Experimenting
Replies
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I'm a little confused too?
But in general, a typical strategy for eating less calories is to fill up on lower cal items that replace calorie dense stuff. Like increase the amount of veggies in your dinner while decreasing the amount of heavier stuff.
Having said that, drinking 10 oz of whole milk a day would make me nauseous. And I don't understand why you would replace the avocado part of your breakfast with milk? Nothing wrong with avocado.
And it sounds like they are drinking 30oz per day... That's a lot of milk.
Child's play.1 -
I used to drink only water and unsweetened tea. No milk. No juice. No sodas. I drank NOTHING that hand calories- not even smoothies.
What am I cutting back on?
Well, I've only eaten 3 meals about 4 times this past week. On several occasions, I replaced lunch with something like a cheese stick, an apple, and milk... or I had milk instead of eating dinner. Instead of eating two large (10 inch diameter) plates overflowing with food on Wednesday, my dinner consisted of two small (like 6 inch diameter) plates of food... so, what would've been a cup or more of pasta salad was only about 3/4 of a cup. Instead of a large pile of steak, I had two small strips. The amount of food I ate was less than HALF what I would normally eat.
Do I think drinking milk is a long term solution? I HAVE NO FRICKIN IDEA!!!! How am I supposed to know if I can maintain it if I haven't tried it yet? Maybe it will work. Maybe it won't. That's why I'm calling this an "EXPERIMENT!"
I've also tried:
1. Weight Watchers (Momentum, PointsPlus, and SmartPoints)
2. Paleo
3. South Beach
4. Sparkpeople
5. Following MFP recommendations
6. TDEE-20%
7. Intermittent Fasting (skipping breakfast)
8. Green smoothies
9. Writing down what I eat in a notebook (no calorie counting)
10. Eating only whole, unprocessed foods.
Guess what.
NONE of those worked for me. NONE. I was unable to maintain any of them for more than a few months.
So, I'm trying to see if this is a sustainable habit because none of the "practical" solutions like counting calories has been sustainable for me.0 -
I used to drink only water and unsweetened tea. No milk. No juice. No sodas. I drank NOTHING that hand calories- not even smoothies.
What am I cutting back on?
Well, I've only eaten 3 meals about 4 times this past week. On several occasions, I replaced lunch with something like a cheese stick, an apple, and milk... or I had milk instead of eating dinner. Instead of eating two large (10 inch diameter) plates overflowing with food on Wednesday, my dinner consisted of two small (like 6 inch diameter) plates of food... so, what would've been a cup or more of pasta salad was only about 3/4 of a cup. Instead of a large pile of steak, I had two small strips. The amount of food I ate was less than HALF what I would normally eat.
Do I think drinking milk is a long term solution? I HAVE NO FRICKIN IDEA!!!! How am I supposed to know if I can maintain it if I haven't tried it yet? Maybe it will work. Maybe it won't. That's why I'm calling this an "EXPERIMENT!"
I've also tried:
1. Weight Watchers (Momentum, PointsPlus, and SmartPoints)
2. Paleo
3. South Beach
4. Sparkpeople
5. Following MFP recommendations
6. TDEE-20%
7. Intermittent Fasting (skipping breakfast)
8. Green smoothies
9. Writing down what I eat in a notebook (no calorie counting)
10. Eating only whole, unprocessed foods.
Guess what.
NONE of those worked for me. NONE. I was unable to maintain any of them for more than a few months.
So, I'm trying to see if this is a sustainable habit because none of the "practical" solutions like counting calories has been sustainable for me.
You al ways say these things didn't work but in not sure if you ever said why. What does that mean they didn't work? You couldn't stick with them? Why? Too hungry? Bored? Didn't see results?2 -
I used to drink only water and unsweetened tea. No milk. No juice. No sodas. I drank NOTHING that hand calories- not even smoothies.
What am I cutting back on?
Well, I've only eaten 3 meals about 4 times this past week. On several occasions, I replaced lunch with something like a cheese stick, an apple, and milk... or I had milk instead of eating dinner. Instead of eating two large (10 inch diameter) plates overflowing with food on Wednesday, my dinner consisted of two small (like 6 inch diameter) plates of food... so, what would've been a cup or more of pasta salad was only about 3/4 of a cup. Instead of a large pile of steak, I had two small strips. The amount of food I ate was less than HALF what I would normally eat.
Do I think drinking milk is a long term solution? I HAVE NO FRICKIN IDEA!!!! How am I supposed to know if I can maintain it if I haven't tried it yet? Maybe it will work. Maybe it won't. That's why I'm calling this an "EXPERIMENT!"
I've also tried:
1. Weight Watchers (Momentum, PointsPlus, and SmartPoints)
2. Paleo
3. South Beach
4. Sparkpeople
5. Following MFP recommendations
6. TDEE-20%
7. Intermittent Fasting (skipping breakfast)
8. Green smoothies
9. Writing down what I eat in a notebook (no calorie counting)
10. Eating only whole, unprocessed foods.
Guess what.
NONE of those worked for me. NONE. I was unable to maintain any of them for more than a few months.
So, I'm trying to see if this is a sustainable habit because none of the "practical" solutions like counting calories has been sustainable for me.
if those programs did not work then it is no the programs fault. If you set MFP to one pound per week loss, log all your food, get a food scale and weigh all solids, restrict no foods, and get some form of exercise you will lose weight and keep it off.2 -
Seems fad driven and doesn't look like a potential lifelong habit from here
640 calories on milk daily ...would be difficult to hit nutritional targets with remaining calorie allowance ...weight loss and maintenance is about adherence
But Good luck
Stranger things have happened
3 -
Carlos_421 wrote: »I'm a little confused too?
But in general, a typical strategy for eating less calories is to fill up on lower cal items that replace calorie dense stuff. Like increase the amount of veggies in your dinner while decreasing the amount of heavier stuff.
Having said that, drinking 10 oz of whole milk a day would make me nauseous. And I don't understand why you would replace the avocado part of your breakfast with milk? Nothing wrong with avocado.
And it sounds like they are drinking 30oz per day... That's a lot of milk.
Child's play.
Just imagine all the Oreos @Carlos_4213 -
I used to drink only water and unsweetened tea. No milk. No juice. No sodas. I drank NOTHING that hand calories- not even smoothies.
What am I cutting back on?
Well, I've only eaten 3 meals about 4 times this past week. On several occasions, I replaced lunch with something like a cheese stick, an apple, and milk... or I had milk instead of eating dinner. Instead of eating two large (10 inch diameter) plates overflowing with food on Wednesday, my dinner consisted of two small (like 6 inch diameter) plates of food... so, what would've been a cup or more of pasta salad was only about 3/4 of a cup. Instead of a large pile of steak, I had two small strips. The amount of food I ate was less than HALF what I would normally eat.
Do I think drinking milk is a long term solution? I HAVE NO FRICKIN IDEA!!!! How am I supposed to know if I can maintain it if I haven't tried it yet? Maybe it will work. Maybe it won't. That's why I'm calling this an "EXPERIMENT!"
I've also tried:
1. Weight Watchers (Momentum, PointsPlus, and SmartPoints)
2. Paleo
3. South Beach
4. Sparkpeople
5. Following MFP recommendations
6. TDEE-20%
7. Intermittent Fasting (skipping breakfast)
8. Green smoothies
9. Writing down what I eat in a notebook (no calorie counting)
10. Eating only whole, unprocessed foods.
Guess what.
NONE of those worked for me. NONE. I was unable to maintain any of them for more than a few months.
So, I'm trying to see if this is a sustainable habit because none of the "practical" solutions like counting calories has been sustainable for me.
I've tried WW, JC, MFP/TDEE-20%, and even had green smoothies for a time (fitting it into my calorie goal MFP gave me). They stopped working, when I stopped working. As long as I followed the program, the program worked. I decided to stop paying for a program to help me lose weight and switch to MFP/TDEE-%. There are some really crappy programs out there, but there are good ones too. MFP is a good program, and it's free!
Have you ever tried to combine programs? Like combine your milk experiment with MFP, just for a time to see how many calories your actually ingesting to see if you're on the right track.
I don't think anyone is deterring you from finding something that will work for you, they're just trying to understand why.2 -
"I went out to PA on Saturday and bought 2 gallons of raw milk"
Is the experiment to see how quickly you can get listeria?
"Yes, I'm aware that there are risks with drinking raw milk (but there are also risks with eating spinach, tomatoes, and cantaloupe). "
These are not at all equivalent. I'm not aware of a risk of eating spinach, tomatoes and cantaloupe. Listeria is much more commonly found in raw milk. Drinking raw milk however can literally kill you from septic shock from a listeria infection.
You want advice? Don't drink raw milk, there is no reason to do it and it is putting yourself at unnecessary risk.7 -
Alluminati wrote: »zoeysasha37 wrote: »Maybe it would help us understand if you explained more about what your hoping to accomplish by adding in extra servings of milk?
Because the plates are divided so the food doesn't touch at the potlucks. Avocado toast.
I almost spit out my coffee.4 -
I used to drink only water and unsweetened tea. No milk. No juice. No sodas. I drank NOTHING that hand calories- not even smoothies.
What am I cutting back on?
Well, I've only eaten 3 meals about 4 times this past week. On several occasions, I replaced lunch with something like a cheese stick, an apple, and milk... or I had milk instead of eating dinner. Instead of eating two large (10 inch diameter) plates overflowing with food on Wednesday, my dinner consisted of two small (like 6 inch diameter) plates of food... so, what would've been a cup or more of pasta salad was only about 3/4 of a cup. Instead of a large pile of steak, I had two small strips. The amount of food I ate was less than HALF what I would normally eat.
Do I think drinking milk is a long term solution? I HAVE NO FRICKIN IDEA!!!! How am I supposed to know if I can maintain it if I haven't tried it yet? Maybe it will work. Maybe it won't. That's why I'm calling this an "EXPERIMENT!"
I've also tried:
1. Weight Watchers (Momentum, PointsPlus, and SmartPoints)
2. Paleo
3. South Beach
4. Sparkpeople
5. Following MFP recommendations
6. TDEE-20%
7. Intermittent Fasting (skipping breakfast)
8. Green smoothies
9. Writing down what I eat in a notebook (no calorie counting)
10. Eating only whole, unprocessed foods.
Guess what.
NONE of those worked for me. NONE. I was unable to maintain any of them for more than a few months.
So, I'm trying to see if this is a sustainable habit because none of the "practical" solutions like counting calories has been sustainable for me.
The only way to get a handle on weight issues is to figure out your calorie balance. I get the impression you don't know how much you are eating, and if that's true replacing food with milk won't do much good.
Have you tried portion control via weighing food and logging everything you eat and drink? I don't mean a week, or a month, or somewhere inbetween I mean long term, such as several months?1 -
I used to drink only water and unsweetened tea. No milk. No juice. No sodas. I drank NOTHING that hand calories- not even smoothies.
What am I cutting back on?
Well, I've only eaten 3 meals about 4 times this past week. On several occasions, I replaced lunch with something like a cheese stick, an apple, and milk... or I had milk instead of eating dinner. Instead of eating two large (10 inch diameter) plates overflowing with food on Wednesday, my dinner consisted of two small (like 6 inch diameter) plates of food... so, what would've been a cup or more of pasta salad was only about 3/4 of a cup. Instead of a large pile of steak, I had two small strips. The amount of food I ate was less than HALF what I would normally eat.
Do I think drinking milk is a long term solution? I HAVE NO FRICKIN IDEA!!!! How am I supposed to know if I can maintain it if I haven't tried it yet? Maybe it will work. Maybe it won't. That's why I'm calling this an "EXPERIMENT!"
I've also tried:
1. Weight Watchers (Momentum, PointsPlus, and SmartPoints)
2. Paleo
3. South Beach
4. Sparkpeople
5. Following MFP recommendations
6. TDEE-20%
7. Intermittent Fasting (skipping breakfast)
8. Green smoothies
9. Writing down what I eat in a notebook (no calorie counting)
10. Eating only whole, unprocessed foods.
Guess what.
NONE of those worked for me. NONE. I was unable to maintain any of them for more than a few months.
So, I'm trying to see if this is a sustainable habit because none of the "practical" solutions like counting calories has been sustainable for me.
It may be time to look at why these didn't work. Once again, weight loss comes down to calories. But you know that already because it's been said time and time again. If your failing at everything you try, it's time to look at the root of the problem. Do you really want to lose weight or do you just like to talk about losing weight? Are you willing to do whatever it takes to achieve your goals? When someone is truly ready, nothing will stop them. They'll find a way to make it happen. Some people just like to talk about it but really don't want to work for it. So you'll have to figure out how badly you really want this. You've been given excellent advice throughout the years ( not just on here either, on every weight loss board) so it's going to come down to you now. If you want it, make it happen. If you want something, you must work for it. Not just physical work but also mental work. Get your issues sorted out and make it happen. Your options are - 1. Continue to talk about it for another three years and receive the same exact advice over and over again. 2. Put in the work needed to make this happen. ( Mentally and physically) nobody can do it for you. There's nothing more anyone can say to you. You've been given the information, now use it. If this isn't working out for you then you need to figure out why and take care of that. You can experiment, go low carb, green smoothie diet, count calories, write in notebooks or whatever fad is next but none of that will make any bit of difference unless you are continuously creating a calorie deficit. Otherwise your just going to continue to spin your wheels. In the past three years I've managed to lose every pound of my extra weight and have been maintaining my new lifestyle change. What have you accomplished in the past three years? You've created a lot of threads in those three years but yet seem to still be at square one. I think it's time for you to get yourself straightened out.
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Why take a chance? Cause it's yummy
Seriously though, I drink raw milk all the time. I know the farmer, see the operations, no what the cows see fed and not fed, so it doesn't seem all that risky to me. YRMV
The big problem is listeria is everywhere. Statistically speaking, if you randomly grab three handfuls of dirt off the ground, at least one contains measurable levels of listeria. It's in the soil, it's in the water, and it's very hardy.
And while listeria can sicken cattle, most of the time there's no symptoms in the cattle themselves, even when their milk contains high levels of the bacteria. Poor conditions may make the disease more common, but there are plenty of listeria outbreaks from high quality free-range cattle operations, too.1 -
rankinsect wrote: »Why take a chance? Cause it's yummy
Seriously though, I drink raw milk all the time. I know the farmer, see the operations, no what the cows see fed and not fed, so it doesn't seem all that risky to me. YRMV
The big problem is listeria is everywhere. Statistically speaking, if you randomly grab three handfuls of dirt off the ground, at least one contains measurable levels of listeria. It's in the soil, it's in the water, and it's very hardy.
And while listeria can sicken cattle, most of the time there's no symptoms in the cattle themselves, even when their milk contains high levels of the bacteria. Poor conditions may make the disease more common, but there are plenty of listeria outbreaks from high quality free-range cattle operations, too.
Yes, I understand that. There is a chance. Adding in that I'm in good shape and my immune system is just fine, it's nothing worth worrying about to me and we'll worth the minimal risk IMO.0 -
I would love to get my hands on raw milk, it's just not available here
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Christine_72 wrote: »I would love to get my hands on raw milk, it's just not available here
Could you milk a cow and then drink the milk?( I'm not being funny, seriously. I'm asking if you have farms or cows in your area. The sale of raw milk is not allowed in new Jersey but every farm would gladly " give" you some if you just ask. Fwiw - I don't drink raw milk but have been to many local farms as I try to buy produce and such from them when possible )0 -
zoeysasha37 wrote: »Christine_72 wrote: »I would love to get my hands on raw milk, it's just not available here
Could you milk a cow and then drink the milk?( I'm not being funny, seriously. I'm asking if you have farms or cows in your area. The sale of raw milk is not allowed in new Jersey but every farm would gladly " give" you some if you just ask. Fwiw - I don't drink raw milk but have been to many local farms as I try to buy produce and such from them when possible )
I haven't directly asked any farmers, but i have heard they get huge fines if they're caught selling it. I have a local dairy not far from me, I guess i could ask them if they are willing to give it away, don't much like my chances though.0 -
This has been my favorite thread in a long time.3
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Christine_72 wrote: »zoeysasha37 wrote: »Christine_72 wrote: »I would love to get my hands on raw milk, it's just not available here
Could you milk a cow and then drink the milk?( I'm not being funny, seriously. I'm asking if you have farms or cows in your area. The sale of raw milk is not allowed in new Jersey but every farm would gladly " give" you some if you just ask. Fwiw - I don't drink raw milk but have been to many local farms as I try to buy produce and such from them when possible )
I haven't directly asked any farmers, but i have heard they get huge fines if they're caught selling it. I have a local dairy not far from me, I guess i could ask them if they are willing to give it away, don't much like my chances though.
Depends on if they are big enough to have their own lawyers
Any dairy that had a legal team would never open themselves up to the degree of liability they'd have if someone became sick or died from their product.
On the other hand, there's a paranoid anti-government dairy farmer out in these parts who sells homemade cheese out of his farmhouse. As long as you promise you're not with the government, I'm sure that guy would sell raw milk.1 -
This is one of the weirdest things I've seen on here in a while.0
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pomegranatecloud wrote: »This is one of the weirdest things I've seen on here in a while.
You should have been here two years ago.2 -
rankinsect wrote: »Why take a chance? Cause it's yummy
Seriously though, I drink raw milk all the time. I know the farmer, see the operations, no what the cows see fed and not fed, so it doesn't seem all that risky to me. YRMV
The big problem is listeria is everywhere. Statistically speaking, if you randomly grab three handfuls of dirt off the ground, at least one contains measurable levels of listeria. It's in the soil, it's in the water, and it's very hardy.
And while listeria can sicken cattle, most of the time there's no symptoms in the cattle themselves, even when their milk contains high levels of the bacteria. Poor conditions may make the disease more common, but there are plenty of listeria outbreaks from high quality free-range cattle operations, too.
Yes, I understand that. There is a chance. Adding in that I'm in good shape and my immune system is just fine, it's nothing worth worrying about to me and we'll worth the minimal risk IMO.
Being in good shape does not make you immune to bacterial infections. Nor will the bacteria particularly care what your opinion on the matter is. If you haven't gotten sick from raw milk its because you haven't drank sufficiently contaminated raw milk...yet. But claiming "I haven't gotten sick so raw milk is safe for me" is like someone coming back from a war saying "Well I didn't get hurt so I'm not sure why people think war is dangerous"
We think its dangerous because of the statistics and the epidemiological studies that show that it is not safe. Pasteurization of milk greatly reduced the incidence of food borne illnesses for a reason. It is an unnecessary risk and I never understood why people take it other than to mistakenly think they are somehow immune to bacterial infections.3 -
I have never drunk raw milk, so what is perceived as what makes it better than grocery store whole milk? Flavor? Nutrition? Just wondering. If I thought that milk was the panacea, I think I would want to start conservative and experiment with milk from the grocery store. But as I say, just curious.0
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I have never drunk raw milk, so what is perceived as what makes it better than grocery store whole milk? Flavor? Nutrition? Just wondering. If I thought that milk was the panacea, I think I would want to start conservative and experiment with milk from the grocery store. But as I say, just curious.
It does have a different texture and flavor - it's actually from what I understand more the homogenization process than the pasteurization that accounts for those changes.0 -
Aaron_K123 wrote: »rankinsect wrote: »Why take a chance? Cause it's yummy
Seriously though, I drink raw milk all the time. I know the farmer, see the operations, no what the cows see fed and not fed, so it doesn't seem all that risky to me. YRMV
The big problem is listeria is everywhere. Statistically speaking, if you randomly grab three handfuls of dirt off the ground, at least one contains measurable levels of listeria. It's in the soil, it's in the water, and it's very hardy.
And while listeria can sicken cattle, most of the time there's no symptoms in the cattle themselves, even when their milk contains high levels of the bacteria. Poor conditions may make the disease more common, but there are plenty of listeria outbreaks from high quality free-range cattle operations, too.
Yes, I understand that. There is a chance. Adding in that I'm in good shape and my immune system is just fine, it's nothing worth worrying about to me and we'll worth the minimal risk IMO.
Being in good shape does not make you immune to bacterial infections. Nor will the bacteria particularly care what your opinion on the matter is. If you haven't gotten sick from raw milk its because you haven't drank sufficiently contaminated raw milk...yet. But claiming "I haven't gotten sick so raw milk is safe for me" is like someone coming back from a war saying "Well I didn't get hurt so I'm not sure why people think war is dangerous"
We think its dangerous because of the statistics and the epidemiological studies that show that it is not safe. Pasteurization of milk greatly reduced the incidence of food borne illnesses for a reason. It is an unnecessary risk and I never understood why people take it other than to mistakenly think they are somehow immune to bacterial infections.
I never stated an opinion. It's well worth the risk of getting sick for me. That's where the immune system/being healthy comment came from. Yes, I know I can get sick. That is a risk I am willing to make based on the information I have about my farmer and his three jersey cows.
I never said it was safe for me cause I haven't gotten sick. It HAS been safe for me because l haven't gotten sick, and should I get sick, it is a good thing I am in good shape and my immune system is fine is a more accurate statement.
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