Counting Cals vs Body's Natural Instinct
fat2fitaddict
Posts: 90 Member
So I have never really been a fan of counting calories..until recently..about 2 months ago. But something I read the other day hit me pretty good and so I wanted to get your take on it as well!
The article was long and detailed but it basically stated that we as humans have a natural "cut off" or "calorie counter" built into us and that we should eat until full and that our bodies will tell us when to cut off the feed! It went on to even say that counting cals in his opinion was a eater disorder within itself. The article concluded by stating that the problem with obesity isn't that our internal cut off alarm doesn't work, but rather that we fail to listen to it and adhere by it. He also stated that it's not always our faults as foods today (sugary, additive, etc) are basically hijacking and short circuiting our system. Causing us to continue eating after we have had enough.
What's your thoughts on this? Should we be "less conscience" on cals and MORE CONSCIENCE on our internal switch?
The article was long and detailed but it basically stated that we as humans have a natural "cut off" or "calorie counter" built into us and that we should eat until full and that our bodies will tell us when to cut off the feed! It went on to even say that counting cals in his opinion was a eater disorder within itself. The article concluded by stating that the problem with obesity isn't that our internal cut off alarm doesn't work, but rather that we fail to listen to it and adhere by it. He also stated that it's not always our faults as foods today (sugary, additive, etc) are basically hijacking and short circuiting our system. Causing us to continue eating after we have had enough.
What's your thoughts on this? Should we be "less conscience" on cals and MORE CONSCIENCE on our internal switch?
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Replies
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Kind of like a conscience, our "internal switch" is only valuable if we listen to it. The problem is that we're taught not to.
How many of us were raised to "eat everything on your plate!" and in some cases, "Eat more, eat more!" Ever since we were kids, we've been trained to view foods as rewards, and the higher the sugar content, the more rewarding.
As adults, this is perpetuated. Only now, we are taught to eat away our stress and to drink to be sociable.
Most of us are now incapable of just listening to our body tell us when we've had enough. We have no clue how much and how often we're overeating. This is where calorie counting comes in.
Personally, I was shocked to find out how much I was overeating. I've only been tracking for three weeks, but I've lost 5 pounds and I feel amazing. And-big shocker-I'm satisfied with way less food. Ideally, I won't need to log my calories forever. But for now, I'm still way off base without the tracking system.0 -
I think if i was able to tell when i was naturally 'topped off' calorie wise....i wouldnt be on MFP to lose weight.
I'll stick to calorie counting so i KNOW how much i have consumed. Not hope Im interpreting my bodies signals correctly.0 -
I don't buy the premise that everyone has a functional hunger/satiety system. Yes, our bodies have evolved to regulate our weight by regulating our appetite, but our eyes also have evolved to correctly focus light, and yet how many people wear glasses or contacts?
Evolution is amazing but it's not perfect, particularly when circumstances have changed so much so quickly - we're far more sedentary and have access to far greater amounts of calories than ever before. A propensity to overeat would be an evolutionary advantage when famine and starvation were recurring threats, because those who stored excess fat in times of plenty would better weather the times of famine. Now we put the descendants of those people into a perpetual time of plenty.0 -
Kind of like a conscience, our "internal switch" is only valuable if we listen to it. The problem is that we're taught not to.
How many of us were raised to "eat everything on your plate!" and in some cases, "Eat more, eat more!" Ever since we were kids, we've been trained to view foods as rewards, and the higher the sugar content, the more rewarding.
As adults, this is perpetuated. Only now, we are taught to eat away our stress and to drink to be sociable.
Most of us are now incapable of just listening to our body tell us when we've had enough. We have no clue how much and how often we're overeating. This is where calorie counting comes in.
Personally, I was shocked to find out how much I was overeating. I've only been tracking for three weeks, but I've lost 5 pounds and I feel amazing. And-big shocker-I'm satisfied with way less food. Ideally, I won't need to log my calories forever. But for now, I'm still way off base without the tracking system.
Very insightful! And very much true.. As children we are indeed taught to eat all on our plates. I notice though how you have found calorie counting to be beneficial in that you're not needing as much food to be satisfied. And also how one day you won't need to count calories. I wonder if this means that your current calorie logging will help get your body back TO listening to your internal switch?
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If I listened to my body when I eat I will forever be fat. Plus, I like to know a good estimate of how much protein, fats, carbs I eat in a day. Counting helps me do that! I don't think it's an eating disorder (though I guess for others it could be if they became crazy about it).0
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Growing up in a poor-financial family, it has been ingrained in my mind not to waste any food. And it is always carb-heavy. So I always try to eat whatever's on the plate.
And nowadays if I wait till my body says full, I can eat a whole 6 pcs pizza, with close to 2000 calories. I log to avoid doing this again.0 -
fat2fitaddict wrote: »The article was long and detailed but
It was woo.
Also, what rankinsect said:rankinsect wrote: »I don't buy the premise that everyone has a functional hunger/satiety system. Yes, our bodies have evolved to regulate our weight by regulating our appetite, but our eyes also have evolved to correctly focus light, and yet how many people wear glasses or contacts?
Evolution is amazing but it's not perfect, particularly when circumstances have changed so much so quickly - we're far more sedentary and have access to far greater amounts of calories than ever before. A propensity to overeat would be an evolutionary advantage when famine and starvation were recurring threats, because those who stored excess fat in times of plenty would better weather the times of famine. Now we put the descendants of those people into a perpetual time of plenty.
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People wouldn't over eat or under eat if this were truly the case. Not to mention we would have no need for excess storage for surplus calories.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
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Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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rankinsect wrote: »I don't buy the premise that everyone has a functional hunger/satiety system. Yes, our bodies have evolved to regulate our weight by regulating our appetite, but our eyes also have evolved to correctly focus light, and yet how many people wear glasses or contacts?
Evolution is amazing but it's not perfect, particularly when circumstances have changed so much so quickly - we're far more sedentary and have access to far greater amounts of calories than ever before. A propensity to overeat would be an evolutionary advantage when famine and starvation were recurring threats, because those who stored excess fat in times of plenty would better weather the times of famine. Now we put the descendants of those people into a perpetual time of plenty.
In light of the evidence (the epidemic of obesity virtually worldwide), that makes a lot more sense than postulating that humans have an endogenous cutoff mechanism.
It's typical clickbait, though - it's not your fault, you're just a victim of the evil foodz.0 -
i think it might be true for natural foods. I will never overeat on broccoli, but crisps..... I easily eat a family bag of those in one sitting.0
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I've never been a fan of counting calories either, but if I listened to my "internal calorie counter," I would never stop eating or gaining weight. I need to track everything I eat so I can interpret my body's signals correctly. Basically, I log and eat my meals, then wait about 15 minutes to see how I feel...hungry or satiated. Tracking helps me control how much I eat. As tedious as it is, it works.0
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Its very true, its what all the thin people you know do. The thin people i know have no problem starting a meal and leaving 2/3 of the food on the plate and saying I'm full. Me? I eat until the food has gone, engrained in me from a kid by parents.
I did try to kick the habit few years ago, and followed Paul Mckenna's i can make you thin, which teaches you how to re-sensatise yourself to this I'm full signal (and real hunger). It worked for me, i got down from 18 stone to 13 stone in about 8 months, just by feeling for this I'm full signal and not overriding it!
The issue was for 30 years of my life i had not been doing this, and had only corrected my self for 8 months, so when i had a few major things in life all hit me at once my old habits kicked in and i just could not tune into the full feeling properly, so i turned to MFP to stop me going back up and to get the final few stone off.
Once i get to the weight i want i intend to re-tune my self to the full feeling again and use that to maintain without calorie counting for the rest of my life.
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My guess is that the vast majority of people are born with a reliable switch but that early programming (clean your plate!) and living in a culture where we're absolutely surrounded with inexpensive, highly processed food full of fat and sugar that has been intentionally engineered to make us want to eat more and more short circuits that switch at a very early age. In most people anyway. As @ElkeKNJ said, very few people overeat broccoli.0
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quackers82 wrote: »Its very true, its what all the thin people you know do. The thin people i know have no problem starting a meal and leaving 2/3 of the food on the plate and saying I'm full. Me? I eat until the food has gone, engrained in me from a kid by parents.
I did try to kick the habit few years ago, and followed Paul Mckenna's i can make you thin, which teaches you how to re-sensatise yourself to this I'm full signal (and real hunger). It worked for me, i got down from 18 stone to 13 stone in about 8 months, just by feeling for this I'm full signal and not overriding it!
The issue was for 30 years of my life i had not been doing this, and had only corrected my self for 8 months, so when i had a few major things in life all hit me at once my old habits kicked in and i just could not tune into the full feeling properly, so i turned to MFP to stop me going back up and to get the final few stone off.
Once i get to the weight i want i intend to re-tune my self to the full feeling again and use that to maintain without calorie counting for the rest of my life.
If they're leaving 2/3 of a normal serving because they're full that's the same problem in the other direction.0 -
Doesn't it take someone typically about 20 minutes to process a feeling of being "full?" I can do a lot of damage in 20 minutes and become over full. That's a slow switch.0
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Nature vs nuture. We might all have it when we are born, but for some of us, it gets 'broken' when we grow up.
That's why there are naturally thin people with great self control and people who like to overeat on delicious foods. If you have a weight problem, it's fair to say that your 'natural satiety instinct' is FUBAR.0 -
I agree with most of the poster's that we have messed up our natural calorie cutoff indicator. I know for some strange reason with alcohol I never want more than one or two drinks, I have a natural cutoff satiety for it but others struggle horribly with alcohol problems. Now, I could eat a whole pizza, gallon of ice cream, package cookies or chocolate. Then 3-4 hours later my hormones and stomach would be asking for more calories.
As Franci127 posted "If you have a weight problem, it's fair to say that your 'natural satiety instinct' is FUBAR."0 -
fat2fitaddict wrote: »we as humans have a natural "cut off" or "calorie counter" built into us and that we should eat until full and that our bodies will tell us when to cut off the feed!
How did that work for you up to now?
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A person who had this "natural satiety instinct" would not necessarily have been what you'd call "evolutionarily advantaged" over most of human history. We're very well-built to store energy for later. Maybe people who are inclined to stop eating after a few hundred calories are evolutionarily advantaged for the next few thousand years. That would make the whole obesity thing kinda self-solving in the long term
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It actually reminds me of advice I was reading when I got my kids... that babies naturally stop drinking milk when they are full, but when moms add rice to their bottle to make them sleep longer, it messes it up and they will just learn to overeat.
Got to wonder if there's truth to it now. Of course all the moms I know who did that say it was BS, but who knows.0 -
fat2fitaddict wrote: »The article was long and detailed but it basically stated that we as humans have a natural "cut off" or "calorie counter" built into us and that we should eat until full and that our bodies will tell us when to cut off the feed!
I see no reason to think this is true, certainly not for everyone. It makes evolutionary sense that it wouldn't be. In an environment of scarcity with feast and famine periods it's beneficial to be able to eat more when food is available, even if it's over your TDEE for the day.
I find that maintenance works for me if I'm mindful (pay attention to how much I eat, eat at mealtimes and don't snack much) without specific counting, but that's different than having some kind of natural "calorie counter" or "cut off," which sounds like bunk.
If counting helps you understand how much you are eating (and many people are very bad at it so likely benefit from counting for a while), I don't see why it would be negative. For me, it helped me eat more while losing weight, which was quite helpful, as my natural inclination was to overdo the cutting out the higher cal foods.0 -
It actually reminds me of advice I was reading when I got my kids... that babies naturally stop drinking milk when they are full, but when moms add rice to their bottle to make them sleep longer, it messes it up and they will just learn to overeat.
Got to wonder if there's truth to it now. Of course all the moms I know who did that say it was BS, but who knows.
I absolutely refused to put anything in my kids' bottles except for formula or milk. I always said If babies were ready to eat solid food, they could eat it from a spoon. With a sample size of 2 (lol) both my kids are at a great weight and stop eating when they are full. Who knows, they may have been this way even if i had put cereal in their bottles....but i look at all my friends who did that and all their kids are overweight, from the youngest, a 1 year old, to the oldest, to a 7 year old.
I did get a lot of nagging and forceful pressure to add stuff to my kids' bottles, though.0 -
Nope. I'm bulking right now, so I'm in a calorie surplus and gaining weight on purpose. I'm still hungry. I still have to log my food because I want to eat OVER the goal I'm giving, which is already enough to make me gain weight.0
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i think the "fullness" feeling is your brain responding to how much is in your stomach and not the nutrient content of what you eat. Foods today are so dense in calories, you could eat something that is the size of your fist and not be full but it would contain almost half your days worth of calories in it.0
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Sorry, but I don't believe it and I'll tell you why. I grew up on a farm. If you feed animals a surplus (just put it in front of them) they will fatten up. They do not turn their backs on extra food and just walk away. For us there is just too much tasty food available. Nobody wants to count, or exercise alot, so there's always this dream floating around that you can just eat til you're full and then stop. I don't believe it. Look how many are back here counting again after letting themselves go.0
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fat2fitaddict wrote: »So I have never really been a fan of counting calories..until recently..about 2 months ago. But something I read the other day hit me pretty good and so I wanted to get your take on it as well!
The article was long and detailed but it basically stated that we as humans have a natural "cut off" or "calorie counter" built into us and that we should eat until full and that our bodies will tell us when to cut off the feed! It went on to even say that counting cals in his opinion was a eater disorder within itself. The article concluded by stating that the problem with obesity isn't that our internal cut off alarm doesn't work, but rather that we fail to listen to it and adhere by it. He also stated that it's not always our faults as foods today (sugary, additive, etc) are basically hijacking and short circuiting our system. Causing us to continue eating after we have had enough.
What's your thoughts on this? Should we be "less conscience" on cals and MORE CONSCIENCE on our internal switch?
It all comes down to how serious you are about your program, how precise you want your results to be, and what exactly you define as ”counting calories” in the first place.
What exactly are calories anyway?
Calories are simply a measurement of the total amount of energy contained in the foods you eat.
If your goal is to burn fat, you need to create a calorie deficit by burning more calories than you consume. If your goal is to build muscle, you need to create a calorie surplus by consuming more calories than you burn (as some of you, may already know). It's all about the numbers.
This is the most foundational, fundamental dietary principle there is and it must be followed if you want to see progress. It’s not that cut and dry, though. There is also an optimal range that you’ll want to hit in order to achieve the best results. If you’re not counting calories in any real way, there’s a decent chance you’ll get the deficit/surplus aspect met (though even this fails in a lot of cases), but a pretty good chance that it won’t be in the optimal range.
What are the consequences of this?
Well, if your goal is fat loss, and your deficit is less than 15-20%, you simply won’t lose fat at your maximum potential. If it’s greater than 15-20%, you’ll still lose fat, but you’ll also lose an excessive amount of lean muscle tissue in the process.
If your goal is muscle gain, and your surplus is less than 15-20%, you won’t gain muscle at your maximum potential. If it’s greater than 15-20%, you’ll still gain muscle, but you’ll also gain an excessive amount of fat as well.
This is where counting calories comes into play. It’s a way to hit your diet with precision so that you:
a) Maximize fat loss while minimizing muscle loss.
Or
b) Maximize muscle gain while minimizing fat gain.
If you simply “wing” your diet, it’s going to be pretty hard, if not impossible to accomplish this.
One thing is for sure though, you definitely need some sort of system in place where you understand what your daily calorie/protein/carbohydrate/fat needs are and have a reasonably accurate idea of what you’re taking in through your diet. Otherwise, you’re just shooting darts with a blindfold.
Try to completely “wing” your diet and there’s a very good chance that you’ll be burning fat or building muscle well below your potential (or losing muscle/gaining fat to an excessive degree), or even worse, wasting your time in the gym altogether.
Proper fitness nutrition is not rocket-science, but don’t make the mistake of thinking that calories don’t matter. If you truly want to achieve an impressive, head-turning body, they absolutely do.
In the end, It’s really up to you. It depends how serious you are about your results and how much effort you're willing to put into your diet.
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If our bodies have a built in calorie counting instinct, why are we sll do overweight? Hmmm...,0
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One of the reasons I have to count calories is that my "natural instinct" is to eat until I'm uncomfortably full, or until there's nothing left in sight to consume!0
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