Tips to help Bench Press/OHP?
peachyfuzzle
Posts: 1,122 Member
So, I am doing Stronglifts 5x5, and I feel like my Squat/Deadlift/Row (doing Pendlays) are pretty good so far at 210x5/220x5/130x5. I've been able to hit 225 on both my Squat/DL for a single rep without dying feeling like I had a good amount of weight to spare, so I'm guessing my 1RM for those is somewhere around 240 - 250. However, my bench, and overhead press are severely lagging behind at 125x5/70x5.
I've been looking into it a little, and have seen that tricep work might help, so I have been adding a 3x8 tricep pushdown to my normal routine. I've only been doing this for a week though, so it's too early to tell if it is helping.
Anyone have suggestions for any other exercises that I could add on in addition to help out with my bench/ohp?
I realize that I'm cutting while losing a bunch of weight, so I know that will play a factor, but it just feels like those lifts, especially my bench, should be higher.
I've been looking into it a little, and have seen that tricep work might help, so I have been adding a 3x8 tricep pushdown to my normal routine. I've only been doing this for a week though, so it's too early to tell if it is helping.
Anyone have suggestions for any other exercises that I could add on in addition to help out with my bench/ohp?
I realize that I'm cutting while losing a bunch of weight, so I know that will play a factor, but it just feels like those lifts, especially my bench, should be higher.
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Replies
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for chest; chest flys, dips, decline and incline bench
for shoulders; lateral dumbbell raises, straight dumbbell raises, incline bench
are you OHPin and benching in the same day?0 -
I'll let more experienced/knowledgable people offer more detailed advice, but a few thoughts...
- OHP is hard for everyone. You should still be able to make progress, but don't expect it to be at or near the same weight as your other lifts.
- Bench is a much more technical lift than most people realize. Check some youtube vids on setup and lift technique.
- Both lifts, actually all the lifts you're doing, are compound lifts, meaning they work multiple muscle groups. So the lifts will be limited by the weakest link. While bench primarily works the chest... lat, shoulder and tri work will help.
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Dips, pull-ups, lat pull downs, and skull crushers. Pause benching helps a lot too.
Do you use leg drive when you bench, OP?
It's hard to make progress on the OHP, but what helps for upper body lifts is increasing the frequency of days you do them. The upper body tires out slower than the lower body and recovers faster, so you can get away with benching/OHP for 3x+ a week.0 -
Try bands. Practice exploding with lighter weight to help the initial part of the OHP lift.0
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for chest; chest flys, dips, decline and incline bench
for shoulders; lateral dumbbell raises, straight dumbbell raises, incline bench
are you OHPin and benching in the same day?
Nope. I bench on Row days, and OHP on DL days.Dips, pull-ups, lat pull downs, and skull crushers. Pause benching helps a lot too.
Do you use leg drive when you bench, OP?
It's hard to make progress on the OHP, but what helps for upper body lifts is increasing the frequency of days you do them. The upper body tires out slower than the lower body and recovers faster, so you can get away with benching/OHP for 3x+ a week.
I try to leg drive as much as possible, but could definitely see myself doing it incorrectly.
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Have you tried making videos and having someone check your form? This is a good place with a lot of experienced lifters:
community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/911984/form-critique-thread-post-your-videos-here0 -
I did not know that group existed. Thanks!0
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This might help : https://www.youtube.com/embed/34XRmd3a8_0?list=PLHKgLeLiJp_T_25oauJHz-IltwkKuJ2W-
She has the best explanation of leg drive that I've found. Her bench is insane-- 309+ lb. at 135 bodyweight. Woman crush.
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It's really hard to say without seeing a video but that's a pretty big disparity in your pressing versus pulling. I would also be curious to see how much "english" is going into your rows.
You don't need a ton of assistance exercises to get stronger, much of the above is overkill. With StrongLifts you're either benching or pressing twice per week depending on your timing. You're a very new lifter still so you sure as hell don't need accommodated resistance (bands / chains), you just need to get better at pressing because you're not very good at it right now and that's okay everybody has to learn.
General tips...
- Review videos on form and make sure you're using your entire body to stabilize yourself
- - leg drive in the bench
- - core activation in both
- - hand placement (may need to narrow or widen depending...)
- - correct breathing, very hard with the press
- - look at how fast your reps are, you might consider doing a 1-sec pause at the end of the eccentric movement before you press
- Improve your core strength. You'll be surprised at how much you can improve your lifts by doing that, squatting & DL'ing does not solve all core strength deficiencies. It doesn't have to be a lot either, one or two exercises is more than enough.
- Super-set ONE lat exercise with pressing exercises (pull-downs or chin-ups)
- Super-set ONE pressing assistance exercise with the rows or DL. (Kickbacks give you STD's, don't do them - Dips are great for helping improve both pressing exercises)
Pressing definitely gets very involved and most don't realize. Your Triceps are largely the prime movers and then other muscles come into play (bench - pecs, delts / press - delts / traps) and are very much supported by the lats.
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OHP is one that I find is most form dependent for me. Rip's book gave me some very good insight on where I was losing efficiency.0
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But, you're certainly not alone. Both of those lifts progressed slower for me. Much slower.0
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Thanks for the tips, and the video.
I don't think I'm leg driving as much as I should be, or arching my back as much as needed either. I will try to incorporate those.Sam_I_Am77 wrote: »It's really hard to say without seeing a video but that's a pretty big disparity in your pressing versus pulling. I would also be curious to see how much "english" is going into your rows.
What do yo mean by "english" exactly?
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peachyfuzzle wrote: »Thanks for the tips, and the video.
I don't think I'm leg driving as much as I should be, or arching my back as much as needed either. I will try to incorporate those.Sam_I_Am77 wrote: »It's really hard to say without seeing a video but that's a pretty big disparity in your pressing versus pulling. I would also be curious to see how much "english" is going into your rows.
What do yo mean by "english" exactly?
How much momentum are you getting from your legs and upper body to get the bar going? I'm just asking, not meaning to be rude, because there is such a huge difference between your Pendlay Row (220 x 5) and your Bench (125 x 5)0 -
Sam_I_Am77 wrote: »peachyfuzzle wrote: »Thanks for the tips, and the video.
I don't think I'm leg driving as much as I should be, or arching my back as much as needed either. I will try to incorporate those.Sam_I_Am77 wrote: »It's really hard to say without seeing a video but that's a pretty big disparity in your pressing versus pulling. I would also be curious to see how much "english" is going into your rows.
What do yo mean by "english" exactly?
How much momentum are you getting from your legs and upper body to get the bar going? I'm just asking, not meaning to be rude, because there is such a huge difference between your Pendlay Row (220 x 5) and your Bench (125 x 5)
I might have typed something incorrectly, but my Row is at 130 x 5. My DL is at 220 x 5.
I don't believe I generate much, if any momentum from my legs with my rows. I try to be extremely mindful of that while performing them.0 -
omg this is the correct discussion board for me too!!
I am basically a fail when it comes with pushing motion!
I can deadlift 315 on good days and squat 250-265 but benching is 170lb and OHP stuck on 120-25lb.
I try to incorporate the correct form e.g. for benching pinch shoulders in and down with slight arch followed by leg drive (still need to sort this out) but I still cannot perform the lifts properly to make me progress. For OHP, similar form as bench where I pinch and drop shoulders and go into lift tight but struggle big time as well. Any advice additional to the ones given would be a god send!
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peachyfuzzle wrote: »Sam_I_Am77 wrote: »peachyfuzzle wrote: »Thanks for the tips, and the video.
I don't think I'm leg driving as much as I should be, or arching my back as much as needed either. I will try to incorporate those.Sam_I_Am77 wrote: »It's really hard to say without seeing a video but that's a pretty big disparity in your pressing versus pulling. I would also be curious to see how much "english" is going into your rows.
What do yo mean by "english" exactly?
How much momentum are you getting from your legs and upper body to get the bar going? I'm just asking, not meaning to be rude, because there is such a huge difference between your Pendlay Row (220 x 5) and your Bench (125 x 5)
I might have typed something incorrectly, but my Row is at 130 x 5. My DL is at 220 x 5.
I don't believe I generate much, if any momentum from my legs with my rows. I try to be extremely mindful of that while performing them.
Okay, that makes a lot more sense to me then; I may have misread your post. With that being said, you most likely just need to work on your form. With the Bench you probably need to be a lot more stable and use your legs to help provide some of that stabilization. Also, get a little core work in; a set or two of front planks or side planks for time a couple times a week is plenty. Aside from that make sure you're eating and recovering well and you should be fine. You don't need anything crazy, Dips or 1 triceps assistance exercise at most, to improve your bench and press. You'll get it, those are the hardest to progress in general.
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omg this is the correct discussion board for me too!!
I am basically a fail when it comes with pushing motion!
I can deadlift 315 on good days and squat 250-265 but benching is 170lb and OHP stuck on 120-25lb.
I try to incorporate the correct form e.g. for benching pinch shoulders in and down with slight arch followed by leg drive (still need to sort this out) but I still cannot perform the lifts properly to make me progress. For OHP, similar form as bench where I pinch and drop shoulders and go into lift tight but struggle big time as well. Any advice additional to the ones given would be a god send!
If you are benching 170lbs, OHP of 120lbs sounds about right. Actually that's a pretty ratio. I can't match that ratio with my bench / OHP0 -
Considering I bench 315 and my OHP (Military press, no legs) is 175lbs I don't think you are doing bad at all. There is a ratio out there but I could not find it right now. I think you are progressing just find. The key is just keep doing them..the numbers will go up, especially doing 5x5..I exploded on that program.
Good luck0 -
I don't really see any problems with the numbers posted in this thread (krhn too). You're not gonna be able to bench and OHP nearly as much as you can squat/dl and you're not gonna progress nearly as fast with them either. If your squat and DL are only in the low 200s for reps then a bench in the low 100s for reps is typical. I don't know how long you've been lifting (not very long I'm guessing) but that's a very normal ratio.
If you want to bench 315, that's cool, but by the time you get there your squats or DL will probably be in the 500+ range (assuming equal dedication) and your OHP will probably be low low 200s. It's gonna be a few years of hard training between now and then though.0 -
I don't really see any problems with the numbers posted in this thread (krhn too). You're not gonna be able to bench and OHP nearly as much as you can squat/dl and you're not gonna progress nearly as fast with them either. If your squat and DL are only in the low 200s for reps then a bench in the low 100s for reps is typical. I don't know how long you've been lifting (not very long I'm guessing) but that's a very normal ratio.
If you want to bench 315, that's cool, but by the time you get there your squats or DL will probably be in the 500+ range (assuming equal dedication) and your OHP will probably be low low 200s. It's gonna be a few years of hard training between now and then though.
I guess so, I mean I officially stuck to lifting 1 and half years ago although it was more geared towards bodybuilding therefore never really focussed on 5x5 until a few months back - its just a bit degrading to see that physique wise, I am quite muscular in this sense (relative to what I think obviously) but see people half my size lift as much if not more than me... Oh the mind loves to play games
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I don't really see any problems with the numbers posted in this thread
Initially when I read the thread I read it as he rowing 220 x 5 and only benching 125 x 5, misread. If that were true that would be an incredible variant and would need some work.
Pressing is tough and usually lags behind the others. The other frustrating thing is that often when you're rollin'-along strongly in one lift another lift will suck. Strength can be very trendy and look like a stock-market chart at times, you just have to roll with the punches.
The best bet is to set yourself up for long-term success.
- Good programming
- proper form
- good recovery
- be smart0 -
I don't really see any problems with the numbers posted in this thread (krhn too). You're not gonna be able to bench and OHP nearly as much as you can squat/dl and you're not gonna progress nearly as fast with them either. If your squat and DL are only in the low 200s for reps then a bench in the low 100s for reps is typical. I don't know how long you've been lifting (not very long I'm guessing) but that's a very normal ratio.
If you want to bench 315, that's cool, but by the time you get there your squats or DL will probably be in the 500+ range (assuming equal dedication) and your OHP will probably be low low 200s. It's gonna be a few years of hard training between now and then though.
I guess so, I mean I officially stuck to lifting 1 and half years ago although it was more geared towards bodybuilding therefore never really focussed on 5x5 until a few months back - its just a bit degrading to see that physique wise, I am quite muscular in this sense (relative to what I think obviously) but see people half my size lift as much if not more than me... Oh the mind loves to play games
This is pretty typical too. Doing hypertrophy-based movements will make you stronger to a dgree but as you know, the focus is on muscle building only. Someone focused on strength-based training will always have a significant advantage. Muscle mass actually has fairly little to do with strength and power (to a point). However, with the mass you have you should be able to train it effectively and be both big AND strong 0 -
If you're looking to build a bigger bench, you'll want to put in more back work. You'll need a solid foundation to bench from. I've heard recommendations as high at a 2:1 ratio of back to chest work. Rows, band pulls, rear delt work can help here.
As was mentioned, you'll want to make sure you are in a proper bench press "stance (decreasing the distance the weight needs to be pushed). These adjustments alone shot my bench from the high 300's to the mid 400's.
As far as the OHP, a lot of that is about form. Seems like too many take too wide of a grip.0 -
i spend an entire workout just on triceps for my bench. and one entire workout just on my lats. wide grip pull ups are my best friend. lats lats lats, And form and technique is super super super important. 99 % of the people see in the gym have horrible bench form. Its all about the form. Another huge factor is learning to engage every muscle before starting the lift, you'll get huge gains just by learning how to control that muscle engagement and keep it engaged, and keep your form through the lift. Learning to engage and use your lats on the bench will give you a huge jump in gains.0
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I think you're doing fine...just keep plugging away.
Patience and use the good program you've chosen.0 -
peachyfuzzle wrote: »However, my bench, and overhead press are severely lagging behind at 125x5/70x5.
What part of the lift are you struggling with? Is it getting the weight off your chest or extending it up on straight arms? I'm quite positive, though, that you are mainly limited by technique.
I would recommend adding dips and pull ups to your routine. Assisted, if full bodyweight work is too heavy.I can deadlift 315 on good days and squat 250-265 but benching is 170lb and OHP stuck on 120-25lb.
This sounds perfectly fine, don't change anything. Just keep at it.0 -
As you're a beginner, your issue is likely to be lifting technique.
Forget add anything else, improve your technique and the numbers will go up.0 -
http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/video/platform_learning_to_press_2.0
I found this really helpful a couple years ago when I stalled on the OHP0 -
little_simon wrote: »As you're a beginner, your issue is likely to be lifting technique.
Forget add anything else, improve your technique and the numbers will go up.
From what I'm learning, it might be challenges with rotator cuff musculature too.0 -
I'll let more experienced/knowledgable people offer more detailed advice, but a few thoughts...
- OHP is hard for everyone. You should still be able to make progress, but don't expect it to be at or near the same weight as your other lifts.
- Bench is a much more technical lift than most people realize. Check some youtube vids on setup and lift technique.
- Both lifts, actually all the lifts you're doing, are compound lifts, meaning they work multiple muscle groups. So the lifts will be limited by the weakest link. While bench primarily works the chest... lat, shoulder and tri work will help.
lots of wisdom in this post here.0
This discussion has been closed.
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