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What is clean eating?
Replies
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First I'll point out that MFP did not, as you say, "disillusioned" you of the idea. The proper word to use in that sentence is "disabused". MFP disabused you of that idea. And I hope I have disabused you of using disillusioned in that context. Second, thank you for asking. I know I'm out with the in crowd, especially as pertains to matters of health and fitness. I didn't know how to frame the question.0
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JeromeBarry1 wrote: »First I'll point out that MFP did not, as you say, "disillusioned" you of the idea. The proper word to use in that sentence is "disabused". MFP disabused you of that idea. And I hope I have disabused you of using disillusioned in that context. Second, thank you for asking. I know I'm out with the in crowd, especially as pertains to matters of health and fitness. I didn't know how to frame the question.
As the OP is now 8 days past the point where I can make any edits, I suppose I'll have to let the word choice stand. I don't mind being corrected but I'm not a big fan of having it done publically when there's nothing I can do to change it.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »ElviraMarieCerri wrote: »Clean eating is a myth. Ask what is dirty eating. It's a stupid turn of phrase.
A myth? In what way?
About 70% Yeti, 30% El Chupacabra.
What do you mean? El Chupacabra is real! You don't want to be a goat living in Puerto Rico I assure you.0 -
diannethegeek wrote: »JeromeBarry1 wrote: »First I'll point out that MFP did not, as you say, "disillusioned" you of the idea. The proper word to use in that sentence is "disabused". MFP disabused you of that idea. And I hope I have disabused you of using disillusioned in that context. Second, thank you for asking. I know I'm out with the in crowd, especially as pertains to matters of health and fitness. I didn't know how to frame the question.
As the OP is now 8 days past the point where I can make any edits, I suppose I'll have to let the word choice stand. I don't mind being corrected but I'm not a big fan of having it done publically when there's nothing I can do to change it.
I'm just glad you cleared it up. Without a quote or some context, I had no idea who he was talking to or what he was talking about.0 -
diannethegeek wrote: »JeromeBarry1 wrote: »First I'll point out that MFP did not, as you say, "disillusioned" you of the idea. The proper word to use in that sentence is "disabused". MFP disabused you of that idea. And I hope I have disabused you of using disillusioned in that context. Second, thank you for asking. I know I'm out with the in crowd, especially as pertains to matters of health and fitness. I didn't know how to frame the question.
As the OP is now 8 days past the point where I can make any edits, I suppose I'll have to let the word choice stand. I don't mind being corrected but I'm not a big fan of having it done publically when there's nothing I can do to change it.
I'm just glad you cleared it up. Without a quote or some context, I had no idea who he was talking to or what he was talking about.
27 pages in everything gets a little fuzzy.0 -
After reading all these, I'll use this as a handy definition of "clean".
Purchase greens and veg. Take them home. Wash the poop and pesticide off. Eat.0 -
JeromeBarry1 wrote: »First I'll point out that MFP did not, as you say, "disillusioned" you of the idea. The proper word to use in that sentence is "disabused". MFP disabused you of that idea. And I hope I have disabused you of using disillusioned in that context. Second, thank you for asking. I know I'm out with the in crowd, especially as pertains to matters of health and fitness. I didn't know how to frame the question.
Well if that's the case, someone needs to report dis abuse to a mod.0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »DancingDarl wrote: »Honestly Clean eating is getting so convoluted why can't people stop breaking into the hype of all these dad diets
Dad diets are so lame. Tell silly jokes and jog to Wilco.
Hey, I jog to Wilco all the time!
Me too, actually, but I'm not a dad, so it's not dad rock when I do it!
;-)0 -
Well there is this guy who thinks vegetables are unnecessary and not necessarily healthy:
http://www.rogermwilcox.com/vegetable/
I do see some of the deeper ketoers claim they have rather strict limits on how many vegetables they can have because of the carbohydrate content.0 -
Lettuce. It's all that's left.0 -
DancingDarl wrote: »Well there is this guy who thinks vegetables are unnecessary and not necessarily healthy:
http://www.rogermwilcox.com/vegetable/
I do see some of the deeper ketoers claim they have rather strict limits on how many vegetables they can have because of the carbohydrate content.
He starts off by stating he is vegephobic.
He is already off to a bad start with me. I just think if he doesn't want to eat vegetables that is fine. But they are good for you, we teach our children the importance of them.
Nigella certainly eats them. So what gives.
If that is directed at me, I think you assume my link to the vegephobe's article or the picture of Nigella is an endorsement more than a comedic interlude.
If I was endorsing Nigella, it would be more her fruits rather than vegetables I endorse.0 -
DancingDarl wrote: »http://www.hellomagazine.com/cuisine/2015100627563/nigella-lawson-clean-eating-diet-yoga/
I cannot agree more with her
"Life is about balance, not about being smug"
Overall I think she makes it quite clear how much she enjoys yoga.
I have the same stance on dieting and these ridiculous ideas of clean eating. We all need to just go back to the basics of eating healthy foods in a balanced way and the other not so healthy in a moderated way.
Nigella is the perfect spokeswoman.
<sigh> You're missing the point. People who follow a paleo lifestyle have a different definition of "healthy food" than someone doing keto. Likewise, there is a big difference between what a vegan considers healthy as compared to someone who eats meat. Healthy can also be subjective, and requires context.0 -
Bemused at how the term 'clean eating' could cause such a long debate.0
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I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .0
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Agree with this^^^. It is a figure of speech someone uses when they decide to eat healthier. "I need to clean up my diet." That is all it is...sunnybeaches105 wrote: »I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .0 -
sunnybeaches105 wrote: »I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .
Like I said upthread, I don't really like or use it in that sense either, but I understand what someone means when they say it -- I am trying to eat healthier than my prior diet, according to my own understanding of healthy -- and don't object to it at all or ever claim that usage is unclear.
I see that as different from saying smugly "I'm a clean eater!" and then when asked what that means getting mad and saying "you know!" or "NO processed food EVER" when the person eats as much processed food as I do. (And my main objection here is to the ignorant idea that process=not nutritious or bad for us, as I think much of the processed stuff I eat, like plain greek yogurt and smoked salmon, is plenty nutritious and would be dumb to cut out, others (like dried pasta) form the backbone for really nutritious meals or can be important time-saving staples (canned tomatoes and beans), and still others are just tasty and I see no reason it would be healthier to give them up entirely vs. eating them in moderation (ice cream).) None of that means I don't care about nutrition or my overall diet or health, which is what the next assertion about non clean eaters usually is.
I don't really eat stuff like fast food or convenience foods (frozen meals) or lots of packaged sweets, so I don't consider cutting these things out as a special diet, and I think people who enjoy them or benefit from them can include them in an overall healthy diet.
I also think whether a diet is healthy depends more on (1) appropriate calories/amounts; and (2) what IS in the diet (adequate protein and fiber and healthy fats, lots of vegetables), so approaching health or nutrition as about what one does not eat rather than about including the foods we need (ideally prepared so that they are super tasty) seems to me quite misguided. That doesn't mean I don't occasionally realize I'm overdoing some less nutritious food and having trouble meeting my overall goals as a result -- sure I do. IMO, that's about balance.
I also don't really like the underlying idea that foods being too enjoyable is bad (the processed foods have been made extra hard to resist thing). I don't believe at all that highly processed foods are tastier than homemade and I've always found that focusing on really tasty foods makes dieting easier. This is why I eat a roasted breast of chicken with skin and bones-in more often than I do boneless, skinless chicken breast, and why if I made the latter it will generally be part of some preparation (and I'm often going to prefer thighs for the preparation).0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »sunnybeaches105 wrote: »I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .
Like I said upthread, I don't really like or use it in that sense either, but I understand what someone means when they say it -- I am trying to eat healthier than my prior diet, according to my own understanding of healthy -- and don't object to it at all or ever claim that usage is unclear.
I see that as different from saying smugly "I'm a clean eater!" and then when asked what that means getting mad and saying "you know!" or "NO processed food EVER" when the person eats as much processed food as I do. (And my main objection here is to the ignorant idea that process=not nutritious or bad for us, as I think much of the processed stuff I eat, like plain greek yogurt and smoked salmon, is plenty nutritious and would be dumb to cut out, others (like dried pasta) form the backbone for really nutritious meals or can be important time-saving staples (canned tomatoes and beans), and still others are just tasty and I see no reason it would be healthier to give them up entirely vs. eating them in moderation (ice cream).) None of that means I don't care about nutrition or my overall diet or health, which is what the next assertion about non clean eaters usually is.
I don't really eat stuff like fast food or convenience foods (frozen meals) or lots of packaged sweets, so I don't consider cutting these things out as a special diet, and I think people who enjoy them or benefit from them can include them in an overall healthy diet.
I also think whether a diet is healthy depends more on (1) appropriate calories/amounts; and (2) what IS in the diet (adequate protein and fiber and healthy fats, lots of vegetables), so approaching health or nutrition as about what one does not eat rather than about including the foods we need (ideally prepared so that they are super tasty) seems to me quite misguided. That doesn't mean I don't occasionally realize I'm overdoing some less nutritious food and having trouble meeting my overall goals as a result -- sure I do. IMO, that's about balance.
I also don't really like the underlying idea that foods being too enjoyable is bad (the processed foods have been made extra hard to resist thing). I don't believe at all that highly processed foods are tastier than homemade and I've always found that focusing on really tasty foods makes dieting easier. This is why I eat a roasted breast of chicken with skin and bones-in more often than I do boneless, skinless chicken breast, and why if I made the latter it will generally be part of some preparation (and I'm often going to prefer thighs for the preparation).
Yep. Big difference between, "I need to clean up my diet" and "I am a clean eater" or "I eat clean".
One is a figure of speech, the other is a proclamation of superiority, IMO...0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »sunnybeaches105 wrote: »I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .
Like I said upthread, I don't really like or use it in that sense either, but I understand what someone means when they say it -- I am trying to eat healthier than my prior diet, according to my own understanding of healthy -- and don't object to it at all or ever claim that usage is unclear.
I see that as different from saying smugly "I'm a clean eater!" and then when asked what that means getting mad and saying "you know!" or "NO processed food EVER" when the person eats as much processed food as I do. (And my main objection here is to the ignorant idea that process=not nutritious or bad for us, as I think much of the processed stuff I eat, like plain greek yogurt and smoked salmon, is plenty nutritious and would be dumb to cut out, others (like dried pasta) form the backbone for really nutritious meals or can be important time-saving staples (canned tomatoes and beans), and still others are just tasty and I see no reason it would be healthier to give them up entirely vs. eating them in moderation (ice cream).) None of that means I don't care about nutrition or my overall diet or health, which is what the next assertion about non clean eaters usually is.
I don't really eat stuff like fast food or convenience foods (frozen meals) or lots of packaged sweets, so I don't consider cutting these things out as a special diet, and I think people who enjoy them or benefit from them can include them in an overall healthy diet.
I also think whether a diet is healthy depends more on (1) appropriate calories/amounts; and (2) what IS in the diet (adequate protein and fiber and healthy fats, lots of vegetables), so approaching health or nutrition as about what one does not eat rather than about including the foods we need (ideally prepared so that they are super tasty) seems to me quite misguided. That doesn't mean I don't occasionally realize I'm overdoing some less nutritious food and having trouble meeting my overall goals as a result -- sure I do. IMO, that's about balance.
I also don't really like the underlying idea that foods being too enjoyable is bad (the processed foods have been made extra hard to resist thing). I don't believe at all that highly processed foods are tastier than homemade and I've always found that focusing on really tasty foods makes dieting easier. This is why I eat a roasted breast of chicken with skin and bones-in more often than I do boneless, skinless chicken breast, and why if I made the latter it will generally be part of some preparation (and I'm often going to prefer thighs for the preparation).
Yep. Big difference between, "I need to clean up my diet" and "I am a clean eater" or "I eat clean".
One is a figure of speech, the other is a proclamation of superiority, IMO...
I don't see why "I eat clean" would automatically be seen as a proclamation of superiority any more than "I eat a flexible diet" or "I eat vegetarian" or "I follow IF' would be. In all of these cases we are being informed how the user eats and it's logical to assume they think it's the best way to eat."0 -
That's why it's an opinion. Just the way I interpret it from my past experiences.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »sunnybeaches105 wrote: »I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .
Like I said upthread, I don't really like or use it in that sense either, but I understand what someone means when they say it -- I am trying to eat healthier than my prior diet, according to my own understanding of healthy -- and don't object to it at all or ever claim that usage is unclear.
I see that as different from saying smugly "I'm a clean eater!" and then when asked what that means getting mad and saying "you know!" or "NO processed food EVER" when the person eats as much processed food as I do. (And my main objection here is to the ignorant idea that process=not nutritious or bad for us, as I think much of the processed stuff I eat, like plain greek yogurt and smoked salmon, is plenty nutritious and would be dumb to cut out, others (like dried pasta) form the backbone for really nutritious meals or can be important time-saving staples (canned tomatoes and beans), and still others are just tasty and I see no reason it would be healthier to give them up entirely vs. eating them in moderation (ice cream).) None of that means I don't care about nutrition or my overall diet or health, which is what the next assertion about non clean eaters usually is.
I don't really eat stuff like fast food or convenience foods (frozen meals) or lots of packaged sweets, so I don't consider cutting these things out as a special diet, and I think people who enjoy them or benefit from them can include them in an overall healthy diet.
I also think whether a diet is healthy depends more on (1) appropriate calories/amounts; and (2) what IS in the diet (adequate protein and fiber and healthy fats, lots of vegetables), so approaching health or nutrition as about what one does not eat rather than about including the foods we need (ideally prepared so that they are super tasty) seems to me quite misguided. That doesn't mean I don't occasionally realize I'm overdoing some less nutritious food and having trouble meeting my overall goals as a result -- sure I do. IMO, that's about balance.
I also don't really like the underlying idea that foods being too enjoyable is bad (the processed foods have been made extra hard to resist thing). I don't believe at all that highly processed foods are tastier than homemade and I've always found that focusing on really tasty foods makes dieting easier. This is why I eat a roasted breast of chicken with skin and bones-in more often than I do boneless, skinless chicken breast, and why if I made the latter it will generally be part of some preparation (and I'm often going to prefer thighs for the preparation).
Yep. Big difference between, "I need to clean up my diet" and "I am a clean eater" or "I eat clean".
One is a figure of speech, the other is a proclamation of superiority, IMO...
I don't see why "I eat clean" would automatically be seen as a proclamation of superiority any more than "I eat a flexible diet" or "I eat vegetarian" or "I follow IF' would be. In all of these cases we are being informed how the user eats and it's logical to assume they think it's the best way to eat."0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »sunnybeaches105 wrote: »I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .
Like I said upthread, I don't really like or use it in that sense either, but I understand what someone means when they say it -- I am trying to eat healthier than my prior diet, according to my own understanding of healthy -- and don't object to it at all or ever claim that usage is unclear.
I see that as different from saying smugly "I'm a clean eater!" and then when asked what that means getting mad and saying "you know!" or "NO processed food EVER" when the person eats as much processed food as I do. (And my main objection here is to the ignorant idea that process=not nutritious or bad for us, as I think much of the processed stuff I eat, like plain greek yogurt and smoked salmon, is plenty nutritious and would be dumb to cut out, others (like dried pasta) form the backbone for really nutritious meals or can be important time-saving staples (canned tomatoes and beans), and still others are just tasty and I see no reason it would be healthier to give them up entirely vs. eating them in moderation (ice cream).) None of that means I don't care about nutrition or my overall diet or health, which is what the next assertion about non clean eaters usually is.
I don't really eat stuff like fast food or convenience foods (frozen meals) or lots of packaged sweets, so I don't consider cutting these things out as a special diet, and I think people who enjoy them or benefit from them can include them in an overall healthy diet.
I also think whether a diet is healthy depends more on (1) appropriate calories/amounts; and (2) what IS in the diet (adequate protein and fiber and healthy fats, lots of vegetables), so approaching health or nutrition as about what one does not eat rather than about including the foods we need (ideally prepared so that they are super tasty) seems to me quite misguided. That doesn't mean I don't occasionally realize I'm overdoing some less nutritious food and having trouble meeting my overall goals as a result -- sure I do. IMO, that's about balance.
I also don't really like the underlying idea that foods being too enjoyable is bad (the processed foods have been made extra hard to resist thing). I don't believe at all that highly processed foods are tastier than homemade and I've always found that focusing on really tasty foods makes dieting easier. This is why I eat a roasted breast of chicken with skin and bones-in more often than I do boneless, skinless chicken breast, and why if I made the latter it will generally be part of some preparation (and I'm often going to prefer thighs for the preparation).
Yep. Big difference between, "I need to clean up my diet" and "I am a clean eater" or "I eat clean".
One is a figure of speech, the other is a proclamation of superiority, IMO...
I don't see why "I eat clean" would automatically be seen as a proclamation of superiority any more than "I eat a flexible diet" or "I eat vegetarian" or "I follow IF' would be. In all of these cases we are being informed how the user eats and it's logical to assume they think it's the best way to eat."
Cause emptiness is loneliness
and loneliness is cleanliness /
And cleanliness is godliness /
And god is empty, just like [junk food calories] /0 -
let me guess 27 pages in and we still don't have a definition ....0
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Need2Exerc1se wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »sunnybeaches105 wrote: »I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .
Like I said upthread, I don't really like or use it in that sense either, but I understand what someone means when they say it -- I am trying to eat healthier than my prior diet, according to my own understanding of healthy -- and don't object to it at all or ever claim that usage is unclear.
I see that as different from saying smugly "I'm a clean eater!" and then when asked what that means getting mad and saying "you know!" or "NO processed food EVER" when the person eats as much processed food as I do. (And my main objection here is to the ignorant idea that process=not nutritious or bad for us, as I think much of the processed stuff I eat, like plain greek yogurt and smoked salmon, is plenty nutritious and would be dumb to cut out, others (like dried pasta) form the backbone for really nutritious meals or can be important time-saving staples (canned tomatoes and beans), and still others are just tasty and I see no reason it would be healthier to give them up entirely vs. eating them in moderation (ice cream).) None of that means I don't care about nutrition or my overall diet or health, which is what the next assertion about non clean eaters usually is.
I don't really eat stuff like fast food or convenience foods (frozen meals) or lots of packaged sweets, so I don't consider cutting these things out as a special diet, and I think people who enjoy them or benefit from them can include them in an overall healthy diet.
I also think whether a diet is healthy depends more on (1) appropriate calories/amounts; and (2) what IS in the diet (adequate protein and fiber and healthy fats, lots of vegetables), so approaching health or nutrition as about what one does not eat rather than about including the foods we need (ideally prepared so that they are super tasty) seems to me quite misguided. That doesn't mean I don't occasionally realize I'm overdoing some less nutritious food and having trouble meeting my overall goals as a result -- sure I do. IMO, that's about balance.
I also don't really like the underlying idea that foods being too enjoyable is bad (the processed foods have been made extra hard to resist thing). I don't believe at all that highly processed foods are tastier than homemade and I've always found that focusing on really tasty foods makes dieting easier. This is why I eat a roasted breast of chicken with skin and bones-in more often than I do boneless, skinless chicken breast, and why if I made the latter it will generally be part of some preparation (and I'm often going to prefer thighs for the preparation).
Yep. Big difference between, "I need to clean up my diet" and "I am a clean eater" or "I eat clean".
One is a figure of speech, the other is a proclamation of superiority, IMO...
I don't see why "I eat clean" would automatically be seen as a proclamation of superiority any more than "I eat a flexible diet" or "I eat vegetarian" or "I follow IF' would be. In all of these cases we are being informed how the user eats and it's logical to assume they think it's the best way to eat."
Cause emptiness is loneliness
and loneliness is cleanliness /
And cleanliness is godliness /
And god is empty, just like [junk food calories] /
Loneliness is cleanliness??0 -
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A definition of one is a language with one speaker.1
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Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »sunnybeaches105 wrote: »I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .
Like I said upthread, I don't really like or use it in that sense either, but I understand what someone means when they say it -- I am trying to eat healthier than my prior diet, according to my own understanding of healthy -- and don't object to it at all or ever claim that usage is unclear.
I see that as different from saying smugly "I'm a clean eater!" and then when asked what that means getting mad and saying "you know!" or "NO processed food EVER" when the person eats as much processed food as I do. (And my main objection here is to the ignorant idea that process=not nutritious or bad for us, as I think much of the processed stuff I eat, like plain greek yogurt and smoked salmon, is plenty nutritious and would be dumb to cut out, others (like dried pasta) form the backbone for really nutritious meals or can be important time-saving staples (canned tomatoes and beans), and still others are just tasty and I see no reason it would be healthier to give them up entirely vs. eating them in moderation (ice cream).) None of that means I don't care about nutrition or my overall diet or health, which is what the next assertion about non clean eaters usually is.
I don't really eat stuff like fast food or convenience foods (frozen meals) or lots of packaged sweets, so I don't consider cutting these things out as a special diet, and I think people who enjoy them or benefit from them can include them in an overall healthy diet.
I also think whether a diet is healthy depends more on (1) appropriate calories/amounts; and (2) what IS in the diet (adequate protein and fiber and healthy fats, lots of vegetables), so approaching health or nutrition as about what one does not eat rather than about including the foods we need (ideally prepared so that they are super tasty) seems to me quite misguided. That doesn't mean I don't occasionally realize I'm overdoing some less nutritious food and having trouble meeting my overall goals as a result -- sure I do. IMO, that's about balance.
I also don't really like the underlying idea that foods being too enjoyable is bad (the processed foods have been made extra hard to resist thing). I don't believe at all that highly processed foods are tastier than homemade and I've always found that focusing on really tasty foods makes dieting easier. This is why I eat a roasted breast of chicken with skin and bones-in more often than I do boneless, skinless chicken breast, and why if I made the latter it will generally be part of some preparation (and I'm often going to prefer thighs for the preparation).
Yep. Big difference between, "I need to clean up my diet" and "I am a clean eater" or "I eat clean".
One is a figure of speech, the other is a proclamation of superiority, IMO...
I don't see why "I eat clean" would automatically be seen as a proclamation of superiority any more than "I eat a flexible diet" or "I eat vegetarian" or "I follow IF' would be. In all of these cases we are being informed how the user eats and it's logical to assume they think it's the best way to eat."
Cause emptiness is loneliness
and loneliness is cleanliness /
And cleanliness is godliness /
And god is empty, just like [junk food calories] /
Loneliness is cleanliness??
It is. It helps if you smash pumpkins to deal with the rat in a cage anger the loneliness causes.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »sunnybeaches105 wrote: »I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .
Like I said upthread, I don't really like or use it in that sense either, but I understand what someone means when they say it -- I am trying to eat healthier than my prior diet, according to my own understanding of healthy -- and don't object to it at all or ever claim that usage is unclear.
I see that as different from saying smugly "I'm a clean eater!" and then when asked what that means getting mad and saying "you know!" or "NO processed food EVER" when the person eats as much processed food as I do. (And my main objection here is to the ignorant idea that process=not nutritious or bad for us, as I think much of the processed stuff I eat, like plain greek yogurt and smoked salmon, is plenty nutritious and would be dumb to cut out, others (like dried pasta) form the backbone for really nutritious meals or can be important time-saving staples (canned tomatoes and beans), and still others are just tasty and I see no reason it would be healthier to give them up entirely vs. eating them in moderation (ice cream).) None of that means I don't care about nutrition or my overall diet or health, which is what the next assertion about non clean eaters usually is.
I don't really eat stuff like fast food or convenience foods (frozen meals) or lots of packaged sweets, so I don't consider cutting these things out as a special diet, and I think people who enjoy them or benefit from them can include them in an overall healthy diet.
I also think whether a diet is healthy depends more on (1) appropriate calories/amounts; and (2) what IS in the diet (adequate protein and fiber and healthy fats, lots of vegetables), so approaching health or nutrition as about what one does not eat rather than about including the foods we need (ideally prepared so that they are super tasty) seems to me quite misguided. That doesn't mean I don't occasionally realize I'm overdoing some less nutritious food and having trouble meeting my overall goals as a result -- sure I do. IMO, that's about balance.
I also don't really like the underlying idea that foods being too enjoyable is bad (the processed foods have been made extra hard to resist thing). I don't believe at all that highly processed foods are tastier than homemade and I've always found that focusing on really tasty foods makes dieting easier. This is why I eat a roasted breast of chicken with skin and bones-in more often than I do boneless, skinless chicken breast, and why if I made the latter it will generally be part of some preparation (and I'm often going to prefer thighs for the preparation).
Yep. Big difference between, "I need to clean up my diet" and "I am a clean eater" or "I eat clean".
One is a figure of speech, the other is a proclamation of superiority, IMO...
I don't see why "I eat clean" would automatically be seen as a proclamation of superiority any more than "I eat a flexible diet" or "I eat vegetarian" or "I follow IF' would be. In all of these cases we are being informed how the user eats and it's logical to assume they think it's the best way to eat."
Cause emptiness is loneliness
and loneliness is cleanliness /
And cleanliness is godliness /
And god is empty, just like [junk food calories] /
Loneliness is cleanliness??
It is. It helps if you smash pumpkins to deal with the rat in a cage anger the loneliness causes.
Will that make me less godly?
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Lent. Acquiring saintliness by depriving oneself of a pleasure. We have our hermits (loneliness), we have the monastic silence of several faiths (Tibetan, Buddhist, Catholic), sexual abstinence (Brahmacharya), and fasting. Read up on the origins of Kellogg's Corn Flakes some time, or Graham flour. Exciting foods were thought to excite the common man to unhealthy passions, which could lead to insanity.0
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Lent. Acquiring saintliness by depriving oneself of a pleasure. We have our hermits (loneliness), we have the monastic silence of several faiths (Tibetan, Buddhist, Catholic), sexual abstinence (Brahmacharya), and fasting. Read up on the origins of Kellogg's Corn Flakes some time, or Graham flour. Exciting foods were thought to excite the common man to unhealthy passions, which could lead to insanity.
I always interpreted the song's lyrics as being about the sexual abstinence kind of loneliness being cleanliness.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »sunnybeaches105 wrote: »I still use the term when I diet, as in "I need to clean up my diet again." It's not the end-all be-all approach and there are way too many interpretations of it from people who use it as a way of showing their own self-righteousness, but salads, veggies and lean meats certainly make up the vast majority of my diet. The debates over what is and what isn't clean seem pretty silly, but I'm enjoying this thread . . .
Like I said upthread, I don't really like or use it in that sense either, but I understand what someone means when they say it -- I am trying to eat healthier than my prior diet, according to my own understanding of healthy -- and don't object to it at all or ever claim that usage is unclear.
I see that as different from saying smugly "I'm a clean eater!" and then when asked what that means getting mad and saying "you know!" or "NO processed food EVER" when the person eats as much processed food as I do. (And my main objection here is to the ignorant idea that process=not nutritious or bad for us, as I think much of the processed stuff I eat, like plain greek yogurt and smoked salmon, is plenty nutritious and would be dumb to cut out, others (like dried pasta) form the backbone for really nutritious meals or can be important time-saving staples (canned tomatoes and beans), and still others are just tasty and I see no reason it would be healthier to give them up entirely vs. eating them in moderation (ice cream).) None of that means I don't care about nutrition or my overall diet or health, which is what the next assertion about non clean eaters usually is.
I don't really eat stuff like fast food or convenience foods (frozen meals) or lots of packaged sweets, so I don't consider cutting these things out as a special diet, and I think people who enjoy them or benefit from them can include them in an overall healthy diet.
I also think whether a diet is healthy depends more on (1) appropriate calories/amounts; and (2) what IS in the diet (adequate protein and fiber and healthy fats, lots of vegetables), so approaching health or nutrition as about what one does not eat rather than about including the foods we need (ideally prepared so that they are super tasty) seems to me quite misguided. That doesn't mean I don't occasionally realize I'm overdoing some less nutritious food and having trouble meeting my overall goals as a result -- sure I do. IMO, that's about balance.
I also don't really like the underlying idea that foods being too enjoyable is bad (the processed foods have been made extra hard to resist thing). I don't believe at all that highly processed foods are tastier than homemade and I've always found that focusing on really tasty foods makes dieting easier. This is why I eat a roasted breast of chicken with skin and bones-in more often than I do boneless, skinless chicken breast, and why if I made the latter it will generally be part of some preparation (and I'm often going to prefer thighs for the preparation).
Yep. Big difference between, "I need to clean up my diet" and "I am a clean eater" or "I eat clean".
One is a figure of speech, the other is a proclamation of superiority, IMO...
I don't see why "I eat clean" would automatically be seen as a proclamation of superiority any more than "I eat a flexible diet" or "I eat vegetarian" or "I follow IF' would be. In all of these cases we are being informed how the user eats and it's logical to assume they think it's the best way to eat."
I think that even beyond the actual usage of the words and definitions, this is one of the problems with the terms people use in communication, and for whatever reason some of these words and terms seem to be almost like triggers here on MFP.
It's not the words or phrases themselves, it's the attachments people making as it being good, bad, judgmental, imposing, etc, etc. And it seems that often those attachments have to do with people using them as some sort of magic fix that one diet to superior to another. Which somewhat boggles me, as I see the vast majority of eating choices as personal preference, and accept that what works best for me might not be what works best for you. Since I don't cling to my way being the only way, it doesn't offend me that others eat differently, or use terms like clean eating.
And I wonder if @diannethegeek is even trying to update her list of possible definitions for the terms. I hope not, she might end up needing a new keyboard in short time.
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