can i build muscle on a calorie deficit?
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CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »CWShultz27105 wrote: »A recomp is a "mixing" of a cut (to lower the body fat to a level that would then support a bulk) and a bulk (where you add muscle and body fat). It is slower but it likely spares you the "pleasure" of being hangry for the better part of your cut. You just have to figure out your maintenance caloric intake (likely using a calculator - which is only the starting point) and then playing to find YOUR number.
And, you are most welcome.
how is it a mixing? if you are eating at maintenance you wont gain fat in a recomp if you do you are in a slight surplus. recomp you eat maintenance calories to lose fat and gain some muscle. a bulk you gain fat along with muscle and a cut you lose fat and may or may not gain muscle depending on several factors including genes.
Technically, during a recomp, you will naturally have days in a surplus and days in a cut. It just so happens overtime, you won't have a net gain or loss impact.
I get that but it evens out and you should not gain fat correct?
Correct.0 -
Okay.....by my use of the term "mixing" I meant, naturally, that you are combining the two different and separate concepts - cutting first and then bulking - into one time frame.
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CWShultz27105 wrote: »A recomp is a "mixing" of a cut (to lower the body fat to a level that would then support a bulk) and a bulk (where you add muscle and body fat). It is slower but it likely spares you the "pleasure" of being hangry for the better part of your cut. You just have to figure out your maintenance caloric intake (likely using a calculator - which is only the starting point) and then playing to find YOUR number.
And, you are most welcome.
No it's not "mixing". It's losing fat and gaining muscle at the same time.
It's also happens in a range either side of maintenance.
Nothing remotely complex or needing anything beyond a decent training program and an adequate diet.4 -
i love that you guys are still posting about this.. I just keep learning more and more. going off keto has been kind of a flop. I cut my fat, and upped my carbs.. but finding it difficult to eat over 50-80g carbs.this recipe = low energy. if anyone wants to add me to be able to view/critique my diet, please do.. i'll trade you for love life or parenting advice or something haha... i have been eating more calories..but that is hard too. i've been low energy and not feelings like cooking which is some kinda catch 22..
ps. how many days a week do i have to lift to recomp?? let me guess.. it depends on the age/weight/height/bf/current everything specific to the individual..0 -
CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »tlanger251 wrote: »CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »tlanger251 wrote: »CWShultz27105 wrote: »So, I might chime in......
There are a couple of concepts involved here.
First and foremost, and I am very much simplifying things, it is "essentially" Calories In vs. Calories Out. So, you have to consume the number of Calories that matches your goal.
Generally speaking, when you want to "bulk" you need to be in a Caloric Surplus. Bulking is lifting heavy and often to gain muscle and strength and eating such that you feed the machine (translation - you are eating a lot of carbs, generally speaking). You are typically lifting heavy (so, think 5 x 5 or 8 x 3 or similar) and your intensity is high (read: you are lifting at weights closer to your 1 Rep Max). You will also gain some body fat along this path. You typically want to bulk when you have lower body fat (typically, if we were to put numbers to this, 13% for dudes and 20% for the ladies.....roughly.....very very roughly). To put it the other way, if you have higher body fat and are considering a bulk then you might consider doing some sort of cut before otherwise you would not necessarily be happy with the results (read: have more body fat at the end than you might like).
Generally speaking, when you want to "cut" you need to be in a Caloric Deficit. Generally speaking, you need to know your maintenance Caloric intake for that. You then - depending on your goal - reduce that number. So, generally you need to consume 500 Calories a day (or, 3,500 Calories a week) under your maintenance total to loose 1 lbs in that week. You might train heavy and have a high intensity but those two things subside - generally speaking - as you progress into your cut. Your carb intake is going to - generally speaking - be lower in a cut (and your protein is likely going to be a tad bit higher than usual) so training heavy and with intensity becomes a challenge.
A recomp is when you eat at your Maintenance Number but lift heavy. Well, likely heavy for one of the training sessions and then maybe more "hypertrophy" for the other training session that week (assuming that you are doing a body part twice a week....which may or may not be accurate).
If you are "skinny fat" then it might not be a bad idea to do a recomp.
Essentially, when you do a recomp you are doing - at the risk of sounding like a mart kitten - a recomp. You are redistributing your body....adding some muscle and loosing some body fat. Your weight might not change, but your body will look different and your clothes will fit slightly differently. Roughly.....
Does this make sense?
yes, thank you! I want to do a recomp.. didn't know the name.. I think my body fat is around 25%
get a dexa scan or hydrostatic weight thing to see how much body fat you have. it may be lower than you think but it may not be.those things are more accurate than other ways(like calipers and so on)
since I've never been in shape, is it really a "recomp" or should it just be "comp."
lol its called a recomp which means recomposition. trust me you will like the results,
And as a noob, they are a prime candidate.
what does prime candidate mean? !!0 -
How many days depends on the program you choose and the program you chose depends on your goal(s) and training status (how many years training solidly).
However, most beginner programs tend to be 3 days a week full body workouts centred on the big compound lifts to give you a nice balance of working your whole body and recovery periods.
For most of my adult life my rule of thumb has been 1 day a week = loss of strength, 2 days = strength/muscle maintenance or glacial progress, 3 days = good progress.
(Now I'm an old fart 3 days a week = glacial progress though!
3 -
tlanger251 wrote: »CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »tlanger251 wrote: »CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »tlanger251 wrote: »CWShultz27105 wrote: »So, I might chime in......
There are a couple of concepts involved here.
First and foremost, and I am very much simplifying things, it is "essentially" Calories In vs. Calories Out. So, you have to consume the number of Calories that matches your goal.
Generally speaking, when you want to "bulk" you need to be in a Caloric Surplus. Bulking is lifting heavy and often to gain muscle and strength and eating such that you feed the machine (translation - you are eating a lot of carbs, generally speaking). You are typically lifting heavy (so, think 5 x 5 or 8 x 3 or similar) and your intensity is high (read: you are lifting at weights closer to your 1 Rep Max). You will also gain some body fat along this path. You typically want to bulk when you have lower body fat (typically, if we were to put numbers to this, 13% for dudes and 20% for the ladies.....roughly.....very very roughly). To put it the other way, if you have higher body fat and are considering a bulk then you might consider doing some sort of cut before otherwise you would not necessarily be happy with the results (read: have more body fat at the end than you might like).
Generally speaking, when you want to "cut" you need to be in a Caloric Deficit. Generally speaking, you need to know your maintenance Caloric intake for that. You then - depending on your goal - reduce that number. So, generally you need to consume 500 Calories a day (or, 3,500 Calories a week) under your maintenance total to loose 1 lbs in that week. You might train heavy and have a high intensity but those two things subside - generally speaking - as you progress into your cut. Your carb intake is going to - generally speaking - be lower in a cut (and your protein is likely going to be a tad bit higher than usual) so training heavy and with intensity becomes a challenge.
A recomp is when you eat at your Maintenance Number but lift heavy. Well, likely heavy for one of the training sessions and then maybe more "hypertrophy" for the other training session that week (assuming that you are doing a body part twice a week....which may or may not be accurate).
If you are "skinny fat" then it might not be a bad idea to do a recomp.
Essentially, when you do a recomp you are doing - at the risk of sounding like a mart kitten - a recomp. You are redistributing your body....adding some muscle and loosing some body fat. Your weight might not change, but your body will look different and your clothes will fit slightly differently. Roughly.....
Does this make sense?
yes, thank you! I want to do a recomp.. didn't know the name.. I think my body fat is around 25%
get a dexa scan or hydrostatic weight thing to see how much body fat you have. it may be lower than you think but it may not be.those things are more accurate than other ways(like calipers and so on)
since I've never been in shape, is it really a "recomp" or should it just be "comp."
lol its called a recomp which means recomposition. trust me you will like the results,
And as a noob, they are a prime candidate.
what does prime candidate mean? !!
Prime candidate to gain muscle. The less trained a person is, the more likely their body will respond to a given stimulus. So it is not uncommon for a person new to lifting to experience noob gains and easily gain a few lbs of muscle. So doing a recomp while being a new lifter is a lot easier than recomping after 4+ years of lifting experience.4 -
@sijomial - exactly, "mixing".
Everyone seems to be taking issue with that word. Concept is clear. You are doing both a cut and a bulk at the same time. In other words, you are not doing a cut and you are not doing a bulk. Or, presented in another light, you are gaining the rewards of the bulk (bigger and stronger) without the 'side-effect' (body fat). In yet another light, you are not experiencing the potentially unpleasant effects of either (with the bulk you have to eat a lot....which is an issue for some folks....and this *WILL* lead to body fat gains....and with the cut you are eating in a strong caloric deficit....which is really tough on people....and they tend to get hangry....). The recomp is a slow yet effective way to "mix" the good parts of both and to avoid (well, 'avoid' might be too strong a word....mitigate might be a better word) the bad parts of both.
No matter how you slice it, we are "mixing" the two usually very separate and distinct concepts and focuses - which are usually done a different and distinct times - into one focus. We could go round and round and round and round with the word "mixing" but the concept is clear.
Anyway, we are both saying the same thing.4 -
People are loving this thread. Allow me to join
I was in a similar situation: weight was ok-ish, but I had too much of the "wrong weight", i.e. fat. I challenged myself to the following: work out (mainly lifting weights) and eat well (slightly calorie deficient initially) while maintaining my weight. I didn't know the word "recomping" back then In the graph below you can see measurements taken at 4 different points in time. (All mass units in kg)
Results/Insights:
1.) After half a year I weighed exactly the same (actually, about 2lb more), but looked completely different.
2.) Body fat mass was reduced by 50%(!), and the weight I had lost in fat was replaced with fat-free mass (about half of it being muscle mass).
3.) It requires more patience because changes in the mirror are more difficult to notice and slower than changes on the scale.
As far as nutrition, everyone has their own theory, preference and health factors to consider (e.g. insulin resistance, blood pressure, cholesterol, allergies etc.). I tend to do a bit better with more protein. Most importantly, learn to listen to your body and see what works well for you personally.
(side note: body composition was measured with a professional bioelectrical impedance analysis scale at my local gym. There is a margin of error there. As with body fat calipers, it's advisable to use the tool to measure progress ("things are moving in the right direction"), rather than absolute values ("this is my body fat %")6 -
People are loving this thread. Allow me to join
I was in a similar situation: weight was ok-ish, but I had too much of the "wrong weight", i.e. fat. I challenged myself to the following: work out (mainly lifting weights) and eat well (slightly calorie deficient initially) while maintaining my weight. I didn't know the word "recomping" back then In the graph below you can see measurements taken at 4 different points in time. (All mass units in kg)
Results/Insights:
1.) After half a year I weighed exactly the same (actually, about 2lb more), but looked completely different.
2.) Body fat mass was reduced by 50%(!), and the weight I had lost in fat was replaced with fat-free mass (about half of it being muscle mass).
3.) It requires more patience because changes in the mirror are more difficult to notice and slower than changes on the scale.
As far as nutrition, everyone has their own theory, preference and health factors to consider (e.g. insulin resistance, blood pressure, cholesterol, allergies etc.). I tend to do a bit better with more protein. Most importantly, learn to listen to your body and see what works well for you personally.
(side note: body composition was measured with a professional bioelectrical impedance analysis scale at my local gym. There is a margin of error there. As with body fat calipers, it's advisable to use the tool to measure progress ("things are moving in the right direction"), rather than absolute values ("this is my body fat %")
but you are male so your results will most likely be different compared to a female. you can get down to lower fat percentages where a woman should not get down too low. you also have more testosterone than a female so the gain will probably be quicker and the fat loss possibly a little faster compared to a female due to having more lean mass than a female1 -
Look at Jeff Cavaliere’s video.
https://youtu.be/Bz3AG-oCXTE. You need to be in nitrogen surplus if you want to gain muscle and calorie deficit to lose fat. 4 -
Hate to see that he did what so many others do.
Referenced what the study likely said - gained Lean Body Mass.
But then he let slip the words later - lean muscle mass.
Not the same thing. Creatine would have increased LBM without even lifting - water weight.
Even his ad at the end playing into current incorrect usage - 90 days to 100% lean muscle - huh?4 -
CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »
but you are male so your results will most likely be different compared to a female. you can get down to lower fat percentages where a woman should not get down too low. you also have more testosterone than a female so the gain will probably be quicker and the fat loss possibly a little faster compared to a female due to having more lean mass than a female
Yes, that's correct - there would definitely be gender differences. I guess my point was that it's possible to lose fat and gain muscle mass at the same time (no matter if it's going from 30%bf to 27%bf or from 15%bf to 12% bf) 1 -
An interesting article on why keto is less than ideal for those training.
http://www.bodyforwife.com/keto-and-low-carb-diets-kill-performance/
Yep. There's a reason why I grab carbs before making ascents while hiking. "Fire hose" for the win!1 -
Yes you can...but it isn't easy.
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No.6
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Moonshot54 wrote: »No.
Wrong.7 -
To lose weight, eat fewer calories than you burn.
To gain muscle, eat slightly more calories than you burn, with a higher percentage of them coming from protein, and repeatedly lift / put down heavy things. Adjust how many extra calories you're eating, as well as the % from protein, until you start getting the results you want.
Those goals are contradictory.
(And to be healthy, eat a wide variety of foods from various sources.)
Just get into IF and you wont have to worry about calories or anyhing like that - its perfect for bodybuilding, high protien, high fat, low carbs...17 -
jleitsfisch wrote: »To lose weight, eat fewer calories than you burn.
To gain muscle, eat slightly more calories than you burn, with a higher percentage of them coming from protein, and repeatedly lift / put down heavy things. Adjust how many extra calories you're eating, as well as the % from protein, until you start getting the results you want.
Those goals are contradictory.
(And to be healthy, eat a wide variety of foods from various sources.)
Just get into IF and you wont have to worry about calories or anyhing like that - its perfect for bodybuilding, high protien, high fat, low carbs...
Brilliant. Nothing in this statement is factual, or correct.8 -
trigden1991 wrote: »jleitsfisch wrote: »To lose weight, eat fewer calories than you burn.
To gain muscle, eat slightly more calories than you burn, with a higher percentage of them coming from protein, and repeatedly lift / put down heavy things. Adjust how many extra calories you're eating, as well as the % from protein, until you start getting the results you want.
Those goals are contradictory.
(And to be healthy, eat a wide variety of foods from various sources.)
Just get into IF and you wont have to worry about calories or anyhing like that - its perfect for bodybuilding, high protien, high fat, low carbs...
Brilliant. Nothing in this statement is factual, or correct.
Lol, you beat me to it! I read it and it was like "whaaaaah??"1
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