Dieter's Edema and Zig-Zagging calories

Verity1111

A couple articles on this at the end...but I am becoming a true believer in this. Basically, the idea is that if you eat at a high deficit for a certain period of time, your body might stall for different reasons. Some believe the lost fat may be temporarily replaced by excess water retention and then randomly fall off. Some theorize that eating at maintenance for a day here or there can help combat this. I am stalled right now and the last time I was I ate a bit more than usual and then found my weight dropped the next day. So I will be trying that again, but I started wondering if there is an actual name for this...some people refer to this as dieter's edema. I am wondering if anyone else has had experiences similar to mine that might make them question if this is a real thing. Zig Zagging calories is basically keeping the same average calories for the week, but altering day to day (1200, 1400, 1800, 1200, for 4 days still averages to 1400, for example)

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjvt-Kh1OXQAhUD3GMKHScPAQ0QFggiMAE&url=http://www.vincedelmontefitness.com/blog/419/why-diets-stop-working/&usg=AFQjCNGj4mCLMYCHUR0TZLGq-ZI_q2jByg&sig2=uVBX1NIzuILU7pQRtJZa9g&bvm=bv.141320020,d.cGc

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/of-whooshes-and-squishy-fat.html/

seska422

I tend to be whooshy but that doesn't matter because I'm playing the long game. My overall trend over months is downward and that's all that matters. Whooshs or not, a sustained calorie deficit will get you there in the end.

As for zig-zagging, go for it if it helps sustain a deficit over time. It's the deficit that matters, not how you get there.

Weight loss is a marathon, not a sprint.

cwolfman13

Eating at a high deficit for a long period of time is going to jack around with hormones...your metabolism is driven by hormones and yes, your metabolism will dial down (adaptive thermogenesis).

Diet breaks and refeeds help to re-establish hormonal balance.

Verity1111

cwolfman13 wrote: »

Eating at a high deficit for a long period of time is going to jack around with hormones...your metabolism is driven by hormones and yes, your metabolism will dial down (adaptive thermogenesis).

Diet breaks and refeeds help to re-establish hormonal balance.

Love this information! Thank you! People look at me funny when I say I am going to eat more so I will pass a plateau, but it almost always works.

lemurcat12

That super low cal mostly protein Lyle McDonald thing that people were talking about in the other thread is based on the theory that you should only do very low cal for a short period of time (how short depends on fat to lose) and then take a diet break, but I doubt that zig zagging calories in a way that maintains an average very high deficit would matter.

Verity1111

lemurcat12 wrote: »

That super low cal mostly protein Lyle McDonald thing that people were talking about in the other thread is based on the theory that you should only do very low cal for a short period of time (how short depends on fat to lose) and then take a diet break, but I doubt that zig zagging calories in a way that maintains an average very high deficit would matter.

It has helped me in the past (zig zagging) but I cant speak for everyone and it could have been a coincidence.

lightenup2016

Yes, I've experienced the whoosh effect after eating high calories for a couple of days following a deficit period. This has happened once by chance, and then again when I did it deliberately. I assumed this was loss of the dieter's edema I've read about. It's true that over time it all evens out, but I have to say that if you're in a stall, losing that extra lb or two from a "refeed" or whatever you want to call it, sure can give back your confidence and motivation!

Verity1111

lightenup2016 wrote: »

Yes, I've experienced the whoosh effect after eating high calories for a couple of days following a deficit period. This has happened once by chance, and then again when I did it deliberately. I assumed this was loss of the dieter's edema I've read about. It's true that over time it all evens out, but I have to say that if you're in a stall, losing that extra lb or two from a "refeed" or whatever you want to call it, sure can give back your confidence and motivation!

Yes it can so here is hoping! lol. I really do think it's a legitimate issue people have and eating high and breaking from exercise a day has helped before so I am counting on it to help again. Lol.

trigden1991

lemurcat12 wrote: »

That super low cal mostly protein Lyle McDonald thing that people were talking about in the other thread is based on the theory that you should only do very low cal for a short period of time (how short depends on fat to lose) and then take a diet break, but I doubt that zig zagging calories in a way that maintains an average very high deficit would matter.

FYI it's called Rapid Fat Loss (aka RFL).

In response to the OP, if you are in a deficit, you are losing weight. Whether the scale shows it or not is a different matter. Water weight does not mean you have not lost the fat so just keep going. It is crazy to induce "wooshes" by eating higher carbs or at maintenance just to see the scale move.

lemurcat12

trigden1991 wrote: »

lemurcat12 wrote: »

That super low cal mostly protein Lyle McDonald thing that people were talking about in the other thread is based on the theory that you should only do very low cal for a short period of time (how short depends on fat to lose) and then take a diet break, but I doubt that zig zagging calories in a way that maintains an average very high deficit would matter.

FYI it's called Rapid Fat Loss (aka RFL).

Thanks. I normally know that but was blanking.

lemurcat12

Verity1111 wrote: »

lemurcat12 wrote: »

That super low cal mostly protein Lyle McDonald thing that people were talking about in the other thread is based on the theory that you should only do very low cal for a short period of time (how short depends on fat to lose) and then take a diet break, but I doubt that zig zagging calories in a way that maintains an average very high deficit would matter.

It has helped me in the past (zig zagging) but I cant speak for everyone and it could have been a coincidence.

Whooshing happens, so hard to tell why. If you only care about water weight loss (which I can't understand) taking a few days off exercise will help, IME, as I've seen that, even when keeping my calories low/at the same deficit.

I didn't whoosh at all when I was at a high deficit and had lots to lose -- lost 2-3 lb consistently for a while (which I wouldn't really recommend but since I was quite fat I don't think it was harmful). I started whooshing when I was within the healthy weight zone and aiming for more like 1 lb or less per week. But other people with lots to lose have reported skipping weeks and then losing 5, so it definitely is a thing that varies.

On the hormonal stuff, though, I don't believe your body is easily tricked, so if you are trying to keep a deficit of 1000-1500 (say, a level that is too aggressive for you -- or me, if you prefer), I don't think I could fool my body by eating at an average of 1000 calories (to get such an excessive deficit) but jumping around with a couple of higher days. I think your body would still perceive the huge deficit. Could you manipulate water weight, though? Probably, sure.