Welcome to Debate Club! Please be aware that this is a space for respectful debate, and that your ideas will be challenged here. Please remember to critique the argument, not the author.
Why fit = slim?
beatricegasti
Posts: 1 Member
Why everywhere I go, healthy and fit must equal skinny? I don't have a weight problem, I don't need to lose weight, but every app and website tries to starve me in order to give me a "healthier" diet. Setting myfitnesspal to "gain / maintain" weight does little to nothing, the app still marks in red the calories that would help me gain weight and in green when I'd lose weight, and the blog posts are still adressed to people who want to be skinnier instead of, say, become stronger, or get more muscle mass. What can I do to get healthier without going dangerously underweight and put my health in peril?
1
Replies
-
I don't correlate fit with Skinny, or healthy with Skinny. You can be fit and healthy at different sizes, and different bf %'s. There is plenty of info out there about being fit and healthy, or gaining muscle without the need to lose weight. No one is trying to "starve" you to be Skinny or healthy.
At the end of the day, you choose how you want to look, and what you put in your mouth. Your definition of healthy would be different to mine, and you should eat accordingly if you're trying to be the healthiest version of yourself. You can eat at "maintenance" level, or above, whilst eating predominantly "healthy" foods, no one is restricting your intake... with that comes the potential to put on excess body fat. There is increased issues with being overweight and underweight, neither is ideal.
0 -
Skinny is a negative term to me, suggests underweight and under-trained which to me sounds unhealthy rather than healthy. Some people regard the term as a positive and aspirational aim, I'm just not one of them!
You have control over your destiny and the choices you make on how you live / eat / exercise.What can I do to get healthier without going dangerously underweight and put my health in peril?
The colour of numbers on a web or phone app have zero power over me and shouldn't have any power over you.
You choose your calorie goal too, the app is a only a tool and it's up to you how you use it.
The majority of people here are probably seeking weight loss despite the "fitness" part of the site name so the blog posts reflect that. Pick and choose what you read. The quality of the articles on here is really poor too IMHO.
I mostly lurk in the weight maintenance and fitness forums on here as the subjects of interest to me. You can also join groups that reflect your interests.
I wouldn't always link the two things, there's a general link but not a universal link.Why fit = slim?
There's plenty of elite fitness level athletes who aren't slim - where strength and power are bigger parts of their chosen sports compared to power to weight ratio or speed for example.
At an everyday levels even when I was 30lbs overweight (fat in other words!) I had higher than average fitness levels but now I'm what I regard as my best weight my fitness levels are much higher.
9 -
Because it's hard to be fit when you're 50 pounds overweight from fat? And the MFP app will not try to make you starve or underweight, it does exactly what you tell it to do, it's just a piece of software.21
-
I don't get that impression in general or from this website at all. The fact of the matter is that the majority of the population is far from fit; they are grossly overweight. Due to that fact, of course the blog posts are going to be addressed to the majority of MFP's userbase. There are plenty of fit people here or people who use MFP to maintain or even gain weight, but the majority are still using the site/app to lose weight.
The green/red numbers are not a big deal. If your goal on MFP is to maintain, of course you're going to see the red font when you go over your goals because the site is telling you that the action of eating over your calorie allotment will hinder the goal you set for yourself. The same with gaining weight; it will only go red when you eat over the surplus you already set for yourself. The green for being under gives you the green light to eat a little more if you want but is letting you know you're okay. It's not trying to starve you. If so, the food diary wouldn't issue a warning when you close it out eating less than 1200 calories.
As written above, in the end it's just a website/app. It's up to the individual to control their own health and decide how much influence something does or doesn't have.6 -
What's seen as "slim" is actually a normal and healthy body fat level.
4 -
CipherZero wrote: »What's seen as "slim" is actually a normal and healthy body fat level.
"regularly downing a pizza for "fuel" before lifting isn't going to give you the muscle you desire"
21 -
CipherZero wrote: »What's seen as "slim" is actually a normal and healthy body fat level.
I like the armpit hair on the bulky guy.18 -
Lots of NFL linemen are pretty fit and aren't skinny. The issue is that media and Hollywood have set this dumb standard for what is perceived as "fit" while being skinny.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
5 -
I'm not sure what your definition of "slim" or "skinny" is...in my mind it's someone with little fat and little in the way of muscle. I know a lot of fit women, including my wife...none of them are "skinny"...they look healthy and vibrant and athletic...they have lower body fat but have muscles so they have a nice physique.1
-
CipherZero wrote: »What's seen as "slim" is actually a normal and healthy body fat level.
The lean and hot guy's hair makes me think it was drawn after Sadik Hadzovic.2 -
OP do you have an eating disorder? It seems rather extreme thought process to jump from 'slim' to 'dangerously underweight' just because your counting calories?0
-
CipherZero wrote: »What's seen as "slim" is actually a normal and healthy body fat level.
I like the armpit hair on the bulky guy.
And the knee braces on the bulky lady... At least she doesn't have armpit hair too...
I don't think that fit necessarily equals slim.... Less fat = more fit than more fat. (did that even make sense?). I know plenty of slim folks who get winded going up stairs. I know a few overweight folks who don't. What's your definition of fit, OP?2 -
OP, what are your stats? And your goals?0
-
beatricegasti wrote: »Why everywhere I go, healthy and fit must equal skinny? I don't have a weight problem, I don't need to lose weight, but every app and website tries to starve me in order to give me a "healthier" diet. Setting myfitnesspal to "gain / maintain" weight does little to nothing, the app still marks in red the calories that would help me gain weight and in green when I'd lose weight, and the blog posts are still adressed to people who want to be skinnier instead of, say, become stronger, or get more muscle mass. What can I do to get healthier without going dangerously underweight and put my health in peril?
Most of the widespread, common mass-media stuff you see on any specialized topic, not just weight loss, is oversimplified, filtered in distorting ways through arbitrary cultural preferences, shored up by platitudes with an inadequate factual foundation, etc. These things are aimed at "the masses" (whatever the heck that is), and mostly exist to sell products, advertising, magazines, etc.
You're not "the masses", you're you, with your own personal goals & needs.
All you can do is recognize this; dig deeper; look for the accurate, well-founded kernels of good info hidden amongst the chaff; seek out information sources that have integrity; learn to recognize those when you see them; and use those rather than the crock'o's*** stuff.
Clarify your own goals. Work on them using the best information you can find. Don't get distracted or annoyed by things like color-coding of goals. Try to feel a sense of glee when you're using a tool in ways other than what the designers may've intended, turning it to achieve your personal goals.
Personally, I've been fat and unfit (obese, inactive); fat and reasonably fit (competitive rower, medaled - not just participation medals! - in races); and now thin and reasonably fit. Personally, I'm finding the latter category the most rewarding, but that's based on my goals and preferences.
What can you do to get healthier without putting your health in danger?- Assess the nutritional quality of your eating, and improve it over time. MFP food logging can be a help here - set some solid macronutrient/micronutrient targets; log; review your diary looking for weak spots; replace foods that don't contribute well to your goals with others you like that have more nutritional benefits.
- You can use the calorie tracking component of MFP to assess how best to maintain your weight while your eating is changing. If you set your MFP profile to maintain, but still lose, manually add calories to your daily goal 100 or so at a time, then wait a couple of weeks to see if you've found the sweet spot of stable weight. If you see red or green or both, but you're hitting your personal targets, just pretend it's Christmas (yay!).
- Find some active pursuits you personally enjoy a lot (sports, exercises, dances, whatever), things that you actively want to do and are inherently motivated to become better at. (This may require trying out a bunch of activities - that can be fun, too.) Once you find the right activity/activities, work on them. After a while, you'll find that some aspect of yourself (strength, flexibility, cardiovascular fitness, balance, . . . .) is a limiting factor in how well you can do activity-X-you-enjoy. Find another relatively fun activity that improves that aspect. Use the fitness forums and others here to help you identify and improve things, reading selectively and ignoring irrelevant BS.
At least that's what I'd do.7 -
Just apply common sense. If you don't need to lose weight and you want to get fit and healthy, then eat a healthy diet of sufficient calories to maintain your healthy weight and exercise. Include both aerobic and resistance in your workouts and/or activities.4
-
Read body recomposition threads, and turn off the blog feed on your home page. This site is a tool, and you can use it however you need to.2
-
beatricegasti wrote: »Why everywhere I go, healthy and fit must equal skinny? I don't have a weight problem, I don't need to lose weight, but every app and website tries to starve me in order to give me a "healthier" diet. Setting myfitnesspal to "gain / maintain" weight does little to nothing, the app still marks in red the calories that would help me gain weight and in green when I'd lose weight, and the blog posts are still adressed to people who want to be skinnier instead of, say, become stronger, or get more muscle mass. What can I do to get healthier without going dangerously underweight and put my health in peril?
It's really not hard to figure out. Most fitness apps and blogs are geared toward the majority of people using/reading them and the majority of people need to lose weight.
If you don't need to lose weight then don't use MFP to lose weight. You can set it up for whatever goals you want.
You can also visit blogs and forums dedicated to gaining muscle. There are even some on this very site.1 -
There are likely a few here that know of Eric Esch AKA Butterbean, I couldn't help but think of him reading this thread. He's anything but slim at 5'11" and 425lbs, but I wouldn't dare tell him he's not fit.
I mean, he may not be in the classical sense, I just wouldn't tell him that.
0 -
Lots of NFL linemen are pretty fit and aren't skinny. The issue is that media and Hollywood have set this dumb standard for what is perceived as "fit" while being skinny.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I'm not sure which linemen you think are pretty fit. None of them are skinny. As a group they are highly overweight and tend to die very young. I don't see how that fits anyone's definition of "fit". You can be good at some sports despite being fat but that doesn't make you "fit" or healthy.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=2313476
2 -
There are likely a few here that know of Eric Esch AKA Butterbean, I couldn't help but think of him reading this thread. He's anything but slim at 5'11" and 425lbs, but I wouldn't dare tell him he's not fit.
I mean, he may not be in the classical sense, I just wouldn't tell him that.
If he survives as long as the average overweight American I would be shocked. He can kick butt, he's not at all "fit".
Everyone doesn't need to have "fit" as a goal. If you want to be an NFL lineman or follow in Butterbean's footsteps that's great, but go into it knowing that's not healthy and highly likely to shorten your life.3 -
mburgess458 wrote: »Lots of NFL linemen are pretty fit and aren't skinny. The issue is that media and Hollywood have set this dumb standard for what is perceived as "fit" while being skinny.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I'm not sure which linemen you think are pretty fit. None of them are skinny. As a group they are highly overweight and tend to die very young. I don't see how that fits anyone's definition of "fit". You can be good at some sports despite being fat but that doesn't make you "fit" or healthy.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=2313476
Body weight or being skinny or whatever has nothing to do with being fit...as in able to perform at a high athletic level...that's what being fit is...to do what they do every Sunday, they have to be very physically fit.
There are a lot of elite level marathon and ultra marathon runners who ultimately develop heart issues due to scarring of the heart, etc...but you can't tell me that an ultra marathon runner isn't physically fit.
I think you don't understand the definition of "fit."
8 -
mburgess458 wrote: »Lots of NFL linemen are pretty fit and aren't skinny. The issue is that media and Hollywood have set this dumb standard for what is perceived as "fit" while being skinny.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I'm not sure which linemen you think are pretty fit. None of them are skinny. As a group they are highly overweight and tend to die very young. I don't see how that fits anyone's definition of "fit". You can be good at some sports despite being fat but that doesn't make you "fit" or healthy.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=2313476
Mmmm. how about JJ Watt. 6'6" 285 lbs with 7% body fat. Probably in better shape than 99% of folks who are within that "BMI healthy" range.3 -
beatricegasti wrote: »Why everywhere I go, healthy and fit must equal skinny? I don't have a weight problem, I don't need to lose weight, but every app and website tries to starve me in order to give me a "healthier" diet. Setting myfitnesspal to "gain / maintain" weight does little to nothing, the app still marks in red the calories that would help me gain weight and in green when I'd lose weight, and the blog posts are still adressed to people who want to be skinnier instead of, say, become stronger, or get more muscle mass. What can I do to get healthier without going dangerously underweight and put my health in peril?
Not sure I understand your complaint. You basically punch in some details and your goal (e.g. gain a 1lb a week). MFP then calculates the calories it thinks you need to eat to maintain that goal. If you eat more than those calories you will gain faster than your intended goal isn't this is correct behaviour???0 -
Medically speaking, fit correlates to you fat percentage. So in many people's eyes, with all they see, read, and are told, and sign of fat is "unhealthy", which we know is not the case. The next issue is BMI, which doens't do well either to demonstrate fit. By BMI I am considered overweight but I am an athlete who plays a pretty high level of tennis anywhere from 2-4 hours 3 times a week, plus workouts. Overweight my butt...but that doesn't mean I am skinny. Not by a long shot.0
-
It seems to me that there are many measures of fitness, a large fraction of which are not tightly linked to low body fat: Strength, endurance, resting heart rate, etc. - even speed in some cases, certainly power.
Fitness, BF% and health are interrelated, but not the same thing. If low BF% equaled fitness, starving people would be athletic marvels. And I wouldn't place any bets on their life expectancy.
As an obese person, I was quite a bit fitter than many thin women my age. It'd be harder to argue that I was healthier than a similar number.
1 -
for_ever_young66 wrote: »mburgess458 wrote: »Lots of NFL linemen are pretty fit and aren't skinny. The issue is that media and Hollywood have set this dumb standard for what is perceived as "fit" while being skinny.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I'm not sure which linemen you think are pretty fit. None of them are skinny. As a group they are highly overweight and tend to die very young. I don't see how that fits anyone's definition of "fit". You can be good at some sports despite being fat but that doesn't make you "fit" or healthy.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=2313476
Mmmm. how about JJ Watt. 6'6" 285 lbs with 7% body fat. Probably in better shape than 99% of folks who are within that "BMI healthy" range.
He's one. Look at the vast majority of offensive linemen with their guts hanging out. How would they do on routine fitness tests? Think they can run a few miles?
If you are twice as likely to die before you turn 50 I don't see how that meets anyone's definition of "fit". If you're dead you're not fit.
Are fat NFL linemen more fit than the fat fan sitting on the couch? Sure. That's not a very high bar.1 -
mburgess458 wrote: »for_ever_young66 wrote: »mburgess458 wrote: »Lots of NFL linemen are pretty fit and aren't skinny. The issue is that media and Hollywood have set this dumb standard for what is perceived as "fit" while being skinny.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I'm not sure which linemen you think are pretty fit. None of them are skinny. As a group they are highly overweight and tend to die very young. I don't see how that fits anyone's definition of "fit". You can be good at some sports despite being fat but that doesn't make you "fit" or healthy.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=2313476
Mmmm. how about JJ Watt. 6'6" 285 lbs with 7% body fat. Probably in better shape than 99% of folks who are within that "BMI healthy" range.
He's one. Look at the vast majority of offensive linemen with their guts hanging out. How would they do on routine fitness tests? Think they can run a few miles?
If you are twice as likely to die before you turn 50 I don't see how that meets anyone's definition of "fit". If you're dead you're not fit.
Are fat NFL linemen more fit than the fat fan sitting on the couch? Sure. That's not a very high bar.
JJ Watt is also a defensive end (and a good one) which requires him to be much faster and more agile than say, an offensive lineman.2 -
If you do research, BMI is highly unreliable and was not designed initially to measure what it is used to measure today. It is only somewhat accurate when measure white men of a specific height range, and even then fails to do it's job much of the time. I would recommend killer fat by Natalie Boero it goes over a lot of this.0
-
mburgess458 wrote: »for_ever_young66 wrote: »mburgess458 wrote: »Lots of NFL linemen are pretty fit and aren't skinny. The issue is that media and Hollywood have set this dumb standard for what is perceived as "fit" while being skinny.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I'm not sure which linemen you think are pretty fit. None of them are skinny. As a group they are highly overweight and tend to die very young. I don't see how that fits anyone's definition of "fit". You can be good at some sports despite being fat but that doesn't make you "fit" or healthy.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/news/story?id=2313476
Mmmm. how about JJ Watt. 6'6" 285 lbs with 7% body fat. Probably in better shape than 99% of folks who are within that "BMI healthy" range.
He's one. Look at the vast majority of offensive linemen with their guts hanging out. How would they do on routine fitness tests? Think they can run a few miles?
If you are twice as likely to die before you turn 50 I don't see how that meets anyone's definition of "fit". If you're dead you're not fit.
Are fat NFL linemen more fit than the fat fan sitting on the couch? Sure. That's not a very high bar.
I'd be willing to bet most of them can run more than "a few miles" with few being defined as 3-5.
Mostly because that's one of the things they have to do during training camp and weekly practices.0 -
I have always found chocks with more sold buolds to be far more attractive. That waif fad like kate moss did nothibg for me.0
This discussion has been closed.
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 393.4K Introduce Yourself
- 43.8K Getting Started
- 260.2K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.9K Food and Nutrition
- 47.4K Recipes
- 232.5K Fitness and Exercise
- 426 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.5K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 153K Motivation and Support
- 8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.7K MyFitnessPal Information
- 24 News and Announcements
- 1.1K Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.6K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions