Sugary Drinks CAN cause Diabetes ?!?
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brianpperkins wrote: »MoiAussi93 wrote: »helenrosec1 wrote: »helenrosec1 wrote: »too much of any sugar can increase your risk of diabetes.
Too much sugar doesn't increase your risk of diabetes. Too many calories causing overweight/obesity increases risk of diabetes.
My Doctor must have lied to me then, because I asked him about eating too much sugar, even in fruits and he told me too much can cause diabetes so try cut it down.
There are some links that sugary drinks cause diabetes, but I would ask, is it the sugary drinks or is it the obesity. The bigger issue, sugary drinks have a lot of calories and don't provide much nutrition and doesn't fill you up, making it very easy to increase caloric intake.
http://www.diabetes.org/diabetes-basics/myths/
Both can play a role. That fact sheet you linked to says this:
"Most overweight people never develop type 2 diabetes, and many people with type 2 diabetes are at a normal weight or only moderately overweight. "
So if most overweight people never get it, and many people with it are not overweight, it clearly is not simply a matter of being overweight. There are other genetic and lifestyle factors at play. Your sheet also says this:
"Research has shown that drinking sugary drinks is linked to type 2 diabetes."
"The American Diabetes Association recommends that people should avoid intake of sugar-sweetened beverages to help prevent diabetes."
"These (sugar-sweetened beverages) will raise blood glucose"
So while it's clear this is not perfectly understood yet by scientists, there certainly does seem to be some legitimate indication that the sugary drinks increase risk beyond just the calorie/weight impact.
Eating anything with sugar will raise blood glucose. If sugar in drinks is causing diabetes then why are countries with higher sugar consumption than the US generating lower diabetes rates? Truly causal relationships hold up across arbitrary lines on a map.
Take it up with the American Diabetes Association. The quote that says we should "avoid intake of sugar-sweetened beverages to help prevent diabetes" comes from them. Frankly, I think it's good advice. YMMV0 -
As with all studies, we need to wait for more to confirm this. Single studies on their own show good points to follow up on, but independent verification is key.
Of course, until then, moderation still appears to be the safe bet.0 -
MoiAussi93 wrote: »brianpperkins wrote: »MoiAussi93 wrote: »helenrosec1 wrote: »helenrosec1 wrote: »too much of any sugar can increase your risk of diabetes.
Too much sugar doesn't increase your risk of diabetes. Too many calories causing overweight/obesity increases risk of diabetes.
My Doctor must have lied to me then, because I asked him about eating too much sugar, even in fruits and he told me too much can cause diabetes so try cut it down.
There are some links that sugary drinks cause diabetes, but I would ask, is it the sugary drinks or is it the obesity. The bigger issue, sugary drinks have a lot of calories and don't provide much nutrition and doesn't fill you up, making it very easy to increase caloric intake.
http://www.diabetes.org/diabetes-basics/myths/
Both can play a role. That fact sheet you linked to says this:
"Most overweight people never develop type 2 diabetes, and many people with type 2 diabetes are at a normal weight or only moderately overweight. "
So if most overweight people never get it, and many people with it are not overweight, it clearly is not simply a matter of being overweight. There are other genetic and lifestyle factors at play. Your sheet also says this:
"Research has shown that drinking sugary drinks is linked to type 2 diabetes."
"The American Diabetes Association recommends that people should avoid intake of sugar-sweetened beverages to help prevent diabetes."
"These (sugar-sweetened beverages) will raise blood glucose"
So while it's clear this is not perfectly understood yet by scientists, there certainly does seem to be some legitimate indication that the sugary drinks increase risk beyond just the calorie/weight impact.
Eating anything with sugar will raise blood glucose. If sugar in drinks is causing diabetes then why are countries with higher sugar consumption than the US generating lower diabetes rates? Truly causal relationships hold up across arbitrary lines on a map.
Take it up with the American Diabetes Association. The quote that says we should "avoid intake of sugar-sweetened beverages to help prevent diabetes" comes from them. Frankly, I think it's good advice. YMMV
As pointed out, the American Diabetes Association also notes that sugar does not cause type 2 diabetes. Of course, we've had health organizations change their previously alarmist pronouncements due to facts not supporting the hype.0 -
There are some links that sugary drinks cause diabetes, but I would ask, is it the sugary drinks or is it the obesity. The bigger issue, sugary drinks have a lot of calories and don't provide much nutrition and doesn't fill you up, making it very easy to increase caloric intake.
The authors are clear that its the sweetened drinks and not the obesity.
For example they found a trend for diabetes with consumption of artificially sweetened drinks but this went away when corrected for adiposity.
They agree with you on filling up etc "SSB may contribute to type 2 diabetes risk via both their effects on adiposity, where energy intake in liquid form is not fully compensated, promoting weight gain via the glycaemic
effect of consuming large amounts of rapidly absorbable sugars, and the metabolic effects of fructose."
Can't get link; "adiposity" including normal weight adiposity (high bf% regardless of weight) or "adiposity in the overweight"? Have seen studies indicating increased risks for the first as well0 -
brianpperkins wrote: »MoiAussi93 wrote: »brianpperkins wrote: »MoiAussi93 wrote: »helenrosec1 wrote: »helenrosec1 wrote: »too much of any sugar can increase your risk of diabetes.
Too much sugar doesn't increase your risk of diabetes. Too many calories causing overweight/obesity increases risk of diabetes.
My Doctor must have lied to me then, because I asked him about eating too much sugar, even in fruits and he told me too much can cause diabetes so try cut it down.
There are some links that sugary drinks cause diabetes, but I would ask, is it the sugary drinks or is it the obesity. The bigger issue, sugary drinks have a lot of calories and don't provide much nutrition and doesn't fill you up, making it very easy to increase caloric intake.
http://www.diabetes.org/diabetes-basics/myths/
Both can play a role. That fact sheet you linked to says this:
"Most overweight people never develop type 2 diabetes, and many people with type 2 diabetes are at a normal weight or only moderately overweight. "
So if most overweight people never get it, and many people with it are not overweight, it clearly is not simply a matter of being overweight. There are other genetic and lifestyle factors at play. Your sheet also says this:
"Research has shown that drinking sugary drinks is linked to type 2 diabetes."
"The American Diabetes Association recommends that people should avoid intake of sugar-sweetened beverages to help prevent diabetes."
"These (sugar-sweetened beverages) will raise blood glucose"
So while it's clear this is not perfectly understood yet by scientists, there certainly does seem to be some legitimate indication that the sugary drinks increase risk beyond just the calorie/weight impact.
Eating anything with sugar will raise blood glucose. If sugar in drinks is causing diabetes then why are countries with higher sugar consumption than the US generating lower diabetes rates? Truly causal relationships hold up across arbitrary lines on a map.
Take it up with the American Diabetes Association. The quote that says we should "avoid intake of sugar-sweetened beverages to help prevent diabetes" comes from them. Frankly, I think it's good advice. YMMV
As pointed out, the American Diabetes Association also notes that sugar does not cause type 2 diabetes. Of course, we've had health organizations change their previously alarmist pronouncements due to facts not supporting the hype.
No, they don't actually say it doesn't cause diabetes. What they say, to be precise, is "The answer is not so simple."
They go on to talk about genetic and lifestyle factors and also, in answer to that question, say "Research has shown that drinking sugary drinks is linked to type 2 diabetes."
That is basically what I said in my original post. It is a number of factors, but there is at least some scientific evidence to suggest that sugary drinks play a role beyond contributing calories. Obviously, more research is needed.0 -
I like how "increases risk of" = "will cause".0
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I like how "increases risk of" = "will cause".
It doesn't mean "will cause". But it certainly does not mean "doesn't cause". The point is there is some link that they need to find out more about before something definitive can be said. Until then, every individual is free to decide their own tolerance for risk. If you feel it is low risk and are comfortable with that, keep drinking sugary drinks. If you want to give yourself the best odds possible (even if a small difference) of avoiding diabetes, stop drinking them. I don't see why this is controversial.0 -
Arg - as someone with a diabetic family, this type of misinformation is beginning to get downright offensive. No, sugar doesn't cause diabetes - and anyone who says it does is either misinformed, or attempting to generalize things in order to simplify an explanation for the layman.
Sugar doesn't cause Type 1 or Type 2. What it does do is throw off your blood glucose numbers enough to where you begin to feel the effects of a disease you were genetically prone to have in the first place. It exacerbates things. And for many people, sugary drinks and binges make their symptoms apparent for the first time. Hence the wrong belief that sugar causes diabetes. Could it "knock" someone into the full fledged disease who, though genetically prone to it, might've been able to avoid pancreatic issues if they hadn't indulged? That's an argument I'm willing to accept with some evidence, but no - to repeat - sugar doesn't cause diabetes.0 -
Link? If someone drinks 3 regular sodas a day, that is like 900 calories of soda. That is a good amount of calories to drink.
So it could be... increased calories --> increases chances of being obese --> increase chance of diabetes..
They "corrected" for overweight, apparently.
Three 330 ml cans of coca cola in the UK are 105g of sugar and 420 cals so "regular" might be a bit flexible
The vague epidemiology also concluded that it would be unwise to substitute fruit juice or artificially sweetened soda as these showed some tendency to increase diabetes risk too.
If it's the same ones at @kgeyser posted, I will have to read those.
But when I think soda, I automatically think 20oz because it's common in the US.
That's interesting. When I think "regular" I would never imagine being able to drink a 20 oz can on my own. Here the most common single serving sizes are 200 and 330 ml (that's 6.7 and 11.1 fl oz).
The correlation in this study is interesting, especially that substituting artificially sweetened drinks does not lower the risk, so if it's not the sugar could it be that there are some overlooked lifestyle habits that soda drinkers had but nondrinkers didn't or vice versa?
For example, I remember a study being done about coffee drinking where they tried to control for several factors, smoking being one, and I remember being intrigued by the fact that smokers drank more coffee than nonsmokers in that group.
Similarly, I read that smokers are more likely to drink caffeinated coffee and drinks in general. When you think "sugary drinks" caffeinated soft drinks (cola-type drinks) jump to mind. I haven't read the paper but have they controlled for smoking and other similar habits which play a role in the likelihood of developing diabetes?0 -
Sugary drinks, like sodas, typically have no protein or fiber. Protein and fiber help stabilize blood sugar levels.
I know I'm gonna catch crap for saying this, but there IS research that indicates artificial sweeteners (like high fructose corn syrup), the kind found in many sugar-sweetened drinks, have more of an effect than natural sugar on blood sugar. Same with white table sugar. People's bodies respond differently to the natural sugars in, for example, fruit. That's why eating a bowl of fruit every day doesn't have the same effect as a daily Coke or sweet tea. Part of that is the fiber found in fruit, but you could blend a fruit smoothie and it wouldn't make your glucose levels spike like a Coke.
There are a lot of armchair nutritionists around here. People can think and eat whatever they like, but telling others that sugar doesn't cause diabetes is pretty irresponsible.0 -
Dr Bernstein, an MD, is a T1 diabetic who left his career of engineering to become a medical doctor so he could devote his life to improving the treatments of diabetics. His work is slowly being emulated around the world.
Anyways, he states (In Diabetes Solutions) that these are the possible causes of T2 diabetes or insulin resistance:
Inheritance
Dehydration
Infection
Obesity
High blood glucose
High triglycerides
Inflammation (from mesententeric fat, autoimmune disease, foods)
I believe pop played a role in my development of pre-diabetes. I switched to regular pop over two years ago because I thought aspertame should be avoided (dumb move - I think I should have just dropped pop). I also did a low dose round of steroids for autoimmune issues (another mistake for me in my mind since steroids can induce diabetes in some people). I think pop, and poor eating with too many sweets (which is my problem food), combined with the steroids and my autoimmune disease got me to where I am; my blood glucose started being high.
I'm not obese, had no major infections (like cavities or injuries), do not have a strong family history of diabetes (beyond an aunt and uncle), am not chronically dehydrated, and my triglycerides are slightly lower than the normal range. All that is left as a cause (for me) is high high blood glucose (from a high sugar diet), steroids (which was low) and inflammtion.
I belive a high sugar (and carb) diet can lead to insulin resistance (diabetes T2). JMO.0 -
nvsmomketo wrote: »Dr Bernstein, an MD, is a T1 diabetic who left his career of engineering to become a medical doctor so he could devote his life to improving the treatments of diabetics. His work is slowly being emulated around the world.
Anyways, he states (In Diabetes Solutions) that these are the possible causes of T2 diabetes or insulin resistance:
Inheritance
Dehydration
Infection
Obesity
High blood glucose
High triglycerides
Inflammation (from mesententeric fat, autoimmune disease, foods)
I believe pop played a role in my development of pre-diabetes. I switched to regular pop over two years ago because I thought aspertame should be avoided (dumb move - I think I should have just dropped pop). I also did a low dose round of steroids for autoimmune issues (another mistake for me in my mind since steroids can induce diabetes in some people). I think pop, and poor eating with too many sweets (which is my problem food), combined with the steroids and my autoimmune disease got me to where I am; my blood glucose started being high.
I'm not obese, had no major infections (like cavities or injuries), do not have a strong family history of diabetes (beyond an aunt and uncle), am not chronically dehydrated, and my triglycerides are slightly lower than the normal range. All that is left as a cause (for me) is high high blood glucose (from a high sugar diet), steroids (which was low) and inflammtion.
I belive a high sugar (and carb) diet can lead to insulin resistance (diabetes T2). JMO.
I have also read that sugar causes inflammation...so it can increase risk through more than just the blood glucose route.0 -
ManiacalLaugh wrote: »Arg - as someone with a diabetic family, this type of misinformation is beginning to get downright offensive. No, sugar doesn't cause diabetes - and anyone who says it does is either misinformed, or attempting to generalize things in order to simplify an explanation for the layman.
Sugar doesn't cause Type 1 or Type 2. What it does do is throw off your blood glucose numbers enough to where you begin to feel the effects of a disease you were genetically prone to have in the first place. It exacerbates things. And for many people, sugary drinks and binges make their symptoms apparent for the first time. Hence the wrong belief that sugar causes diabetes. Could it "knock" someone into the full fledged disease who, though genetically prone to it, might've been able to avoid pancreatic issues if they hadn't indulged? That's an argument I'm willing to accept with some evidence, but no - to repeat - sugar doesn't cause diabetes.
This
This is how it was explained to me also. Genetic.
Is high blood pressure genetic also?
and I am talking about people who are not obese, maybe a little overweight.0 -
accidentalpancake wrote: »helenrosec1 wrote: »too much of any sugar can increase your risk of diabetes.
Too much sugar doesn't increase your risk of diabetes. Too many calories causing overweight/obesity increases risk of diabetes.
There are plenty of "healthy" weight people who develop diabetes. It's not that simple.
I said obesity not sugar INCREASES risk. There are other risk factors as well, mainly heredity among other. Healthy weight people can develop T2, but it is more rare.0 -
ManiacalLaugh wrote: »Arg - as someone with a diabetic family, this type of misinformation is beginning to get downright offensive. No, sugar doesn't cause diabetes - and anyone who says it does is either misinformed, or attempting to generalize things in order to simplify an explanation for the layman.
Sugar doesn't cause Type 1 or Type 2. What it does do is throw off your blood glucose numbers enough to where you begin to feel the effects of a disease you were genetically prone to have in the first place. It exacerbates things. And for many people, sugary drinks and binges make their symptoms apparent for the first time. Hence the wrong belief that sugar causes diabetes. Could it "knock" someone into the full fledged disease who, though genetically prone to it, might've been able to avoid pancreatic issues if they hadn't indulged? That's an argument I'm willing to accept with some evidence, but no - to repeat - sugar doesn't cause diabetes.
This
This is how it was explained to me also. Genetic.
Is high blood pressure genetic also?
and I am talking about people who are not obese, maybe a little overweight.
Genetics plays a role but not for everybody. Not me. I have two obese elderly relaives who have T2D. Considering 1 in 10 adults have T2D, and 1 in 4 seniors are T2D, my famial risk is probably pretty low. I am guessing that most people, of african, latin or european decent probably have at a relative with T2D. Just guessing.
Low blood pressure was part of the reason I was put on steroids. I don't think high blood pressure causes T2D (could be wrong) but I think it is often co-occuring.
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ManiacalLaugh wrote: »Arg - as someone with a diabetic family, this type of misinformation is beginning to get downright offensive. No, sugar doesn't cause diabetes - and anyone who says it does is either misinformed, or attempting to generalize things in order to simplify an explanation for the layman.
Sugar doesn't cause Type 1 or Type 2. What it does do is throw off your blood glucose numbers enough to where you begin to feel the effects of a disease you were genetically prone to have in the first place. It exacerbates things. And for many people, sugary drinks and binges make their symptoms apparent for the first time. Hence the wrong belief that sugar causes diabetes. Could it "knock" someone into the full fledged disease who, though genetically prone to it, might've been able to avoid pancreatic issues if they hadn't indulged? That's an argument I'm willing to accept with some evidence, but no - to repeat - sugar doesn't cause diabetes.
This
This is how it was explained to me also. Genetic.
Is high blood pressure genetic also?
and I am talking about people who are not obese, maybe a little overweight.
Genetics does not play a role for everyone with diabetes.0 -
FatFreeFrolicking wrote: »ManiacalLaugh wrote: »Arg - as someone with a diabetic family, this type of misinformation is beginning to get downright offensive. No, sugar doesn't cause diabetes - and anyone who says it does is either misinformed, or attempting to generalize things in order to simplify an explanation for the layman.
Sugar doesn't cause Type 1 or Type 2. What it does do is throw off your blood glucose numbers enough to where you begin to feel the effects of a disease you were genetically prone to have in the first place. It exacerbates things. And for many people, sugary drinks and binges make their symptoms apparent for the first time. Hence the wrong belief that sugar causes diabetes. Could it "knock" someone into the full fledged disease who, though genetically prone to it, might've been able to avoid pancreatic issues if they hadn't indulged? That's an argument I'm willing to accept with some evidence, but no - to repeat - sugar doesn't cause diabetes.
This
This is how it was explained to me also. Genetic.
Is high blood pressure genetic also?
and I am talking about people who are not obese, maybe a little overweight.
Genetics does not play a role for everyone with diabetes.
Yes, I realize genetics is not the cause for everyone. History in the family but nobody obese (only slightly overweight.....so told genetic.
What causes diabetes? genetic, overweight, ???
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If it doesn't mean "will cause", then wtf do people keep mixing up the two phrases? That's my only contention.MoiAussi93 wrote: »I like how "increases risk of" = "will cause".
It doesn't mean "will cause". But it certainly does not mean "doesn't cause". The point is there is some link that they need to find out more about before something definitive can be said. Until then, every individual is free to decide their own tolerance for risk. If you feel it is low risk and are comfortable with that, keep drinking sugary drinks. If you want to give yourself the best odds possible (even if a small difference) of avoiding diabetes, stop drinking them. I don't see why this is controversial.
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To my understanding, there is no one cause for type 2 diabetes. There's a number of factors that figure into the equation, and high sugar consumption is only one of them. I don't think doctors have a good, concrete answer to what causes it. All they can say is these are factors that can contribute, but they don't know how much or which combinations are worse. Being overweight contributes. Genetics contribute. High sugar diets contribute. Lack of exercise contributes. I'm sure there are more I'm not thinking of. But it's not just one thing.0
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brianpperkins wrote: »If sugar in drinks is causing diabetes then why are countries with higher sugar consumption than the US generating lower diabetes rates? Truly causal relationships hold up across arbitrary lines on a map.
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I think this might be what she's referring to:
Friendly news article version: http://www.cam.ac.uk/research/news/replacing-one-sugary-drink-per-day-could-cut-risk-of-type-2-diabetes
Down and dirty science version: http://www.diabetologia-journal.org/files/OConnor.pdf
@tomatoey PDF download for paper ?
Energy intake, waist circumference and BMI were analysed, as was smoking status, alcohol and activity.
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brianpperkins wrote: »If sugar in drinks is causing diabetes then why are countries with higher sugar consumption than the US generating lower diabetes rates? Truly causal relationships hold up across arbitrary lines on a map.
That's misleading. You should have included diabetes statistics as well. US only ranks 57th in the world for prevalence of diabetes% and many of the countries that rank much higher have a much lower sugar consumption.0 -
I don't have diabetes data to hand, but it's clear the US tops the sugars and soda leagues. So I don't know where the countries with greater consumption but lower diabetes are, which was the comment I repnded to.
Edit - 2010 OECD diabetes prevalence, US second to Mexico -
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I don't have diabetes data to hand, but it's clear the US tops the sugars and soda leagues. So I don't know where the countries with greater consumption but lower diabetes are, which was the comment I repnded to.
Edit - 2010 OECD diabetes prevalence, US second to Mexico -
Here is the full list for your preference.
http://www.indexmundi.com/facts/indicators/SH.STA.DIAB.ZS/rankings
US and Brazil indeed top the sugar list (and not only on the limited graphs here, but on more complete lists) but neither tops the diabetes list or even comes close.
My point is, diabetes is a complicated disease. Seeking a single "evil" to pin it on is futile. All we could do is observe a correlation with certain aspects and deem them as "interesting" without jumping to conclusions on causation.0 -
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Liftng4Lis wrote: »
Except it doesnt exlcude the other possibility that a diet high on sugar itself can lead to an increased level of diabetes, which is what they are investigating. the study appears to take whether people were obese or not into account. Nobody is arguing that being obese increases the chance of getting diabetes, thats accpeted.0 -
crazyjerseygirl wrote: »
I read that artificially sweetened soda had no effect, did I miss something in there?
Nope that seems to be what they found.0 -
Driving a vehicle increases one's risk 100% to get into an automobile accident versus one that doesn't drive. Driving safely, obeying driving rules and being aware of others lowers risk considerably, but if one wants to avoid a personal car accident, then the best option would be not to drive at all. Hopefully this person is within walking distance to work or is financially independent.MoiAussi93 wrote: »I like how "increases risk of" = "will cause".
It doesn't mean "will cause". But it certainly does not mean "doesn't cause". The point is there is some link that they need to find out more about before something definitive can be said. Until then, every individual is free to decide their own tolerance for risk. If you feel it is low risk and are comfortable with that, keep drinking sugary drinks. If you want to give yourself the best odds possible (even if a small difference) of avoiding diabetes, stop drinking them. I don't see why this is controversial.
It doesn't have to be cut and dry to increase risk on just about anything. People risk living in tornado alley, or Florida where's there hurricanes, etc.
I truly doubt consuming a sugary drink a day is going to be any higher risk to one's health if they aren't overweight or aren't dealing with metabolic syndrome. People who are truly at risk would be comparable to a driver who drives a car that has no tail lights, no seat belts, bad brakes, etc. meaning they shouldn't to begin with.
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