Whole Foods- Plant based diet

amandagyeoman

I'm trying 30 days of Plant Based Dieting strictly out of curiosity. And while so far I totally appreciate the benefits I've experienced so early in to this quest, I do wonder if this is how we as humans are supposed to live to be healthy, why must Plant Based/Vegan diets be supplemented with B12? I genuinely want to know - not looking for an argument.

janejellyroll

amandagyeoman wrote: »

I'm trying 30 days of Plant Based Dieting strictly out of curiosity. And while so far I totally appreciate the benefits I've experienced so early in to this quest, I do wonder if this is how we as humans are supposed to live to be healthy, why must Plant Based/Vegan diets be supplemented with B12? I genuinely want to know - not looking for an argument.

This is a really good question and I'm going to approach it from a vegan perspective, not necessarily a plant-based one.

I don't know if we are "supposed" to be plant-based or not. Most primates supplement their plant diet with meat -- either smaller primates, scavenged meats, or insects. Some plant-based/vegan people argue that in a pre-industrial diet, we would receive B12 from soil on our foods. Since food safety is much more important to us today, we are no longer getting it in this form. This would be a good thing, at least in my book -- as the soil would contain a lot of stuff besides the B12 that we wouldn't really want. You will also see some people argue that B12 can be found in some plant foods like seaweeds or fermented foods. I would be extremely skeptical of anyone you see making this claim -- research has actually demonstrated that these are B12 analogs. That is, they *look* like B12, but they don't function as B12 in our body.

So we're back to plant-based/vegan people needing some type of supplement or fortified food in order to ensure they're meeting their need for B12. So are we "supposed" to eat animal foods?

This question is about as relevant to me as the questions "Am I supposed to be wearing eyeglasses?" or "Am I supposed to be communicating with you via computer?" All I need to know is that, in 2017, I have the ability to thrive on a diet without animal products.

But then, I would never argue that we're supposed to be plant-based. I think there are multiple diets that can contribute to health. A diet without animal products can be one of them, but I don't think we're obliged to eliminate animal foods in order to have good health. So maybe I'm not the best target audience for this question.

cwolfman13

Leslierussell4134 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

Leslierussell4134 wrote: »

crzycatlady1 wrote: »

janejellyroll wrote: »

live2dream wrote: »

It's funny when people say it's propaganda. It's facts. The trillion dollar meat and dairy industry is the real propaganda. You can't turn on the TV or walk/drive down the street without being inundated with ads promoting it, and then the next commercial is pharmaceuticals. Why are people so sick? Hmmmm I wonder. Hint: it's not the plant foods.

I have a group on here - Happy herbivores. The only thing we sell is good vibes - for free http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/group/45-happy-herbivores

Feel free to join for advice. We'd love to have you.

I'm really uncomfortable with the idea that going plant-based or vegan is some sort of insurance against illness or that people who are sick should be blamed for their illnesses. Virginia Messina says it better than I do (as usual).

"Disease shaming alienates and ostracizes people. Vegans may be afraid to share their diagnosis with others. They may not ask for much-needed support because they worry about feeling judged. Some may be reluctant to admit that they have chosen conventional treatment for their cancer instead of trying to cure it through some raw, low-fat, alkaline, whole foods vegan diet. But, there is no evidence that any particular diet, whole foods plant-based or otherwise, can cure cancer. Believe it or not (sorry, Hippocrates) sometimes you have to let medicine be thy medicine."

http://www.theveganrd.com/2014/12/vegan-diets-cancer-and-disease-shaming.html

I've read a couple of her books and while I'm not a vegan I really respect her. Solid stuff

There actually is evidence that certain foods slow down the various stages of cancer development, there most certainly is. You said you read the book, but don't want to go there for whatever reason. That is precisely the research that many doctors have to acknowledge when assessing treatment of certain cancers. I'm not saying I don't respect anyone's decision for eating an omnivorous diet, however I am a woman of science and I cannot deny the evidence. Animal proteins have been found to increase the rate and mass of certain cancers. Plant protein has been shown to slow and haunt growth at various stages...I'm doing it...I'm citing Dr. Campbell book, The China Study.

so your lone citation is one book that has been debunked?

No actually, I work with many healthcare professionals, Chemo and infusion, and have seen a lot on the topic first hand. Just because I reference one book, doesn't mean it was one study, this is research that started in the 60's, and now has been implemented into numerous universities and nutritional education programs.
No more on the topic, if you feel you are informed, great, that's your decision. Just keep being informed and having an open mind.
I used to knock vegans and swore I didn't want to take a supplement for something I could just eat...b12 blah blah blah. My mind changed the more I dug into the science, there are numerous funded vegan studies happening right now, not just this "one book."

Lol..."keep an open mind"...yours is so open?

Nobody is knocking being vegan...I have no problems with people being vegan for ethical reasons...I have problems when people get all preachy and then proceed to further fear monger. Again...look at blue zone regions of the world...they eat very healthy diets consisting of all macros...plenty of complex carbs and veg and fruit, healthy fats, and they include meat in their diets to some degree or another...some of the healthiest cultures in the world.

crzycatlady1

cwolfman13 wrote: »

Leslierussell4134 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

Leslierussell4134 wrote: »

crzycatlady1 wrote: »

janejellyroll wrote: »

live2dream wrote: »

It's funny when people say it's propaganda. It's facts. The trillion dollar meat and dairy industry is the real propaganda. You can't turn on the TV or walk/drive down the street without being inundated with ads promoting it, and then the next commercial is pharmaceuticals. Why are people so sick? Hmmmm I wonder. Hint: it's not the plant foods.

I have a group on here - Happy herbivores. The only thing we sell is good vibes - for free http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/group/45-happy-herbivores

Feel free to join for advice. We'd love to have you.

I'm really uncomfortable with the idea that going plant-based or vegan is some sort of insurance against illness or that people who are sick should be blamed for their illnesses. Virginia Messina says it better than I do (as usual).

"Disease shaming alienates and ostracizes people. Vegans may be afraid to share their diagnosis with others. They may not ask for much-needed support because they worry about feeling judged. Some may be reluctant to admit that they have chosen conventional treatment for their cancer instead of trying to cure it through some raw, low-fat, alkaline, whole foods vegan diet. But, there is no evidence that any particular diet, whole foods plant-based or otherwise, can cure cancer. Believe it or not (sorry, Hippocrates) sometimes you have to let medicine be thy medicine."

http://www.theveganrd.com/2014/12/vegan-diets-cancer-and-disease-shaming.html

I've read a couple of her books and while I'm not a vegan I really respect her. Solid stuff

There actually is evidence that certain foods slow down the various stages of cancer development, there most certainly is. You said you read the book, but don't want to go there for whatever reason. That is precisely the research that many doctors have to acknowledge when assessing treatment of certain cancers. I'm not saying I don't respect anyone's decision for eating an omnivorous diet, however I am a woman of science and I cannot deny the evidence. Animal proteins have been found to increase the rate and mass of certain cancers. Plant protein has been shown to slow and haunt growth at various stages...I'm doing it...I'm citing Dr. Campbell book, The China Study.

so your lone citation is one book that has been debunked?

No actually, I work with many healthcare professionals, Chemo and infusion, and have seen a lot on the topic first hand. Just because I reference one book, doesn't mean it was one study, this is research that started in the 60's, and now has been implemented into numerous universities and nutritional education programs.
No more on the topic, if you feel you are informed, great, that's your decision. Just keep being informed and having an open mind.
I used to knock vegans and swore I didn't want to take a supplement for something I could just eat...b12 blah blah blah. My mind changed the more I dug into the science, there are numerous funded vegan studies happening right now, not just this "one book."

Lol..."keep an open mind"...yours is so open?

Nobody is knocking being vegan...I have no problems with people being vegan for ethical reasons...I have problems when people get all preachy and then proceed to further fear monger. Again...look at blue zone regions of the world...they eat very healthy diets consisting of all macros...plenty of complex carbs and veg and fruit, healthy fats, and they include meat in their diets to some degree or another...some of the healthiest cultures in the world.

The ironic thing is there's another thread going right now where someone is starting a keto diet because she's read that it will prevent cancer and other diseases. But it's pretty much the opposite of a plant based woe. So which one is actually the One True Way? The misinformation and fearmongering makes your head spin

cross2bear

KeepRunningFatboy wrote: »

I lost over 100 pounds with a WFPB diet and exercise. I started it for health reasons but as I became more immersed and informed I transitioned to full vegan. Get informed and make a decision that is right for you. The world is full of negativity and critics; seek your path, find peace, pursue compassion.

I lost over 100lbs without the WFPB diet or exercise. I started for health reasons and as I became more immersed and informed I found eating a variety of food in my diet satisfied me and met my health goals. Get informed and make a decision that is right for you. The world is full of negativity and critics; seek your path, find peace, pursue compassion.