Debating unlimited fruits and veggies, like on WW. Thoughts???

fishshark

beachhouse758 wrote: »

ahamm002 wrote: »

It depends on your goals. If you're obese and eat a generally unhealthy diet, then WW's tactic of not counting fruits and veggies is probably great. It gets people into the habit of eating healthier and probably won't hinder weight loss.

Now if you're already pretty healthy and lean, and just trying to get a bit leaner to look great in a swim suit than you should log everything.

I agree.

Also, different approaches work for different people.

I have to log everything. That's what works for me.
For example I usually eat 1 avocado a day. I love them. Each avocado has about 200 calories and about 15-20 grams of fat.
If I ate unlimited avocados, then I would not be able to maintain a deficit.
But I eat one and I make my numbers work.
I also eat a ton of raw veggies, but I log them because I still need to learn portion control as part of my long term health goals.

I see a lot of the "Vegan Fitness Gurus" on IG and they don't count calories, they don't count portions and they have an enormous amounts of fruits and veggies everyday and they still manage to look like magical forest fairies. But since I love steak, bison, seafood etc..; so I have to make room in my diet for these things. And that means limiting my avocados.

I still don't understand those people... one of my best friends is a raw vegan and he literally consumes like 10 avocados a day like 100 oranges like the most ridiculous (and expensive) diet ever and he is skin and bones. i logged his day once and it was about 5k in calories.

JPW1990

There's a diet contest show in the UK based on dietbet. They had one competitor who was vegetarian, and thought instead of counting, he'd just eat "cleaner." After a week or two, the doctor who hosts the show had to do an intervention on him to explain he'd been eating 4000 calories a day, and half of it was bananas and oranges.

peter56765

simplydelish2 wrote: »

Intuitive eating has a lot of benefits. Listening to your body, feeding it what it needs, and eating only when hungry provides a great plan for some. The standard MFP CICO version doesn't look at that kind of eating plan as wise.

If it works for you - go for it!

My body's intuition tells me to eat when I'm hungry, bored, stressed, for pleasure, or just when I'm sitting around in front of the TV - basically whenever possible. I suspect I am descendant from a long line of people who managed to survive periods of famine by stuffing their faces when a surplus was available. Now of course, I am surrounded by surplus all the time but my "intuition" keeps telling me to chow down. So, yeah, I think I'll pass on intuitive eating.

punkuate

I can eat mountains of peas so it's never a good idea to give me unlimited veggies!

HeySwoleSister

I weigh and log fruit and estimate and log all veggies.

I don't see the point in "not counting," though. Take my breakfast, for example. I usually have a coffee with half and half and a veggie egg white omelet. The cream in my coffee and the broccoli in my omelet each have about 40 calories. Why would one "count" and not the other? makes no sense.

Oh, and according to WW, the egg whites in my omelet are also "zero points!!" So, basically, my whole omelet is "free." Which....no. It's not.

Tubbs216

fishshark wrote: »

beachhouse758 wrote: »

ahamm002 wrote: »

It depends on your goals. If you're obese and eat a generally unhealthy diet, then WW's tactic of not counting fruits and veggies is probably great. It gets people into the habit of eating healthier and probably won't hinder weight loss.

Now if you're already pretty healthy and lean, and just trying to get a bit leaner to look great in a swim suit than you should log everything.

I agree.

Also, different approaches work for different people.

I have to log everything. That's what works for me.
For example I usually eat 1 avocado a day. I love them. Each avocado has about 200 calories and about 15-20 grams of fat.
If I ate unlimited avocados, then I would not be able to maintain a deficit.
But I eat one and I make my numbers work.
I also eat a ton of raw veggies, but I log them because I still need to learn portion control as part of my long term health goals.

I see a lot of the "Vegan Fitness Gurus" on IG and they don't count calories, they don't count portions and they have an enormous amounts of fruits and veggies everyday and they still manage to look like magical forest fairies. But since I love steak, bison, seafood etc..; so I have to make room in my diet for these things. And that means limiting my avocados.

I still don't understand those people... one of my best friends is a raw vegan and he literally consumes like 10 avocados a day like 100 oranges like the most ridiculous (and expensive) diet ever and he is skin and bones. i logged his day once and it was about 5k in calories.

I think that amount of fruits & veggies go right through without touching the sides. Hence, nothing counts!

Angela26point2finisher

beemerphile1 wrote: »

I'm pretty sure fruit and vegetables have calories. It doesn't matter to your body where the calories comes from.

It does matter where your Calories come from. 100 Calories from an apple and a dozen baby carrots is going to have much more nutrients then a 100 Calorie pack of Oreo bites, way more filling, and won't leave you wanting more. The micro-nutrients matter, too.

Akimajuktuq

I'm not one of those "it's only calories in and calories out" types because metabolism is far more complex than that... BUT. If unlimited means a licence to over-eat, then it will be a fail. Especially with starchy vegetables (which aren't unlimited in WW) and fruits. Too much fruit for me is a FAIL cuz SUGAR. Assuming that you have excess body fat then sugar DOES matter, and calories to a lesser degree (it's the FOOD more so). WW sucks imo (where I learned to starve myself, fear dietary fat, and just basically eat opposite of what is biologically appropriate) so I wouldn't personally want to emulate anything from their program.

Sabine_Stroehm

I've ALWAYS been unlimited non-starchy vegetables. I do somewhat limit (or remain conscious of) starchy vegetables and fruits.
But I eat as many and as much vegetable foods as I want and can.

2snakeswoman

I think if you want to use Weight Watchers strategy, you will have to do the whole WW program, not just the part that appeals to you.

icrushit

Sure, seems like a good way to go. If you don't want to adjust your calorie total to compensate, I would count the fruit, starchier vegetables and things like avocadoes so they don't put you over. For a looser approach, you could drop your calories a little, and only count medium and larger pieces of fruit, potatoes, sweet potatoes, corn and avocadoes, letting your slightly lower calorie intake take care of the rest without having to count them.

IF can be a good way to eat more intuitively without counting I find also, with the little bit of restriction from the IF often allowing more freedoms elsewhere.

AlisonH729

I can see the unlimited fruit & vegetable idea being helpful to people just starting their journey toward better health. (A lot of the people who decide to join WW probably fall into this category.) If someone is trying to better unhealthy eating habits and begin replacing less healthful choices with more fruit & veg, even if they are not tracking them, they will likely still come out ahead of the game at the end of the day.

It might work for a while. But eventually they would probably have to tighten up their diet.

lemurcat12

Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »

But I eat as many and as much vegetable foods as I want and can.

Me too, but that doesn't mean I don't log them. IF one is logging (I know you don't) it makes no sense to me to log some foods and not others, as EWJLang said. That has nothing to do with limiting them.

I like to log veggies since it's how I give myself credit for them and can see them later if I wonder why some day was easier than another, maybe.

rscunu

lemurcat12 wrote: »

Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »

But I eat as many and as much vegetable foods as I want and can.

Me too, but that doesn't mean I don't log them. IF one is logging (I know you don't) it makes no sense to me to log some foods and not others, as EWJLang said. That has nothing to do with limiting them.

I like to log veggies since it's how I give myself credit for them and can see them later if I wonder why some day was easier than another, maybe.

I log them too! It's important, calories in vs calories out...that's what we are doing, right?!

lemurcat12

Angela26point2finisher wrote: »

beemerphile1 wrote: »

I'm pretty sure fruit and vegetables have calories. It doesn't matter to your body where the calories comes from.

It does matter where your Calories come from. 100 Calories from an apple and a dozen baby carrots is going to have much more nutrients then a 100 Calorie pack of Oreo bites, way more filling, and won't leave you wanting more. The micro-nutrients matter, too.

He didn't say it doesn't matter what you eat. He said that it doesn't matter where the calories come from, clearly meaning that if you overeat on nutrient dense foods you will still gain weight.

I have some experience with that myself, you definitely do.

And unfortunately it's simply not the case that eating lots of veggies means that you won't be able to overeat on other foods. You might have an easier time resisting than if you let yourself be really hungry, but I expect a lot of us here don't actually overeat because of hunger.

Sabine_Stroehm

lemurcat12 wrote: »

Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »

But I eat as many and as much vegetable foods as I want and can.

Me too, but that doesn't mean I don't log them. IF one is logging (I know you don't) it makes no sense to me to log some foods and not others, as EWJLang said. That has nothing to do with limiting them.

I like to log veggies since it's how I give myself credit for them and can see them later if I wonder why some day was easier than another, maybe.

Yep. If you log, you log vegetables and fruits too!

WalkingAlong

There are all kinds of ways to log. I would suggest that you log everything for a few days and see how much produce you eat when you're not limiting yourself but eating it to satiety. It's probably 300-500 calories. Then subtract that from your goal and don't log produce, if that appeals to you. E.g., if you want to eat 1800 calories a day, allow yourself 1300-1500 and free produce. Less logging, more incentive to have an apple over a cookie, more fiber, more vitamins... lots of plusses.

barbecuesauce

I don't think it's a good strategy for someone with only 15 pounds to lose. If you were obese and new to counting, I think it would be a great strategy.

But if you want to do it, I would suggest limiting the number of servings.

T1DCarnivoreRunner

Angela26point2finisher wrote: »

beemerphile1 wrote: »

I'm pretty sure fruit and vegetables have calories. It doesn't matter to your body where the calories comes from.

It does matter where your Calories come from. 100 Calories from an apple and a dozen baby carrots is going to have much more nutrients then a 100 Calorie pack of Oreo bites, way more filling, and won't leave you wanting more. The micro-nutrients matter, too.

I won't argue about the micro-nutrients, but let's not pretend that an apple and a dozen baby carrots is any more filling than a 100 calorie pack of Oreos. In either case, I may as well have eaten nothing... I will be just as hungry regardless.

staceypunk

Thank you everyone for your comments. i appreciate it!