TDEE
leejoyce31
Posts: 794 Member
Although, I can't use NEAT because I have no way to estimate my calories burned during exercise, TDEE is such a moving target. I don't use the HRM's, which is why I don't think NEAT will work for me.
It's crazy frustrating because I still don't know my maintenance calorie range. My weight fluctuates so much because I retain fluid often. The swings are large enough that even using Happy Scale and 7 day moving averages, I can show a 2-3 pound loss in a month and regain during the time period shortly after.
Right now, I'm in the loss range. I'm showing 3 pound loss in 30 days per 7 day moving average and a 2 pound loss with Happy Scale over 30 days. In the next couple of weeks, I'll probably start retaining more fluid due to birth control and will likely swing back up 2-3 pounds and stay there for long enough for my averages to shift back to a gain of 2-3 pounds. I see these as phantom gains/losses, not real fat.
However, with those swings, my calculations can show a TDEE as low as 1300 and as high as 2,000. It doesn't impact my maintenance trend overall. But I guess I really want to have some idea of what my TDEE range is. I know that it varies based upon activity level, but my activity is pretty much the same. I'm averaging 1500 calories using the 30 day trend. I would like to see if I can ease up to a higher number. I have posted about this before to some degree. I guess I rinse and repeat because it annoys the heck out of me because I am too chicken to slowly increase up more to see if I can maintain on a higher TDEE.
Oh well. Just my labor day vent. Does anyone else have this issue with nailing down TDEE? Just curious to see what others' experience with this has been.
I see that many people have nailed their TDEE down to some degree of comfort level. I just can't get there.
Happy Labor Day to those of you who are fortunate enough to not have to work today! My chosen career requires me to work this time of year.
It's crazy frustrating because I still don't know my maintenance calorie range. My weight fluctuates so much because I retain fluid often. The swings are large enough that even using Happy Scale and 7 day moving averages, I can show a 2-3 pound loss in a month and regain during the time period shortly after.
Right now, I'm in the loss range. I'm showing 3 pound loss in 30 days per 7 day moving average and a 2 pound loss with Happy Scale over 30 days. In the next couple of weeks, I'll probably start retaining more fluid due to birth control and will likely swing back up 2-3 pounds and stay there for long enough for my averages to shift back to a gain of 2-3 pounds. I see these as phantom gains/losses, not real fat.
However, with those swings, my calculations can show a TDEE as low as 1300 and as high as 2,000. It doesn't impact my maintenance trend overall. But I guess I really want to have some idea of what my TDEE range is. I know that it varies based upon activity level, but my activity is pretty much the same. I'm averaging 1500 calories using the 30 day trend. I would like to see if I can ease up to a higher number. I have posted about this before to some degree. I guess I rinse and repeat because it annoys the heck out of me because I am too chicken to slowly increase up more to see if I can maintain on a higher TDEE.
Oh well. Just my labor day vent. Does anyone else have this issue with nailing down TDEE? Just curious to see what others' experience with this has been.
I see that many people have nailed their TDEE down to some degree of comfort level. I just can't get there.
Happy Labor Day to those of you who are fortunate enough to not have to work today! My chosen career requires me to work this time of year.
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Replies
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I'm trying to affix a handle to the horns of the maintenance dilemma by carefully tracking my calorie deficit as I approach maintenance. Two weeks ago I raised my calorie intake range from 1500-1600 to 1600-1700 because I first touched Onederland. With that change, I exited Onederland for a few days but re-entered it yesterday. My calorie deficit continues to increase. I expect to continue losing weight at about 8 lb per month and I expect that when I reach 190 I'll again raise my intake calorie range. Maybe tracking your calorie deficit against your weight and paying attention only to the 30-day interval is what will work for you.0
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My TDEE varies from about 2000 to c. 6500 (on very rare occasions) but differences of 1000 - 1500 day to day are very common.
And yet I can maintain, lose or gain without logging my food or doing trend analysis on my weight - so don't get analysis paralysis!
Calculations are just supposed to be a help to get you to the results you want, they aren't an end in themselves.
Question for you.... As you like numbers what would be the worst outcome of increasing your daily allowance by 100cals/day for a month?too chicken to slowly increase up more to see if I can maintain on a higher TDEE
PS - what kind of exercise stops you using the NEAT method?
The vast majority of my exercise estimates don't come from a HRM.
PPS - 7 day moving average as a female who knows they are prone to water fluctuations seems far too short a time period (no pun intended!).1 -
My TDEE varies from about 2000 to c. 6500 (on very rare occasions) but differences of 1000 - 1500 day to day are very common.
And yet I can maintain, lose or gain without logging my food or doing trend analysis on my weight - so don't get analysis paralysis!
Calculations are just supposed to be a help to get you to the results you want, they aren't an end in themselves.
Question for you.... As you like numbers what would be the worst outcome of increasing your daily allowance by 100cals/day for a month?too chicken to slowly increase up more to see if I can maintain on a higher TDEE
PS - what kind of exercise stops you using the NEAT method?
The vast majority of my exercise estimates don't come from a HRM.
PPS - 7 day moving average as a female who knows they are prone to water fluctuations seems far too short a time period (no pun intended!).
How do you estimate your exercise?0 -
leejoyce31 wrote: »My TDEE varies from about 2000 to c. 6500 (on very rare occasions) but differences of 1000 - 1500 day to day are very common.
And yet I can maintain, lose or gain without logging my food or doing trend analysis on my weight - so don't get analysis paralysis!
Calculations are just supposed to be a help to get you to the results you want, they aren't an end in themselves.
Question for you.... As you like numbers what would be the worst outcome of increasing your daily allowance by 100cals/day for a month?too chicken to slowly increase up more to see if I can maintain on a higher TDEE
PS - what kind of exercise stops you using the NEAT method?
The vast majority of my exercise estimates don't come from a HRM.
PPS - 7 day moving average as a female who knows they are prone to water fluctuations seems far too short a time period (no pun intended!).
How do you estimate your exercise? Also, I look at the 7 day moving average weights that I log over a 4 week period to see a trend.0 -
leejoyce31 wrote: »My TDEE varies from about 2000 to c. 6500 (on very rare occasions) but differences of 1000 - 1500 day to day are very common.
And yet I can maintain, lose or gain without logging my food or doing trend analysis on my weight - so don't get analysis paralysis!
Calculations are just supposed to be a help to get you to the results you want, they aren't an end in themselves.
Question for you.... As you like numbers what would be the worst outcome of increasing your daily allowance by 100cals/day for a month?too chicken to slowly increase up more to see if I can maintain on a higher TDEE
PS - what kind of exercise stops you using the NEAT method?
The vast majority of my exercise estimates don't come from a HRM.
PPS - 7 day moving average as a female who knows they are prone to water fluctuations seems far too short a time period (no pun intended!).
How do you estimate your exercise?
Main exercise is cycling - Strava or Garmin (both actually tend to estimate low, sometimes very low)
Strength - MFP estimate (it's too low a burn, and impossible to verify anyway, to bother agonising over)
Some suitable gym cardio - Polar HRM
Concept2 rower - calories displayed (I'm close enough to their assumed weight it doesn't really matter), its estimates are pretty good.
WattBike Pro cycle trainer - calories displayed (power meter equipped so as accurate as possible)
Walking - either a phone app (estimates high) or use a standard formula based on distance/weight.
Activities I feel are worth logging - guesswork.
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leejoyce31 wrote: »My TDEE varies from about 2000 to c. 6500 (on very rare occasions) but differences of 1000 - 1500 day to day are very common.
And yet I can maintain, lose or gain without logging my food or doing trend analysis on my weight - so don't get analysis paralysis!
Calculations are just supposed to be a help to get you to the results you want, they aren't an end in themselves.
Question for you.... As you like numbers what would be the worst outcome of increasing your daily allowance by 100cals/day for a month?too chicken to slowly increase up more to see if I can maintain on a higher TDEE
PS - what kind of exercise stops you using the NEAT method?
The vast majority of my exercise estimates don't come from a HRM.
PPS - 7 day moving average as a female who knows they are prone to water fluctuations seems far too short a time period (no pun intended!).
How do you estimate your exercise?
Main exercise is cycling - Strava or Garmin (both actually tend to estimate low, sometimes very low)
Strength - MFP estimate (it's too low a burn, and impossible to verify anyway, to bother agonising over)
Some suitable gym cardio - Polar HRM
Concept2 rower - calories displayed (I'm close enough to their assumed weight it doesn't really matter), its estimates are pretty good.
WattBike Pro cycle trainer - calories displayed (power meter equipped so as accurate as possible)
Walking - either a phone app (estimates high) or use a standard formula based on distance/weight.
Activities I feel are worth logging - guesswork.
Thanks for responding.0 -
If your activity level is fairly consistent, why are you seeing a 50% swing in TDEE from 1300 to 2000? I would look at your average day and target that number, perhaps eating 250 less on quieter days and 250 more on active days.0
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If your activity level is fairly consistent, why are you seeing a 50% swing in TDEE from 1300 to 2000? I would look at your average day and target that number, perhaps eating 250 less on quieter days and 250 more on active days.
As mentioned in my post, I retain lots of fluid due to the BC pill. I'm not going to change anything because I also mentioned in my post that it does not effect my overall trend. Wasn't asking for advice. Was trying to poll to see if any others have issues nailing down TDEE.
Also, eating 250 less calories when I am averaging 1500 calories a day will make me "hangry". No way would I do that. That's 1250 calories on some days.
Thanks0 -
leejoyce31 wrote: »If your activity level is fairly consistent, why are you seeing a 50% swing in TDEE from 1300 to 2000? I would look at your average day and target that number, perhaps eating 250 less on quieter days and 250 more on active days.
As mentioned in my post, I retain lots of fluid due to the BC pill. I'm not going to change anything because I also mentioned in my post that it does not effect my overall trend. Wasn't asking for advice. Was trying to poll to see if any others have issues nailing down TDEE.
Also, eating 250 less calories when I am averaging 1500 calories a day will make me "hangry". No way would I do that. That's 1250 calories on some days.
Thanks
I retain loads of fluid too. Last week Trendweight told me i was gaining 0.3kgs a week, which is BS. I had too many high sodium days plus my TOM was approaching. This week i weigh nearly 6lbs less than last week.
I dont use a HR monitor, i don't trust them. I have the fitbit Alta which tracks my exercise, which is all step based.0 -
It took me a while to determine my TDEE. I do different exercise each day, but when viewed weekly, it is extremely consistent one week to the next. So by keeping my weekly exercise constant, tracking my intake as accurately as I could using a food scale, and tracking my weight trend to eliminate fluctuations, it took 8-10 weeks to figure out my average TDEE. It's really close to what online calculators predict, FWIW. I don't adjust intake based on daily activity. Instead, I go on my weekly average and bank weekend calories.
If you track over several months, the fluctuations will average out. This only works, though, if your exercise is extremely consistent. Good luck figuring it out.
Happy Labor Day to you, too!0 -
It took me a while to determine my TDEE. I do different exercise each day, but when viewed weekly, it is extremely consistent one week to the next. So by keeping my weekly exercise constant, tracking my intake as accurately as I could using a food scale, and tracking my weight trend to eliminate fluctuations, it took 8-10 weeks to figure out my average TDEE. It's really close to what online calculators predict, FWIW. I don't adjust intake based on daily activity. Instead, I go on my weekly average and bank weekend calories.
If you track over several months, the fluctuations will average out. This only works, though, if your exercise is extremely consistent. Good luck figuring it out.
Happy Labor Day to you, too!
Lol. I've been trying to figure it out for over 4 months. The swings in my fluid cause Happy scale and 7 day moving average to vary from 2-3 pounds which messes with my TDEE computation. I think I'm ready to stop trying to figure out and just gradually up my calories. Since maintenance is a range I'm trying to figure out the high end of my range. 1500 is the low end but I think the higher end could be 1800 or close. Just been too chicken to try.0 -
leejoyce31 wrote: »If your activity level is fairly consistent, why are you seeing a 50% swing in TDEE from 1300 to 2000? I would look at your average day and target that number, perhaps eating 250 less on quieter days and 250 more on active days.
As mentioned in my post, I retain lots of fluid due to the BC pill. I'm not going to change anything because I also mentioned in my post that it does not effect my overall trend. Wasn't asking for advice. Was trying to poll to see if any others have issues nailing down TDEE.
Also, eating 250 less calories when I am averaging 1500 calories a day will make me "hangry". No way would I do that. That's 1250 calories on some days.
Thanks
So sorry.0 -
leejoyce31 wrote: »If your activity level is fairly consistent, why are you seeing a 50% swing in TDEE from 1300 to 2000? I would look at your average day and target that number, perhaps eating 250 less on quieter days and 250 more on active days.
As mentioned in my post, I retain lots of fluid due to the BC pill. I'm not going to change anything because I also mentioned in my post that it does not effect my overall trend. Wasn't asking for advice. Was trying to poll to see if any others have issues nailing down TDEE.
Also, eating 250 less calories when I am averaging 1500 calories a day will make me "hangry". No way would I do that. That's 1250 calories on some days.
Thanks
So sorry.
Nothing to be sorry about. It's all good. 0 -
Have you tried recording your weight daily but looking at a rolling average of the #days in your cycle, e.g. 28 on BC, I would guess? That way the weird spikes and drops average out, if hormones are part of what's making a clear read difficult.0
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Does a 28-day moving average smooth out the fluctuations?0
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leejoyce31 wrote: »Although, I can't use NEAT because I have no way to estimate my calories burned during exercise, TDEE is such a moving target. I don't use the HRM's, which is why I don't think NEAT will work for me.
I genuinely don't understand this line of thinking. I'm not saying this to pick on you and you're far from the only person who thinks this way. What confuses me is: if it's too hard to estimate how many calories you burned in one workout, how will you get any more accurate by estimating for a whole week, including several workouts? I've never trusted the whole concept of TDEE, and that's a big part of why. (Another is that I don't keep doing the same things over and over again.)
I've always had better results with NEAT. Even with estimates.1 -
NorthCascades wrote: »leejoyce31 wrote: »Although, I can't use NEAT because I have no way to estimate my calories burned during exercise, TDEE is such a moving target. I don't use the HRM's, which is why I don't think NEAT will work for me.
I genuinely don't understand this line of thinking. I'm not saying this to pick on you and you're far from the only person who thinks this way. What confuses me is: if it's too hard to estimate how many calories you burned in one workout, how will you get any more accurate by estimating for a whole week, including several workouts? I've never trusted the whole concept of TDEE, and that's a big part of why. (Another is that I don't keep doing the same things over and over again.)
I've always had better results with NEAT. Even with estimates.
You can't pick on me. You don't know me. Nor do I care if you understand how I think. I don't understand how you think either. Have a blessed day!0 -
I'm curious... What is your exercise routine?0
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