BMR/cals per day,

jusjoking

Help my get my head wrapped around these numbers

5'8" male, 49 yo, 255lbs

plug it into a BMR calculator and get around 2000 cals

currently I work 4 days per week. I drive a stand up forklift so this involves standing on my feet for about 9 hrs per workday and at the end of that day I am totally shot so there are x amount of calories being burned. In general I walk either 1x or 2x per week for about an hour.

If I plug that into "lightly active" it comes to about 2750 to maintain

if I plug it into "moderately active" it comes to about 3100 to maintain

"very active" puts it at 3450 cals to maintain.


So far so good, but now the questions come. Being as i am just starting to cut calories and have lots to lose, should I aim at 3lbs per week loss?

I want to at LEAST drop 2lbs per week. So lets say I use "moderately active" (3100 maintenance) that would put me at 2100 cals per day to lose 2lbs per week. Im pretty sure I can easily do 2100 cals per day.

So what if I were to step up to "very active" (3450 maintenance) and yet eat those same 2100 per day? This would put me averaging a 1350 deficit which supposedly works out to approx 2.7 lbs lost per week

is that too high of a deficit or is that ok since I am just starting and am superfat? (yes, I know I wont die on that deficit lol)

What about a 1500 deficit which would still leave me at 1950 cals per day? That would equate to a 3lb loss per week. too much?

thoughts?

Thanks, JonJon

StaciMarie1974

My understanding is the safe guideline is 1% or 2 pounds per week. At 1% you'd be 2.5 pounds per week. When eating at a deficit you lose fat and lean/muscle mass. The bigger the deficit, the more muscle mass you risk losing. You don't want that.

In addition, figuring our your TDEE is a bit of a guesswork/trial & error. Its a little hard to know if you're burning 2750 or 3450 or something in the middle. If you feel satiated/energetic then try eating around 2000/day and see how that goes for a few weeks. Track your losses over time, adjust if necessary.

Tacklewasher

Be aware of some of the side effects of losing too quickly. The one that has me the most scared is gallstones.

From this page https://www.niddk.nih.gov/health-information/health-topics/weight-control/dieting_gallstones/Pages/dieting-and-gallstones.aspx

"Losing weight very quickly may increase your chances of forming gallstones. If you have silent gallstones, you may also be more likely to develop symptoms. People who lose more than 3 pounds per week may have a greater chance of getting gallstones than those who lose weight more slowly."

I would aim for 2 lbs per week. And I would start at moderately active. So start out eating in the 2000 cal range, and if you do any extra exercise, eat those calories back (at least 1/2). But the best gauge will be how your weight loss averages over 6-8 weeks. If you are losing more than 2 lbs on average, up your calorie intake.

So pretty much what @StaciMarie1974 said.

jusjoking

thanks

yeah, 2000 seems a decent way to start. Even at "moderately active" it puts me at 2lbs per week lose.

Ill start around there and see how it goes

Cheers, JonJon

Theo166

Switch your mind, this isn't a sprint race if you have lots to lose. You need to develop habits you can bring into maintenance and use for many years. The tortoise wins this race, not the hare.

First 1-2 weeks just focus on meal planning and tracking everything you eat. You are going to build self-awareness and 'technique' at the beginning while you get into a rhythm. Start by targeting -1lb a week since going to hard out of the gate can lead to binge eating, which feels like failure.

After you are in a rhythm at -1lb a week, tighten in down in half lb stages. The recommended max is 2 lbs or 1% of weight, so 3lbs is not a good goal - it's too severe for comfort.

jusjoking

Theo166 wrote: »

Switch your mind, this isn't a sprint race if you have lots to lose. You need to develop habits you can bring into maintenance and use for many years. The tortoise wins this race, not the hare.


First 1-2 weeks just focus on meal planning and tracking everything you eat. You are going to build 'technique' at the beginning and get into a rhythm. Start by targeting -1lb a week, going to hard out of the gate can lead to binge eating which feels like failure.

After you are in a rhythm at -1lb a week, tighten in down in stages. The recommended max is 2 lbs or 1% of weight, so 3lbs is not a good goal - it's too severe for comfort.

I hear ya and of course logically I agree. But the flip side of it is that starting off super slow feels like not doing much of anything

I know that fat loss etc will slow as I lose weight, so id feel a little silly aiming at 1 lb/week when im just starting. It should be EASY to lose right now. 1lb to a 260lb guy doesnt even register lol

I hear ya though. The habits and processes are the main part.

TBH, its super depressing to calculate out something like a 1-1.5lb weigh loss plan. For a person who has been fat for a long time, its totally unmotivating to think he can only lose 50lbs in a year

Theo166

jusjoking wrote: »

Theo166 wrote: »

Switch your mind, this isn't a sprint race if you have lots to lose. You need to develop habits you can bring into maintenance and use for many years. The tortoise wins this race, not the hare.


First 1-2 weeks just focus on meal planning and tracking everything you eat. You are going to build 'technique' at the beginning and get into a rhythm. Start by targeting -1lb a week, going to hard out of the gate can lead to binge eating which feels like failure.

After you are in a rhythm at -1lb a week, tighten in down in stages. The recommended max is 2 lbs or 1% of weight, so 3lbs is not a good goal - it's too severe for comfort.

I hear ya and of course logically I agree. But the flip side of it is that starting off super slow feels like not doing much of anything

I know that fat loss etc will slow as I lose weight, so id feel a little silly aiming at 1 lb/week when im just starting. It should be EASY to lose right now. 1lb to a 260lb guy doesnt even register lol

I hear ya though. The habits and processes are the main part.

TBH, its super depressing to calculate out something like a 1-1.5lb weigh loss plan. For a person who has been fat for a long time, its totally unmotivating to think he can only lose 50lbs in a year

I understand you want to muscle through this, but that's not sustainable. I started off at 300lbs targeting ~2100 cal/day and have tightened it down to ~1700/day. I've been averaging over 2lbs a week loss since Jan - the weight comes off quickly at the start.

Going from a surplus that got you fat to a 1lb deficit will be a shock to your body already, you don't want binging to destroy creating new habits and developing your portion control. If you ease into it over a couple weeks, you won't even feel severely deprived. Remember you are really developing habits that you will use for years to come, so it's not a contest.

jusjoking

Theo166 wrote: »

jusjoking wrote: »

Theo166 wrote: »

Switch your mind, this isn't a sprint race if you have lots to lose. You need to develop habits you can bring into maintenance and use for many years. The tortoise wins this race, not the hare.


First 1-2 weeks just focus on meal planning and tracking everything you eat. You are going to build 'technique' at the beginning and get into a rhythm. Start by targeting -1lb a week, going to hard out of the gate can lead to binge eating which feels like failure.

After you are in a rhythm at -1lb a week, tighten in down in stages. The recommended max is 2 lbs or 1% of weight, so 3lbs is not a good goal - it's too severe for comfort.

I hear ya and of course logically I agree. But the flip side of it is that starting off super slow feels like not doing much of anything

I know that fat loss etc will slow as I lose weight, so id feel a little silly aiming at 1 lb/week when im just starting. It should be EASY to lose right now. 1lb to a 260lb guy doesnt even register lol

I hear ya though. The habits and processes are the main part.

TBH, its super depressing to calculate out something like a 1-1.5lb weigh loss plan. For a person who has been fat for a long time, its totally unmotivating to think he can only lose 50lbs in a year

I understand you want to muscle through this, but that's not sustainable. I started off at 300lbs targeting ~2100 cal/day and have tightened it down to ~1700/day. I've been averaging over 2lbs a week loss since Jan - the weight comes off quickly at the start.

Going from a surplus that got you fat to a 1lb deficit will be a shock to your body already, you don't want binging to destroy creating new habits and developing your portion control. If you ease into it over a couple weeks, you won't even feel severely deprived. Remember you are really developing habits that you will use for years to come, so it's not a contest.

How tall are you? at 300lb, 2100/day sounds like more than 2lb/week

I dont think "binging" is a super huge concern for me. With me its been more like just consistently eating too much...every meal. Eating way too big of portions etc. for instance eating the whole can of pringles lol. or eating 3 pieces of dark meat kfc, Amp energy drink, plus chips etc

So its not so much of a "binge" as it is just eating like that all the time. A long term running binge.

pretty sure when the results start coming in that my mental resolve will be strengthened.

2lbs does seem slow though lol. Gonna take 4ever

Tacklewasher

I'm no different than you. Big bag of chips over a couple of night, large pizza spread over 2 days with a 2L of Pepsi. I didn't binge but I constantly overate. I'm 6' and was ~330 lbs (scale didn't go past 300 when I started so I'm not real sure of my start weight). And I lost more than 2 lbs per week for a long time. But I hadn't read about some of the health issues that may be in my future from losing as quick as I did (15 lbs per month for the first 3 months).

But yes, it will take a while to lose it. The goal is not to just lose the weight, but to learn how to eat appropriately so you don't re-gain it in the future. I'm not doing this again, so I need to be sure I can keep it off and if that means it takes a bit longer to lose it, than so be it.

Maybe find a secondary goal, that is fitness related. Plan to run a 5K, or to lift more (whichever you think you will you will hate the least) and try to focus more on that than on the number on the scale.

And with my normal day, at 245 lbs, to lose 1.5 lbs per week I'm at 1730 calories. I sit on my butt all day. Exercise gives me more to eat, but if I didn't exercise that is what I would need to eat.

Theo166

jusjoking wrote: »

Theo166 wrote: »

jusjoking wrote: »

Theo166 wrote: »

Switch your mind, this isn't a sprint race if you have lots to lose. You need to develop habits you can bring into maintenance and use for many years. The tortoise wins this race, not the hare.


First 1-2 weeks just focus on meal planning and tracking everything you eat. You are going to build 'technique' at the beginning and get into a rhythm. Start by targeting -1lb a week, going to hard out of the gate can lead to binge eating which feels like failure.

After you are in a rhythm at -1lb a week, tighten in down in stages. The recommended max is 2 lbs or 1% of weight, so 3lbs is not a good goal - it's too severe for comfort.

I hear ya and of course logically I agree. But the flip side of it is that starting off super slow feels like not doing much of anything

I know that fat loss etc will slow as I lose weight, so id feel a little silly aiming at 1 lb/week when im just starting. It should be EASY to lose right now. 1lb to a 260lb guy doesnt even register lol

I hear ya though. The habits and processes are the main part.

TBH, its super depressing to calculate out something like a 1-1.5lb weigh loss plan. For a person who has been fat for a long time, its totally unmotivating to think he can only lose 50lbs in a year

I understand you want to muscle through this, but that's not sustainable. I started off at 300lbs targeting ~2100 cal/day and have tightened it down to ~1700/day. I've been averaging over 2lbs a week loss since Jan - the weight comes off quickly at the start.

Going from a surplus that got you fat to a 1lb deficit will be a shock to your body already, you don't want binging to destroy creating new habits and developing your portion control. If you ease into it over a couple weeks, you won't even feel severely deprived. Remember you are really developing habits that you will use for years to come, so it's not a contest.

How tall are you? at 300lb, 2100/day sounds like more than 2lb/week

I dont think "binging" is a super huge concern for me. With me its been more like just consistently eating too much...every meal. Eating way too big of portions etc. for instance eating the whole can of pringles lol. or eating 3 pieces of dark meat kfc, Amp energy drink, plus chips etc

So its not so much of a "binge" as it is just eating like that all the time. A long term running binge.

pretty sure when the results start coming in that my mental resolve will be strengthened.

2lbs does seem slow though lol. Gonna take 4ever

My TDEE starting out was 2700/day but I did lose faster than 1lb a week. If you start with -1 but set your activity to 'light', you may be really doing -1.5 because your job is more active. Think of the first couple weeks as your 'warm up' before you get serious. In the beginning you build a lot of self awareness on what works and doesn't for you. Maybe you can comfortably do 2.5lbs a week as well, just ease into it.

Remember, it took us years to put on the weight. It won't come off like in The Biggest Loser, at least not in a healthy manner that we can maintain for years.

jusjoking

Tacklewasher wrote: »

Maybe find a secondary goal, that is fitness related. Plan to run a 5K, or to lift more (whichever you think you will you will hate the least) and try to focus more on that than on the number on the scale.

yeah, that might be a good idea. Pretty sure running is out of the question though lol. never been a runner.

I have done powerlifting before. Squatted 425, bench 325 (315 in competition), deadlifted 445. Those numbers would take a couple years to get back to even if I stayed fat. But while losing weight?? not realistic. And powerlifting takes soooooo long. I used to squat for 90 minutes.

But I could come up with something. maybe something like dips or chinups which losing weight would actually help

mainly I just want to look and feel better. for instance id like to start a youtube channel for my music/guitar playing/singing but lets get real, no one is trying to look at vids of a fat grey bearded middle aged dude lol. So the weight is really holding me back in other areas


Cheers, JJ

StaciMarie1974

Don't assume running is out of the question. If you don't want to run, don't like running: no problem. The most important detail in my opinion is to find things you DO enjoy doing. But don't avoid something just because you think you can't.

When it comes to running, its not about speed. I think many start out trying to go too fast and that causes problems. Check out a Couch to 5k program, which is designed to gradually move you from doing nothing to being able to alternate running/walking until you can eventually run for 30+ minutes at a time. Don't even worry about speed until after you get to the end of the program, and only think of it then if you really want to. I do best when I run with my husband who runs slower than me. If I'm not careful I get burnt out. By making an effort to keep my speed reasonable, I completed a 10k last month in about 67 minutes and did not have to walk for any of it. I was quite pleased with myself.

jusjoking

StaciMarie1974 wrote: »

Don't assume running is out of the question. If you don't want to run, don't like running: no problem. The most important detail in my opinion is to find things you DO enjoy doing. But don't avoid something just because you think you can't.

When it comes to running, its not about speed. I think many start out trying to go too fast and that causes problems. Check out a Couch to 5k program, which is designed to gradually move you from doing nothing to being able to alternate running/walking until you can eventually run for 30+ minutes at a time. Don't even worry about speed until after you get to the end of the program, and only think of it then if you really want to. I do best when I run with my husband who runs slower than me. If I'm not careful I get burnt out. By making an effort to keep my speed reasonable, I completed a 10k last month in about 67 minutes and did not have to walk for any of it. I was quite pleased with myself.

ive just never been much of a runner, even when i was young and lean. I pretty much lived on a bicycle though

over the past 25ish years, whenever ive tried to run/jog on a treadmill it only resulted in my shins getting totally locked up with lactic acid etc

and at my age id be way scared of the pounding on the knees/ankles

that being said, I could see some sprints at some point

TimothyFish

To begin with, 2,750 is probably stretching it a little. Even though you are on your feet all day, it isn't the same as it would be if you were a waiter and you were supplying the power to move yourself around. I suspect that if you set your calorie goal at 1,750 that you will be doing good to lose two pounds per week.

While it can be a good thing to increase your activity level, doing so without also increasing your calorie intake isn't a very good idea.

jusjoking

TimothyFish wrote: »

I suspect that if you set your calorie goal at 1,750 that you will be doing good to lose two pounds per week.
.

Dunno, 1750 seems low. I see people weight 140 saying 1700 is maintenance for them

Then again im sitting at 1300 cals today and I just ate my 2nd meal. Bedtime is like 4 hours from now and ill eat again but im not even hungry. of course ive had 0 activity (took a day off of work) unless you count doing guitar scales

Im going to aim for around 1900-2000 cals and see where I am after 1-2 weeks

for sure my diet needs a lot of repair work. Im trying to start from where I am and gradually make it better. Right now the macros are all screwed up as one would expect. Tons of carbs, hardly any protein

Tacklewasher

Not sure how old you are, but I've started running at 52 ish. Started on a treadmill and have moved to running outside lately. Done 2 5K runs so far and plan to do more of them.

But if you enjoy biking then go biking. I still need to put mine back together, but will one day this week.

jusjoking

Tacklewasher wrote: »

Not sure how old you are.

see 2nd line of the OP

yeah, I have a nice Motobecane mountain bike. Its still brand new after having it maybe 6-8 years?

it sure looks good leaning against the wall in that 2nd bedroom

I havent done ANY real exercise in quite a while, besides walking a couple times per week.....thats one reason im so fat lol

like ive said, im starting from scratch with many bad habits firmly in place

Tacklewasher

So, younger than I am. Yeah, I didn't go back and read. Now get off my lawn

What you do is, of course, your call. But you would be able to run. I did the C25K starting at 275 and 51. And I did it. But if running isn't your thing, then dust off the bike and go around the block. Start slow and take breaks (same thing as the C25K program does for running), but try to increase the time each trip. Take rest days etc.

But remember your weight loss will have a lot more to do with how much you eat than with how much you exercise.

SusanMFindlay

TimothyFish wrote: »

To begin with, 2,750 is probably stretching it a little. Even though you are on your feet all day, it isn't the same as it would be if you were a waiter and you were supplying the power to move yourself around. I suspect that if you set your calorie goal at 1,750 that you will be doing good to lose two pounds per week.

While it can be a good thing to increase your activity level, doing so without also increasing your calorie intake isn't a very good idea.

I disagree. My husband has a desk job, but gets enough physical activity on evenings and weekends to get his 10K steps daily. (He usually manages to get the 250 steps/hour it takes to keep FitBit happy during the day, but not necessarily much more than that during working hours.) He started at about 245 and is now about 215. Admittedly, he's a bit taller than the OP. He burns more than 3,000 calories every single day - even the ones where he only gets to ~8,000 steps. His usual burn is in the range of 3,500 - and he has days over 4,000.

With the OP's stats (5'9; 255 pounds), 2,750 is unlikely to be an overestimate if he's on his feet for any significant portion of the day. My personal experience has been that the calculators massively *underestimate* calorie burns for those of us who are on our feet a lot without necessarily "working out" a lot. I think he should start off believing the calculator, keep his calories over 2,000 and adjust based on actual results.

To the OP: 50 pounds in a year might sound slow - but 50 pounds in a year still has you weighing 50 pounds less! Now, with your stats, 2 pounds/week is going to be completely achievable for the first few months, so I'm not saying you shouldn't aim for 2 pounds/week - but please don't see 1 pound/week as a bad thing.

jusjoking

SusanMFindlay wrote: »

TimothyFish wrote: »

To begin with, 2,750 is probably stretching it a little. Even though you are on your feet all day, it isn't the same as it would be if you were a waiter and you were supplying the power to move yourself around. I suspect that if you set your calorie goal at 1,750 that you will be doing good to lose two pounds per week.

While it can be a good thing to increase your activity level, doing so without also increasing your calorie intake isn't a very good idea.

I disagree. My husband has a desk job, but gets enough physical activity on evenings and weekends to get his 10K steps daily. (He usually manages to get the 250 steps/hour it takes to keep FitBit happy during the day, but not necessarily much more than that during working hours.) He started at about 245 and is now about 215. Admittedly, he's a bit taller than the OP. He burns more than 3,000 calories every single day - even the ones where he only gets to ~8,000 steps. His usual burn is in the range of 3,500 - and he has days over 4,000.

With the OP's stats (5'9; 255 pounds), 2,750 is unlikely to be an overestimate if he's on his feet for any significant portion of the day. My personal experience has been that the calculators massively *underestimate* calorie burns for those of us who are on our feet a lot without necessarily "working out" a lot. I think he should start off believing the calculator, keep his calories over 2,000 and adjust based on actual results.

To the OP: 50 pounds in a year might sound slow - but 50 pounds in a year still has you weighing 50 pounds less! Now, with your stats, 2 pounds/week is going to be completely achievable for the first few months, so I'm not saying you shouldn't aim for 2 pounds/week - but please don't see 1 pound/week as a bad thing.

yeah, I drive a stand up forklift. true, it gives the "power" to move us around etc, BUT its still pretty physical because there is lots of turning, twisting to look around for traffic plus we tend to do a lot of moving around to different positions to try to find a comfortable position. Lots of craning the neck all day etc. Lots of "standing up" alternated with "kneeling" with knees against the machine to take weight off the feet. We are on production so we have to hustle all day. Nevermind the fact that its intense mental work even if it doesnt seem so. I go home totally spent every day. of course part of that is because im fat lol


She is 'standing' but if her feet get tired she could 'kneel' with her knees against the lift interior to take weight off her feet. So we are doing that little kneel/squat motion probably a 100 times per day