low carb, high fat
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by my eleventh day on less than 20 carbs and well into ketosis eating 66% protein, 1800kcal
That's a LOT of protein! Nearly 300g/day. Even if your lean body mass was 100kg (which I'm thinking is generous for most people), it would still be 0.47g nitrogen/kg! There's no way your body can cope with that, maximum protein utilisation sits at around 0.3g nitrogen/kg. Maybe something to think about.
its actually 230g protein 100g fat for a lean mass of 160 and with the weight coming off i ll be reducing it acordingly.
All this talk of keto and low carb seems ill thoughtout as low carb (anywhere up to 100g ) is nothing like below 20g and full ketosis and you wont benefit with increased energy and escape the drained feeling until you get down around 20g, nor will your body give you a high from BHP nor will you lose the weight you could.0 -
I have been low carb/high fat for nearly 3 months now and I have lost about 15lbs in that time. I have lost some midriff fat but my thigh muscles are bigger now as I cycle a few hours a week. The big change for me is the feeling of fullness, which I never got (or felt hungry again soon after eating) when I ate carbs like bread, rice, pasta and potatoes which means I don't snack.
I eat about 1500 -1600 cals a day and feel fuller than I did on 2500+, I feel full of energy and last week I did a 40mile mtb ride with no need to eat for fuel while riding, because I run on fat for fuel. I have noticed my lactate threshold is a bit lower than when I was eating carbs but I can live with that. (I do eat a bit more if I have done some exercise)
We did not evolve running on carbs for fuel, we evolved catching and eating animals and we didn't really bring the type of carbs mentioned above into our diets until about 10,000 years ago when we started growing grains as a crop. They are easy to store for a year round food supply.
We're all different and the lchf way of eating works for me. It can be a bit tricky in restaurants but I can see myself eating like this for years to come.
Edit to say I aim for 20g carbs or less.0 -
Works for me. Got my 6-pack back by eating reallllllly high-fat, and my bloodwork is much better than it was when I was also very lean but ate a more typical low-fat/high-carb diet. If you look at the science of how insulin works and what raises it and what that does to a body, it's sort of a no-brainer (though I was into the calories in-calories out dogma, thought "low-carbers" were totally crazy, and high fat would kill ya for years...it took an initial jolt of "Wtf??" and then a LOT of research to change my very ingrained thinking, but the numbers don't lie.)
Yup. That's me in a nutshell too. While I don't have a 6-pack 80% of the weight I've been able to lose is due in part to switching over to high fat, low carb.
I was diagnosed with metabolic issues and needed to reduce greatly the amount of carbs I was eating, 1200 cal diet didn't work, 1400 cal didn't work, 1600 cal didn't work. Lifting heavy didn't do much and cardio only made me cranky.
Due to my health, I need to stay with this way of eating. For me, it's almost effortless. I've gone back to eating the way I did as a thin teenager, cooking with butter or ghee, staying away from all grain & eating foods with simple and short ingredients list that I can understand.
Not only has it been the only way I've been able to reduce, but I feel a hundred times better now. I'm having my labwork rechecked in a month or so and looking forward to better numbers for sure.0 -
Honestly I see the best results with counting calories while eating a balance of everything. Hit your minimums in protein & fatvand let the rest fall where they may. Less stressful too.
Yeah, I see it less stressful too. You're not limited with foods and in my opinion, you can loose weight at the same pace and be in better mood if you balance the foods and follow a normal healthy diet. It's just simplier.
I find nothing complicated or stressful with my keto diet. It's quite the opposite actually, not feeling hungry all the time or constantly craving food is really quite wonderful after spending years miserable on a reduced calorie, reduced fat diet.... trying and failing to lose weight.
Amen!! :drinker:0 -
I have been eating a low carb/moderate protein/high fat diet for over a year. It works for me. I am diabetic and PCOS. It's the only way I can regulate my metabolism. I would suggest that anyone unable to lose weight just by eating lower calories is dealing with a metabolic issue.0
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THIS!If people are insulin resistant simply counting calories wont always work. I know I needed to seriously avoid sugars (even from fruit) and watch my carbs.
Ketogenic eating is not optional for me - it is VITAL in order to regain my health. I am extremely carb sensitive, since I have severe insulin resistance and PCOS. Counting calories isn't enough for people with metabolic issues like this.
If you don't have a metabolic illness, eating a balanced diet at a caloric deficit to your TDEE should be enough to facilitate weight loss and better health.0 -
Thanks for your input everyone! I noticed that eating more protein/fat keeps my cravings at bay. I think that I am EXTREMELY carb/sugar sensitive. Even a piece of gum is enough to have me craving a whole pack. My diet has always been pretty healthy, and I just want to lose those last 5 pounds. I find that even though I loooveee fruit, it makes me crave sweets. This is why I was considering low carb veg, protein, and fats.0
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I keep my macros set at 60F/20P/20C and have had good success (both with adherence and results.)
ETA: This is the only way for ME to control my eating. I do this in addition to IF and this keeps me satisfied and literally not thinking about food until I break my fast (sometime between 18-22 hours later.) I eat in about a 4 hour window 5 days a week and an 8 hour window the other two. In my experience ONLY high fat (mod protein) makes this possible, and also easily attained. For me, doing that on typical high carb diet is MURDER.
ETA: Despite my lower carb intake, I have no lack of energy. I do 1-2 easy and 1 hard workout every week day (yes, 2-3 workouts a day) and then one long hike at least once on weekends. All my workouts are fasted. I just finished a heavy lifting 12 week program (Nia Shanks) and progressed until I reached the point I had to change gyms to keep going (I surpassed all their dumbbells.) I now do an intermediate TRX program for my muscle development needs and feel stronger than ever.0 -
I just started a ketogenic style diet and trying to balance at 65%fats 25%protein and 10%carbs. I have lost 6 lbs in one week but I also take a multivitamin and a fiber supplement.
Hate to tell you this but that is not fat loss. That is water weight fluctuations.
Lower carb is a good idea for insulin resistant people. Keto is not a requirement.
And going into ketosis forces your body to uses fat as fuel. This does not necessarily mean it is from stored fat seeing as how your dietary fat intake is increased. As well as this, you need to take into account exercise performance. Any sort of anaerobic actitvity will primarly use glycogen for energy. Try going a week on low carbs and then do a low rep, heavy weight workout. Then do the same thing but refeed the day before with high carbs/low fat and see what the difference in performance is.
by my eleventh day on less than 20 carbs and well into ketosis eating 66% protein 33% fat and 1800 cals i had the energy of a bull and was able to train to the limit ... Re fed on sunday ( 3000 cals, 400 carbs ) and my workout monday was in a much lesser league , so i d have to strongly disagree based on personal experience.
Cant wait to be back in full ketosis as i love the feeling of wellbeing, the warm muscles and the dramatic weight loss and cant for the life of me see anything but disadvantage to using a normal restrictive diet and counting calories on everything everyday and feeling hungry as its a sure fire way to "go off the rails" .
I seem particularly suseptable to the "beta- hydroxybutyrate" ( BHP) which is probably why i so enjoy the keto diet and i d suggest anyone doing keto and in full ketosis (sub 20 carbs) that is not benefitting as should be is eating the wrong type of fats or have their macros out.
what was your "workout"0 -
I just started a ketogenic style diet and trying to balance at 65%fats 25%protein and 10%carbs. I have lost 6 lbs in one week but I also take a multivitamin and a fiber supplement.
Hate to tell you this but that is not fat loss. That is water weight fluctuations.
Lower carb is a good idea for insulin resistant people. Keto is not a requirement.
And going into ketosis forces your body to uses fat as fuel. This does not necessarily mean it is from stored fat seeing as how your dietary fat intake is increased. As well as this, you need to take into account exercise performance. Any sort of anaerobic actitvity will primarly use glycogen for energy. Try going a week on low carbs and then do a low rep, heavy weight workout. Then do the same thing but refeed the day before with high carbs/low fat and see what the difference in performance is.
by my eleventh day on less than 20 carbs and well into ketosis eating 66% protein 33% fat and 1800 cals i had the energy of a bull and was able to train to the limit ... Re fed on sunday ( 3000 cals, 400 carbs ) and my workout monday was in a much lesser league , so i d have to strongly disagree based on personal experience.
Cant wait to be back in full ketosis as i love the feeling of wellbeing, the warm muscles and the dramatic weight loss and cant for the life of me see anything but disadvantage to using a normal restrictive diet and counting calories on everything everyday and feeling hungry as its a sure fire way to "go off the rails" .
I seem particularly suseptable to the "beta- hydroxybutyrate" ( BHP) which is probably why i so enjoy the keto diet and i d suggest anyone doing keto and in full ketosis (sub 20 carbs) that is not benefitting as should be is eating the wrong type of fats or have their macros out.
what was your "workout"
seconded.
Also agree with PU. A balanced calorie deficit diet is restrictive but one that cuts out an entire macronutrient isn't? WTF?0 -
...so my thoughts are what works for one person will not work for the other so each person needs to do what works for them.
If you are not a fan of a keto-diet that is cool, then don't do it. For me, I have done the research, I am working with my doctor, I am doing body-comp analysis so I know it is real weight, I feel healthy and I am energized for my Insanity, Les Mills Pump and running exercise sessions. I wish you luck on your own fitness journeys.0 -
Honestly I see the best results with counting calories while eating a balance of everything. Hit your minimums in protein & fatvand let the rest fall where they may. Less stressful too.
Can't agree with u more...0 -
...so my thoughts are what works for one person will not work for the other so each person needs to do what works for them.
If you are not a fan of a keto-diet that is cool, then don't do it. For me, I have done the research, I am working with my doctor, I am doing body-comp analysis so I know it is real weight, I feel healthy and I am energized for my Insanity, Les Mills Pump and running exercise sessions. I wish you luck on your own fitness journeys.
I am not anti keto, in fact I used it myself last week to cut water weight. You are correct in saying that you should use the type of diet that suits you best. For insulin resistant people, that would be to lower carbs (not necessarily keto) and for insulin sensitve people that would be higher carbs/lower fat. (both should get adequate protein).
And I'm sorry but there is no way you lost 6lbs of fat in a week if that is you in your profile pic.
Good luck on your journey. If you want to stick with keto dieting, I'd highly recommend heading over to www.bodyrecomposition.com and read up on refeeds. Lyle McDonald wrote the ketogenic diet book and knows a thing or two about it.0 -
I did this too where I lost 7 pounds on my weigh-in in one week. I am using supplements. The weight just fell off while I was eating a lot of fat. I am trying to get a fix on it, I mean to figure out how to repeat it. I suspected the same, maybe it is water loss. But I am drinking so much water as never before. I have lost inches. And the weight started falling away at a time when I was not doing anything appreciably different than the previous week except that my activity level was tremendous and I had so much energy I could not believe.
Now the weight-loss is a normal healthy pace, returning to what I know has worked for me in the past, only using supplements for a little edge. I am starting to restrict my food choices to fit certain known patterns. But I lost weight fast when not caring about food at all. I ate almost zero traditional grains, but had super-fruit and other nutrient dense foods despite fat content. I had chocolate, olive oil, avocados, tahini, sardines, steak, walnuts, sunflower seeds. There was a lot of fat and protein in my diet because I was trying to slow the weight-loss to a safer speed. Yet that just seemed to speed up weight-loss.
Does processing nutrient dense food actually result in negative calories? I mean, if someone who is at low or average levels of nutrition, gets a big dose of nutrient, does the body go through a transformation in order to quickly make use of the abundant nutrients?
Or maybe it was stress, like finding out my wife will have a baby soon and there being lots to do? Or the supplements, some coffee and tea, also really upped my stress? I am very relaxed now, though I reported being very relaxed then. It was the week before the fast weight-loss when I felt over-stress. I cannot explain it; this is new territory for me.
Way in the past I did do a low fat, high protein diet, with focus on calorie deficit as well. I had a lot of carbohydrates, though those were reduced by eating lentils and oats. I got 10% calories from fat and about 55g of protein. I don't remember my calories; but I know I reduced as much as possible on a student's nearly vegetarian-style budget. I rode a bicycle to school and work 26 miles a day to do both work and school and something like 17 miles on days where I was going only to school or to work. I lost about 1 lb. per week. It was a lot of effort in terms of regimen. I am wanting something less strenuous for this weight-loss period.0 -
I feel better high carbs low fat vegan but definately must do lots of cardio and eat greens to stabilise energy.0
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Bump, I need this!0
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The person I quoted stated this with regards someone with insulin resistance. For someone with metabolic issues (ie. insulin resistance, diabetes, etc) it is more than calories in vs. out.
THIS!If people are insulin resistant simply counting calories wont always work. I know I needed to seriously avoid sugars (even from fruit) and watch my carbs.
Ketogenic eating is not optional for me - it is VITAL in order to regain my health. I am extremely carb sensitive, since I have severe insulin resistance and PCOS. Counting calories isn't enough for people with metabolic issues like this.
If you don't have a metabolic illness, eating a balanced diet at a caloric deficit to your TDEE should be enough to facilitate weight loss and better health.
You "can't" eat carbs to well. I understand it's important for your health. The person you're qouting is implying that weight gain/loss is more than about calories which isn't true. Even in your case.
Your body is made up energy/mass It uses energy all day. Eat less energy and your body will be forced to reduce it's size by using energy from the body. Carbs/protein/fats are ALL energy, nothing more. Calories in vs calories out.0 -
Regarding ketosis I can't see that any diet that is sucessful in losing weight can avoid ketosis. The body seems to use fat reserves as the last resort and if you are to use them you have to arrange things such that at some point there is no option but to dig into the fat reserves for energy and that is ketosis.
I am beginning to suspect that a diet that results in weight loss without hunger of cravings is one where the transition from glucose metabolism to ketosis happens overnight, though that is really just a guess. That would certainly explain the fact that I am almost always lighter first thing in the morning than last thing at night.
The difference between what is normally described as a ketgogenic diet, i.e. one used not for weight loss but for control of other symptoms, and one where people are simply restricting carbs is that in the classic ketogenric diet you eat more fat to make up for the calories forgone by eating less carbs.
Certainly that is not what I did or what I set out to do. I set out to create a calorie defecit as you would expect for a diet to lose weight and again that is what I did. To create that defecit I had two choices:
1. I could see the recommended proportion of calories from each food group as golden and simply try to eat less of everything, or:
2. I could see where the most calorie dense foods were in my diet and eat less of them.
It seemed to me the latter approach was less likely to leave me feeling hungry and would therefore be easier to comply with and what I discovered was that while fat is quite calorie dense it would be hard to reduce that significantly without also eating less protein (assuming I stick to normal food rather than protein shakes etc.) The other things that were notably calorie dense were foods made from grains (including flour), rice and foods containing lots of sugar. Foods such as breakfast cereal, bread, pasta, cakes, biscuits, chocolates.
So, I started eating less breakfast cereal and fewer slices of bread. I started having potatoes (NOT as chips) more often and pasta less often. When I do have pasta or rice I have smaller portion, i.e. smaller than the typically recommended size and I keep cakes and chocolates for the occasional treat.
Something else I noticed along the way is that food high in sugar seems to causes a short-term feeling of being energised followed by craving more. To a lesser extend the same seems to be true of baked goods and pasta. If I have the opportunity to respond to the feeling of being energised by taking some exercise this seems to avoid the subsequent craving though for this to be effective the timing is important.
That leads quite nicely into the effect of diet on athletic performance. If you're an athlete that is obviously very important. If you are, as I am, in a sedentary occupation where thinking is the primary activity athletic performance could hardly matter less. Don't get me wrong, I walk the dog, I cycle to the office on the occasions I need to go there and walk or cycle to other local activities and events because it lifts my mood, I believe it is good for me and by doing this instead of driving I benefit the environment and my pocket. But is does not really matter if I get there a few minutes quicker or manage to shave 5 mins off my normal dog walk.0 -
Thanks Melampus, there were some very good observations. I would point out that you can actually obtain weight-loss without ketosis. Ketosis would only be required in a complete absence of sugars, for getting the activation energy for burning fat. You can have plenty of sugars and complex carbohydrates and still lose weight by eating less fat. But this method of weight-loss has in the past, for me at least, required a massive effort regarding exercise (26 mile biking every day for one pound per week loss).
Eating a low amount of carbs can also achieve weight-loss without ketosis, so long as blood sugar remains fairly constant. The problem you have with consuming refined sugar and experiencing cravings or tiredness is likely due to having triggered insulin. With a lot of insulin in your system, you may as well take a nap and start your day over, because continuing to feed the sugar beast is not going to give you any energy at some point.
One problem with getting your protein while cutting carbs is that to get amino acids in good proportion generally means eating high carb foods for a measly gram or so of the correct amino acid. Supplements, protein bars and shakes help out here greatly. If you want to get all your protein from the fresh-food grocer, then I might suggest lentils, a staple for vegan diets, short only in the amino acid methionine. Lentils are pretty good as far as the protein to carb ratio when compared to other foods in the grain/legume category. If you like broccoli as much as I do, you would have no trouble getting your methionine.
Or you could just get all your required protein from animal products, though that can cost. And when trying to get your vitamins, minerals, and phytonutrients the amino acids from vegetables are only counted as calories when they are not balanced out with grain/legume amino acids. Potatoes have a good balance of amino acids as far as I know; but they have a lot of carbs too, not going to get any ketosis going on when having much potatoes in your diet.0 -
Anyone have any opinions on this way of eating/success stories? I've tried veganism, vegetarianism, high carb low fat, high protein, and low carb low fat. The one that was the best was low carb low fat, but it was too low in everything! The reason why I was wondering about low carb high fat is because I gained weight eating high carb (no grains but LOTS of fruit). Thanks all!
You gained weight by eating to many calories... not to many carbs. The diet you're talking about sounds like a ketogenic diet.
Just focus on your calories and call it a day.
Ketogenic diets work nicely for those with insulin resistance. If the OP has insulin resistance, a ketogenic diet might be a good option for consideration.0 -
The person I quoted stated this with regards someone with insulin resistance. For someone with metabolic issues (ie. insulin resistance, diabetes, etc) it is more than calories in vs. out.
THIS!If people are insulin resistant simply counting calories wont always work. I know I needed to seriously avoid sugars (even from fruit) and watch my carbs.
Ketogenic eating is not optional for me - it is VITAL in order to regain my health. I am extremely carb sensitive, since I have severe insulin resistance and PCOS. Counting calories isn't enough for people with metabolic issues like this.
If you don't have a metabolic illness, eating a balanced diet at a caloric deficit to your TDEE should be enough to facilitate weight loss and better health.
You "can't" eat carbs to well. I understand it's important for your health. The person you're qouting is implying that weight gain/loss is more than about calories which isn't true. Even in your case.
Your body is made up energy/mass It uses energy all day. Eat less energy and your body will be forced to reduce it's size by using energy from the body. Carbs/protein/fats are ALL energy, nothing more. Calories in vs calories out.
^^^QFT0 -
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Anyone have any opinions on this way of eating/success stories? I've tried veganism, vegetarianism, high carb low fat, high protein, and low carb low fat. The one that was the best was low carb low fat, but it was too low in everything! The reason why I was wondering about low carb high fat is because I gained weight eating high carb (no grains but LOTS of fruit). Thanks all!
My opinion? It's the best way for myself to stick to a meal plan that restricts my calories and ultimately works for my weight loss through calorie deficit.
I feel happier, less bloated without the carbs, and have healthier hair, skin and nails, because of the healthy fats I consume from avocados, nuts, cheese, coconut oil, butter and heavy cream.
I still monitor my calorie intake, and stay under what MFP generates for me.
But I just do it aiming for 65% fat, 30% protein and <5% carbs from my calories.
Which is about 20-25 net grams (carbs minus fiber) of carbs per day.
I wish you luck!
Anyone feel free to add/message me if you'd like! We are all striving to get healthier and I could always use and provide the support! :drinker: 0 -
Anyone have any opinions on this way of eating/success stories? I've tried veganism, vegetarianism, high carb low fat, high protein, and low carb low fat. The one that was the best was low carb low fat, but it was too low in everything! The reason why I was wondering about low carb high fat is because I gained weight eating high carb (no grains but LOTS of fruit). Thanks all!
I started with calories in vs calories out. Lost my last 15lbs that way. I've been doing low carb (under 100) and high fat for a bit over a month now and I feel it's helping with body composition. I think the hardest thing is that with this diet I feel very satiated with the high fat high protein low carb meals so I have trouble getting in 1600 cals a day.0 -
Didn't work. Then I tracked my calories carefully. That works.0
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Honestly I see the best results with counting calories while eating a balance of everything. Hit your minimums in protein & fatvand let the rest fall where they may. Less stressful too.
NO SCIENCE IS ALLOWED ON THE INTERWEBZ!!!!!!!!!! Oh wait this isn't the Fox-News channel, nvm continue!0 -
I've lost my weight on low carb. I'm doing calorie counting now for lose the rest0
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What is considered low carb these days?0
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