Starting Strength/Practical Programming

Nopedotjpeg
Nopedotjpeg Posts: 1,805 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
Anyone else starting out one of Rippetoe's linear progression strength programs? I had tried this before, and after seeing how bad my form was I kind of gave up and then started just ****ing around in the weight room with my own modified routines. Now I'm back at trying to do this right. Only on the first week, and I know form is going to be a constant work in progress.

For anyone who doesn't know about them, they're pretty damn simple. 5 exercises total split up into a Workout A/Workout B.

Starting Strength
Workout A:
Squat 3x5
Overhead Press 3x5
Deadlift 1x5

Workout B:
Squat 3x5
Bench Press 3x5
Power Clean 5x3 (though you start with 3x5 I believe).

According to the book though in the beginning you stick with Deadlifts until your form is good enough to move onto doing the Power Cleans. Practical Programming is just about the same program, but instead of Power Cleans, you rotate Pull-Ups and Chin-Ups for the 3rd Workout B exercise.

So anyone else doing one of these?

Replies

  • JNick77
    JNick77 Posts: 3,783 Member
    I've never read his book I just know he's a pretty good strength coach. I am shocked at the power clean beiing in the list for somebody just starting out because it is one of the more technical lifts. That programming looks good although I'm also surprised he doesn't have some supporting exercises in there.

    Personally, I would add chin-ups / pull-ups into each workout and maybe even dips if you can do them. Those two exercises really cover a lot of muscle groups and it keeps it simple as you build your strength.
  • Nopedotjpeg
    Nopedotjpeg Posts: 1,805 Member
    Yeah, but the PC is a great movement from what I understand. He does give suggestions about adding assistance exercises after a little while of doing the program. Dips are kind of redundant when you're doing heavy benching though me thinks. I agree that there's not much being added to lat strength though without Chins/Pull-ups.

    EDIT: Now that I think about it, DLs and benching does do a solid number on your back (lats included) if you're setting up correctly.
  • JNick77
    JNick77 Posts: 3,783 Member
    Yeah, but the PC is a great movement from what I understand. He does give suggestions about adding assistance exercises after a little while of doing the program. Dips are kind of redundant when you're doing heavy benching though me thinks. I agree that there's not much being added to lat strength though without Chins/Pull-ups.

    EDIT: Now that I think about it, DLs and benching does do a solid number on your back (lats included) if you're setting up correctly.

    Power Cleans are an excellent exercise, no doubt. They're just pretty darn technical. If you can do them right, then kick some butt and do them. You may just want to start with a broom stick or something until you get the form down.

    I wouldn't say Dips are redundant by an means. They help strengthen your triceps which are key to bench and shoulder press strength, as well as strengthening your deltoids and traps which you can argue are also important to those two lifts. He knows his stuff so go with his recommendations but I wouldn't be afraid to add either of those in at any point.

    Aside from Lats, chin-ups are actually excellent at working the biceps and rear deltoids. The lats are actually somewhat involved in the bench press and warrant some attention if you're looking to improve your bench strength aside from overall fitness level.
  • tigersword
    tigersword Posts: 8,059 Member
    Im currently doing Stronglifts, which is basically the same routine, only the power cleans are swapped out for Pendlay Rows, and everything except deads are 5x5, deads are 1x5. I like Rip's books, but I feel Stronglifts is actually a more well rounded beginner workout.

    Workout A
    Squats 5x5
    Bench press 5x5
    Pendlay Row 5x5

    Workout B
    Squats 5x5
    Overhead Press 5x5
    Deadlifts 1x5

    I eventually want to start working power cleans into my routine, but I love Pendlay Rows for my back.
  • JNick77
    JNick77 Posts: 3,783 Member
    Im currently doing Stronglifts, which is basically the same routine, only the power cleans are swapped out for Pendlay Rows, and everything except deads are 5x5, deads are 1x5. I like Rip's books, but I feel Stronglifts is actually a more well rounded beginner workout.

    Workout A
    Squats 5x5
    Bench press 5x5
    Pendlay Row 5x5

    Workout B
    Squats 5x5
    Overhead Press 5x5
    Deadlifts 1x5

    I eventually want to start working power cleans into my routine, but I love Pendlay Rows for my back.

    If you really want a well-rounded training method checkout Westside for Skinny *kitten* 3. You get max-effort lifting with flexible options, as well as a good assortment of assistance lifts, and Dynamic Effort lifting days. I actually like it a little more than 5/3/1, which IMO is better than 5x5 too. I just personally like more flexibility in my training so I can be more fluid in making adjustments.
  • taso42
    taso42 Posts: 8,980 Member
    I love Starting Strength. I did 3 rounds of the novice program (though only the 3rd round was complete; the first 2 were truncated due to having to travel and/or injury). Lifting like this really changed everything for me. Previously I was doing strictly isolated dumbbell exercises. While I won't say it was a complete waste, I often wonder how much stronger I would be right now had I started with the heavy compound lifts right from the get-go.

    So I think the reason assistance exercises aren't included right off the bat is because someone who is truly a beginner has plenty of gains to milk from the regular lifts alone before assistance work needs to enter the picture. I did throw in some chins, pullups, or dips at the end of many or most workout days, just for the heck of it.

    As for power cleans, I never got good at them. I sort of replaced them with rows, which seems to be a common thing to do. I want to circle back at a later time and master the power clean. It's a great exercise.
  • JennieAL
    JennieAL Posts: 1,726 Member
    Yep. Doing the Practical Programming version.

    Mondays: squat, bench, chin-up

    Wednesdays: squat, press, dead

    Fridays: squat, bench, pull-up
  • Nopedotjpeg
    Nopedotjpeg Posts: 1,805 Member
    Yeah, but the PC is a great movement from what I understand. He does give suggestions about adding assistance exercises after a little while of doing the program. Dips are kind of redundant when you're doing heavy benching though me thinks. I agree that there's not much being added to lat strength though without Chins/Pull-ups.

    EDIT: Now that I think about it, DLs and benching does do a solid number on your back (lats included) if you're setting up correctly.

    Power Cleans are an excellent exercise, no doubt. They're just pretty darn technical. If you can do them right, then kick some butt and do them. You may just want to start with a broom stick or something until you get the form down.

    I wouldn't say Dips are redundant by an means. They help strengthen your triceps which are key to bench and shoulder press strength, as well as strengthening your deltoids and traps which you can argue are also important to those two lifts. He knows his stuff so go with his recommendations but I wouldn't be afraid to add either of those in at any point.

    Aside from Lats, chin-ups are actually excellent at working the biceps and rear deltoids. The lats are actually somewhat involved in the bench press and warrant some attention if you're looking to improve your bench strength aside from overall fitness level.

    The mentality is though, for a true novice lifter, there's nothing really needed to improve these lifts besides doing the lifts. Eventually when one stalls out or gets beyond their initial gains in the lifts is when I believe he recommends adding assistance exercises.
  • JNick77
    JNick77 Posts: 3,783 Member
    As for power cleans, I never got good at them. I sort of replaced them with rows, which seems to be a common thing to do. I want to circle back at a later time and master the power clean. It's a great exercise.

    You know what's kind of a good precursor to learning the power clean, is the high-power pull from the hang. It's almost exactly the same movement pattern but instead cleaning up the weight, you pull the weight straight up like an upright row.

    Here's a pretty good video on learning the Power Clean. I actually do that first video as part of my warm-up when I'm going to do cleans. http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/cleans_and_snatches_made_easier
  • taso42
    taso42 Posts: 8,980 Member
    As for power cleans, I never got good at them. I sort of replaced them with rows, which seems to be a common thing to do. I want to circle back at a later time and master the power clean. It's a great exercise.

    You know what's kind of a good precursor to learning the power clean, is the high-power pull from the hang. It's almost exactly the same movement pattern but instead cleaning up the weight, you pull the weight straight up like an upright row.

    Here's a pretty good video on learning the Power Clean. I actually do that first video as part of my warm-up when I'm going to do cleans. http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/cleans_and_snatches_made_easier

    Good stuff, thanks. I've bookmarked.

    I also found this 3-part video of Pendlay coaching the clean very helpful
    http://www.californiastrength.com/videos/viewvideo/44/clean/clean-how-to-video-part-one
  • dinosnopro
    dinosnopro Posts: 2,177 Member
    I use the 5x5 format with my bench, and started to use it with my squats. The only real reason is that I was starting to stall on both exercises but now I'm starting to see improvement from week to week.
  • JNick77
    JNick77 Posts: 3,783 Member
    As for power cleans, I never got good at them. I sort of replaced them with rows, which seems to be a common thing to do. I want to circle back at a later time and master the power clean. It's a great exercise.

    You know what's kind of a good precursor to learning the power clean, is the high-power pull from the hang. It's almost exactly the same movement pattern but instead cleaning up the weight, you pull the weight straight up like an upright row.

    Here's a pretty good video on learning the Power Clean. I actually do that first video as part of my warm-up when I'm going to do cleans. http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/cleans_and_snatches_made_easier

    Good stuff, thanks. I've bookmarked.

    I also found this 3-part video of Pendlay coaching the clean very helpful
    http://www.californiastrength.com/videos/viewvideo/44/clean/clean-how-to-video-part-one

    Yeah Pendlay is awesome too.
  • Nopedotjpeg
    Nopedotjpeg Posts: 1,805 Member
    bump
  • JayByrd107
    JayByrd107 Posts: 282 Member
    bump
  • UponThisRock
    UponThisRock Posts: 4,519 Member
    I did it some years back, I found the progression to be a bit too aggressive for me.
  • Monkee_Magic
    Monkee_Magic Posts: 32 Member
    i've just started the stronglifts 5x5 and would be interested in the comparison with the starting strength. I chose the 5x5 because of its simplicity and progression.
  • JayByrd107
    JayByrd107 Posts: 282 Member
    I've started stronglifts as well, but am not happy with it because it is starting me so far below my current weight on some of my movements. I can do 135 5x5, but it has me starting at 70. I feel no resistance at all at that weight and I can't believe that it's doing anything for my muscles except training form. By the end of 12 weeks I'll barely be back up to where I'm at now. :grumble:
  • mjbrenner
    mjbrenner Posts: 222 Member
    I've started stronglifts as well, but am not happy with it because it is starting me so far below my current weight on some of my movements. I can do 135 5x5, but it has me starting at 70. I feel no resistance at all at that weight and I can't believe that it's doing anything for my muscles except training form. By the end of 12 weeks I'll barely be back up to where I'm at now. :grumble:

    There is a spreadsheet on the Stronglifts site, I believe, that will let you enter what you lift now and what the translates into for starting at Stronglifts. It is specifically targeted at experienced 5x5 lifters. You might want to check it out.
  • JayByrd107
    JayByrd107 Posts: 282 Member
    I have the spreadsheet - that's what I used to set my starting weight and how I know that, according to the plan, I'll be only up 130 by the end of 12 weeks. I've been playing with my starting numbers so that my weight at the end of 12 weeks will be a good improvement over what I can do now.

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