms. You need to drink a lot more than usual on this diet because the breakdown of protein creates waste products such as uric acid, which are a real no-no. Drink lots of water to help the kidneys eliminate this from the body.

    After being on a high protein diet, I AM NOT A FAN. It's restrictive, doesn't really teach good eating habits, and doesn't allow us to eat from all food groups that our body needs. I would just eat enough protein to make sure you can achieve your desired results, and take it slow... eat right, count calories and exercise!

    Here is a good protein calculator to figure out how much protein you should be eating daily to be in the healthy limits:
    http://www.meals.com/Meals-Tools/Protein-Calculator.aspx
  • Aineko
    Aineko Posts: 163
    How high protein are you talking? I have to take in 95 grams of protein daily. Are you doing more than that?
    It's hard to say precisely how many grams but, as I said, couple of days on ~30% protein will induce these symptoms (I even experimented with keeping proteins at 30% and varying carbs and fat just to see if it is really about proteins).
  • Aineko
    Aineko Posts: 163
    Also wanted to add I thought I had a stomach ulcer my GP treated me for it, still had bad stomach aches (not gassy just pain) turns out it was my intolerances
    ha, good to know. thanks.
  • kid75
    kid75 Posts: 17
    I'm on a high protein/ low car diet but I have to add 30 grams of fiber to it.
  • dmitche
    dmitche Posts: 2 Member
    I am no expert. However in various articles I have read it seems the body has a limit of the amount of protein it can use. Certainly too much protein can be destructive (headaches, dehydration, weakness, dizziness). I try to keep my protein intake at or under 90% of my weight (in pounds) in grams of protein OR twice my weight (in kg) in grams. That is if you weigh 150lbs then you would consume no more than 135 grams of protein (150lbs*.9 or 68KG*2). This has worked well for me because I do a fair amount of weight training and am trying to build lean muscle mass.

    However, if your goal isn't too gain muscle mass but rather maintain then these values would decrease. I personally try to keep my protein calories between 18-21% of my total calories. I weight 145lbs. So 145*.9 = 130 grams of protein. 130*4 calories per gram = 520 calories. 520/.20 (20% of my calories from protein) = 2600 calories per day. This right in line with my calculated calorie needs based on the Harris Benedict Equation.

    All this is to say that simply 'adding protein' to gain lean muscle mass is not the whole truth. But by using various calculations using weight, age, activity level, and weight goals you can get a pretty accurate measurement. Furthermore, most people can achieve their protein requirements without the need of protein shakes, protein bars, or other protein supplements. By eating lean beef, chicken, turkey, dairy, nuts, tofu, etc you will likely have plenty of protein.
  • monty619
    monty619 Posts: 1,308 Member
    High protein & low-carb diets can cause your body to go into a dangerous metabolic state called ketosis since your body burns fat instead of glucose for energy. During ketosis, the body forms substances known as ketones, which can cause organs to fail and result in gout, kidney stones, or kidney failure. Ketosis may shed weight, but it's also associated with headaches, irritability, nausea, kidney trouble, and heart palpitations. Ketones can also dull a person's appetite, cause nausea and bad breath. Ketosis can be prevented by eating at least 100 grams of carbohydrates a day. (WebMd)

    I was on a high protein diet and my doctor also warned me about the buildup of uric acid, which might be the cause of your symptoms. You need to drink a lot more than usual on this diet because the breakdown of protein creates waste products such as uric acid, which are a real no-no. Drink lots of water to help the kidneys eliminate this from the body.

    After being on a high protein diet, I AM NOT A FAN. It's restrictive, doesn't really teach good eating habits, and doesn't allow us to eat from all food groups that our body needs. I would just eat enough protein to make sure you can achieve your desired results, and take it slow... eat right, count calories and exercise!

    Here is a good protein calculator to figure out how much protein you should be eating daily to be in the healthy limits:
    http://www.meals.com/Meals-Tools/Protein-Calculator.aspx

    WRONG! ketosis is not dangerous, infact the brain prefers to run on mainly ketones rather than carbohydrates. ive done low carb diets for extended periods of time (+5months) how do you think people in arctic climates ate or africans in the plains it all was from animal protein and fats.. although i do not recomend doing a ketogenic diet it is 100% safe
  • Tunia85
    Tunia85 Posts: 212 Member
    P.S. From experience, high protein diets are hard on your stomach (lots of meat) and more acid production (as I explained previously) so... you might also be experiencing gas or acid reflux. Almonds are great for acid reflux if you can eat those or take something OTC if you can't. Overall if you have problems while on the diet, I would recommend changing the diet. Its wonderful to loose weight fast, but not if it hurts you in the process. Good luck!
  • Aineko
    Aineko Posts: 163
    It may very well depend on the kinds of proteins you're eating. Animal proteins, though they can be beneficial, are difficult for your body to process...so if you're loading up on these, I'm not surprised that you're having a few digestion problems. Have you tried getting the majority of your protein from plant sources? Legumes, nuts, seeds, quinoa...etc?
    the funny thing is, the only food that gives me "lactose-intolerance-like" symptoms (bloating/gasses) are some plant proteins. For example, I can't eat chickpeas and I only tried a golden peas protein supplement once and I'm not doing it again lol :D. but these things give me a different response than the ones I asked my GP about.
    Agree with the smelly pee

    Also...do you have regular BMs?
    I really wouldn't care if it was about the smell :).

    and for your question, not much change compared to before.
  • Topsking2010
    Topsking2010 Posts: 2,245 Member
    Bump!!!
  • Tunia85
    Tunia85 Posts: 212 Member
    High protein & low-carb diets can cause your body to go into a dangerous metabolic state called ketosis since your body burns fat instead of glucose for energy. During ketosis, the body forms substances known as ketones, which can cause organs to fail and result in gout, kidney stones, or kidney failure. Ketosis may shed weight, but it's also associated with headaches, irritability, nausea, kidney trouble, and heart palpitations. Ketones can also dull a person's appetite, cause nausea and bad breath. Ketosis can be prevented by eating at least 100 grams of carbohydrates a day. (WebMd)

    I was on a high protein diet and my doctor also warned me about the buildup of uric acid, which might be the cause of your symptoms. You need to drink a lot more than usual on this diet because the breakdown of protein creates waste products such as uric acid, which are a real no-no. Drink lots of water to help the kidneys eliminate this from the body.

    After being on a high protein diet, I AM NOT A FAN. It's restrictive, doesn't really teach good eating habits, and doesn't allow us to eat from all food groups that our body needs. I would just eat enough protein to make sure you can achieve your desired results, and take it slow... eat right, count calories and exercise!

    Here is a good protein calculator to figure out how much protein you should be eating daily to be in the healthy limits:
    http://www.meals.com/Meals-Tools/Protein-Calculator.aspx

    WRONG! ketosis is not dangerous, infact the brain prefers to run on mainly ketones rather than carbohydrates. ive done low carb diets for extended periods of time (+5months) how do you think people in arctic climates ate or africans in the plains it all was from animal protein and fats.. although i do not recomend doing a ketogenic diet it is 100% safe

    The brain might sure... but what about your kidneys with the uric acid? I never said all high protein diets are bad (I was on one myself) but what I wanted to say is that there are issues if you don't do it right! Also, I don't know what people in the arctic ate, but I also know that they didn't have cars to haul their *kitten* around, fake/created food, pesticides, and we all live very different lives than those people as well as each other so what might hurt one might not hurt another. All I meant to say is that IF the diet doesn't agree with you-change it. I am not here to negate something I tried myself. I would probably still be on the diet if it didn't get too boring and restrictive for me... I had no problems, but did develop acid reflux afterward (but that might be unrelated). I would definitely look for a new doctor though, because there should be an answer for that question. Whether it be more tests, a look into your diet, looking at the ulcer issue or just a plain "oh I actually give a crap". Good luck, and a great weekend to you! I hope anything I "said" helps :)
  • LabRat529
    LabRat529 Posts: 1,323 Member
    Hmm. Some of the symptoms you described could be related to gall-bladder- if your protein is accompanied by fat especially- but that doesn't explain the acidic urine.

    The build up of uric acid mentioned above is also a possibility.

    I'd switch GPs and force the issue of getting help. There are just too many possibilities... and a good GP should listen to your concerns and send you to a specialist if he/she can't help.

    In the mean time... experiment as others have suggested. 30% protein is a good choice for preserving muscle mass as much as possible while dieting and strength training, but you'll still get good results with 25% protein... or 20%. Find where you can be without symptoms.

    Good luck. Sorry to hear you're having problems.
  • Tunia85
    Tunia85 Posts: 212 Member
    High protein & low-carb diets can cause your body to go into a dangerous metabolic state called ketosis since your body burns fat instead of glucose for energy. During ketosis, the body forms substances known as ketones, which can cause organs to fail and result in gout, kidney stones, or kidney failure. Ketosis may shed weight, but it's also associated with headaches, irritability, nausea, kidney trouble, and heart palpitations. Ketones can also dull a person's appetite, cause nausea and bad breath. Ketosis can be prevented by eating at least 100 grams of carbohydrates a day. (WebMd)

    I was on a high protein diet and my doctor also warned me about the buildup of uric acid, which might be the cause of your symptoms. You need to drink a lot more than usual on this diet because the breakdown of protein creates waste products such as uric acid, which are a real no-no. Drink lots of water to help the kidneys eliminate this from the body.

    After being on a high protein diet, I AM NOT A FAN. It's restrictive, doesn't really teach good eating habits, and doesn't allow us to eat from all food groups that our body needs. I would just eat enough protein to make sure you can achieve your desired results, and take it slow... eat right, count calories and exercise!

    Here is a good protein calculator to figure out how much protein you should be eating daily to be in the healthy limits:
    http://www.meals.com/Meals-Tools/Protein-Calculator.aspx

    No, you might be thinking of ketoacidosis which is more of a diabetic issue, ketosis is not ketoacidosis. Ketones don't cause organs to fail. Well... you're making this more complicated than what it is. Let me explain, ketosis has the same metabolic patheways as starvation. Yes ketones are produced in both cases. On a ketosis based diet you eat food, in starvation you don't eat food which can lead to organ failure.
    e
    I agree that uric acid can be a problem, This mostly is due to red meats. I do low carb for the most part, I did have 1 gout flare up, it was due to red meat. Once i cut out red meat I have been fine.

    The kidney issues and all that stuff is due to the fact that high protein acts as a diuretic. Mean it takes water out of your body which can put stress on the kidneys. The solution is simple, drink more water. This is also the culprit to headaches and things of that sort.

    I agree... I was just thinking about the uric acid issue. It's been a while for me off the diet, so I forgot what it was called. I apologize for steering anyone wrong, but I still believe results can be achieved many ways one works, one doesn't. Research and doctor's care are very important and can make all the difference.
  • LabRat529
    LabRat529 Posts: 1,323 Member
    WRONG! ketosis is not dangerous, infact the brain prefers to run on mainly ketones rather than carbohydrates. ive done low carb diets for extended periods of time (+5months) how do you think people in arctic climates ate or africans in the plains it all was from animal protein and fats.. although i do not recomend doing a ketogenic diet it is 100% safe

    The brain DOES NOT PREFER to run on ketones. It can run on ketones without a problem, but it does NOT prefer ketones to glucose.
  • Aineko
    Aineko Posts: 163
    .... or just a plain "oh I actually give a crap". Good luck, and a great weekend to you! I hope anything I "said" helps :)
    yeah, that was my greatest problem with this doctor :).

    I certainly did change my diet back to 25% or less once I realized what is going on (I did few 'experimental' days after that, as I said, just to confirm it is definitely high protein that's causing it).

    I'll get tests back on Tuesday and if it's all fine, I'll just stick to =<25% and see how it goes with my lifting program.
  • DopeItUp
    DopeItUp Posts: 18,771 Member
    I too would wonder how many grams of protein you're actually getting. You log your food right, can't you see how many grams you are eating a day?

    I strive for 35% a day from protein with no problems. It averages out to 225-240g a day depending on the day. Not that that helps you at all. I do average 12-14 cups of water a day typically, which I feel helps me out a bit.
  • Lolli1986
    Lolli1986 Posts: 500 Member
    Hmm. Some of the symptoms you described could be related to gall-bladder- if your protein is accompanied by fat especially- but that doesn't explain the acidic urine.

    The build up of uric acid mentioned above is also a possibility.

    I'd switch GPs and force the issue of getting help. There are just too many possibilities... and a good GP should listen to your concerns and send you to a specialist if he/she can't help.

    In the mean time... experiment as others have suggested. 30% protein is a good choice for preserving muscle mass as much as possible while dieting and strength training, but you'll still get good results with 25% protein... or 20%. Find where you can be without symptoms.

    Good luck. Sorry to hear you're having problems.

    agreed.

    i'm trying to think... can painful, acidic pee be combated with increased water? it should be possible, and theoretically if you're metabolising protein for energy there should be lots more nitrogen byproduct that the body needs to flush out. if you keep your water up it should at least dilute the concentration a bit.

    bloat from legumes is very common <--former vegetarian.

    also, as an alternative, songbyrd said on my status today that she successfully put on muscle while on 50:20:30 (c:p:f). she said that because she was getting plenty of energy from carbs and fats, her body did not need to use as much proteins for energy, leaving it available for repair. this made a lot of sense to me.
  • Aineko
    Aineko Posts: 163
    I too would wonder how many grams of protein you're actually getting. You log your food right, can't you see how many grams you are eating a day?

    I strive for 35% a day from protein with no problems. It averages out to 225-240g a day depending on the day. Not that that helps you at all. I do average 12-14 cups of water a day typically, which I feel helps me out a bit.
    I just pulled out my reports: I have problems when I eat 120g (or more) for a couple of days. My usual protein intake (since 5th of April, when I started monitoring of mfp) is 80g per day (or less; sometimes as low as 60g, but 80g most of the time) and I have no problems when I eat about that much (this is still much higher than what I used to eat before I changed my diet and started recording).
  • monty619
    monty619 Posts: 1,308 Member
    High protein & low-carb diets can cause your body to go into a dangerous metabolic state called ketosis since your body burns fat instead of glucose for energy. During ketosis, the body forms substances known as ketones, which can cause organs to fail and result in gout, kidney stones, or kidney failure. Ketosis may shed weight, but it's also associated with headaches, irritability, nausea, kidney trouble, and heart palpitations. Ketones can also dull a person's appetite, cause nausea and bad breath. Ketosis can be prevented by eating at least 100 grams of carbohydrates a day. (WebMd)

    I was on a high protein diet and my doctor also warned me about the buildup of uric acid, which might be the cause of your symptoms. You need to drink a lot more than usual on this diet because the breakdown of protein creates waste products such as uric acid, which are a real no-no. Drink lots of water to help the kidneys eliminate this from the body.

    After being on a high protein diet, I AM NOT A FAN. It's restrictive, doesn't really teach good eating habits, and doesn't allow us to eat from all food groups that our body needs. I would just eat enough protein to make sure you can achieve your desired results, and take it slow... eat right, count calories and exercise!

    Here is a good protein calculator to figure out how much protein you should be eating daily to be in the healthy limits:
    http://www.meals.com/Meals-Tools/Protein-Calculator.aspx

    WRONG! ketosis is not dangerous, infact the brain prefers to run on mainly ketones rather than carbohydrates. ive done low carb diets for extended periods of time (+5months) how do you think people in arctic climates ate or africans in the plains it all was from animal protein and fats.. although i do not recomend doing a ketogenic diet it is 100% safe

    Where you get this claim from, the brain "prefers" to run on ketones

    more efficient* due to medical research... srry i dont have citings for you im sure you can google it.
  • Aineko
    Aineko Posts: 163
    here's the report:


    edit: or not...just to figure out how to post an image form photobucket
    edit2: finally!

    stats-1.jpg
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