Final answer on protein requirements?!

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Kdp2015
Kdp2015 Posts: 519 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
I've read so many different things about protein requirements and am constantly pushing myself to eat more than I normally would. I'm female, 5'10 143lbs and about 19.5% bf (only known according to scales) I average 85g of protein a day, is this enough to preserve muscle mass when lifting 2 or 3 times a week? I would like to start actually building some muscle but I have no idea how much protein that would take.
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  • seska422
    seska422 Posts: 3,217 Member
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    You aren't going to get a "this is the exact correct amount of protein you personally need to eat to build muscle" answer. I've seen studies that show that personal protein utilization can vary.

    The RDA for adequate protein for most adults is 0.8 grams per kilogram of ideal weight. That's about 46 grams of protein per day for non-pregnant, non-lactating women and 56 grams for men.

    Dietary Reference Intakes: Macronutrients

    The recommendation I've seen for optimal protein (especially if body building or losing weight) is 1 gram of protein per pound of lean body mass or 0.8 grams per pound of your ideal weight (middle of normal BMI).
  • Kdp2015
    Kdp2015 Posts: 519 Member
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    So for me that would make adequate 52 or optimal 112 - it's a huge range which is why I'm so confused!
  • seska422
    seska422 Posts: 3,217 Member
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    IMO, since you are lifting, I'd say you should aim for at least 150% RDA. If 85 g is working for you, you might try that for a while to see how you do with it.
  • CathyBen1
    CathyBen1 Posts: 3 Member
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    its not hard to get protein, grab a protein shake most have around 30 grams of protein, ISO Femme has only 3 carbs per shake, females need around 70-80 grams a day
  • Kdp2015
    Kdp2015 Posts: 519 Member
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    How do you know if it's working?
  • seska422
    seska422 Posts: 3,217 Member
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    Kdp2015 wrote: »
    How do you know if it's working?
    Does it work with your way of eating? Does that macro balance keep you satisfied?

    I aim for 70 g per day and I don't struggle to get in that much protein.
  • Kdp2015
    Kdp2015 Posts: 519 Member
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    I'm happy with my diet but I don't want it to result in me losing muscle mass
  • seska422
    seska422 Posts: 3,217 Member
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    The RDA is supposed to be enough for 97-98% of the population to retain muscle mass. Eating 150% of that should be plenty.
  • BillMcKay1
    BillMcKay1 Posts: 315 Member
    edited July 2016
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    seska422 wrote: »
    The RDA is supposed to be enough for 97-98% of the population to retain muscle mass. Eating 150% of that should be plenty.

    The RDA is the minimum recommended intake for a sedentary person. Not someone involved in resistance training.

    http://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/how-much-protein-do-you-need-every-day-201506188096
    The Recommended Dietary Allowance (RDA) for protein is a modest 0.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight. The RDA is the amount of a nutrient you need to meet your basic nutritional requirements. In a sense, it’s the minimum amount you need to keep from getting sick — not the specific amount you are supposed to eat every day.

    Further edit. Based on an aggregate of the numerous blogs, studies and a wee bit of bro science most recommendations come in that .8g per pound or 1g per lb of lean body mass. For heavier individuals using the .8 per lb of goal weight is a good rule of thumb. That is what I have been doing to maintain mass while in a deficit. I eat around 185-190g per day on a 1600cal diet which is where my goal weight is. That's probably higher than most, but it is what I have found keeps me feeling full and happy.

  • Kdp2015
    Kdp2015 Posts: 519 Member
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    Sorry but I'm not sure that's right, I can't believe many people lifting survive in what is deemed adequate and 150% feels like a bit of a stab in the dark. I know HOW to get protein it's more a case of not WANTING more than I NEED...I do appreciate your taking time to answer I'm just not convinced by what you're saying
  • Kdp2015
    Kdp2015 Posts: 519 Member
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    I will happily have 112 if that's what I need but I'd really rather not if I can continue to lift well on less
  • LPflaum
    LPflaum Posts: 174 Member
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    I use this article as a guide: http://www.menshealth.com/nutrition/workout-nutrition-for-muscle-building

    It states that a good target is .73g/lb of body weight every day (about 105g for you), consumed throughout the day in chunks of no less than 20g/serving. I would recommend reading the entire article, though, as its incredibly informative.
  • eeejer
    eeejer Posts: 339 Member
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    eat 1g per lb of lean body weight, this is generally agreed upon as adequate to optimal (but you will find as many opinions on this as you like), and is easy to calculate. It is pretty hard to eat too much protein, and it is the most satiating macro, as well as having the highest TEF. When training you need more than a sedentary person, especially when cutting.
  • tillerstouch
    tillerstouch Posts: 608 Member
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    No one can say exactly how much you need. So idk how anyone will convince you of a number.

    But seska was giving you was spot on with everything I've read.

    The most important piece of retaining muscle is following a good lifting program. You say you lift 2 OR 3 times a week which to me means you're probably not on a well regimented/established program.

    What's your lifting routine like?

    If you really want to preserve muscle go for 1 gram per pound of lean body weight and lift at least 3 times per week on a good program. (IMO)
  • sijomial
    sijomial Posts: 19,811 Member
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    Another vote for 1g/1lb of LBM here. (Doesn't have to be terribly precise every day.)
    With you being at maintenance it shouldn't be that hard to get it unless you have a dislike of protein rich foods.
  • Erik8484
    Erik8484 Posts: 458 Member
    edited July 2016
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    [Linked wrong video, see 2 posts below]

    This is what Eric Helms has to say, its a worthwhile watch, cites various studies, and maybe after watching this you will be able to reach your own conclusion rather than cherry picking from the multiple opinions in this thread.
  • julie_broadhead
    julie_broadhead Posts: 178 Member
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    seska422 wrote: »
    You aren't going to get a "this is the exact correct amount of protein you personally need to eat to build muscle" answer. I've seen studies that show that personal protein utilization can vary.

    The RDA for adequate protein for most adults is 0.8 grams per kilogram of ideal weight. That's about 46 grams of protein per day for non-pregnant, non-lactating women and 56 grams for men.

    Dietary Reference Intakes: Macronutrients

    The recommendation I've seen for optimal protein (especially if body building or losing weight) is 1 gram of protein per pound of lean body mass or 0.8 grams per pound of your ideal weight (middle of normal BMI).

    You have found one of the most controversial topics in sports nutrition:-) The answer I quoted is a pretty solid answer to your question. Your ideal protein intake can be any where between 10% and 35% of your daily calories. I know that's a big range, but it does take some experimentation to find what works for you. I'm 5'9" weigh 158 and I breastfeed. I'm doing Starting Strength and I add a day of moderate kettle bell training (4 strength sessions a week). The amount of protein that works best for me is 137grams. I know that it works because I'm recovering very well from my workouts and my strength level is increasing.
  • BillMcKay1
    BillMcKay1 Posts: 315 Member
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    Erik8484 wrote: »
    https://youtu.be/4livEPcsQvw

    This is what Eric Helms has to say, its a worthwhile watch, cites various studies, and maybe after watching this you will be able to reach your own conclusion rather than cherry picking from the multiple opinions in this thread.

    That one is on protein and workout timing. This is the one on total protein intake.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOE2zIg7bN0
  • Erik8484
    Erik8484 Posts: 458 Member
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    BillMcKay1 wrote: »
    Erik8484 wrote: »

    This is what Eric Helms has to say, its a worthwhile watch, cites various studies, and maybe after watching this you will be able to reach your own conclusion rather than cherry picking from the multiple opinions in this thread.

    That one is on protein and workout timing. This is the one on total protein intake.

    Good catch, thanks!
  • middlehaitch
    middlehaitch Posts: 8,483 Member
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    If you are maintaining, I am in the 1g per 1 lbs LBM camp too, especially as you would like to progress.

    Eating at maintenance and lifting will give you a recomp. This is a slow, and I mean slow, increase in muscle and decrease in fat, while progressing in strength.

    If you want to gain actual muscle, not only strength, faster you would need to do a clean bulk. Adding 250 calories to your daily intake to add both fat and muscle to your body. And then a cut at a 250- ish deficit while still lifting to retain as much muscle as possible.

    Here is a list of programmes, any of the beginners are suitable.
    A 5x5 type is foremost strength, muscle increase is slower.
    All Pro is s 8-12 rep programme which focuses on muscle mass increase, strength is second.
    A woman, on average can gain .5-1 lbs of muscle per month if all the stars are aligned.

    http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1

    A good protien intake is needed to retain and build strength and muscle no matter what you do.
    I also agree that it is best to try to eat no lower than 20g protien per meal.

    This is just my interpretation from various things I have read over the years.

    Cheers, h.

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