The lazy dieter
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For searing, cast iron pans are awesome. Sometimes I will sear steaks without a drop of additional oil, just get the cast iron pan hot, put the meat on, wait a few minutes until it naturally releases from the bottom of the pan, and flip to see the beautiful searing.
OK, confession time. I have never really used cast iron pans. I have heard that you need to break them in for years before they reach their full potential.
If you are really being honest that a brand new, never before used cast iron pan will sear meat well without a drop of butter or lard or oil or fat or shortening or anything else... well, I'm going to pick one up tonight and give it a try.
We have a 10yo one. My husband swears by it. I hate the thing, pain to clean and I can't just let it dry naturally or it rusts.
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lemurcat12 wrote: »Nobody who advocates home cooking has even addressed the sodium issue at all except to say that they ignore it or don't care about sodium. Yet the only who person who gave a concrete example about what they imagined was bad about processed food, incorrectly thought that it had too much sodium in it.
This seems counterintuitive to me. While you can get processed food that's low sodium, the easiest way to control your sodium if it matters to you is by avoiding processed food and just paying attention to how you prepare it.
I don't care about sodium (because my levels are pretty low anyway, due to eating mostly whole foods) so I don't track that dash of salt when cooking, but if you do care about it cooking yourself and, well, not adding salt would seem an easy way to manage. There are other spices or herbs you can use for flavor that wouldn't pose a health issue. Or log the salt; seems simple.
I'm NOT saying it's bad for you to rely on packaged food if you really prefer to do so (more on that in response to your other post). I'm just saying there's nothing about MFP or logging that should discourage home cooking or using whole foods.
Ahh, one of the sensible ones. OK, I'll switch gears and explain what I mean without trying to be silly..
I agree that you can certainly better control your sodium intake by preparing your own food. But, my position was not that people could do it, but rather that they do NOT do it--or rather that the people who make healthy processed foods do a better job of it more often. I had that prejudiced opinion because I am conscious about sodium intake and yet I still find it impossible to keep an accurate measurement much of the time. So, I simply presented the dilemma and asked what other people did to monitor these things. The most frequent response was that everybody else just ignores it altogether.
Example of one real world problem: how do measure the amount of sodium you use to season meat when only a small portion of it actually sticks to the meat? It isn't insignificant when you realize that a dash of salt is about 360 mg of sodium and seasoning a peace of meat takes one heck of alot more than a dash. Think about that for a minute.
So, do you simply stop seasoning all your food with salt when you cook? That is a reasonable theoretical answer, but I would be strongly suspicious that any home cook who told me they did that were either outright lying just to prove a point on an internet diet forum or just really lousy cooks.
I am not as closed minded as I sound. I suppose if enough people adamantly insisted that they don't season their food when they cook, and gave concrete examples of suitable alternatives (like Mrs. Dash brand seasonings for example), and that it WORKED well and their food doesn't taste like decomposing shoe leather, well... OK, I'd be motivated to try home cooking that way instead of just swiping barcodes.
That changes matters.
Most of us are concerned with calories and many of us are concerned with macros, so that is what we track. Those of us who are concerned about micros aren't concerned about ALL micros, so we track what's important to us and ignore the rest - something that food companies do too. They put on the label what's required by law, not every nutrient out there.
So. You're concerned about salt. Specifically how to account for what sticks to the meat. Question: how do you salt your meat? I use a salt grinder set on fine (finer than table salt). I grind what I want directly on the meat. The salt pretty much instantly dissolves on the meat. There's maybe a couple of bits of salt dust that fall off. More would come off as meat juices and rendered fat wash it away, but there's no way to measure that and the amount would be a tiny fraction of what was added.
One solution for you, do similar but grind the salt and weigh first. You'd need a specialized scale to weigh such small amounts. A kitchen scale wouldn't cut it.
Second solution (assuming sodium is the problem), don't use sodium-based salt. Use potassium chloride instead. ETA: might be a bad taste, I wouldn't know.
Third solution - use salt-free herb mixes. I use several, but not for seasoning meat before browning (ick, burned herbs). Baking, roasting, etc, yes. Penzey's has a good selection.
Fourth solution - keep eating processed food, but if you enjoy cooking you're going to miss it.0 -
geneticsteacher wrote: »I cook, on average, 18 meals a week. Lean Cuisine is a vacation for me. And I LIKE the taste of some of them.
Yes. I agree.
The heresy I spoke was not about how they are a nice vacation from preparing your own food from scratch and not even that some of them are NOT horrible tasting. The heresy was that I have actually paid attention to the nutritional content on the packaging and had the sheer audacity to challenge the dogma of conventional wisdom.
I think the old "TV Dinners" of the 1960's and 1970's were evil concoctions of slow roasted death. I'm not talking about the taste since that was before my time. I'm talking about the nutritional content.
By the time microwave ovens and nutritionally sound healthy frozen food was being packaged for mass consumption in the 1990's and beyond, it was too late. Every nutritionist, personal trainer, and internet know it all had already heard the gospel about the evils of "TV dinners". They drank the cool aid and are true believers. Their religion allows no converts.
I think we have moved beyond the frozen pizza and TV dinners of the 1960's; unfortunately we've moved firmly into the twilight zone of urban legend and internet rumor that all processed food is bad and (even more bizarrely) the notion that any untrained home cook can and DOES make food that is healthier and better tasting than anything you can buy pre-made in a grocery store.
Give me enough seasoning, fat, butter, oil, wine, etc and I can make a steaming pile of cow dung taste delicious, but take away the fat, the butter, the salt, the seasonings and all the rest, and it is damn difficult to make something taste better than what I can get out of a box in the frozen food isle of my local supermarket. Maybe not impossible, but DAMN difficult.
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All that glitters is not gold and all dietary concerns are not about the bathroom scale or the waistband of your pants.
Agreed, but in the absence of actual health issues (and my tests are all fine and always have been), I don't believe that adding a little salt when cooking is unhealthy. Especially if one drinks plenty of water and gets enough potassium. It's one of those things (like overconcern about saturated fats, IMO, or the endless fears about sugar) that people worry too much about. If one has a generally good diet and doesn't artificially increase sodium by eating lots of canned or other kinds of processed foods that contain it (not all processed foods do), I don't think it's worth worrying about.
If I did, I'd log my salt, though.
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What are your thoughts. What really got TAPF angry enough to respond? What is it about responding with thoughtful, if not a bit facetious, responses to your posts instead of mindlessly agreeing with TAPF made you the most angry??
Your smugness.
Example one:
You really have never heard of searing meat in a hot pan? Oh well, for those of you who don't know what searing meat is, here's an article to check it out:
(sidenote: I successfully sear meat regularly with a tablespoon of butter or oil. Call Hogwart's, for I am performing magic.)0 -
I do get lazy too, but usually that means I'm eating the same thing over and over, which makes for easier logging.
This, I'll still do home-cooked meals but there is a lot of repeats so that it's easy to plan and track. I do tend to eat a lot of canned soup when dieting too which helps with satiety and because I'm lazy.
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Give me enough seasoning, fat, butter, oil, wine, etc and I can make a steaming pile of cow dung taste delicious, but take away the fat, the butter, the salt, the seasonings and all the rest, and it is damn difficult to make something taste better than what I can get out of a box in the frozen food isle of my local supermarket. Maybe not impossible, but DAMN difficult.
This is purely subjective, so I'm not going to argue with you about it, but I totally disagree. I mostly use salt (not a lot), pepper, various herbs, garlic, and onion as seasoning. I used to cook a lot with wine and butter, but now I rarely have wine on hand and save butter for when it really matters (use it maybe once a week), and I typically use spray olive oil or coconut oil at most. The calories added from all this is minimal, and we've discussed salt. To my taste, my home cooking, even without all the fat, etc., tastes tons better than any boxed meal I've tried. In particular, the meat and veggies which tend to be the central feature of my meals are both tastier and more substantial than what one gets in boxed meals. You asked Francl if it was psychological, and for me it's not--my meals are larger by volume than a Lean Cuisine, because I have more veggies and more protein, and are probably somewhat plainer. Relatively plain home cooked meals are tasty to me, though--I've never understood why people needed to add butter to roasted chicken (which is common) as the chicken tastes so good with just its natural fat (of which it has plenty, of course).0 -
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ShannonMpls wrote: »
(sidenote: I successfully sear meat regularly with a tablespoon of butter or oil. Call Hogwart's, for I am performing magic.)
And when you used that tablespoon of butter your meal now has about 50% of the calories and 100% of the fat of my processed dinner while the pan was still empty. Now that is magical.
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To answer your question about cast iron:
I cook most of the time with regular or enameled cast iron. If I am searing meat and do not plan to deglaze, I use the naked cast iron. These are inexpensive pans by Lodge that you purchase pre-seasoned. They worked from day one and have only gotten better with use. I absolutely can and do sear meat with small amounts of fat - one tablespoon or less.
Enameled cast iron (mine are Le Creuset) doesn't have quite the same nonstick properties, but I still prefer to use them to sear a cut of meat if I deglaze. And I still use only a tablespoon of fat, if that.
There is a learning curve as you learn to use both of these. I ruined a whole lot of meatballs when I first started using Le Creuset - to sear a meatball in enameled cast iron takes a lot of oil; naked cast iron is a better choice for me.
And speaking generally of fat: I decrease the oil in almost any dish I cook. For example, I made this last week:
http://www.saveur.com/article/Recipes/Maqloubeh-Upside-Down-Rice-With-Lamb
It calls for more than a cup of oil! I made it with 4 tablespoons (the dish serves 8). It was about 440 delicious calories per serving.0 -
I love my cast iron frying pan. I use a different pan for sauce-based cooking. I don't use soap, and I clean up right after. The seasoned pan is now better than teflon, so cleans easily.
I say, do whatever works. I have been at this for over a year so now I crave variety, so I cook a few home-made dinners every week. Typically leftovers the next day are a serving of dinner from the night before.
For 100 calorie snack size bags, I bought snack size ziplocs. You only have to measure the first time for a favorite snack and then you know how much to take.
I try and have protein with every meal, every snack. Which can be challenging. I buy a low-fat old cheddar block and cut it in to single serving sizes. I lay out the single servings on plastic wrap, about four to a row, and wrap them all up. Put them all in the freezer. Presto bango, single serving cheddar every day.
Slow cookers make things easier too.0 -
You still haven't answered the question about how you intend to maintain after you lose weight.0
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You still haven't answered the question about how you intend to maintain after you lose weight.
Well, because I don't think my situation applies well to what you imagine it to be or to the point of this particular thread. Perhaps in a different thread and at a time when I have the interest in typing an autobiography.
Suffice it to say, I believe that the mental image in your head of me as a morbidly obese couch potato isn't COMPLETELY accurate. Or that the reason I find myself wanting to loose weight now is because of years of an unhealthy lifestyle. Or that my main concern is how I look in a bathing suit.
It may satisfy somebody's curiosity to find out why I don't think that is a relevant problem, but it is pretty much just a derail of this thread.0 -
Give me enough seasoning, fat, butter, oil, wine, etc and I can make a steaming pile of cow dung taste delicious, but take away the fat, the butter, the salt, the seasonings and all the rest, and it is damn difficult to make something taste better than what I can get out of a box in the frozen food isle of my local supermarket. Maybe not impossible, but DAMN difficult.
Strange argument, I see no problem with adding seasoning, butter, oil, etc. Yes, fat and salt in appropriate amounts. Herbs and such in whatever amounts are appealing. Why would you want or need to make something completely bland? It strikes me as ironic that you are complaining we are all buying into received wisdom about processed foods being evil, when you seem to be buying into outdated science about fat being evil.
Again, you may not be able to create healthy options with home cooking, but I certainly am able to cook things that are both healthier and tastier than anything I've found in the freezer aisle.
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girlviernes wrote: »Strange argument, I see no problem with adding seasoning, butter, oil, etc. Yes, fat and salt in appropriate amounts. Herbs and such in whatever amounts are appealing. Why would you want or need to make something completely bland? It strikes me as ironic that you are complaining we are all buying into received wisdom about processed foods being evil, when you seem to be buying into outdated science about fat being evil.
Again, you may not be able to create healthy options with home cooking, but I certainly am able to cook things that are both healthier and tastier than anything I've found in the freezer isle.
I'll just touch on this quickly because it ties in a bit with my previous post, but I'm going to have to get some other work done today, and I kinda feel like I'm just hanging out on here as an excuse to procrastinate from getting other things done.
The fat issue: it is evil. It is evil for me. It is evil for many, many people. I envy you if it is not an evil for you. Nothing outdated about it. Hard science and facts only without a bit of emotion.
Also, don't feel as if I think you are bullying me by disagreeing. I'm not that way. I prefer spirited debate to mindless agreement (or mindless disagreement either for that matter!). Not fighting. Not arguing. Just an exchange of opinions in a healthy manner. I've never been bullied into anything in my life, but I have had my mind changed from long held beliefs by logical coherent arguments--but only after I have challenged them ad nauseum and not a moment before. I don't take things at face value and my opinions don't change with the weather.
But stand up for yourself and fight for what you believe, express your views and feel free to respond to my posts, just understand that, "Because I said so" has never won an argument with me since I stopped wearing diapers. I'm going to challenge your positions if I disagree with them and it isn't personal and it isn't emotional.
And sometimes behind all my contrariness is a person who wants to better understand your point of view, not change your mind or pick a fight.0 -
ShannonMpls wrote: »What are your thoughts. What really got TAPF angry enough to respond? What is it about responding with thoughtful, if not a bit facetious, responses to your posts instead of mindlessly agreeing with TAPF made you the most angry??
Your smugness.
Example one:
You really have never heard of searing meat in a hot pan? Oh well, for those of you who don't know what searing meat is, here's an article to check it out:
(sidenote: I successfully sear meat regularly with a tablespoon of butter or oil. Call Hogwart's, for I am performing magic.)
OP might be amazed to know you can even do a nice hard sear WITHOUT any lipids.
Amazing, but true.0 -
Hey, bro, are we good now?
You are my third favorite poster on this thread, but it is mainly because whenever I read one of your posts, all I can see in my mind is this guy:
http://static.fjcdn.com/gifs/*kitten*_b45621_2851629.gif
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Fat is an essential macronutrient. It is important for bodily functions and satiety in the diet. As the american diet focused on reducing fat, obesity rates rose significantly: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24911982. One of the healthiest eating styles is mediterranean which is rich in olive oil. This is an important study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25316904 which showed improvement in metabolic functioning both in people who were given olive oil or nuts to add to their diets. High fat dairy may actually be protective against weight gain: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22893781
I'm not a proponent of any dietary extremes. I think we all need a balance of carb-fat-protein. Where the balance falls can vary, but there is certainly some room for oil in cooking
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girlviernes wrote: »Fat is an essential macronutrient. It is important for bodily functions and satiety in the diet. As the american diet focused on reducing fat, obesity rates rose significantly: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24911982. One of the healthiest eating styles is mediterranean which is rich in olive oil. This is an important study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25316904 which showed improvement in metabolic functioning both in people who were given olive oil or nuts to add to their diets. High fat dairy may actually be protective against weight gain: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22893781
I'm not a proponent of any dietary extremes. I think we all need a balance of carb-fat-protein. Where the balance falls can vary, but there is certainly some room for oil in cooking
Of course my description of how I cook already demonstrates that I use oil, so I kinda feel like this is a bit of a straw man argument.
If I told you 100% oxygen causes damage to your lungs, would you try to explain to me that oxygen is an essential component of life and link me to articles?
Saying too much of something is bad is not the same thing as saying too little of it is good. The issue for many people is to expand outside of their own minds and lives and realize that what may be just enough of something for you could be too much for somebody else. I think that applies to more than just diet.
It isn't even a matter of where to set the limit of "just enough" for some dietary components when they are ubiquitous and all but unavoidable. Rather, it becomes a matter of where to set the limit for "too much". It is this point where we differ.
Differ physiologically, not philosophically.
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Well, my post was in response to your post stating that fat is evil. It was also made in the context of decades of low-fat recommendations that if you examine the literature actually do not have as firm a basis as previously thought. Thus, I would argue that for most people (barring a specific medical issue), the line of where fat is "too much" is higher than we have been taught.
Certainly, there is no need to add fat if you are already consuming foods that are naturally rich in it or eating out frequently...0 -
I read this last night and I've been thinking about it. I think the best answer I can give is: Do what works for you.
I could certainly be called a lazy dieter. I hate cooking, meal planning, grocery shopping, all of it. This has been my downfall from every diet I've ever tried. Weighing and logging is actually easier for me because I'm kind of a data geek.
But there are facts that I can't deny. One is that processed foods always have too much of something. From my perspective it's usually too many carbs or too much sodium. The other is that the "diet" meals are always lacking in something: not very filling, not very satisfying, or not very tasty.
Despite that, I still turn to Lean Cuisines or Atkins meals when my options are limited. I'll still get a salad at McDonald's if I don't have time to go home and make one. I don't consider any of these to be good choices, but sometimes they are the better alternatives and I just work them into the bigger picture.
I've been seriously yoyo dieting for about 6 years. With each attempt I go further than before. With each attempt I successfully develop some habit that makes the next attempt that much easier. I believe that eventually all the right habits will come together like pieces of a puzzle. But first I have to figure out which habits those are, and establish them one at a time. That's what works for me.
It's good to find out what others do. But at the end of the day, all that matters is what works for you.0 -
Hey, bro, are we good now?
You are my third favorite poster on this thread, but it is mainly because whenever I read one of your posts, all I can see in my mind is this guy:
http://static.fjcdn.com/gifs/*kitten*_b45621_2851629.gif
That's a chimp, and I love chimps.
My one strength goal is to be strong enough to pull a hipster's arm from their socket and beat them with it until the act becomes ironic.
So you going to commit to an update plan?
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girlviernes wrote: »Well, my post was in response to your post stating that fat is evil. It was also made in the context of decades of low-fat recommendations that if you examine the literature actually do not have as firm a basis as previously thought. Thus, I would argue that for most people (barring a specific medical issue), the line of where fat is "too much" is higher than we have been taught.
Which is why I asked for citations.0 -
So, let's shift gears a bit and turn up the heat. I see I've got most of Team Anti-Processed Food (aka TAPF) warmed up, so let's take it to the next level.
Why, EXACTLY, is it about "processed food" (that is specifically tailored for people who are diet conscious) bad? I'm not talking about frozen pizza and ice cream. I'm talking about... oh, you all already know exactly what I'm talking about.
So why is it bad?
Does their meat come from different animals?
Are their vegetables grown in different soil?
What is it specifically?
Or is it just dogma? Just something people have repeated over and over and you swallowed it all hook line and sinker without questioning? Was it something that used to be true years ago, but has changed over time? Is it something that only applies to some processed food, like Twinkies, but not others?
What are your thoughts. What really got TAPF angry enough to respond? What is it about responding with thoughtful, if not a bit facetious, responses to your posts instead of mindlessly agreeing with TAPF made you the most angry??
This is what I thought about your post when I first read it. You're just trying to rile people up----and show us how clever you are. Your Lean Cusine meals are great for you. I'm glad you found what works. Let us know when you hit goal. I wish you all the best with your tasty meals, but am not at all jealous, as I eat my own home cooked one.
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Or better yet, let us know when you've not only hit goal, because losing weight is the easy part, but let us know how it goes when you've been in maintenance for a few months or more... Sustainability is the key, here.0
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SherryTeach wrote: »This is why I batch cook and freeze single portions of several different main dishes. Then I can go through spells of being lazy and still be eating good food made with real food ingredients.
This! I have a ton of homemade frozen meals in my freezer ready to go. No bar code to scan, just click on my recipe when I log. (I know that that last statement will open a whole new can of worms seeing that the NEW and Improved recipe builder is ONLY new, NOT improved.)0 -
I am starting to get the sneaking suspicion that all those guys and gals that only eat fresh, non-processed home cooked food, really don't bother with keeping track of calories or nutritional content at all (or at best they are completely guessing most of the time).
I kinda get the sense that they are really just ballparking it. Like guessing that their caloric intake for the day was roughly somewhere between 1,500 and 1,800 calories (uhm, give or take about 1,000 calories in error one way or the other).
I can't prove that is the case, just a sneaking suspicion.
I predominantly eat meals I've prepared myself and incorporate a lot of fruits and veggies. I absolutely admit to ballparking it. I don't weigh anything (don't even own a food scale) and the closest I come to measuring is with my a measuring cup and spoons, and I don't even use those very often.
For me weighing/measuring would just be an extra step that I don't enjoy though I would do it if I had to. I've successfully lost and kept off a significant amount of weight without weighting so I don't think it would be a very useful tool for me.
I readily admit to being a bit lazy. Ballparking works for me. Processed foods probably wouldn't work for me because I'd get too hungry (I can eat a greater volume of food I make myself vs. processed food for the same caloric bang).
I say do whatever works for you, gets you results, and doesn't have a negative impact on your health (throwing that last one in there because my former coworker only ate lean cuisines for lunch and dinner and the amount of sodium in them made her blood pressure go up like crazy and she had problems with swelling/fluid retention).
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I figure, why would I eat frozen dinners when the food I cook tastes way better?
Also, we are a family of 6 and I am the main cook. I have lost nearly 89lbs so far with "home cookin'."0
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