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Getting rid of stubborn fat

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2

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  • stevencloser
    stevencloser Posts: 8,911 Member
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    arditarose wrote: »
    I have listened to Lyle talk about this, and though I have read RFL I haven't read his Stubborn Fat book. When I first heard him talking about it I thought "You gotta be kidding me man..", especially after reading over and over that you can't spot reduce. I don't know. I wish I could understand the studies better. I just don't have a scientific mind. If anyone reads the studies above and want to provide cliffs because you're bored....

    I'm not an expert either but here's the short. Your cells have hormone receptors in them. Different cells have different sorts of receptors and in different amounts in different areas. The alpha adrenergic receptors talked about are more prominent in the stubborn areas and have, among others, the effect that when activated they stop fat cells from giving up their contents for lipolysis. Thus, the idea, that if you stop them from activating, fat should come off more evenly distributed along your body.
  • arditarose
    arditarose Posts: 15,575 Member
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    stevencloser wrote: »
    arditarose wrote: »
    I have listened to Lyle talk about this, and though I have read RFL I haven't read his Stubborn Fat book. When I first heard him talking about it I thought "You gotta be kidding me man..", especially after reading over and over that you can't spot reduce. I don't know. I wish I could understand the studies better. I just don't have a scientific mind. If anyone reads the studies above and want to provide cliffs because you're bored....

    I'm not an expert either but here's the short. Your cells have hormone receptors in them. Different cells have different sorts of receptors and in different amounts in different areas. The alpha adrenergic receptors talked about are more prominent in the stubborn areas and have, among others, the effect that when activated they stop fat cells from giving up their contents for lipolysis. Thus, the idea, that if you stop them from activating, fat should come off more evenly distributed along your body.

    Okay...these cells where the stubborn fat is stop/halt lipolysis from other fat cells when they are activated.....How are they "activated" though?
  • stevencloser
    stevencloser Posts: 8,911 Member
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    They're activated when certain hormones "hit" them. For these alpha receptors that's adrenaline and noradrenaline as well as some medicines for lowering blood pressure according to wikipedia.
  • arditarose
    arditarose Posts: 15,575 Member
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    stevencloser wrote: »
    They're activated when certain hormones "hit" them. For these alpha receptors that's adrenaline and noradrenaline as well as some medicines for lowering blood pressure according to wikipedia.

    So women having the common stubborn fat in thighs and hips could possibly be caused by hormones "hitting" the fat cells there, thus activating them and causing fat to not drop off evenly over the body?
  • 100df
    100df Posts: 668 Member
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    I am interested in how these fat cells are activated. It is annoying losing fat in my face while my hips stay the same.
  • stevencloser
    stevencloser Posts: 8,911 Member
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    I think it's just because of the distribution of those receptors. I.e. women have more of them on their thighs etc. while men have more on their belly. There's also more in subcutaneous fat than in visceral.
    I guess this distribution has come to be because of evolution, having your emergency fat in those regions being protective for men and attractive in women?

    Also the beta receptors (which aid lipolysis) also get activated from adrenaline so it's basically a fight between which gets more activated if you end up losing fat from those particular fat cells.

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2362.1987.tb02395.x/abstract

    This link lists it.
  • arditarose
    arditarose Posts: 15,575 Member
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    stevencloser wrote: »
    I think it's just because of the distribution of those receptors. I.e. women have more of them on their thighs etc. while men have more on their belly. There's also more in subcutaneous fat than in visceral.
    I guess this distribution has come to be because of evolution, having your emergency fat in those regions being protective for men and attractive in women?

    Also the beta receptors (which aid lipolysis) also get activated from adrenaline so it's basically a fight between which gets more activated if you end up losing fat from those particular fat cells.

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2362.1987.tb02395.x/abstract

    This link lists it.

    Thank you
  • senecarr
    senecarr Posts: 5,377 Member
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    stevencloser wrote: »
    I think it's just because of the distribution of those receptors. I.e. women have more of them on their thighs etc. while men have more on their belly. There's also more in subcutaneous fat than in visceral.
    I guess this distribution has come to be because of evolution, having your emergency fat in those regions being protective for men and attractive in women?

    Also the beta receptors (which aid lipolysis) also get activated from adrenaline so it's basically a fight between which gets more activated if you end up losing fat from those particular fat cells.

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2362.1987.tb02395.x/abstract

    This link lists it.

    Protective in women - carrying a child to term is risky business without modern medicine. Men theoretically as a store for endurance during cursorial hunting but I have doubts - hunting was maybe more gender egalitarian than we back project from modern beliefs.
  • lithezebra
    lithezebra Posts: 3,670 Member
    edited April 2016
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    I eat a LCHF diet, and I'm not a big fan of bacon and eggs. Sigh. Cheese is my weakness.

    I'm taking notes. I would like to keep some overall body fat and keep it off my waist.
  • ErikTee
    ErikTee Posts: 11 Member
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    [/quote]

    I'm unsure how eating most people's maintenance calories in a single meal is going to help someone get rid of any fat, stubborn or not.[/quote]

    I never told anyone to eat that amount of calories. The point is to hit your calorie count using a low carb high fat diet instead of your normal macro which is most likely 50% carbs minimum. This was just something I thought was worthy of a mention in a thread talking about losing stubborn fat.

  • _PatientZer0_
    _PatientZer0_ Posts: 1 Member
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    Erik Tee is right, I've gone ketogenic for the past 6.5 weeks and only lost weight in my stubborn spots. I've mainly been losing fat in my love handles, while sparing lean muscle mass. The science behind this is right. I'm sticking to it, the results are proof enough for me.
  • snowflake954
    snowflake954 Posts: 8,400 Member
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    The recent thread "Lyle McDonald nails it" about female body fat was a real eye opener for me. Alot of good information.
  • ErikTee
    ErikTee Posts: 11 Member
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    Lost another half inch. Measured around the naval. Started at 38, now down to 37". 6'1 185#'s
  • bioklutz
    bioklutz Posts: 1,365 Member
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    snowflake954 wrote: »
    The recent thread "Lyle McDonald nails it" about female body fat was a real eye opener for me. Alot of good information.

    Do you have a link for the article?
  • DrifterBear
    DrifterBear Posts: 265 Member
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    I feel like some of this is just due to perception. I've seen my stomach go down, but am 'seeing' the loss more in my face and chest. Is it proven that certain areas reduce at different rates in different people? It would be interesting to measure the amount of fat in areas of someone's body. And track not just the total % loss, but the % loss in those areas. If people actually lost belly fat last (or some other place), their whole body would be looking like ideal weight, but they'd have this obese belly. I feel like there are differences between where fat is stored between men and women, and in general person to person, and it takes more time to feel like the larger fat stores are 'gone.' I'd suspect loss is fairly even across the body and proportional to the starting point. It would be natural to focus on the 'problem areas' and feel like they're not getting better.
  • arditarose
    arditarose Posts: 15,575 Member
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    bioklutz wrote: »
    snowflake954 wrote: »
    The recent thread "Lyle McDonald nails it" about female body fat was a real eye opener for me. Alot of good information.

    Do you have a link for the article?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6846ZTBu08k
  • bioklutz
    bioklutz Posts: 1,365 Member
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    ndj1979 wrote: »
    tagging to follow ....

    My own observation is that as one gets lower and lower body fat your body's natural "defense mechanism" kicks in and says "we are getting low on body fat here, and we need to preserve it for emergency times" couple that with slowed metabolism plus lower calorie deficits to get to a lower body fat and you can see where the problem comes in....I can get to about 12% body fat, but anything lower than that I have an issue with ...

    arditarose wrote: »
    bioklutz wrote: »
    snowflake954 wrote: »
    The recent thread "Lyle McDonald nails it" about female body fat was a real eye opener for me. Alot of good information.

    Do you have a link for the article?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6846ZTBu08k

    @ndj1979 I have always suspected that something like this happens. I finally had time to listen to the interview with Lyle and one of the things he talks about your body fighting back. You might find it interesting - despite it being more about women. Thanks for the link @arditarose!
  • pfreeme
    pfreeme Posts: 42 Member
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    stevencloser wrote: »
    ErikTee wrote: »
    #lchf

    Low Carb High Fat

    I have always struggled with my belly and handles as my hardest fat to get rid of. A good diet would always leave me feeling like I was making progress but he tape measure would always tell me otherwise. I figured out my issue was carbs. Instead of just going crazy and giving them up altogether, I started lchf. In 20 days I've lost 5 pounds. Not great weight loss by any stretch but I see the definition in my shoulders and I can see my abs starting to show more and more. I measured my waist at 38" at the start and 2 weeks later is was 37.5".

    My diet consists of salted almonds, lots of eggs, cottage cheese, bacon, butter, 70-80% fat chopped meat, braised beef, pot roast, chicken, protein powder, natural peanut butter, milk, fish, yogurt and all sorts of cream sauces on top. I do still eat carbs in the form of vegetables.

    It is helping me and I really feel I am leaning out.

    It's a highly debated lifestyle of eating but it is incredibly easy. Who doesn't enjoy slamming down a pound of bacon and 6 eggs fried in butter?

    Btw, I had my blood work done and honest to God my cholesterol came down. Good Cholesterol is UP.

    The thought is that you prevent your body from burning glucose for energy and having it burn fat instead. Many marathon runners are starting to give up carb loading for big runs because they crash and burn. Check out the article on it in runners world and good luck to each of you.

    http://www.runnersworld.com/diet/can-eating-more-fat-make-you-a-better-runner?cid=soc_runnersworld_TWITTER_Runner’s World__Nutrition_MarathonTraining

    Anyone who enjoys still having calories left after breakfast.

  • pfreeme
    pfreeme Posts: 42 Member
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    Ive known many people who do high protein high fat and they do lose quickly but they also had very oily skin breakouts and bad breath.
    Im transitioning vegan which is 99%a moral choice but my body feels better on a 70-80%veg 20% grains /nuts tofu beans that sorta thing. Clean. No matter how fit toned leaned I am I have always had the thigh/saddlebags goin on. Cycling helps it better than anything but even in my beast shape when low wheight/bmi still had some xtra there.
  • EvgeniZyntx
    EvgeniZyntx Posts: 24,208 Member
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    pfreeme wrote: »
    Ive known many people who do high protein high fat and they do lose quickly but they also had very oily skin breakouts and bad breath.
    Im transitioning vegan which is 99%a moral choice but my body feels better on a 70-80%veg 20% grains /nuts tofu beans that sorta thing. Clean. No matter how fit toned leaned I am I have always had the thigh/saddlebags goin on. Cycling helps it better than anything but even in my beast shape when low wheight/bmi still had some xtra there.

    This is just full of confirmation bias.
    Tofu isn't any "cleaner" than ... well anything.

    https://youtu.be/6svdsikwKXo

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