Had my RMR tested...advice needed!
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BarbieAS
Posts: 1,414 Member
TL;DR version: Got my RMR tested, it's in the toilet. What do I do now?
Brief backstory: Current stats: 34 years, old, 5'5", 217lbs. I've had a LOT of trouble losing weight over the last 3.5 years or so. My rate of loss was absolutely nowhere near what my deficit would dictate - like, by a LOT. I use a food scale and am honest about my intake, so my logging is pretty tight. So, I decided to get an RMR test done at my gym via a BodyGem device.
Based on the online calculators out there, my RMR should be in the neighborhood of 1,750 or so. My tested RMR was 1,350. My Fitbit tells me that, on average, I burn about 800-900 calories per day between NEAT and exercise (I'm moderately active, I average ~8,000 or more steps on a non-workout day, plus a few gym sessions per week), but obviously my true burn is less than that, since clearly Fitbit's calculations are not going to be accurate for me. I'm probably looking at a TDEE between 1,800 and 2,000 including workouts at my current frequency/intensity.
I've been attempting to lose weight for several years now and I've tried a lot of different approaches in that time, but I've never been one to over-restrict - on average (with some lower days and some higher days), I've been eating ~1,700-1,800 calories (total, not net) per day (which I thought was a halfway decent deficit but turns out is basically maintenance). Nor have I ever been one to go crazy with cardio - I have some joint issues so I mostly stick to brisk walking/elliptical and some resistance training. Based on that, I feel like it's hard to say whether I drove down my RMR through eating too little over such a long period of time or if I'm just built that way (I've been overweight my entire life) or some combo of the two. I should also mention that in the last 3.5 years I've had my thyroid tested twice (though the last was about 2 years ago), both times with normal results.
So, I need some advice on what to do next. Two things are immediately obvious to me, and I'm committed to both of them: (1) making protein and weight training my #1 health priority, and (2) being realistic about how quickly I can lose weight based on this information. Past that, I'm not sure what to do. Should I try to eat more for awhile to see if I can boost my RMR a bit? Should I just develop a reasonable deficit based on the information I have and go from there starting now? Should I go crazy on cardio to just try to burn as many calories per day as I can? Should I scale back the steady-state cardio and focus on HIIT? Are there any other non-woo strategies out there that can help me, in terms of diet advice or supplements or whatnot? Even though my thyroid has tested normal, are there any other medical issues that could drive this that could make a doctor's visit worthwhile? Informed opinions and advice are very welcome and appreciated!!
Brief backstory: Current stats: 34 years, old, 5'5", 217lbs. I've had a LOT of trouble losing weight over the last 3.5 years or so. My rate of loss was absolutely nowhere near what my deficit would dictate - like, by a LOT. I use a food scale and am honest about my intake, so my logging is pretty tight. So, I decided to get an RMR test done at my gym via a BodyGem device.
Based on the online calculators out there, my RMR should be in the neighborhood of 1,750 or so. My tested RMR was 1,350. My Fitbit tells me that, on average, I burn about 800-900 calories per day between NEAT and exercise (I'm moderately active, I average ~8,000 or more steps on a non-workout day, plus a few gym sessions per week), but obviously my true burn is less than that, since clearly Fitbit's calculations are not going to be accurate for me. I'm probably looking at a TDEE between 1,800 and 2,000 including workouts at my current frequency/intensity.
I've been attempting to lose weight for several years now and I've tried a lot of different approaches in that time, but I've never been one to over-restrict - on average (with some lower days and some higher days), I've been eating ~1,700-1,800 calories (total, not net) per day (which I thought was a halfway decent deficit but turns out is basically maintenance). Nor have I ever been one to go crazy with cardio - I have some joint issues so I mostly stick to brisk walking/elliptical and some resistance training. Based on that, I feel like it's hard to say whether I drove down my RMR through eating too little over such a long period of time or if I'm just built that way (I've been overweight my entire life) or some combo of the two. I should also mention that in the last 3.5 years I've had my thyroid tested twice (though the last was about 2 years ago), both times with normal results.
So, I need some advice on what to do next. Two things are immediately obvious to me, and I'm committed to both of them: (1) making protein and weight training my #1 health priority, and (2) being realistic about how quickly I can lose weight based on this information. Past that, I'm not sure what to do. Should I try to eat more for awhile to see if I can boost my RMR a bit? Should I just develop a reasonable deficit based on the information I have and go from there starting now? Should I go crazy on cardio to just try to burn as many calories per day as I can? Should I scale back the steady-state cardio and focus on HIIT? Are there any other non-woo strategies out there that can help me, in terms of diet advice or supplements or whatnot? Even though my thyroid has tested normal, are there any other medical issues that could drive this that could make a doctor's visit worthwhile? Informed opinions and advice are very welcome and appreciated!!
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Replies
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Well, to me, it sounds like a doctors visit is already worthwhile? Why wait for the house to be burned down before calling the fire department? Why not call them when the fire breaks out? It sounds like you have plenty of reason to visit the doctor and have some legitimate testing done... why not go do it?0
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BecomingBane wrote: »Well, to me, it sounds like a doctors visit is already worthwhile? Why wait for the house to be burned down before calling the fire department? Why not call them when the fire breaks out? It sounds like you have plenty of reason to visit the doctor and have some legitimate testing done... why not go do it?
I agree. The only reason I hesitated was because I've seen two different doctors on two separate occasions in the last couple of years, specifically regarding trouble losing weight. One doctor gave me a thyroid test, told me it was normal, and prescribed me phentermine (which I never took). The other doctor gave me a thyroid test, told me it was normal, and sent me to a registered dietitian (who I saw a couple of times and I followed her plan for awhile, with no improvement). Both times they acted like a normal thyroid test indicated that there was nothing more they could do for me. That's why I asked if anyone knew of another medical condition that they could look for that would impact my metabolic rate in this way, otherwise it seems like it's a waste of time. I should mention that my cholesterol, blood pressure, and blood sugar tests over the last few years have all been basically perfect, and I show no signs of PCOS, insulin resistance, or anything like that.0 -
Well first off, I would not trust a test done at the gym to be accurate.
Second, maybe you're just overestimating your activity level. 8000 steps is not moderately active, but lightly active.
Third, weighing is great, but you could be using inaccurate entries etc.
I find it hard to believe that your RMR would be low if you're that weight though. Even if you did slow it down at some point by eating too little, you've still gained weight, and so it should have 'fixed' your issue.
My advice is to go see a doctor again to make sure that there is no other issue, and decrease your calories to 1600.0 -
An alternative to a RMR test is just using real life results. Log your food as accurately as possible for 6 weeks and log your weight for 6 weeks. The more accurate the better. At the end, run some math and calculate TDEE. Then, set your deficit based on that.
As for metabolic adaptation, my understanding is that is a result of eating so little that you lose large amounts of weight. At which point, the lower energy requirements don't always match up with the actual weight lost. If you have been trying without success to lose weight for years, then you weren't eating at a big deficit, you were eating at maintenance and metabolic adaptation shouldn't apply (maybe I'm wrong, this is just my understanding of it). TDEE/BMR calculators can be off by +/-15%. If your RMR test is correct (and agrees with real world results), then sadly you are one of the extremely unlucky few who have a very low BMR. But, that means you just need to use that information to lose weight.
I don't know if there is a way to boost your BMR. You could try eating at maintenance (based on real world results) with sufficient protein, while lifting weights and see what happens. Log it all and in theory if BMR increased, then you would lose weight along the way. The worst that happens is you do recomp for 6 months, lose some fat, and gain some muscle, instead of actually seeing the number on the scale drop.0 -
Adding muscle really, really does help increase your BMR/RMR. But it's hard to build muscle when you're eating at maintenance or a deficit.0
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Well first off, I would not trust a test done at the gym to be accurate.
Second, maybe you're just overestimating your activity level. 8000 steps is not moderately active, but lightly active.
I find it hard to believe that your RMR would be low if you're that weight though. Even if you did slow it down at some point by eating too little, you've still gained weight, and so it should have 'fixed' your issue.
My advice is to go see a doctor again to make sure that there is no other issue, and decrease your calories to 1600.
Well, it's 8,000 steps without working out - I do go to the gym or go for a brisk outside walk 3-4 times per week in addition to that. However, I don't use MFP's activity level estimates or exercise calories, I go off my Fitbit for all exercise adjustments. I agree that it's being overstated for sure - that's my whole issue here.
Even if the gym's RMR test isn't accurate, it supports my experience over the last few years (I haven't actually gained weight, I've just only lost maybe 20 pounds when I "should" have lost much much more). I'm sure it's not perfect, but I think it's reasonable to believe that my true RMR is significantly lower than the estimates out there would indicate. The test is just one more piece of evidence that I think supports my theory that it's not a logging issue, or at least not entirely a logging issue.0 -
It's mid single digits per pound of muscle per day. Twenty pounds of muscle would be about 120 extra calories.Adding muscle really, really does help increase your BMR/RMR. But it's hard to build muscle when you're eating at maintenance or a deficit.
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It's my understanding, based on conversations with my doctor, that thyroid and hormonal issues are notoriously difficult to diagnose and even harder to treat. I'd ask for a complete series of tests (mine were covered by insurance as part of my physical) and ask to see the results and have them fully explained to me. My doctor admitted to me that hormonal issues will often be overlooked because of how hard they are to treat, especially if they are not posing an immediate health problem.
If you are not satisfied with your current doctor, try to find one who specializes in those types of issues and see them, odds are a specialist will be more knowledgeable than a GP any day and will notice something that the GP might not.0 -
DeguelloTex wrote: »
It's mid single digits per pound of muscle per day. Twenty pounds of muscle would be about 120 extra calories.Adding muscle really, really does help increase your BMR/RMR. But it's hard to build muscle when you're eating at maintenance or a deficit.
Access to Beachbody products
Access to ItWorks! products
Access to Plexus products
Been in fitness for numerous years and have studied anatomy, physiology, and nutrition
Yep. And it made a HUGE difference to me when I added about 30 lbs of muscle. Thanks for the exact numbers!0 -
nordlead2005 wrote: »An alternative to a RMR test is just using real life results. Log your food as accurately as possible for 6 weeks and log your weight for 6 weeks. The more accurate the better. At the end, run some math and calculate TDEE. Then, set your deficit based on that.
I actually have a running spreadsheet with my Fitbit burns and my MFP logged food that can tell you this info for very long periods of time
. I consistently calculate that my TDEE is actually about 20-25% less than what my Fitbit tells me that it is. This RMR test is just another piece of the puzzle, and like I mentioned in another comment, another way to "prove" (that's much too strong of a word, but you know what I'm getting at) that I'm not just WAY off in my logging. I honestly think I log quite well - I weigh/measure everything except the obvious stuff like the odd restaurant meal, and I make a point to ensure I log everything I eat.
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Do you log here on MFP?0
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Why do you think cardio would be a bad idea? Cardio does not damage your RMR. Honestly, my suggestion would be some type of exercise that incorporates both cardio and resistance. Something like swimming might be good since you have joint issues.0
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8000 steps/day is NOT moderately active--nowhere near in fact.
The only thing that you can do to make up for your low rate is to exercise more.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Why do you think cardio would be a bad idea? Cardio does not damage your RMR. Honestly, my suggestion would be some type of exercise that incorporates both cardio and resistance. Something like swimming might be good since you have joint issues.
I didn't mean that I thought cardio would be bad, so much as I want to do the right type of cardio. I've got a more than full-time job and 2 small kids. I make time for workouts, but there's still only so much time I can make. I've read that HIIT can provide a better "after burn" boost to your metabolic rate, and so I was thinking about incorporating that instead, since I'm sort of in a "every little bit can help" mindset.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Why do you think cardio would be a bad idea? Cardio does not damage your RMR. Honestly, my suggestion would be some type of exercise that incorporates both cardio and resistance. Something like swimming might be good since you have joint issues.
I didn't mean that I thought cardio would be bad, so much as I want to do the right type of cardio. I've got a more than full-time job and 2 small kids. I make time for workouts, but there's still only so much time I can make. I've read that HIIT can provide a better "after burn" boost to your metabolic rate, and so I was thinking about incorporating that instead, since I'm sort of in a "every little bit can help" mindset.
Got it. Yeah, HIIT is good stuff. Especially when you are pressed for time.0 -
azulvioleta6 wrote: »8000 steps/day is NOT moderately active--nowhere near in fact.
The only thing that you can do to make up for your low rate is to exercise more.
The charts I've seen classify 7,500-10,000 steps per day as "somewhat active," which is between "low active" and "active." And, again, that's without exercise. But, that's really just semantics - I was just trying to demonstrate that despite having a 45+ hours per week desk job and a 2 hours/day commute, I don't only sit on my tuchus all day and do get some degree of activity in.0 -
BecomingBane wrote: »It's my understanding, based on conversations with my doctor, that thyroid and hormonal issues are notoriously difficult to diagnose and even harder to treat. I'd ask for a complete series of tests (mine were covered by insurance as part of my physical) and ask to see the results and have them fully explained to me. My doctor admitted to me that hormonal issues will often be overlooked because of how hard they are to treat, especially if they are not posing an immediate health problem.
If you are not satisfied with your current doctor, try to find one who specializes in those types of issues and see them, odds are a specialist will be more knowledgeable than a GP any day and will notice something that the GP might not.
Maybe I'll try a third doctor. I mean, I guess it can't hurt. What kind of specialist are you thinking? Like an endocrinologist or something?0 -
BecomingBane wrote: »It's my understanding, based on conversations with my doctor, that thyroid and hormonal issues are notoriously difficult to diagnose and even harder to treat. I'd ask for a complete series of tests (mine were covered by insurance as part of my physical) and ask to see the results and have them fully explained to me. My doctor admitted to me that hormonal issues will often be overlooked because of how hard they are to treat, especially if they are not posing an immediate health problem.
If you are not satisfied with your current doctor, try to find one who specializes in those types of issues and see them, odds are a specialist will be more knowledgeable than a GP any day and will notice something that the GP might not.
Maybe I'll try a third doctor. I mean, I guess it can't hurt. What kind of specialist are you thinking? Like an endocrinologist or something?
An endocrinologist would be the person to see for thyroid or hormonal issues. I trust my GP, but I made sure that not only did they have good reviews, a great education, but also that they were versed in sports medicine. So they met all of my criteria... plus, they have never given e advice that I'd questions based on any studies I've read. Ultimately, for me, it boils down to trust. Do I trust they are giving me well educated advice... if the answer is even hesitant, I'd find a new GP. You may or may not be able to do that, but it takes confidence in a doctor to trust their advice and second or third opinions never hurt unless it's my wallet that feels the pain, lol.0 -
So, I'm thinking that I'm going to shoot for a 1,600 goal like was suggested (I liked that), and take my Fitbit out of the equation for now. Some data god here on MFP (I hate that I can't remember who and give them the appropriate credit) set up a spreadsheet where you can input a tested RMR value and it will tell you how to futz your height on Fitbit so that it compensates for any differences - I had to laugh because it told me to put in that I'm 3 feet 3.5 inches tall, but, hey, whatever. I'm going to make that adjustment and keep wearing my Fitbit, and make sure my logging is TIGHT, and then even though I'm not going to use exercise adjustments for now I'll compare Fitbit to MFP in 4-6 weeks and see what it looks like. I'm going to see if I can find some HIIT videos on YouTube or something, too, and even if I can't increase the quantity of my workouts I'll see how much increase in intensity I can handle. And up my protein.0
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BecomingBane wrote: »BecomingBane wrote: »It's my understanding, based on conversations with my doctor, that thyroid and hormonal issues are notoriously difficult to diagnose and even harder to treat. I'd ask for a complete series of tests (mine were covered by insurance as part of my physical) and ask to see the results and have them fully explained to me. My doctor admitted to me that hormonal issues will often be overlooked because of how hard they are to treat, especially if they are not posing an immediate health problem.
If you are not satisfied with your current doctor, try to find one who specializes in those types of issues and see them, odds are a specialist will be more knowledgeable than a GP any day and will notice something that the GP might not.
Maybe I'll try a third doctor. I mean, I guess it can't hurt. What kind of specialist are you thinking? Like an endocrinologist or something?
An endocrinologist would be the person to see for thyroid or hormonal issues. I trust my GP, but I made sure that not only did they have good reviews, a great education, but also that they were versed in sports medicine. So they met all of my criteria... plus, they have never given e advice that I'd questions based on any studies I've read. Ultimately, for me, it boils down to trust. Do I trust they are giving me well educated advice... if the answer is even hesitant, I'd find a new GP. You may or may not be able to do that, but it takes confidence in a doctor to trust their advice and second or third opinions never hurt unless it's my wallet that feels the pain, lol.
I'll be honest that I've never really looked into a GP that deeply. I rarely go to the doctor at all, so I honestly don't even have a real GP, I just see whatever doctor is available in the practice I've been going to literally since I was born. There is a third doctor at the practice that I've seen once or twice for other things and who I actually really like, so maybe I'll schedule something with her and see what she has to say. I've also never really pushed my doctors hard for answers (more like "oh, you say it's normal? ok, my mistake, I must just be wrong about things, I won't bother you again"); maybe if I walk in with years of logging and an (albeit possibly not totally accurate but still something) RMR test I can at least get them to admit something is wrong and hopefully they'll agree to help me figure out what.0
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