Rotator cuff issues - particularly 'pushing' movements - not healing

geebusuk

My right hand rotator cuff (or that general area) has been painful for a while in certain positions.
I stopped doing weights over 4 months ago now as bench press and overhead press were obviously causing it problems and thus I also wasn't progressing on them.
Pull ups/rows didn't seem too bad and dips where somewhere inbetween - definitely not as bad as with arms pushing when in-front or above me.
I've just swung my arms about a bit and sitting on my sofa it feels worst if I hold the elbow at about 90 degrees with the forearm forward (as I was going to do a bench press, but at a position that would see the bar over my neck rather than chest).

Any suggestions on what the exact problem is likely to be and anything I can do to try and 'fix' it?

I did go to the doctor a while ago and he merely said "just rest it" and wouldn't offer anything more. Might try going again, but I doubt I'll get more without paying someone.

Also, would I be 'safe' to do weights that don't seem to cause it problems - ie pull ups etc.

tgmichelleee

bump

CharlieBeansmomTracey

look up rotator cuff exercises on youtube. they show how to strengthen the area,you can look and see if that is what is causing the pain ,you can look up videos on how to tell if that is what it could be as well. I would also find a dr that deals with sports medicine or an orthopedic surgeon and have them give you an exam to be sure. in your case get a second,3rd and 4th opinion if you have to.Its not something to mess with if it is your rotator cuff. the more you use it the more damage you will do.

Walter__

Four months of rest sounds like it's been long enough. I'd go find another doctor for a second opinion.

How'd you end up injuring it?

By the way in case you haven't yet, you may want to try a powerlifting-style bench press where you rest the weight on your traps and your shoulder blades are pulled together tight. It puts A LOT less stress on your shoulders. I had a friend with constant shoulder issues and once he started benching like this they went away.

Here's a few examples:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSN50sIwFz8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-WgUJbtiLY

emblu

Oky coky hun, I've seen plenty of people with rotator cuff injuries (mainly through rugby) and it usually involves seeing a decent doctor. If it's not healed in 4 months then it's definitely a trip to see a specialist as it's likely to need some serious treatment.
Sorry I don't want scare you but get yourself back to the doctors and demand to see someone, leave the weights alone as you will be more than likely making it worse.
Good luck and hope you get sorted soon x

tomatoey

go to a physiotherapist or sports med - they know muscles, tendons and bones better than GPs do.

cheshirecatastrophe

I do these rotator cuff exercises - for *prevention*. I use a pretty light resistance band, though, not the cable machines. The rule back when I was playing water polo, where RC injuries run rampant, was to do the work in advance because if you tear it, basically you're out. So I'd definitely be visiting a doctor if you're having pain at *rest* after so long away.

Good luck! I'm always skirting the line of overstressing my RC with swimming, so I have a vested interest in you being able to fix this.

AllanMisner

Find a sports doctor and/or physical therapist. And in the mean time, there is no reason to not do heavy squats.

EvgeniZyntx

I have lighter RC issues but found that this book helped me immensely.

http://www.amazon.com/Treat-Your-Own-Rotator-Cuff/dp/1598582062#

The exercise list in there is pretty good.

Packerjohn

As others have mentioned, see a good doctor. I'd suggest checking with a nearby university or HS to see what orthopedic surgeon their athletes use. This article shows several ways to train shoulders that are easier on the joint:

http://www.stack.com/2015/01/23/7-exercises-that-safely-build-shoulder-strength/?utm_content=bufferd0de7&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Ive had 6 shoulder operations and find exercises using neutral grip are easier on the shoulder, such as neutral grip chest press with dumbbells as opposed to a regular barbell.

BarrieLawrence

It may not be a rotator cuff at all but a bursitis. I had exactly the same symptoms for 12 months, saw a doctor who ordered an ultrasound and x-ray of the shoulder and then had it injected with a steroid (under ultrasound) to decrease the bursa size to normal. Rest for a further 2 weeks and it feels great. If it is this any exercise just makes it worse, you need treatment. Lots on the internet about treatment of bursitis.

geebusuk

First off thanks for all replies - I had taken a break from MFP for a bit around the end of 2014 with life getting busy.

Sadly the issue is still there, so now I'm making a real effort to sort it - stopped almost all exercise as a lot of things seem to make it flare up (though only noticeable a couple of days later, so can be hard to work out what caused it. Definitely not doing any mountain biking, rock climbing or motorcycle track riding for a bit.

Added to that recently I've had elbow pain, even when I haven't done much recently.

This also seems to be tendon related - matches for Tennis elbow from what I can tell.

sgt1372

geebusuk wrote: »

My right hand rotator cuff (or that general area) has been painful for a while in certain positions.

<nip>

Any suggestions on what the exact problem is likely to be and anything I can do to try and 'fix' it?

I did go to the doctor a while ago and he merely said "just rest it" and wouldn't offer anything more. Might try going again, but I doubt I'll get more without paying someone.

Also, would I be 'safe' to do weights that don't seem to cause it problems - ie pull ups etc.

Go back to your doctor, tell him the pain is still there and insist on an MRI.

I've had 2 rotator cuff surgeries; one in each shoulder. The 2nd rotator cuff injury was undiagnosed depsite an initial MRI. Received some steroid injections but the pain persisted. Went back after a YEAR! and told the doc the pain still existed and he ordered a high contrast MRI (using a dye) and a tear in the subscapularis tendon was found and later operated on. Took 3 years after surgery for pain to finally go away. Without doing this, the pain would still persist to this day.

Don't presume that if it doesn't hurt, it's ok to use your shoulder. If it's a chronic pain that does not "go away" after rest, then something is wrong and, even if you can do certain things w/o feeling acute pain, you can still aggravate the injury just by doing "just a little bit" more. It only takes one "wrong" movement or one "last" rep to do this.

So, if I were you, I would NOT anything that might further aggravate the injury until I get a clear picture of what is wrong and you'll only get this info with an MRI.

Good luck!

comptonelizabeth

Agree with the above - see a doctor or a physio,doctor preferable as you can then be referred for further tests.
I had a rotator cuff injury years ago and it took a long time to heal- it takes time and patience. Sometimes it's the result of a repetitive strain. Basically if it hurts,don't do it - at least until you've got a diagnosis

juliet3455

@geebusuk Since your original post was on November 6, 2014 5:23PM and you are still experiencing pain it's well overdue for Medical Intervention. Dr MFP and Dr Google should not be your primary source.

tomatoey wrote: »

go to a physiotherapist or sports med - they know muscles, tendons and bones better than GPs do.

AllanMisner wrote: »

Find a sports doctor and/or physical therapist.

comptonelizabeth wrote: »

Agree with the above - see a doctor or a physio,doctor preferable as you can then be referred for further tests. I had a rotator cuff injury years ago and it took a long time to heal- it takes time and patience. Sometimes it's the result of a repetitive strain. Basically if it hurts,don't do it - at least until you've got a diagnosis

Evamutt

I started having shoulder/arm pain a year ago on my right. Dr took xrays of neck thinking it's arthritis but i wasn't It hurt so bad, it would throb with pain, mainly when i sat on couch & rested it beside me. I re strarted taking glucosamin/condroitin & It hardly hurts any more, as long as I keep taking it. I take 2 a day. I get it from Costco

canadianlbs

AllanMisner wrote: »

Find a sports doctor and/or physical therapist. And in the mean time, there is no reason to not do heavy squats.

that would depend on what the issue is. shoulders are definitely not off the hook when you're doing back squats . . . or if they are, then you're doing them wrong.

i had a minor impingement thing in one shoulder for almost a year, and it definitely affected my squat. not only not good for the shoulder itself, but dysfunction in the shoulder made the rest of my form suck as well. and that in turn led to other issues elsewhere between my shoulders and feet.

BodayJohnnay

geebusuk wrote: »

My right hand rotator cuff (or that general area) has been painful for a while in certain positions.
I stopped doing weights over 4 months ago now as bench press and overhead press were obviously causing it problems and thus I also wasn't progressing on them.
Pull ups/rows didn't seem too bad and dips where somewhere inbetween - definitely not as bad as with arms pushing when in-front or above me.
I've just swung my arms about a bit and sitting on my sofa it feels worst if I hold the elbow at about 90 degrees with the forearm forward (as I was going to do a bench press, but at a position that would see the bar over my neck rather than chest).

Any suggestions on what the exact problem is likely to be and anything I can do to try and 'fix' it?

I did go to the doctor a while ago and he merely said "just rest it" and wouldn't offer anything more. Might try going again, but I doubt I'll get more without paying someone.

Also, would I be 'safe' to do weights that don't seem to cause it problems - ie pull ups etc.

Go get x-rays and mri scans done. Only true way to know if there is any impingement or tears. Wouldn't want to continue damaging and lengthening if torn. Dr is your friend.

Michael190lbs

I have been fighting this for months myself- Doing Needling/acupuncture this Tuesday-

Mri and xrays all fine its Brusitis and it sucks!! I have done cortizone and predizone its time for something to work!!

tarothelp

Go talk to chiro/physics even one appointment / assessment can help .... it's so useful to get advice from a real professional when lifting heavy weights you don't want a long term problem to develop!

geebusuk

Cheers for the further thoughts

Had a busy few weeks -
My living situation wasn't ideal for seeing doctors as I was 250 miles away from the one I was registered for, but not a permanent residence and it was hard to get anything bar emergency stuff.

Just resting has meant my left shoulder is ok now, at least for most normal stuff. Part of the problem was sleeping in my (since the start of the year ex-)girlfriend's bed and so on; made my shoulders a good bit worse to the point I had to sort out my own mattress etc at her place.

Now can get to see a doctor if I can get an appointment that is, so will see what they say.
Unfortuntely their budgets are pretty tight these days, so can be hard to get scans etc. I don't mind paying myself if I can be sure it'll be money well spent.

I've wondered about doing squats again (barely exercised recently and been off the weights for ages now) - but I definitely wouldn't want to hold the bar with my right arm. It's one of the things that won't hurt or will be barely hurt, but in reality will irriate it.

I've actually just tried doing some situps, thinking the shoulders should be really isolated, but even there I think it's causing a bit of a tweak to it!

comptonelizabeth

You could just do bodyweight squats?

geebusuk

Never really seen the point for strength gain.
Pistol squats maybe, but I'd prefer a weighted jacket, or to just make up some handles for my bar so I can hold my hands in a position that doesn't cause any problems.

Was getting the ex to sit on my shoulders for me to do squat, then holding heavier things while I was doing them (hmm, I wonder why I got the "it's not you it's me" thing? :P )

JB035

@geebusuk
I delt with shoulder pain for a while while doing the same movements. The problem turned out to be mobility issues and the muscles surrounding my shoulder blades were weak. I found that when doing bench or overhead press movements my shoulders were dropping out to a position that was causing a lot of issues. I started doing some band work for strengthening those areas on my back and also some mobility drills.

Problem is gone.

Also stopped doing bench for about a year and continued to do all other exercises.

nicolabradley87

Are you in the UK or the US? It could be something as simple as a chronic impingement which won't necessarily show up on scans, it could be a partial tear which would be best assessed with an ultrasound scan. It's unlikely to be a full tear from what you have said but obviously nothing can be ruled out via the internet!!

I would recommend seeing a physio, and also see your GP about the possibility of an ultrasound. If you're in the UK they will be much more inclined to send you for US than MRI and it's more likely to pick up a tear anyway. Partial tears can be rehabbed without surgery by physio most of the time, some incredible sports people have partial tears and don't have the surgery.

If the rehab doesn't work, surgery should be the final option as it's a long, tough recovery afterwards and often doesn't result in full recovery anyway. Do not use exercises from the Internet until you've seen a professional. If you have impingement and do the wrong exercises you can easily aggravate the problem.

I am a musculoskeletal physio so all of the above is the advice I would give any patient. The biggest thing is to see a professional! Chronic problems can be difficult to treat. Good luck!

geebusuk

Cheers JB035 - unfortunately since posting the first post I've been off all weights for some time and tried several sets of other exercises - one made it a good bit worse, others not much difference.

I'm in the UK. Cheers for the info Nicola.

Got a bit lost where I am in the thread, but while I was away from my normal GP I did get to see a GP that referred me to the local NHS physio place.

I think it was only because he was a locum and so it wasn't his budget they were spending!

An impingement was diagnosed. I was given exercises and some 'shoulder classes'. I didn't do the exercises as much as I should have, but did make a reasonable effort and didn't seem to help.

geebusuk

Got to see a doctor again today.

This was quite good - she told me the specific tendon which was likely the issue - so it's likely Supraspinatus tendinitis that I've got.

I've been taking 500mg Naproxen once a day - she's upped that to twice day (which I did have at one point, but caused some tummy issues and didn't seem to be getting better) and also said no exercise at all bar specific ones for this condition for 4 weeks*.

*Which is annoying... I do much better with 'CICO' if I can exercise, then eat cake .

We'll see how it goes!

Jm172017

Skip the medical doctor, go see a physical therapist. You definitely will waste less time and get a good answer by going to a PT asap. If you had questions on how to find a good one let me know. I'm a PT btw.