Those who go back to cutting (from maintenance or from bulk) ...come chat

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Sued0nim
Sued0nim Posts: 17,456 Member
in Health and Weight Loss
I understand CICO and some of the science. Don't go there please. I am interested in the personal, anecdotal psychological issues behind returning to a cut

I know me. I know how I act and react in 80% of situations. I have decades of history of yo-yo dieting and each effective method of achieving CICO to defecit and weight loss has proved ineffective long term (except calorie counting) but more importantly and the point of my thread I have been unable to return to each method a second time and experience similar success

I put it down to psychology...I know it and I know the cheat parts and I don't commit as though I was learning something new so it doesn't work

So I've been big on not letting go of calorie counting ..the weighing and logging (whether here or other web based data sites) and I've had successful 2 year maintenance

Have a minor weight creep, am 0.6lbs above my comfortable 5lb weight range (yes it's not much but I've been sitting top end for a couple of weeks since transatlantic holiday and the expected flushing away of flight and vacation water weight has not yet occurred)

So I thought an ickle cut ..125 to 250 ..and my self doubts are high again (psychological not practical) ...my commitment is a bit meh ...yeah I know, I've said it often enough commit or kitten off

How do you get back to a cut ? What's the psychological process for you? If it's Nike slogan that's nice but not interesting

<early morning insufficient caffeine ramblings...I do this once in a while :)>



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  • Sued0nim
    Sued0nim Posts: 17,456 Member
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    Looking at my history there's a clear culprit in that I started a new job in September and while I was running round for a couple of weeks my activity and purposeful exercise has dropped ...but not my appetite.

    So I know the why which means I also know the solution ..just the putting it into practice part is psychologically evading me ..
  • Sued0nim
    Sued0nim Posts: 17,456 Member
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    That's nice Sue

    Yeah I thought so

    So stop dicking around and commit you kitten

    What did I say about no Nike slogans?

  • queenliz99
    queenliz99 Posts: 15,317 Member
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    Your CO side of the equation needs a little kick in the *kitten*! Yes?
  • middlehaitch
    middlehaitch Posts: 8,483 Member
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    You crossed the Atlantic and didn't visit me :'(

    Ok to the problem at hand.

    I have only lost weight once, so can't really identify with yoyo dieting and those particular mind games.

    (I am not going into my stats 'cos I think you know them- they're irrelevant anyway)

    I have gone over and under my maintenance range a handful of times in my six years of maintenance and once purposefully gone below- trip to India, the foooood.

    Right now (well all summer) I am toying with dropping just a couple of pounds to try a bulk. I just can't get the inspiration for this the same as I did for India.

    I think, for me the circumstances and time line makes the difference. I can choose when to try a bulk so I am waffling and quaffing the vino collapso.

    For the trip to India I had time lines and boundaries, floaty clothes bought, and money paid. This meant that I shaved portions and upped the exercise a little so I could get the most out of the trip. I didn't feel any hardship doing it.

    Fortunately, unfortunately, I am happy with myself and my slowww recomp is satisfying me, and challenging me, most of the time. The bulk is a vanity bulk (have you ever heard anything so silly) and not urgent so I feel the deprivation more and keep backsliding.

    It is all a mind game, and although the majority of my journey has been a quiet and private one with only self motivation propelling me forward, sometimes I just don't get my *kitten* together as well as others.

    There, I have nattered on forever and have no solution except to say-
    if determination is needed for the big jobs, maybe a little motivation is needed for the little ones.

    Cheers, h.
  • Francl27
    Francl27 Posts: 26,372 Member
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    OP you've probably seen my posts and I'm struggling a lot with this! I actually do great for a couple weeks then hormones kick in and my willpower goes out of the window. Then I have to try to get back on track and there are always temptations (it's been a bad couple weeks for me!). So I constantly lose and gain a few pounds (unfortunately I'm in the 'gain' part right now).

    It's definitely a mind game. I think that the main issue is that when you start, you clearly have a lot of reasons to, so it's pretty motivating... plus with more fat, you're less hungry overall (in my experience)... vanity pounds? Not so much.

    What I do is set a low goal. I'm less likely to have an extra granola bar at 3pm if I see that I have 500 calories left instead of 700 for dinner.. and more often than not I'll still be satisfied after dinner and stick to my calories. Then I don't feel too bad if I have a special treat or am hungrier a couple times that week.
  • RoxieDawn
    RoxieDawn Posts: 15,488 Member
    edited October 2016
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    I am kinda spilling this out as I have not had coffee yet and its pretty early in my neck of the woods..

    It takes me forever to get back into a cut mentally and psychically. I like food way too much.. But once I get past the 1 - 2 weeks of missing those extra calories I can get sorted out and actually a little comfortable again if that's what you want to call it. Not really..

    I am cutting now (I do have a planned bulk two weeks, my third bulk).. it took me forever to get to losing again this time. I cheated my self in the beginning 1 to 1 1/ 2 months by not logging a few things here the first month and there I was thinking I was keeping my deficit in check.. yeah right..

    I put time lines on things this time. I have the next 5 months planned out.. I am running in a /2 marathon (fully committed) so things are based around that training.. If I waste one or two or three weeks, that pushes the goals out too far and I am at an age where I can't make up for lost time by being too lapsed and then doing something aggressive to make up for lost time. I do need slow and steady and consistency and a road map to follow. Mind you I have never planned anything 5 months in advance.. still working on that.. LOL

    Once I got past the hump I am fine.. seeing results keeps me going.. but getting to that point sucks. Even today I want to rebel as I have two weeks left.. I think my determination this time around is much better.. I turned another year older last month, and I realized I will be 50 soon. :)
  • bioklutz
    bioklutz Posts: 1,365 Member
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    I went from maintenance to a small cut because I was sick of recomp. I wanted to bulk but wanted to get my body fat a little lower before bulking. I think because I had a goal to work for it didn't really seem that bothersome. The last month though was not pleasant. My weight fluctuations were all over the place - it was hard to figure out what was going on. Normally a few days before my period the scale spikes up. Instead it spiked down. My workouts were also tanking.

    I was also trying to lose a few pounds not because I needed to - but just to get my body fat down a little lower. My thighs are pretty fat compared to my bony upper body. Funny though - now that I am eating in a slight surplus I swear my legs look much more muscular! (it might be wishful thinking or maybe the water weight gain has leveled out so they don't look as puffy)
  • snowflake954
    snowflake954 Posts: 8,399 Member
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    So many of us have this problem and, as you know, it's the devil to fix. SideSteel just replied to a poster with an interesting take on this problem. See what you think---Oh and when you find the solution, please let me know. B)
  • dragon_girl26
    dragon_girl26 Posts: 2,187 Member
    edited October 2016
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    I'm working through this, too. Last week I said I'd cut..by the end of it, I wound up at maintenance (okay, maybe actually a little over) and said screw it, I'll try again next week. Been on that kick for..I dunno...2 months now? I've restarted cuts again several times but damn it's hard the first few weeks. I think it's that "ugh, this again..when can I just be DONE" feeling. To be honest, I don't know how I managed to go back to the cuts each time. Somehow I just do. That's super hepful, right? Haha.
    Maybe I sometimes just have commitment issues; other times the tIming just seems to fit better.
  • SingingSingleTracker
    SingingSingleTracker Posts: 1,866 Member
    edited October 2016
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    Sued0nim wrote: »
    How do you get back to a cut? What's the psychological process for you? If it's Nike slogan that's nice but not interesting.

    That's a good question that we all must face from time to time - especially if we do creep up above our comfortable fluctuation range.

    I've got a list of talking points to kick my Id, Super Ego, and Ego into some sort of a coordinated action to begin the cut again.

    • Biological father just passed away at 79 after years of a battle with heart disease. (I'm committed to avoiding that in my own life as best I can by controlling what it is I can control: keeping waistline as trim and slim as I can, eating cholesterol lowering foods, and continuing with good exercise habits - all items he avoided at my age.)

    • My comfortable fluctuation range is up to 8% of my ideal racing weight which seems to happen during every off season (October - January). When I get near reaching the top of that 8% gain range, the psychological process involves the usual shift in eating habits. After enjoying all the eating I did in my 4 off season months, I turn the ship around which does involve about a month of screaming, crying, kicking, and ranting - but I do it. January - April is the cut phase, or rather my surly months.

    • Related to the second kick point above, weight is an issue for my enjoyment of racing a bicycle. The more one weighs, the more one has to carry up the hill. Knowing that extra weight reduces any competitive advantage that I may have (which isn't much, believe me B) ) is enough of a solid psychological kicking point to start the cut again so I am not carrying excess weight on my body's frame.

    • Fitting into my wardrobe is also a major psychological kicking point. When the pants get tight - that's the end of the line. The ship turns around to get me back into my comfortable fluctuation range.

    • And finally, without it being a huge narcissistic thing - who doesn't like to look and feel good? The energy levels, confidence, and enjoyment of life when in your ideal weight range is a huge boost to one's life. Having been out of that comfortable ideal weight range for about a decade of my life - I don't want to be there ever again. It's so much better being in the comfortable fluctuation range that it acts as a huge psychological boost to initiate a cut when needed.

    You will need to develop your own list of kick points and live by them if that is important to you.
  • Francl27
    Francl27 Posts: 26,372 Member
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    You know, energy levels... I'm at my best after the days when I eat too much! My workouts start to suck when I go back to a deficit. So it's not exactly a great motivator for me.

    But clothes... yeah, definitely. That's where I draw the line.

    Honestly for me it just comes down to willpower to resist treats and dessert. So it's much harder around Holidays and birthdays and such... I always carry a small deficit but half of it is easily wiped off if we decide to go out for dinner on Friday or something (I'm always hungry during the day and rarely have more than 400-500 calories left for dinner - good luck finding something filling for that amount of calories at most restaurants).
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,874 Member
    edited October 2016
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    I've put on about 10lbs since we returned from our vacation in Colombia at the end of May...a substantive amount of that is due to the fact that I've been on IR for about 12 weeks and unable to cycle or lift, but it's also due to letting things go a bit with summer time fun.

    I don't log as it takes a toll on my mental health and where health and wellness is concerned, I'm all about the whole package...mental, physical, and spiritual.

    For one, I'll be able to get back on the bike and back to the weight room next week (fingers crossed)...this will of course help things immensely. A part of me is ready to rock and roll, but another part of me is like, "man...it's been nice just coming home from work and cracking open a cold one and chilling on the patio." It's kind of weird, but what really helps me in this regard is to right down my training schedule...what I'll be doing and when I'll be doing it...for whatever reason, when I right it down it sort of seals the deal for me...I guess it's kind of like signing a contract or something from a psychological standpoint.

    Where diet is concerned, I just have to tweak things...like I said, I don't log so I just have to look at what I'm doing on the daily and tweak it. One of the things I've written down and committed to starting next week is no alcohol during the week...this alone will cut a substantive amount of calories...I've contracted myself to eight weeks of this. I've also contracted with myself to no weekend splurges...both my wife and I are pretty tight during the week, but we do pretty much whatever on the weekends...not really a big deal when I'm maintaining and able to train...more of an issue when I'm trying to cut weight.

    Pretty much that is all I've decided to do from a dietary standpoint as my diet overall is pretty tight but will reassess in a few weeks as per my results. In addition to basically writing out this contract to myself, I have let my wife know of my intentions...she has no qualms about being like, "WTF...why are you drinking a beer...you said you weren't drinking during the week." I have also let my buddy/coach know what's going on so he'll be monitoring Strava to make sure I'm getting in my miles and he owns the gym so he'll be expecting me on gym days...he also has no qualms about slapping me upside the head...and/or changing my training protocol as he sees fit...often he will text me out of the blue to see what I had for breakfast or lunch or whatever...he's an excellent resource for staying the course.

    ETA: I know you said no Nike slogans or whatever...but yeah...these do help me along too...

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    957988567-motivational-weight-lifting-quotes-1.jpg

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  • VintageFeline
    VintageFeline Posts: 6,771 Member
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    I'm not really totally in the same place as i have yet to reach maintenance. BUT, I am having some compliance issues at the moment and maintaining my desired deficit. Part of it is heavily in the psychology of being close to the smallest dress size I have ever been as an adult, even when I was a super fit dance student. I think there's a little devil on my shoulder saying this is a huge accomplishment in itself and I can chill a bit now. This week it almost totally turned to custard, no workouts, no logging (though I haven't lost total control which is nice).

    I know that come Monday I just need to get my backside back in gear and get back to it but it is hard to convince the niggly part of me to do it. I of course have the added complication of wildly fluctuating mental health which has been a massive hindrance this year in particular.

    I'm fine going slowly but don't want to grind to a halt with still a bit of a ways to go really. Being in a deficit for the best part of 18 months is also hard to sustain when you can't make much progress fitness wise due to the deficit but taking an extended break isn't something I want to do either.

    I'm just waffling really but this is a conundrum for sure and another one I'll face at some point when I switch to recomp or want to cut further in future.
  • VintageFeline
    VintageFeline Posts: 6,771 Member
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    My new wondering is switching my goals to maintain and just seeing what the green number is at the end of the day. I don't know if this would be any more effective than when I manually shaved 100 calories per day off my goal to allow me not to be quite so hard with logging (that didn't really work, I seem to eat the same at the moment regardless!).

    It is really interesting trying to work out the psychology of it all though because that's really what it boils down to at this point. Health risks all but eliminated it is entirely down to vanity (though I'm not quite a healthy BMI yet my waist is well within what is deemed healthy) and motivation for that can for some of us not be quite as strong a pull perhaps?
  • GottaBurnEmAll
    GottaBurnEmAll Posts: 7,722 Member
    edited October 2016
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    VintageFeline wrote: »
    My new wondering is switching my goals to maintain and just seeing what the green number is at the end of the day. I don't know if this would be any more effective than when I manually shaved 100 calories per day off my goal to allow me not to be quite so hard with logging (that didn't really work, I seem to eat the same at the moment regardless!).

    It is really interesting trying to work out the psychology of it all though because that's really what it boils down to at this point. Health risks all but eliminated it is entirely down to vanity (though I'm not quite a healthy BMI yet my waist is well within what is deemed healthy) and motivation for that can for some of us not be quite as strong a pull perhaps?

    Well, I am in the same boat as you, Vintage Feline, having faffed about with being really close to the finish line (I'm down very much to vanity pounds at this point as I am at a healthy BMI) and going back and forth with compliance issues to going all out to going too far off the deep end to rebounding with binging. It's been a wild ride.

    My weight loss has slowed to a once every month event, and I got some very wise advise to just eat maintenance calories for my goal weight and let the scale settle where it will.

    Maybe you could try that?

    Edit: As for the larger questions in this thread? I dunno. I haven't been able to pull my own head together about why I've held it together for 92 pounds but seem to be losing it over the end game so badly and get knuckled down for it. Perhaps because it's just window dressing? I already have the new size 0 wardrobe. I'm wearing XS. There's no dangling carrot except marginally thinner thighs and a slightly flatter stomach.

    Maybe it's less incentivizing to work on such a small goal.
  • dragon_girl26
    dragon_girl26 Posts: 2,187 Member
    edited October 2016
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    GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
    VintageFeline wrote: »
    My new wondering is switching my goals to maintain and just seeing what the green number is at the end of the day. I don't know if this would be any more effective than when I manually shaved 100 calories per day off my goal to allow me not to be quite so hard with logging (that didn't really work, I seem to eat the same at the moment regardless!).

    It is really interesting trying to work out the psychology of it all though because that's really what it boils down to at this point. Health risks all but eliminated it is entirely down to vanity (though I'm not quite a healthy BMI yet my waist is well within what is deemed healthy) and motivation for that can for some of us not be quite as strong a pull perhaps?

    Well, I am in the same boat as you, Vintage Feline, having faffed about with being really close to the finish line (I'm down very much to vanity pounds at this point as I am at a healthy BMI) and going back and forth with compliance issues to going all out to going too far off the deep end to rebounding with binging. It's been a wild ride.

    My weight loss has slowed to a once every month event, and I got some very wise advise to just eat maintenance calories for my goal weight and let the scale settle where it will.

    Maybe you could try that?

    Edit: As for the larger questions in this thread? I dunno. I haven't been able to pull my own head together about why I've held it together for 92 pounds but seem to be losing it over the end game so badly and get knuckled down for it. Perhaps because it's just window dressing? I already have the new size 0 wardrobe. I'm wearing XS. There's no dangling carrot except marginally thinner thighs and a slightly flatter stomach.

    Maybe it's less incentivizing to work on such a small goal.
    I think there is some good sense here. When I was plus sized (20-22) and obese, my focus was on not being plus size, not feeling awful,not having higher blood pressure, etc....
    Now that I'm within 15 lbs of my goal and a size 8-10, it seems less pressing to hit that goal. I'm not yet in the healthy BMI range...about 8 lbs from it, but I'm not terribly unhappy with what I see in the mirror. I'm more confident. Plus, it seems like a heck of a lot of work to keep a 250 calorie deficit just to see 1-2 lbs a month come off the scale. I hate the feeling that I am shorting out at the finish line, yet the pressing motivators and the huge payoffs are no longer there to inspire me.

    Plus, sometimes I just wanna come home and lay around and eat alllll the cookies...

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