Can we please settle on at least a loose definition of...

Meg_Shirley_86

Clean eating.
Processed food.

-I mean, it never gets brought up without someone asking for a definition. Ever.
-I feel that we all know that eating processed or "unclean" food and being healthy are not mutually exclusive. We DO know that, right?
-I am one of "those people" that avoids processed food, and I catch a lot of grief for it, because some people act like it's the ONLY way to eat.
-Does some smart guy always have to step in, and say "You know, what do you call your packaged fruits and veggies, that's a process, right?" As if he has made some brilliant observation to the flaw in the logic. We use the word "processed" because that is the term people are familiar with. Not because it is perfect. I assure you, I buy bagged rice. I know it has been through a process to get bagged. Don't play like that's the same as a boxed dinner that has a shelf life longer than my oldest child.

This is starting to sound like a rant, and if it's obnoxious of me to post it, call me out. I don't mind, and I'm kind of "hangry" at the moment. I'd really just like to see what people define these terms as.

http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/cityofate/Coffee_Talk_Linda_Richman_NpeqcXvCF7PZ.jpg
Discuss.

JossFit

I see where you are coming from, but it's never going to happen. To a vegan, beef is going to be 'dirty' but to someone eating a Paleo style diet grains are 'dirty'.

Wouldn't it be easier to stop using arbitrary labels? Who cares if your food is "clean" or not? Just eat what YOU want to eat.

sailawaykate

Not sure for the clean eating (that one seems to have quite the wide range of definitions!)

But as for processed food, I think that if it's not in its original recognizable form, it counts as processed.

That being said, I would vote that things like brown rice and steel cut oats, frozen vegetables and cuts of meat (without additives), still count in the happy whole foods crowd. Yeah, they've gone through a process, but their nutritional value has not been negated by that process. That's what we're supposed to be concerned about, right?

kitka82

People are always going to question clean eating, just to be obnoxious. And--there will always be hierarchies within the realm of clean eating. Even if you eat as clean as you can, it will not be the cleanest of the clean lol. I know what you mean on a very basic level, but hear me out: There are the clean eaters who eat "unprocessed", as in basically the perimeter of the grocery store. Then there are the clean eaters who don't eat ANY sugar (not even agave). Then there's Paleo. Then there's the non-GMO, totally organic, free range, whatever eaters. Then there's raw and vegan and everything on top of that. I'm pretty sure I have that all out of order, but you get the jist.

And THAT is why I don't label my diet. It's too much work to explain it. I don't walk around with velveeta and twinkies hanging out of my mouth. But I don't always eat organic either. I consider my diet to be balanced, and healthy. Clean? No. Unclean? No.

LAW_714

Does some smart guy always have to step in, and say "You know, what do you call your packaged fruits and veggies, that's a process, right?" As if he has made some brilliant observation to the flaw in the logic. We use the word "processed" because that is the term people are familiar with. Not because it is perfect. I assure you, I buy bagged rice. I know it has been through a process to get bagged. Don't play like that's the same as a boxed dinner that has a shelf life longer than my oldest child.

This.

When I see comments that go to such absurd lengths (For example: You chopped it and heated it. You processed it too! Nyah!) I just think 'troll'.

YpsiChris

Here's an attempt and processed foods: they come in a package, they have labels, they have lobbies, there is an industry associated with them, they contain ingredients you cannot pronounce and your grandparents wouldn't have identified as food, they are made in a factory. What am I missing?

IMHO - GMO foods count as processed foods, but I realize that's a whole different can of worms. For me, eating clean means not eating heavily processed foods. As a vegan, I view meat as a heavily processed food. Conversely, I'm not worried about my consumption of steel cut oats or packaged quinoa.

I do not believe you can't be healthy eating processed foods. I eat them, I'm just selective about what I eat. I'd love to have my own organic garden, but the choices I've made re: how to live my life don't leave space for that activity. Maybe someday they will.

In my judgment, I'm happier and healthier eating some Beyond Meat Chicken strips than I am eating Fritos.

This list isn't all inclusive and I'm sure there are holes in my logic that someone can and will try to drive a semi through. I'm okay with that

chezjuan

I think that the definition of processed and clean really does depend on the person. Some people say dairy isn't clean, others say organic dairy is clean, but non-organic isn't. Some say frozen vegetables are processed, even if they are simply flash-frozen after picking, others say that they don't count as processed because all that happens is they are frozen. I don't know if a loose definition, other than "if you don't think it's clean" or "if you think it's processed" will work.

i personally eat pretty much anything as long as it fits my macros, but in general I cook my own foods, have leftovers for lunch, and opt for what I feel are healthier options in the foods I buy (processed or not). For pre-packaged foods, I define "healthier" as less unnecessary ingredients as a general guideline - for example, the peanut butter I buy is the "natural" style that simply lists peanuts as the ingredients.

NadineSabbagh

Does some smart guy always have to step in, and say "You know, what do you call your packaged fruits and veggies, that's a process, right?" As if he has made some brilliant observation to the flaw in the logic. We use the word "processed" because that is the term people are familiar with. Not because it is perfect. I assure you, I buy bagged rice. I know it has been through a process to get bagged. Don't play like that's the same as a boxed dinner that has a shelf life longer than my oldest child.

Yes, this! I completely agree. This frustrates me so much! People know exactly what is meant when someone refers to 'clean' and 'processed' food, but they simply have to have their obnoxious input. Of course the exact definition will differ between different people, but the basic premise is the same.

To me, 'clean' eating is any food that doesn't have an ingredients list as long as your arm, full of words you can't pronounce. Fresh, natural food, cooking from scratch etc. I eat dairy, but a lot of clean eaters won't agree that this is clean. However it's certainly not processed in the sense that it has had a bunch of things added to it to completely change it from it's original state.

'Processed' food, to me, is definitely not just ANYTHING that's been packaged (veggies in a bag for example), that's just a ridiculous assertion made by people who are bothered by the fact that you don't eat the way they think you should eat. Or people who just like an argument for the sake of it. 'Processed' quite clearly implies foods such as microwave meals, foods with a bunch of random chemicals thrown in etc, food that has gone through a significant amount of processing to add in extra ingredients... not just putting something natural in a bag!

I think the definitions of 'clean' and 'processed' are extremely clear, and it's basically common sense which is which. People just can't seem to pass up the opportunity for an argument... as much as I can't stand it, I guess that's the nature of the internet

(edit - have you noticed that the people who dispute the definitions, attack others and generally have an issue with clean eating are the people who don't eat clean and who have a problem with those who do? The people who generally say they eat clean, regardless of their definition, don't tend to be the ones who have the problem with other peoples definitions. It's mainly just the people who don't agree with our choice of diet. At least, that's what I've gathered from the posts I've read!)

Meg_Shirley_86

I am absolutely on board with what you all are saying. There was someone on the forums yesterday asking people to join a 60 day clean eating challenge, and you can predict how well that went. I felt bad, because she had good intentions, and since I already don't really do processed foods (by my definition), I thought I'd join her. Then I realized she had a really strange definition of clean, and the challenge didn't make any sense, because it was more like, "Eat clean, or don't, it's whatever...." She was giving some advice I found to be kind of bizarre, and I'm already a vegan who makes her own shampoo, conditioner, face and body wash, etc., so you KNOW that if I'm put off by how weird and unfounded the advice was, well, you know....

cwolfman13

The problem is that everyone has their own definition. My definition is rather lose...but some people's definition is rather strict. I avoid things like boxed foods with extensive shelf lives, frozen dinners, pre-made ready to eat meals, etc...but I'm not going to, for example, always cook dry beans...sometimes, and more often than not, I'm going to get out my can opener and poor a can of beans into a sauce pan. To someone following a strict paleo diet, that would be a double sin...legumes...and on top of that, canned legumes.

For me, it's pretty simple. Get my nutrition from my food...lots of veg and fruit, lean proteins and healthy fats... and then get my fitness on...the end.

dym123

I guess my version of "clean" is to avoid artificial flavors and chemicals in my food. Going 100% unprocessed is unrealistic unless you have the time and inclination to mill your own wheat. I read ingredients religiously, I try to stick with items with short list that are made up of real recognizable food. Of course try to eat as much whole foods as possible, frozen and fresh. I'm not 100%, but I'm OK with that. I'm sure there will be people that will say its not clean if its processed, then there are others that say it doesn't matter what I eat as long as I stay within my calories. I say, unless you're buying my groceries, you don't get a say.

Meg_Shirley_86

Here's an attempt and processed foods: they come in a package, they have labels, they have lobbies, there is an industry associated with them, they contain ingredients you cannot pronounce and your grandparents wouldn't have identified as food, they are made in a factory. What am I missing?

IMHO - GMO foods count as processed foods, but I realize that's a whole different can of worms. For me, eating clean means not eating heavily processed foods. As a vegan, I view meat as a heavily processed food. Conversely, I'm not worried about my consumption of steel cut oats or packaged quinoa.

I do not believe you can't be healthy eating processed foods. I eat them, I'm just selective about what I eat. I'd love to have my own organic garden, but the choices I've made re: how to live my life don't leave space for that activity. Maybe someday they will.

In my judgment, I'm happier and healthier eating some Beyond Meat Chicken strips than I am eating Fritos.

This list isn't all inclusive and I'm sure there are holes in my logic that someone can and will try to drive a semi through. I'm okay with that

I couldn't have said it better myself, as far as how I personally feel about it. I'm probably a hypocrite because I don't buy everything organic, only the ones proven to have had the most harm done in the process. I work, and my husband doesn't. I have to reconcile my concerns against my budget. And good food is the priority before anything else, so I don't feel too bad about it.

vjohn04

my definition:

Pretty much anything that hasn't been dropped on the floor.

but then again... we could argue the 5 second rule.

kobiemom

I don't understand why everyone has to agree completely. If you're doing better than you did yesterday, you're improving. Keep going.

SarahBeth0625

I think if it's already been "made", as in, "hi I'm going to put this frozen boxed lasagna in the oven" -- it's processed. We buy a lot of organic beef and chicken in our house, make steamed frozen vegetables, buy no canned goods, grow our own fruit and buy what we don't grow... for the MOST part, we avoid processed foods, but we're not perfect.

Achrya

my definition:

Pretty much anything that hasn't been dropped on the floor.

but then again... we could argue the 5 second rule.

Going to agree with this, actually. If it hasn't been on the floor/has been washed as needed It's 'clean'.

etoiles_argentees

please define "clean" ?

reposted, because I'm lazy -

I guess it depends on how you define clean. Many define it as food that is not processed or altered from it's original form, in any way. Right now I'm finding it hard to get raw milk instead of pasteurized and homogenized, so I usually use organic, not ideal but what can you do. I buy packaged and deli meats and chicken and such because I won't go to a butcher. I don't want to grind my own meat or flour. Cows and chickens running around my backyard are something my city frowns upon.

Same with things in cans - I like tuna from a can or pouch, I know it's processed but I'm okay with that. It's hard to find almonds unprocessed, let alone corn or soybeans that aren't genetically modified. I drink processed coconut water. I eat pasta that comes in a box or bag. Luckily in Florida we've got plenty of fruit and even a few veggies I can get unaltered. I do try to avoid preservatives, additives, pesticides and fungicides and I take part in my local organic food delivery program and our community garden, but I still buy and eat processed food. I guess I really don't want to put the time in to make things like yogurt or spaghetti sauce from scratch.

I respect and admire people that put in the effort to eat clean, it's much more time consuming than most realize.

* I've heard this used a lot to define "clean eating" - If you can shoot it, catch it, or grow it - eat it!

LorinaLynn

I don't really "eat clean," but here's my very loose definition: If it's at least somewhat recognizable from it's natural state, it's clean. If it's not, it's processed.

IE: chicken breast is clean, even if it's been "processed" by removing the skin and bone. But the kind of chicken nuggets that, when you bite into them, more closely resemble medium density fiberboard than the actual meat of a bird, are processed.

And there's varying degrees. A tomato is obviously clean. Canned crushed tomatoes, still pretty good. A jar of marinara, somewhat processed. The powder that comes in a box of Hamburger Helper? Totally processed.

mjschumacher100

There's no scientific definition of what a 'clean' food is. It's also extremely subjective and often changes according to one's agenda. The term is actually ridiculous. I think many consider it to refer to foods that are low in calories and added chemicals. The more calorie dense a food is, some might say, the less clean it is. That's of course total nonsense but there we go.

It all stems from a bunch of bro scientists who believe eating brown rice and grilled chicken is somehow more healthy than eating white rice and fried duck. Or Twinkies. The science simply doesn't support that. And even those trials that show some level of support for the assertion still suggest the differences are extremely minor.

samlankford

i TRY to stick away from anything with additives that I cannot pronounce.... try to stay away from things with added sugar/salt or anything with "nautral flavors" added (seriously WTF is natural flavor?!!)

chezjuan

'Processed' food, to me, is definitely not just ANYTHING that's been packaged (veggies in a bag for example), that's just a ridiculous assertion made by people who are bothered by the fact that you don't eat the way they think you should eat. Or people who just like an argument for the sake of it. 'Processed' quite clearly implies foods such as microwave meals, foods with a bunch of random chemicals thrown in etc, food that has gone through a significant amount of processing to add in extra ingredients... not just putting something natural in a bag!

I think the definitions of 'clean' and 'processed' are extremely clear, and it's basically common sense which is which. People just can't seem to pass up the opportunity for an argument... as much as I can't stand it, I guess that's the nature of the internet

I understand what you are saying here, but how do items like organic microwave meals (Amy's for example) fit into the definition? From Amy's Website:

Amy’s food tastes so good because it’s made from the kind of real food ingredients that people use in their own kitchens…no additives, no preservatives, no GMOs. If a child can’t pronounce it, you won’t find it on an Amy’s label.

It is definitely more than just putting vegetables in a bag and freezing them, and it is microwavable, but I could make something similar to their food at home without needing to buy a bag (vial?) of Polysorbate 80, etc.

I am genuinely curious as I think it is a major grey area... it is the kind of food that I would consider non- or minimally- processed but others would avoid.

dym123

i TRY to stick away from anything with additives that I cannot pronounce.... try to stay away from things with added sugar/salt or anything with "nautral flavors" added (seriously WTF is natural flavor?!!)

Seriously, you do not want to know.

ItsCasey

Why do you need a definition? I truly could not care less what anyone thinks of my diet, and I do not make my food choices based on some random definition of what's good or bad or clean or processed. I make them based on what I enjoy eating, what fits my calorie and macro targets, and what improves my performance in the gym. I eat lots of red meat. I eat lots of chocolate. I eat lots of ice cream. I lose weight, I lift heavy stuff, and I'm happy. Anyone who has a negative opinion about my diet can go pound sand, as far as I'm concerned.

CharliesInCharge

Why do you need a definition? I truly could not care less what anyone thinks of my diet, and I do not make my food choices based on some random definition of what's good or bad or clean or processed. I make them based on what I enjoy eating, what fits my calorie and macro targets, and what improves my performance in the gym. I eat lots of red meat. I eat lots of chocolate. I eat lots of ice cream. I lose weight, I lift heavy stuff, and I'm happy. Anyone who has a negative opinion about my diet can go pound sand, as far as I'm concerned.

but how do you REALLY feel ?:)

Jerrypeoples

While I cant claim to eat 100 process free (by your definition) i have really cleaned up my act.

One Year ago

to me dinner was either, Mickey Dees, Wendys or Burger King. or just to change things up, pizza.

this was after spending an 90 minutes at the gym. so i never gained weight but i also never lost it.

my breakfast had to have sugar as the #1 ingredient and preferably some cartoony mascot on the front

my lunches were the same as dinner.

Now

Breakfast is either Cascade Farms Organic Granola with Raisins and a half cup of skim milk

my lunch is 7oz of chicken breast baked with Mrs Dash lemon pepper seasoning or something else, 1/2 cup of brown rice and 1 cup of broccoli. Sprinkled with Kraft Mexican Blended Cheese. topped with 2 spoon fulls of salsa

Dinner is a Peanutbutter Fantasy Shake from the gym

Snack is a homemade protein Shake.

in between the meals i have 1 cup of cantaloupe 1 cup of grapes, 2 granola bars and a banana. before i leave from work to the gym its a homemade salad

to me whether you eat organic or not the key is to try to make as many healthy choices as you can that you feel comfortable with

iAMsmiling

No

MLBuddecke

Hi dym123, I agree, and I'm coming from a place where my parents grew their own organic wheat and milled it, but now that they are retired, changes have been made, I have to buy whole wheat floor in a bag at the store, I grow and freeze a lot of my own veggies, but where I live it's basically impossible to have fresh fruit and veg year round, organic or not, so Ido the best I can, and I really don't give a rat's about what other people think of my diet.

JUDDDing

my definition:

Pretty much anything that hasn't been dropped on the floor.

but then again... we could argue the 5 second rule.

heh. We could argue the 30 second rule. :drinker:

KenosFeoh

I don't think we have a definition section here.

I find "clean eating" to be a really obnoxious term. It implies that anything else is "dirty".

CrankMeUp

No

Meg_Shirley_86

my definition:

Pretty much anything that hasn't been dropped on the floor.

but then again... we could argue the 5 second rule.

Ha! I like you! :drinker: