No more wine time for this little drunk duck
vanessaaorth717
Posts: 44 Member
Soooo after a gain in pure lard of about 25kgs over a few years and many bottles of white wine, my journey to sobriety is beginning. So far I've cut back to weekends but Peter, Paul and Mary, if there's a bottle in my house, no drop will go unfinished. How do you 'control' your alcohol intake? What's your poison and do you think there's ANY chance of losing weight, exercising, calorie controlling AND drinking plenty?! Help!
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Uuuugh I feel your pain. Chardonnay and I are such close friends my recycling bin perpetually glows a subtle shade of 'French Green'. I honestly don't think there's a chance we can drink like we want and lose weight. The only time I've been successful in dropping the kilos is when I did, per week, two days alcohol free and three days 'low' alcohol - 2 glasses max. I had two days of my normal intake (which for most people is coma-inducingly high) and it was slow going but I did manage 16 kilos in 6 months. I exercised 5 days as well. It stayed off for 6 months but 8 of those SOBs have since crept back on. Yes, it's because I love you, Chardonnay....and your cousins Riesling and Merlot. Lord knows I've tried to exercise my booze intake away or not even eat much and use all my cals on drinking but it just doesn't work for me. I don't gain, which is still a bonus I guess, but there's no shrinking belly blubber like there is when I suck it up and force myself to ditch(ish) the vino. The stupid thing is I've tried substituting vodka for wine to save calories but turns out I couldn't care less about vodka, I'd rather have wine or nothing. I mean, hooray for not being an alcoholic but boo for the unbearable wine cravings. It's hard freaking work but I find I need to distract myself with menial tasks (hello finding healthy recipes in magazines and writing them in a notebook I'll invariably lose next week) and I also need to plan my meals around my drinking days - like, no chance I could go without a nice red when having steak or bolognese so those meals can't happen on 'No Booze Tues' or 'Freaking Awful Fridays'. I've also found sugar free cordial and soda water helps. It's what I put the vodka in at first but now just leave that out because it's pointless for me. I wish it wasn't so stupidly hard, but it can be done with wine - just nowhere near as much as we'd like. I'm back walking next to the wagon for now...I started again a couple of weeks ago and I'm one kg down. Just one. But better than none or plus 8! Best of luck to you my friend!13
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i am an alcoholic, i cannot diagnose anyone but myself. i have been sober 10 years. i go to 12 step meetings daily still. once an alcoholic, always an alcoholic. if you cannot control or stop when you should, if you want help and really want to stop i would suggest A.A. not trying to be rude or hurtful to anyone, it is a touchy subject, but so prevalent in society today. if i am totally out of line, disregard. if i can help at least one person, great! best of luck in your journey! j19
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@jsmoo1 thanks for your honesty.... Totally understand the 'vino or nothing' feeling. I think you're right; booze doesn't equal a healthy, lean body. I'm going to try and go totally without for a month (I have fatty liver disease too. Boo) and try the sparkling water with lime slices, lots of tea, going to bed early and perhaps taking a sleeping pill.... Let's see how that goes anyhow! I'll add you on my friends if you like and we can keep in touch and share tips
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vanessaaorth717 wrote: »@jsmoo1 thanks for your honesty.... Totally understand the 'vino or nothing' feeling. I think you're right; booze doesn't equal a healthy, lean body. I'm going to try and go totally without for a month (I have fatty liver disease too. Boo) and try the sparkling water with lime slices, lots of tea, going to bed early and perhaps taking a sleeping pill.... Let's see how that goes anyhow! I'll add you on my friends if you like and we can keep in touch and share tips
Why take a sleeping pill?1 -
EttaMaeMartin wrote: »i am an alcoholic, i cannot diagnose anyone but myself. i have been sober 10 years. i go to 12 step meetings daily still. once an alcoholic, always an alcoholic. if you cannot control or stop when you should, if you want help and really want to stop i would suggest A.A. not trying to be rude or hurtful to anyone, it is a touchy subject, but so prevalent in society today. if i am totally out of line, disregard. if i can help at least one person, great! best of luck in your journey! j
Wow, you've done some good, hard work. AA is probably not what I need, but I do agree that alcohol is definitely a problem in society. The old 'just don't drink' doesn't work for everyone!
Thanks for your well wishes
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I am the same way. I love my red, red wine and it hates me back in the form of flab. Life is unfair. I don't seem to be able to drink normally in that once I have opened a bottle....it will be gone. The big ones might take me 2 nights. I have had to cut it out completely. I have bought several flavors of MiO and other water flavouring drops and I "mix my drink" from that. I also investigates cucumber water and other ways of dressing water up. It actually does work and I feel better than I have in a long time. Funny, because I miss the thing that makes me fat and feel like crap the next day. Like a crummy boyfriend!9
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Oh, the insomnia will go away within a couple of weeks. It did for me, but it was a tough couple of weeks and I took diphenhydramine almost every night for the first weeek. Once that sorted out, I found that I don't need as much sleep sober as I did when I tied one on.2
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@Packerjohn I used to drink large volumes of wine at night, since going without or cutting back, I just can't get to sleep. I have a script for a Z class drug (not addictive like a benzodiazepine is) It's just hard lying awake until 2 in the morning and then trying to function! I'm Not the greatest sleeper at the best of times. Hopefully heavy exercise helps. Why do you ask anyway?
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I am the same way. I love my red, red wine and it hates me back in the form of flab. Life is unfair. I don't seem to be able to drink normally in that once I have opened a bottle....it will be gone. The big ones might take me 2 nights. I have had to cut it out completely. I have bought several flavors of MiO and other water flavouring drops and I "mix my drink" from that. I also investigates cucumber water and other ways of dressing water up. It actually does work and I feel better than I have in a long time. Funny, because I miss the thing that makes me fat and feel like crap the next day. Like a crummy boyfriend!
Too funny. Stupid love/hate relationships. How crazy when you say it like that "I miss the thing that makes me fat and feel like crap". We must be crazy!! 1 -
@vanessaaorth717 Good luck with this admirable endeavor! I believe you will succeed, especially with the support you will find here.
And this I am saying for anyone who may be reading this thread and might not know: Alcohol plus a Z class drug or a benzodiazepine can be a fatal combination. Don't drink alcohol and then take a sleeping pill.5 -
Are you trying to cut out alcohol because you are concerned you have a problem controlling your intake, or are you cutting it out because you believe you can't successfully lose weight while still continuing to drink in moderation? Because the advice you receive may differ based on your motivation and personal situation.1
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WinoGelato wrote: »Are you trying to cut out alcohol because you are concerned you have a problem controlling your intake, or are you cutting it out because you believe you can't successfully lose weight while still continuing to drink in moderation? Because the advice you receive may differ based on your motivation and personal situation.
Hi @WinoGelato Not so much that I have a problem..... Well, I guess I'm not good at control if there's wine in my fridge. But then again, it's the same for pizza
To answer your question, I guess it's a little bit from column A and a little bit from column B.1 -
@KetoneKaren absolutely. Many medications shouldn't be taken with alcohol but this is true for any type of sedative. Even codeine! I certainly would not go down that path.
Thanks for your well wishes. Appreciate it 2 -
I mostly gave up booze, beer and all other type alcohol.vanessaaorth717 wrote: »Soooo after a gain in pure lard of about 25kgs over a few years and many bottles of white wine, my journey to sobriety is beginning. So far I've cut back to weekends but Peter, Paul and Mary, if there's a bottle in my house, no drop will go unfinished. How do you 'control' your alcohol intake? What's your poison and do you think there's ANY chance of losing weight, exercising, calorie controlling AND drinking plenty?! Help!
I'll have a glass of wine with a nice meal, but that is it. We're talking once a month...
Booze to me represent empty, body killing calories, and you can now COUNT ME OUT of that tribe.
My health and fitness goals are more to me than the fleeting pleasures of junk foods, including booze...3 -
Don't get me wrong, I love my wine (and as a student pretty much anything else, gin & tonic is my jam), but these posts worry me. I know nothing of your life and I don't want to judge or be out of line here, but both your stories indicate that you show symptoms of alcohol use disorder according to the DSM V.
See https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-athletes-way/201506/what-are-the-eleven-symptoms-alcohol-use-disorder (sorry I can't find something a little more scientific/reliable, English is not my native language). What to do with this info is up to you obviously
As for losing weight, alcohol is notorious for halting the digestion of everything else because your body wants to get rid of alcohol (which is toxic) asap. From personal experience, I also snack way more and care less about diet when I drink in large quantities. A glass of wine is around 125 kcal a glass, so a few glasses will easily undo your deficit.
So, drinking large amounts and losing weight? Probably not going to happen.
Personally I drink around 5 days a week. One glass of wine for dinner, or a gin & tonic for special occasions. When I go out for dinner it's usually 2 glasses and when I have a party I party hard and try to drink my bodyweight in alcohol, but that only happens once every like 8-10 weeks. This is the only way I've found that I can drink and maintain my weight. When I was losing I only had a glass of wine with dinner on the weekends. In the end your energy balance matters most for weight, but dropping alcohol consumption and eating healthy/exercising matter most for your health 5 -
@Return2Fit awesome mindset. I'm thinking of flicking the wine all together. It's all about fitness after all. Stupid empty calories messing with my fat metabolism.2
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vanessaaorth717 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Are you trying to cut out alcohol because you are concerned you have a problem controlling your intake, or are you cutting it out because you believe you can't successfully lose weight while still continuing to drink in moderation? Because the advice you receive may differ based on your motivation and personal situation.
Hi @WinoGelato Not so much that I have a problem..... Well, I guess I'm not good at control if there's wine in my fridge. But then again, it's the same for pizza
To answer your question, I guess it's a little bit from column A and a little bit from column B.
Fair enough. Ok here's my story, for what it's worth. Alcoholism runs in my family (father and brother) but I love my vino. Before starting MFP, and when my husband was still drinking (he quit for medical reasons not related to alcoholism) we used to drink a bottle of wine or a 6 pack of beer or more every night, more on the weekends. I didn't think I had a drinking problem and still am perfectly fine cutting out alcohol for various reasons at various points in my life but the genes are always in the back of my mind if I go out and really tie one on.
Anyway, when I started MFP like everyone else, I was aggressive with my goal rate of loss and was set at 1200 cals like many petite women who choose lose 1-2 lbs/week. I logged everything faithfully but couldn't fit the wine in without starving! So a few things happened...
1. I started reading the advice on here that many people can lose weight eating more than 1200c so I changed my goal, first to 1400 then 1500.
2. I started exercising more giving me more calories to work with from that
3. I started waiting to pour a glass of wine till after dinner, after the kids were in bed, when I finally would sit down on the couch for maybe one hour of me time. Prior to all this, I would start with a glass of wine after a stressful day at work while cooking dinner, then have one with dinner, then one or two after dinner during that "me time".
So long story short, by focusing on logging and becoming more active, I had room for a glass of wine each day while I was losing, and now that I'm in maintenance I often have 2 glasses each day. On weekends I relax my rule about waiting till the kids are in bed and often have a drink when we go out, but I also bank calories for the weekends so I can eat more too...
Bottom line, if you can moderate your intake of alcohol and not feel out of control, it is entirely possible to continue to partake and still achieve your weight loss goals. However, like anything, whether it be pizza, ice cream or wine, logging the calories is critical to make sure you can fit it in without compromising other foods that contribute to a healthy balanced diet.
Whew that was long. Cheers!22 -
@WinoGelato Thank you! So appreciate hearing your story. I have been on MFP for 45 days now and have logged everything faithfully. I'm only on 1200 cal a day but it's working for me at this point in my 'journey'. Alcoholism runs in my family too and I believe it to be a genetic predisposition. I think I have made up my mind to at least try a month with no booze and evaluate from there. If I can be trusted to just drink one or two glasses after that, then great, but it's not worth it otherwise. Cheers!
Vanessa1 -
I agree with WinoGelato. Your initial comment/question leaves it in doubt as to your goal. Ultimately, only you know if alcohol is problem for you but the fact you stated that no drop goes unfinished if in the house should tell you something. As to the weight and alcohol perspective, I can speak from experience in this department. The only way to lose weight is to under consume (calorically) your TDEE. If you do that you will lose weight regardless of where those calories came from, so in theory if your calories came only from wine so long as you under consumed your TDEE you would lose weight but that's more theory than reality. The problem with wine or a lot of alcohol is really multi fold depending on how you view it. We know that calories from any liquid beverage (including protein shakes for example) do not satiate appetite like real food does. This creates a situation regardless of what type of caloric drink we are talking about where you are intaking calories but not satisfying your appetite. Make that drink of an alcoholic nature and not only is this typically a higher caloric drink (per volume) but often it is high in sugar/carbs creating a situation where you will be more hungry hormonally and when you have the least amount of willpower (due to your buzz) to make good decisions. I too like to drink occasionally but I found in my weight loss journey limiting the days and type of alcohol (dry red wines or Bacardi and diet no beer). In my experience it really wasn't the calories from the alcohol that caused the problem it was dietary behavior due to the alcohol consumption. The same thing can be said of cookies too (a personal weakness of mine) the calories from them are relatively negligible but the subsequent hunger and ultimately more consumption of food is what did me in. In the end, if you can't under consume your caloric allotment because of the wine it will have to go if you want to lose weight but what works best for me was planning on partaking certain days and accepting that weight loss won't occur but doing the right thing 5 days a week. This really is the two steps forward one back approach but over time you will reach your goal.6
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In Spain the recommended daily consumption of alcohol for women is 1 bottle of wine per day4
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vanessaaorth717 wrote: »@Packerjohn I used to drink large volumes of wine at night, since going without or cutting back, I just can't get to sleep. I have a script for a Z class drug (not addictive like a benzodiazepine is) It's just hard lying awake until 2 in the morning and then trying to function! I'm Not the greatest sleeper at the best of times. Hopefully heavy exercise helps. Why do you ask anyway?
Your original post made it sound like you though you had or were close to having a drinking problem. Then you say you're going to hit up sleeping pills (before you mentioned under a doctor's care)
Trading one possible addiction for another isn't the healthiest thing2 -
I stopped drinking altogether because my husband is on probation and one of the conditions is that he cannot have alcohol. So we can't go to bars or clubs and we can't purchase alcohol and keep it at home. I find I don't miss it. It has all these empty calories. Every 2 or 3 months I make an exception and go out with girlfriends, and purchase 2 or 3 individual drinks. Then I switch to no cal Red Bull and water.0
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Packerjohn wrote: »vanessaaorth717 wrote: »@Packerjohn I used to drink large volumes of wine at night, since going without or cutting back, I just can't get to sleep. I have a script for a Z class drug (not addictive like a benzodiazepine is) It's just hard lying awake until 2 in the morning and then trying to function! I'm Not the greatest sleeper at the best of times. Hopefully heavy exercise helps. Why do you ask anyway?
Your original post made it sound like you though you had or were close to having a drinking problem. Then you say you're going to hit up sleeping pills (before you mentioned under a doctor's care)
Trading one possible addiction for another isn't the healthiest thing
Making a transition to normal sleeping habits via RX is okay. The doctor will generally authorize it for three months then wean you off.1 -
Packerjohn wrote: »vanessaaorth717 wrote: »@Packerjohn I used to drink large volumes of wine at night, since going without or cutting back, I just can't get to sleep. I have a script for a Z class drug (not addictive like a benzodiazepine is) It's just hard lying awake until 2 in the morning and then trying to function! I'm Not the greatest sleeper at the best of times. Hopefully heavy exercise helps. Why do you ask anyway?
Your original post made it sound like you though you had or were close to having a drinking problem. Then you say you're going to hit up sleeping pills (before you mentioned under a doctor's care)
Trading one possible addiction for another isn't the healthiest thing
Making a transition to normal sleeping habits via RX is okay. The doctor will generally authorize it for three months then wean you off.
Yep as I mentioned the original post didn't mention any doctor involvement..0 -
We made our minds up Saturday to stop drinking for a month, because hubby was hungover and it ruined the whole day. Sunday? He was offered a beer at a party, and said yes. Twas a quick month.
We only drink on weekends, and usually only with each other as part of our "date" nites..but...my father was an alcoholic...his father was an alcoholic....
That said, I've lost 80 lbs while continuing to drink most weekends at least one night.0 -
In the U.S., the OTC sleep aids include diphenhydramine, doxylamine, valerian, melatonin, certain amino acids, and magnesium that I can think of. As far as I know, none of those are addicting. Reading @Packerjohn's post made me curious if there are OTC sleep aids available in other countries (I'm sure there must be) that are addicting?0
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Someone on these forums posted a link to this website http://tiredofthinkingaboutdrinking.com/. I have been reading the blogs and committed to the 100 day no drinking challenge. Her blog is awesome and it really hits home for me. I'm not sure if this is the kind of support or option you may be looking for but wanted to throw it out there for you.1
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vanessaaorth717 wrote: »Soooo after a gain in pure lard of about 25kgs over a few years and many bottles of white wine, my journey to sobriety is beginning. So far I've cut back to weekends but Peter, Paul and Mary, if there's a bottle in my house, no drop will go unfinished. How do you 'control' your alcohol intake? What's your poison and do you think there's ANY chance of losing weight, exercising, calorie controlling AND drinking plenty?! Help!
I can't control myself around a bottle of wine. Literally, I don't care about beer, liquor, or anything else but put a bottle (or box) of white zinfandel in front of me, and there's no turning back lol. I've been trying to only drink on Saturday nights. Usually it goes something like this: I'll go to a restaurant for dinner and look at the menu and say, hmmm....a glass of wine would go really well with this. Then it's a second glass, and a third, and by that point when my friends say "lets pick up a bottle and continue this at the house" I'm too tipsy to remember I'm about to consume over 1200 calories in wine. Needless to say, we usually finish the bottle and end up at Mcdonald's at 2am for chicken nuggets...lol, hence why I limit it to once a week.
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Simply put - I don't control my alcohol intake. I just control my food more strictly when I drink. I'd rather have alcohol for dinner some nights than food, so that's what I do. lol2
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As a recovering addict, clean 6+ years, I can tell you that insomnia after stopping alcohol or drugs is an issue. It took me about a year to really get back to a presubstance sleep pattern. That is not the case for everyone and I can only tell you my experience. Taking sleeping medications can cause issues in the future if you have any inclination towards addiction. Prescriptions sleeping medications can be an issue even under a doctors care. They are for short term use but realistically, in 3 months if you still have troubles sleeping, is your doctor going to tell you "no"? You may not be physically addicted but can be mentally addicted and feel like you have to have the med to sleep.
I am in no way saying you have an addiction problem. I am just saying, as a recovering addict, be careful of sleeping pills. Sleeping meds, even OTC made me tired during the day and affected my motivation to get out there and workout.4
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