I'm trying to bulk , gain weight & make my abs show
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I had this old school trainer who would always tell the skinnier kids who lifted with us a SIMPLE trick to put on weight:
Buy 2 loafs of white bread a jar of PB, a jar of jelly and a 1 gallon jug of whole milk a week.
Eat exactly what you've been eating, but simply add a generous PBJ sandwiched and 16 ozs of milk to your diet RIGHT BEFORE BED.
We always made fun of him, but damn.....it worked. Think about it, that gives you all your macros, it's high calorie and fairly slow digesting to help stave off break down over the nigh time hours a lot with high metabolism suffer from.
You really want to get technical and assuming you are lifting fairly hard, add a scoop of Casein protein to the milk.0 -
I had this old school trainer who would always tell the skinnier kids who lifted with us a SIMPLE trick to put on weight:
Buy 2 loafs of white bread a jar of PB, a jar of jelly and a 1 gallon jug of whole milk a week.
Eat exactly what you've been eating, but simply add a generous PBJ sandwiched and 16 ozs of milk to your diet RIGHT BEFORE BED.
We always made fun of him, but damn.....it worked. Think about it, that gives you all your macros, it's high calorie and fairly slow digesting to help stave off break down over the nigh time hours a lot with high metabolism suffer from.
You really want to get technical and assuming you are lifting fairly hard, add a scoop of Casein protein to the milk.
Aside from the timing thing, which is actually irrelevant since you body isn't going to break down over night time, the idea is pretty good. You've just added about 500 calories to your intake and if you assume that you were eating at maintenance, you have enough of a surplus for a 1 pound/week gain.
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ramdettmer751 wrote: »No don't go eating fast food or anything you see. Head to the market and buy things that are high in carbs and food with good protein. I normally get wild caught salmon, red meat and chicken breast. If you want good carbs get some whole grain spaghetti noodles and tomato sauce. The money you spend into fast food could just go into something more healthier while bulking which is what I've been doing &it helps keep you from having so much fat that it would be a lot more difficult to get rid of in the future. So eat clean while you can.
good luck getting into a surplus "eating clean" ....
what are "good" carbs...??????????
Easy. Complex carbs are the good ones that you should be getting. Its a slow digesting form of carbs so it gives your body plenty of energy. Simple carbs are things like soda, artificial syrups or anything white bread, rice etc. When people say eat more carbs, its like thinking you can eat a bunch of cake which contains simple carbs those are the bad ones. But if you're on a bulk its ok to always have a limited amount of white bread after a workout since it digests faster. If you really wanna get in extra calories then make your own weight gainer its easy.0 -
ramdettmer751 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »No don't go eating fast food or anything you see. Head to the market and buy things that are high in carbs and food with good protein. I normally get wild caught salmon, red meat and chicken breast. If you want good carbs get some whole grain spaghetti noodles and tomato sauce. The money you spend into fast food could just go into something more healthier while bulking which is what I've been doing &it helps keep you from having so much fat that it would be a lot more difficult to get rid of in the future. So eat clean while you can.
good luck getting into a surplus "eating clean" ....
what are "good" carbs...??????????
Easy. Complex carbs are the good ones that you should be getting. Its a slow digesting form of carbs so it gives your body plenty of energy. Simple carbs are things like soda, artificial syrups or anything white bread, rice etc. When people say eat more carbs, its like thinking you can eat a bunch of cake which contains simple carbs those are the bad ones. But if you're on a bulk its ok to always have a limited amount of white bread after a workout since it digests faster. If you really wanna get in extra calories then make your own weight gainer its easy.
No, some of what you say is kind of right but most of it is incorrect and you need to learn more about nutrition.0 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »No don't go eating fast food or anything you see. Head to the market and buy things that are high in carbs and food with good protein. I normally get wild caught salmon, red meat and chicken breast. If you want good carbs get some whole grain spaghetti noodles and tomato sauce. The money you spend into fast food could just go into something more healthier while bulking which is what I've been doing &it helps keep you from having so much fat that it would be a lot more difficult to get rid of in the future. So eat clean while you can.
good luck getting into a surplus "eating clean" ....
what are "good" carbs...??????????
Easy. Complex carbs are the good ones that you should be getting. Its a slow digesting form of carbs so it gives your body plenty of energy. Simple carbs are things like soda, artificial syrups or anything white bread, rice etc. When people say eat more carbs, its like thinking you can eat a bunch of cake which contains simple carbs those are the bad ones. But if you're on a bulk its ok to always have a limited amount of white bread after a workout since it digests faster. If you really wanna get in extra calories then make your own weight gainer its easy.
No, some of what you say is kind of right but most of it is incorrect and you need to learn more about nutrition.
Feel free to correct me then but what is incorrect?0 -
ramdettmer751 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »No don't go eating fast food or anything you see. Head to the market and buy things that are high in carbs and food with good protein. I normally get wild caught salmon, red meat and chicken breast. If you want good carbs get some whole grain spaghetti noodles and tomato sauce. The money you spend into fast food could just go into something more healthier while bulking which is what I've been doing &it helps keep you from having so much fat that it would be a lot more difficult to get rid of in the future. So eat clean while you can.
good luck getting into a surplus "eating clean" ....
what are "good" carbs...??????????
Easy. Complex carbs are the good ones that you should be getting. Its a slow digesting form of carbs so it gives your body plenty of energy. Simple carbs are things like soda, artificial syrups or anything white bread, rice etc. When people say eat more carbs, its like thinking you can eat a bunch of cake which contains simple carbs those are the bad ones. But if you're on a bulk its ok to always have a limited amount of white bread after a workout since it digests faster. If you really wanna get in extra calories then make your own weight gainer its easy.
No, some of what you say is kind of right but most of it is incorrect and you need to learn more about nutrition.
Feel free to correct me then but what is incorrect?
there is nothing wrong or bad about white bread or white rice….
but I will let wheel correct the rest….0 -
ramdettmer751 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »No don't go eating fast food or anything you see. Head to the market and buy things that are high in carbs and food with good protein. I normally get wild caught salmon, red meat and chicken breast. If you want good carbs get some whole grain spaghetti noodles and tomato sauce. The money you spend into fast food could just go into something more healthier while bulking which is what I've been doing &it helps keep you from having so much fat that it would be a lot more difficult to get rid of in the future. So eat clean while you can.
good luck getting into a surplus "eating clean" ....
what are "good" carbs...??????????
Easy. Complex carbs are the good ones that you should be getting. Its a slow digesting form of carbs so it gives your body plenty of energy. Simple carbs are things like soda, artificial syrups or anything white bread, rice etc. When people say eat more carbs, its like thinking you can eat a bunch of cake which contains simple carbs those are the bad ones. But if you're on a bulk its ok to always have a limited amount of white bread after a workout since it digests faster. If you really wanna get in extra calories then make your own weight gainer its easy.
No, some of what you say is kind of right but most of it is incorrect and you need to learn more about nutrition.
Feel free to correct me then but what is incorrect?
To start the classification of good/bad is not scientific but moralistic and your description of simple vs complex is loose and mostly incorrect. Simple carbs are monosaccharides (most importantly glucose) and disaccharides such as table sugar while complex carbs are longer chains i.e polymers. Simple vs complex is an antiquated classification system and speed of digestion depends on things other than complexity since some complex carbs can be absorbed very quickly.
There is a lot to the subject so I'm not going to go into a thesis here but just ask you to do some more research.
ETA the two main categories of complex carbs are starches and cellulose0 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »I had this old school trainer who would always tell the skinnier kids who lifted with us a SIMPLE trick to put on weight:
Buy 2 loafs of white bread a jar of PB, a jar of jelly and a 1 gallon jug of whole milk a week.
Eat exactly what you've been eating, but simply add a generous PBJ sandwiched and 16 ozs of milk to your diet RIGHT BEFORE BED.
We always made fun of him, but damn.....it worked. Think about it, that gives you all your macros, it's high calorie and fairly slow digesting to help stave off break down over the nigh time hours a lot with high metabolism suffer from.
You really want to get technical and assuming you are lifting fairly hard, add a scoop of Casein protein to the milk.
Aside from the timing thing, which is actually irrelevant since you body isn't going to break down over night time, the idea is pretty good. You've just added about 500 calories to your intake and if you assume that you were eating at maintenance, you have enough of a surplus for a 1 pound/week gain.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22330017
It doesn't necessarily ascribe the difference of breaking down (catabolism) or not, so whatever regarding that, but the data is fairly clear that in this case taking protein before bed helps.0 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »I had this old school trainer who would always tell the skinnier kids who lifted with us a SIMPLE trick to put on weight:
Buy 2 loafs of white bread a jar of PB, a jar of jelly and a 1 gallon jug of whole milk a week.
Eat exactly what you've been eating, but simply add a generous PBJ sandwiched and 16 ozs of milk to your diet RIGHT BEFORE BED.
We always made fun of him, but damn.....it worked. Think about it, that gives you all your macros, it's high calorie and fairly slow digesting to help stave off break down over the nigh time hours a lot with high metabolism suffer from.
You really want to get technical and assuming you are lifting fairly hard, add a scoop of Casein protein to the milk.
Aside from the timing thing, which is actually irrelevant since you body isn't going to break down over night time, the idea is pretty good. You've just added about 500 calories to your intake and if you assume that you were eating at maintenance, you have enough of a surplus for a 1 pound/week gain.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22330017
It doesn't necessarily ascribe the difference of breaking down (catabolism) or not, so whatever regarding that, but the data is fairly clear that in this case taking protein before bed helps.
Yes, I am aware of the research and that there is a small recovery boost with both fast and slow absorbing proteins taken before bed or right after a workout but it's not necessary and isn't going to of much practical significance to anyone who is not a high performance athlete. However, this doesn't mean that the body is breaking down over night.
The most significant factor was the increase in calories not the timing of the protein intake.
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Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »I had this old school trainer who would always tell the skinnier kids who lifted with us a SIMPLE trick to put on weight:
Buy 2 loafs of white bread a jar of PB, a jar of jelly and a 1 gallon jug of whole milk a week.
Eat exactly what you've been eating, but simply add a generous PBJ sandwiched and 16 ozs of milk to your diet RIGHT BEFORE BED.
We always made fun of him, but damn.....it worked. Think about it, that gives you all your macros, it's high calorie and fairly slow digesting to help stave off break down over the nigh time hours a lot with high metabolism suffer from.
You really want to get technical and assuming you are lifting fairly hard, add a scoop of Casein protein to the milk.
Aside from the timing thing, which is actually irrelevant since you body isn't going to break down over night time, the idea is pretty good. You've just added about 500 calories to your intake and if you assume that you were eating at maintenance, you have enough of a surplus for a 1 pound/week gain.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22330017
It doesn't necessarily ascribe the difference of breaking down (catabolism) or not, so whatever regarding that, but the data is fairly clear that in this case taking protein before bed helps.
Yes, I am aware of the research and that there is a small recovery boost with both fast and slow absorbing proteins taken before bed or right after a workout but it's not necessary and isn't going to of much practical significance to anyone who is not a high performance athlete. However, this doesn't mean that the body is breaking down over night.
The most significant factor was the increase in calories not the timing of the protein intake.
I don't think this study had anything to do with calories...and I am not trying to pick a cut and paste fight, but the change wasn't that small actually. I think it was a ~20-25% jump in synthesis....that's actually fairly large relative to variance.
As far as it only being applicable to elite athletes, I don't really follow why that would be so.0 -
ramdettmer751 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »No don't go eating fast food or anything you see. Head to the market and buy things that are high in carbs and food with good protein. I normally get wild caught salmon, red meat and chicken breast. If you want good carbs get some whole grain spaghetti noodles and tomato sauce. The money you spend into fast food could just go into something more healthier while bulking which is what I've been doing &it helps keep you from having so much fat that it would be a lot more difficult to get rid of in the future. So eat clean while you can.
good luck getting into a surplus "eating clean" ....
what are "good" carbs...??????????
Easy. Complex carbs are the good ones that you should be getting. Its a slow digesting form of carbs so it gives your body plenty of energy. Simple carbs are things like soda, artificial syrups or anything white bread, rice etc. When people say eat more carbs, its like thinking you can eat a bunch of cake which contains simple carbs those are the bad ones. But if you're on a bulk its ok to always have a limited amount of white bread after a workout since it digests faster. If you really wanna get in extra calories then make your own weight gainer its easy.
No, some of what you say is kind of right but most of it is incorrect and you need to learn more about nutrition.
Feel free to correct me then but what is incorrect?
You are thinking about things as good and bad and it makes logic skewed at times. Take into consideration that you could be looking at 3k-3500 to get a good surplus in and saying things like "limit quick digesting carbs" might actually be what some people need to avoid in order to be able to get that much food in. Then everyone likes to label processed food or white carbs as bad because of the insulin response but we are bulking no? So many tend to not realize the importance that insulin plays in this game.
Without insulin you cannot build muscle but that fact gets lost amid the noise.0 -
eat more and pull your pants up
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Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »I had this old school trainer who would always tell the skinnier kids who lifted with us a SIMPLE trick to put on weight:
Buy 2 loafs of white bread a jar of PB, a jar of jelly and a 1 gallon jug of whole milk a week.
Eat exactly what you've been eating, but simply add a generous PBJ sandwiched and 16 ozs of milk to your diet RIGHT BEFORE BED.
We always made fun of him, but damn.....it worked. Think about it, that gives you all your macros, it's high calorie and fairly slow digesting to help stave off break down over the nigh time hours a lot with high metabolism suffer from.
You really want to get technical and assuming you are lifting fairly hard, add a scoop of Casein protein to the milk.
Aside from the timing thing, which is actually irrelevant since you body isn't going to break down over night time, the idea is pretty good. You've just added about 500 calories to your intake and if you assume that you were eating at maintenance, you have enough of a surplus for a 1 pound/week gain.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22330017
It doesn't necessarily ascribe the difference of breaking down (catabolism) or not, so whatever regarding that, but the data is fairly clear that in this case taking protein before bed helps.
Yes, I am aware of the research and that there is a small recovery boost with both fast and slow absorbing proteins taken before bed or right after a workout but it's not necessary and isn't going to of much practical significance to anyone who is not a high performance athlete. However, this doesn't mean that the body is breaking down over night.
The most significant factor was the increase in calories not the timing of the protein intake.
I don't think this study had anything to do with calories...and I am not trying to pick a cut and paste fight, but the change wasn't that small actually. I think it was a ~20-25% jump in synthesis....that's actually fairly large relative to variance.
As far as it only being applicable to elite athletes, I don't really follow why that would be so.
I hope you don't feel this is a fight as that's not my intent here. Meal timing just isn't a big thing in reality and the jump really isn't what it seems to be. It doesn't mean that they were gaining that much more muscle, or actually any more muscle for that matter, in reality since they were only looking at protein synthesis at night and NOT over all protein synthesis for the day. The timing of synthesis isn't as important as overall synthesis and there is no indication in this study that this was different between the two groups.
ETA as far as athletes I mention this because there may be small benefits that would interest those at the elite level but would have little effect for anyone else.0 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »No don't go eating fast food or anything you see. Head to the market and buy things that are high in carbs and food with good protein. I normally get wild caught salmon, red meat and chicken breast. If you want good carbs get some whole grain spaghetti noodles and tomato sauce. The money you spend into fast food could just go into something more healthier while bulking which is what I've been doing &it helps keep you from having so much fat that it would be a lot more difficult to get rid of in the future. So eat clean while you can.
good luck getting into a surplus "eating clean" ....
what are "good" carbs...??????????
Easy. Complex carbs are the good ones that you should be getting. Its a slow digesting form of carbs so it gives your body plenty of energy. Simple carbs are things like soda, artificial syrups or anything white bread, rice etc. When people say eat more carbs, its like thinking you can eat a bunch of cake which contains simple carbs those are the bad ones. But if you're on a bulk its ok to always have a limited amount of white bread after a workout since it digests faster. If you really wanna get in extra calories then make your own weight gainer its easy.
No, some of what you say is kind of right but most of it is incorrect and you need to learn more about nutrition.
Feel free to correct me then but what is incorrect?
You are thinking about things as good and bad and it makes logic skewed at times. Take into consideration that you could be looking at 3k-3500 to get a good surplus in and saying things like "limit quick digesting carbs" might actually be what some people need to avoid in order to be able to get that much food in. Then everyone likes to label processed food or white carbs as bad because of the insulin response but we are bulking no? So many tend to not realize the importance that insulin plays in this game.
Without insulin you cannot build muscle but that fact gets lost amid the noise.
More important that just insulin is leptin and its regulatory effect on a whole host of hormones and neurotransmitters. Trying to fear monger carbohydrates is just plain reckless.0 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »ramdettmer751 wrote: »No don't go eating fast food or anything you see. Head to the market and buy things that are high in carbs and food with good protein. I normally get wild caught salmon, red meat and chicken breast. If you want good carbs get some whole grain spaghetti noodles and tomato sauce. The money you spend into fast food could just go into something more healthier while bulking which is what I've been doing &it helps keep you from having so much fat that it would be a lot more difficult to get rid of in the future. So eat clean while you can.
good luck getting into a surplus "eating clean" ....
what are "good" carbs...??????????
Easy. Complex carbs are the good ones that you should be getting. Its a slow digesting form of carbs so it gives your body plenty of energy. Simple carbs are things like soda, artificial syrups or anything white bread, rice etc. When people say eat more carbs, its like thinking you can eat a bunch of cake which contains simple carbs those are the bad ones. But if you're on a bulk its ok to always have a limited amount of white bread after a workout since it digests faster. If you really wanna get in extra calories then make your own weight gainer its easy.
No, some of what you say is kind of right but most of it is incorrect and you need to learn more about nutrition.
Feel free to correct me then but what is incorrect?
You are thinking about things as good and bad and it makes logic skewed at times. Take into consideration that you could be looking at 3k-3500 to get a good surplus in and saying things like "limit quick digesting carbs" might actually be what some people need to avoid in order to be able to get that much food in. Then everyone likes to label processed food or white carbs as bad because of the insulin response but we are bulking no? So many tend to not realize the importance that insulin plays in this game.
Without insulin you cannot build muscle but that fact gets lost amid the noise.
More important that just insulin is leptin and its regulatory effect on a whole host of hormones and neurotransmitters. Trying to fear monger carbohydrates is just plain reckless.
I never really see much written about Leptin during a bulk though. Maybe it's because we usually keep our carbs so much higher on a bulk than on a cut?
Yeah, on a bulk most sane people know that carbs are king. But it is just another thing to understand about carbs; that they keep leptin levels high. Just another reason NOT to fear carbs, ANY carbs...even the unclean ones. LOL!0 -
The funny thing I think is that the DIY mass gainer shakes are typically a lot higher fat than a mass produced one. I'd say that is because dextrose is not popular anymore. However, if I was bulking and I was not insulin resistant I'd want my extra calories to come from carbs for their energy and anaerobic performance benefits.
OP: track your cals. Work out your average cals over a 2 week period that you maintain weight at. Now add 250 or so per day and track your weight changes over the following 2 weeks. I am assuming that you are on some sort of resistance training program? (Ice cream fitness 5x5 is a good beginner one IMO)
Check out this article for maximum rates of lbm gain per month and work out your goals from there. When you reach the upper limit of your bf% ( that you accept), keep the training the same and drop the cals to slightly under maintenance. Do this for as long as it take to get bigger and stay relatively lean.
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/whats-my-genetic-muscular-potential.html/0 -
To all you guys with the helpful tips and all that thanks. Also, for the guys arguing about insulin for gains or what not, is it that serious & isn't wheat bread better than white. All these helpful ideas and I'm still trying to see what's best for me. Here's a picture of the protein and mass gainer that some people say isn't helpful.
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