Strength training: what do you think about this article?
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I read something by Lyle McDonald where he said training once every five days might work for some people; he says "my preferred training frequency for the majority of folks seeking optimal size gains: somewhere between once every 5th day and twice per week."
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/training-frequency-for-mass-gains.html/
Hit Each Muscle Group Between Every 5th Day and Twice Per Week
He's still training more than once per week, where the article is talking about just one single training session per week. Lyle trains several days a week, he just only hits each body part every 5th day.0 -
The idea the 60% returns makes sense is really misleading.
Even with a program where training results diminish over time after several cycles of those suboptimal returns you are going to end up with a lot lower results.
Obviously pulling a model out of my ear in the graph above but try the math to convince yourself. Those 60% returns on training? Not so good.
Yeah, in that case Dan will have a 200%+ greater strength increase than Bob... I'll pass... I'm already not going to go to amazing levels, but I should half my limited potential?
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Most of the groups were 21 year olds. One test only had untrained women do a single set of leg press (6-10 reps) either once or twice a week for 8 weeks. Another was done on senior citizens (average age was 70). I didn't see any studies done on an average group of adults with the exercises structured like most people should normally workout.
No *kitten*? That's what this book is based on? I wouldn't give this book that much credit unless you fall into one of those populations.0 -
Sounds like HIT jedi stuff, all it needs is Super Slow™ Fred Hahn style0
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Sam_I_Am77 wrote: »Most of the groups were 21 year olds. One test only had untrained women do a single set of leg press (6-10 reps) either once or twice a week for 8 weeks. Another was done on senior citizens (average age was 70). I didn't see any studies done on an average group of adults with the exercises structured like most people should normally workout.
No *kitten*? That's what this book is based on? I wouldn't give this book that much credit unless you fall into one of those populations.
Yep. Conclusion from one of the studies was that a 21 year old training one time per week was as effective as an adult training 2-3 times per week. No *kitten*.0 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »
And that's great for you, but some of us are the opposite: I now rely mainly on heavy lifting and cardio is just for heart-health and done minimally per week. Neither method is right or wrong; do what works for you.
I say, if you dislike lifting just start doing the once per week thing. See how it goes. This is just my opinion, but once I started seeing muscle definition it made me want to lift heavier and more frequently. You may change your mind after you get into it for a while. Can't hurt to try, right?0 -
You might be able to maintain strength by training 1 day a week if you aren't very strong to begin with but if you want to have any appreciable amount of strength or muscle mass you are going to need to lift more frequently than that.
Not necessarily so, in regards to strength. You can gain appreciable strength with 1x per week training, but it's going to be really, really slow going. And, of course, if when you begin you are a complete newbie, you'll gain more and faster than if you already have some training just like any other program.
Back before I had any interest in losing weight or getting fit, I signed up for a 1x per week weights session as an incentive to encourage a family member to start weight training. Over about a year and a half, I went from 30 lb reps to 120 lb reps for lat pull-down and being able to do 3 strict form pull ups (I weighed ~125 lbs by then). Not bad, considering.0 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »The idea the 60% returns makes sense is really misleading.
Even with a program where training results diminish over time after several cycles of those suboptimal returns you are going to end up with a lot lower results.
Obviously pulling a model out of my ear in the graph above but try the math to convince yourself. Those 60% returns on training? Not so good.
Yeah, in that case Dan will have a 200%+ greater strength increase than Bob... I'll pass... I'm already not going to go to amazing levels, but I should half my limited potential?
Looking at that model, it appears you are taking 60% of the diminishing returns each cycle, and the max potential return is the same for both people. I'm not sure it would work that way. It would seem like with more rest, and a lower increase in strength each cycle, the lazy person should have a potential return greater than the potential return of the other person for every cycle except for the first. So the difference between the two over time would diminish faster.
for example (WAG)
cycle/lazy person %return/other person %return
1/25%/25%
2/24%/23%
3/23%/20%
Basically, if you want to at least maintain strength, think it'd be nice to gain strength but you're not too bothered by how much or how long it takes, 1x per week could be a really nice program.
edited for formatting, grammar, other such screwups0 -
I would have appreciated an abstract, or executive summary, or something along those lines.
I'm one of those who don't enjoy strength training all that much, and I don't have a good place to do it anyhow-company gym is pretty lacking. I'm mainly interested in burning calories and preserving LBM, not really gaining strength. In that case more cardio and shorter less frequent targeted lifting might be appropriate.
I'm going to consider cutting down my lifting regimen a little based on this and we'll see where it gets me.0 -
You might be able to maintain strength by training 1 day a week if you aren't very strong to begin with but if you want to have any appreciable amount of strength or muscle mass you are going to need to lift more frequently than that.
Not necessarily so, in regards to strength. You can gain appreciable strength with 1x per week training, but it's going to be really, really slow going. And, of course, if when you begin you are a complete newbie, you'll gain more and faster than if you already have some training just like any other program.
Back before I had any interest in losing weight or getting fit, I signed up for a 1x per week weights session as an incentive to encourage a family member to start weight training. Over about a year and a half, I went from 30 lb reps to 120 lb reps for lat pull-down and being able to do 3 strict form pull ups (I weighed ~125 lbs by then). Not bad, considering.
Again- going from nothing to doing something- of course you'll see gains. How is that even a question or cause for pause. But can you imagine how much greater you success had been had you been more dedicated and applied yourself a little more?0 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »why would I want to get the absolute lowest and slowest amount of gains available?
That's the thing, it's not the absolute lowest. It's more than half, which is pretty respectable - no reason to shy away from strength training because it's "too much effort to be worth it". and why? Because people have different goals. That's like professional bodybuilders and powerlifters wondering why hobbyists do so little.
by definition, it's the absolute lowest. unless of course i missed the amount of gains to be had by training zero times per week or something.
"half" sounds nice until you put it in context. if I'm benching 400, then someone that doesn't aspire to that might think, "well damn, repping 200 sounds plenty strong to me." yeah, except it took me forever to get to 400. Getting there took a lot of work and was frustrating as all hell.
and now you tellin me that it's going to take twice was long as forever to get there? or the same amount of years, effort, sweat and pain to get half the results? yeeeeeeeah, i would have quit way before getting to 200.0 -
*sigh*amusedmonkey wrote: »why would I want to get the absolute lowest and slowest amount of gains available?
That's the thing, it's not the absolute lowest. It's more than half, which is pretty respectable - no reason to shy away from strength training because it's "too much effort to be worth it". and why? Because people have different goals. That's like professional bodybuilders and powerlifters wondering why hobbyists do so little.
No.
and the attempted analogy actually doesn't work. lulz.0 -
I'm late to the party but here goes...
If you can get 100% gains why not put out the extra effort to do so? In that context the article annoys me a bit.
HOWEVER something is always better than nothing. If this news gets people to work out once a week that might otherwise not worked out at all because they for whatever reason weren't going to work out three or four times a week that's a good thing.
So... yeah my thoughts are a bit mixed.0 -
The article really reads like someone trying to validate a desire to half *kitten* and be lazy.0
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The article really reads like someone trying to validate a desire to half *kitten* and be lazy.
Depends how you are looking at it. For me it was encouraging and motivating. It meant taking my training from an attempted 1 week then quitting for months due to boredom before attempting again to a sustainable every week of doing less. That's not lazy, that's being true to someone's goals and preferences. I have no desire to squat my body weight. I see no personal reason for that. Some people have that goal and more, and it's alright. Other people don't, and that's alright too. All I want is to lose less muscle as I lose weight and to have an easier time moving heavier things around the house, none of which weighs 200 pounds.0 -
It's all pretty simple really if you like the idea behind the article try it and see if it works for you... if not... don 't0
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