concerned about a friend

WalkingAlong

We don't really know what she's been told. I think someone who tells themselves they needed to get a Coke because they were shaky on the drive home also tells their friends that their doctor's advice is too strict to follow. We tell ourselves all kinds of things to justify not changing, especially when the change is doctor-imposed and not something we chose to take on. Just my opinion.

But I also know that people can be so "black and white" about diets they sabotage themselves by that, too.

How low fat are you supposed to go with Orlistat? I tried Alli once and I think it suggested you cap each meal's fat at 15g. It didn't seem that difficult. That's like the fat in three eggs. I could do low carb at that level, especially temporarily with diabetes looming.

LKArgh

kommodevaran wrote: »

aggelikik wrote: »

laropmet wrote: »

I totally agree with everything, everyone has said in this post. Even the ones that are saying she's not sticking to it. I don't believe she is sticking to it because she keeps telling me things like "I got shaky on the way home so had a coke to help", or "It got to dinner time and I had a whole packet of biscuits". The impression I'm getting is that she is so hungry that she grabs whatever is handy rather than cooking and part of me can't blame her for that because who among us can tolerate low fat and low carb at the same time. I don't know her ratio's. She's in her 50's, probably around 225lbs although she has never actually told me her weight. Definitely at risk and probably an ideal candidate for Orlistat. I just don't feel this is too healthy.

Sorry, but if this is what she is doing, this is suicide by eating and no dr can help her. Nothing is stopping her from grabbing an apple, or a yoghurt if she needs to eat something immediately. Usually a diabetic clinic will give an eating plan and this eating plan will be low-ish carb and also low-ish fat, until there is improvement. Which means mostly high protein at first, which also means lots of cooking options. Meat, fish, chicken, grilled, sauteed, in tomato based sauces, in lemon etc based sauces, lots of salads, a couple of fruit per day, yoghurt, low fat cheese, milk, nuts, legumes, eggs. Lots of things that are easy to prepare, and will not leave her starving.

But she didn't get an eating plan, and wasn't told to eat moderate fat, moderate carbs, plenty of protein, and get cooking - she has been told to, practically, "not eat". She's panicking.
I recognize this pattern of behavior from my own experience. I took the nutritional guidelines so seriously and literarily that I tried to avoid fat as much as possible, which of course wasn't possible, and instead of allowing more fat from real, nutritious food, I caved and bought lots of junk. Looking back, I understand that I was too scared by the health warnings, of cancer, heart failure and even diabetes, to think straight and investigate alternatives. I regard myself as both sensible and literate, and this makes me feel more sad and angry than stupid. I love to talk about myself, sorry, but I hope this is useful to understand this seemingly irrational behavior.

Nutritional guidelines for diabetes have some pretty standard parts, so I find it hard to believe she has even been to a diabetes clinic and was just told a generic "avoid carbs". And if she was panicking, she wouldn't be eating a package of biscuits or looking for a coke. It is pretty obvious these have sugar and I think it is also rather clear to most adults that sugar is not good for diabetics. I think OP is taking this more seriously than the patient.

kommodevaran

aggelikik wrote: »

kommodevaran wrote: »

aggelikik wrote: »

laropmet wrote: »

I totally agree with everything, everyone has said in this post. Even the ones that are saying she's not sticking to it. I don't believe she is sticking to it because she keeps telling me things like "I got shaky on the way home so had a coke to help", or "It got to dinner time and I had a whole packet of biscuits". The impression I'm getting is that she is so hungry that she grabs whatever is handy rather than cooking and part of me can't blame her for that because who among us can tolerate low fat and low carb at the same time. I don't know her ratio's. She's in her 50's, probably around 225lbs although she has never actually told me her weight. Definitely at risk and probably an ideal candidate for Orlistat. I just don't feel this is too healthy.

Sorry, but if this is what she is doing, this is suicide by eating and no dr can help her. Nothing is stopping her from grabbing an apple, or a yoghurt if she needs to eat something immediately. Usually a diabetic clinic will give an eating plan and this eating plan will be low-ish carb and also low-ish fat, until there is improvement. Which means mostly high protein at first, which also means lots of cooking options. Meat, fish, chicken, grilled, sauteed, in tomato based sauces, in lemon etc based sauces, lots of salads, a couple of fruit per day, yoghurt, low fat cheese, milk, nuts, legumes, eggs. Lots of things that are easy to prepare, and will not leave her starving.

But she didn't get an eating plan, and wasn't told to eat moderate fat, moderate carbs, plenty of protein, and get cooking - she has been told to, practically, "not eat". She's panicking.
I recognize this pattern of behavior from my own experience. I took the nutritional guidelines so seriously and literarily that I tried to avoid fat as much as possible, which of course wasn't possible, and instead of allowing more fat from real, nutritious food, I caved and bought lots of junk. Looking back, I understand that I was too scared by the health warnings, of cancer, heart failure and even diabetes, to think straight and investigate alternatives. I regard myself as both sensible and literate, and this makes me feel more sad and angry than stupid. I love to talk about myself, sorry, but I hope this is useful to understand this seemingly irrational behavior.

Nutritional guidelines for diabetes have some pretty standard parts, so I find it hard to believe she has even been to a diabetes clinic and was just told a generic "avoid carbs". And if she was panicking, she wouldn't be eating a package of biscuits or looking for a coke. It is pretty obvious these have sugar and I think it is also rather clear to most adults that sugar is not good for diabetics. I think OP is taking this more seriously than the patient.

I disagree - that's exactly what panic does to you. You can't make good decisions when frightened, shameful, hungry, deprived, stressed out AND misinformed, surrounded by every opportunity to make bad choices.

If that is the case at all. Good points about us not knowing the whole story.

laropmet

I'm pretty sure I don't even know her whole story. I just feel bad that she seems to be suffering to my eyes. The clinic that she went to sent her around the supermarket to look at nutritional information panels and find foods that had less than 5g of carbs per 100g. Although I'm not sure if that's what they are setting her target as. I'm not sure if she managed to find anything because that seems really low for a moderate carb diet. She has never mentioned protein to me so i'm not even sure if she has been told to increase her protein. I see her eating a lot of low fat yogurts and fruit at work, so she is trying at the start of the day. We mostly finish work at 2.30pm which is when i think most of her problems start. Probably because she has only eaten around 150 calories while doing a fairly active job. I walk around 5 miles in an 8 hour shift to give you an idea of calories burned. I'm really frustrated because i'm out of supportive advice to give her.

LKArgh

If your friend wants to do this seriously, there are several options:
- call her dr
- call the diabetes clinic to ask for a more specific plan
- check whatever reading material she was given (I find it hard to believe there were no instructions other than find food with less than 5% carbs)
- google it
- access diabetes.org, the American Diabetes Association website. They have plans, instructions and even recipes.

But, you need to understand that many times people choose convenience over health. And you cannot help someone who does not want help. Do not confuse feeling miserable with actually asking for help. There is the "I am miserable because I am ill and need to change things" and there is "I am so miserable, life is not worth living with all these restrictions, poor me will surely die".

kmbrooks15

I echo those suggesting a different doctor. Sounds like she needs to see a new doctor and request a FULL workup - blood tests, everything. If she's THAT hungry, they need to figure out what's going on with her so they can make sure she's on the right medication and eating plan. I have PCOS, so for more, low-carb, low-sugar is the way to go. But I didn't know that until my doctor got a correct diagnosis through blood tests.

Another possibility here is this: could the binging be psychological? I don't know her, so I can't say, but it's a side of the issue to consider.

HutchA12

laropmet wrote: »

I'm pretty sure I don't even know her whole story. I just feel bad that she seems to be suffering to my eyes. The clinic that she went to sent her around the supermarket to look at nutritional information panels and find foods that had less than 5g of carbs per 100g. Although I'm not sure if that's what they are setting her target as. I'm not sure if she managed to find anything because that seems really low for a moderate carb diet. She has never mentioned protein to me so i'm not even sure if she has been told to increase her protein. I see her eating a lot of low fat yogurts and fruit at work, so she is trying at the start of the day. We mostly finish work at 2.30pm which is when i think most of her problems start. Probably because she has only eaten around 150 calories while doing a fairly active job. I walk around 5 miles in an 8 hour shift to give you an idea of calories burned. I'm really frustrated because i'm out of supportive advice to give her.

Almost everything you have mentioned her eating is very high carb and she is eating fruit every morning... Have you talked to her about carbs or is she even really trying. Sounds like she mostly eats sugar. Also low fat yogurt and fruit ever morning can be low cal it can also be much higher than you think. Just a small yogurt and normal banana is over 150 calories.