Calorie deficit...confused
Replies
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mca90guitar wrote: »Little confused myself. I did the last 4 weeks at 1700-1800 mostly and work out 6 days a week for 1 hr+ Lost 2 pounds but assuming some fat was replaced with muscle. I sit on my butt all day at work so I reset mfp to non active and it has me at 1680 or something like that.
So if I'm nocking off 500+ calories a workout I should eat where I was at 1800 area to be safe?
Figure this out eventually haha
You probably did not gain much muscle over that time period. It takes a while to gain muscle, but a 2 lb loss is decent, not know your stats.
If MFP is giving you 1680, then I'd add 250 for your exercise (50%) so eat maybe 1900 and see what happens with the weight loss. Or give us your stats (sex, height, weight, age, goal weight and expected loss) and we can toss some numbers around.1 -
NorthCascades wrote: »hansklamp2112 wrote: »However, I couldn't stand by and let someone mindlessly shout "terrible advice" on something that is based on the formulas put together by people with actual educations and scientific backgrounds on the subject matter.
The formulae behind this stuff is fine, it's your terrible advice about how to misapply them that's a problem here. If you can't stand being called out for giving bad advice, then stop giving bad advice. And, when you can't do that, don't assume that anybody who disagrees with you is in poor physical condition. You were wrong, but that's ok, we're all wrong sometimes, it's how we deal with it.
I left OP with an explanation, they can take it and try to learn more based off that or not, but until you actually prove to OP that learning more about the underlying factors of BMR and TDEE is not beneficial to her EXACT questions in this post, then you're simply trying to rob her of exceptional advice on how to move forward and using MFP as a tool, but using an external calculator to get an idea of what she should do so she knows why her net calories are what they are, whether she should eat her deficit gained from workouts back, etc.
Cheers.deannalfisher wrote: »have you actually read about how MFP determines calories - because unless you have done that, your advice is less than useful
https://myfitnesspal.desk.com/customer/en/portal/articles/410332-how-does-myfitnesspal-calculate-my-initial-goals-
TDEE is only as good as your estimations and work outs (i.e. If I say that I am moderately active and yet for one week am only lightly active, or vice versa, heavily active) - then my TDEE will change since my daily energy expenditure has changed - so its not a one size fits all equation
Have you actually read what I am saying? The purpose of using the calculator is to understand the WHY. I didn't say eat your calories based on TDEE, I said you use the calculator to learn your BMR/TDEE to then move accordingly. Understanding WHY you are eating x calories a day is how you learn how to adjust based on your activity levels. That's the ENTIRE POINT.
You're sitting here saying that TDEE gives you a one all answer to what you should do, but doesn't account for weeks where you have less activity--you do understand that MFP also does not? Changing your weekly goals based on fitness activity is inconsistent and if anyone here knows anything, inconsistency is a very poor way to lose weight. You use it so you have an idea of what you're burning based on what your activity level is. You use the BMR to know what your body is very likely, and quite accurately may I add, burning based on normally existing. You then have two numbers to work from instead of a random one MFP gives you without telling you WHY. I could not make this any simpler. OP's questions would be answered with this type of knowledge, which is why I am trying to share it.
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TDEE - total daily energy expenditure - which will change based on (shock gasp) daily activity - it is at best an calculated estimate that doesn't take your specific body chemistry into an account but it based on population metric2
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hansklamp2112 wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »hansklamp2112 wrote: »However, I couldn't stand by and let someone mindlessly shout "terrible advice" on something that is based on the formulas put together by people with actual educations and scientific backgrounds on the subject matter.
The formulae behind this stuff is fine, it's your terrible advice about how to misapply them that's a problem here. If you can't stand being called out for giving bad advice, then stop giving bad advice. And, when you can't do that, don't assume that anybody who disagrees with you is in poor physical condition. You were wrong, but that's ok, we're all wrong sometimes, it's how we deal with it.
I left OP with an explanation, they can take it and try to learn more based off that or not, but until you actually prove to OP that learning more about the underlying factors of BMR and TDEE is not beneficial to her EXACT questions in this post, then you're simply trying to rob her of exceptional advice on how to move forward and using MFP as a tool, but using an external calculator to get an idea of what she should do so she knows why her net calories are what they are, whether she should eat her deficit gained from workouts back, etc.
Cheers.deannalfisher wrote: »have you actually read about how MFP determines calories - because unless you have done that, your advice is less than useful
https://myfitnesspal.desk.com/customer/en/portal/articles/410332-how-does-myfitnesspal-calculate-my-initial-goals-
TDEE is only as good as your estimations and work outs (i.e. If I say that I am moderately active and yet for one week am only lightly active, or vice versa, heavily active) - then my TDEE will change since my daily energy expenditure has changed - so its not a one size fits all equation
Have you actually read what I am saying? The purpose of using the calculator is to understand the WHY. I didn't say eat your calories based on TDEE, I said you use the calculator to learn your BMR/TDEE to then move accordingly. Understanding WHY you are eating x calories a day is how you learn how to adjust based on your activity levels. That's the ENTIRE POINT.
You're sitting here saying that TDEE gives you a one all answer to what you should do, but doesn't account for weeks where you have less activity--you do understand that MFP also does not? Changing your weekly goals based on fitness activity is inconsistent and if anyone here knows anything, inconsistency is a very poor way to lose weight. You use it so you have an idea of what you're burning based on what your activity level is. You use the BMR to know what your body is very likely, and quite accurately may I add, burning based on normally existing. You then have two numbers to work from instead of a random one MFP gives you without telling you WHY. I could not make this any simpler. OP's questions would be answered with this type of knowledge, which is why I am trying to share it.
If you rad the link it gives you the formula that MFP uses to get ermine calories - BMR + daily activity (NEAT) + purposeful exercise - which is (wait for it) TDEE
In fact if you go by that it gives you more data than most TDEE calculators6 -
hansklamp2112 wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »hansklamp2112 wrote: »However, I couldn't stand by and let someone mindlessly shout "terrible advice" on something that is based on the formulas put together by people with actual educations and scientific backgrounds on the subject matter.
The formulae behind this stuff is fine, it's your terrible advice about how to misapply them that's a problem here. If you can't stand being called out for giving bad advice, then stop giving bad advice. And, when you can't do that, don't assume that anybody who disagrees with you is in poor physical condition. You were wrong, but that's ok, we're all wrong sometimes, it's how we deal with it.
I left OP with an explanation, they can take it and try to learn more based off that or not, but until you actually prove to OP that learning more about the underlying factors of BMR and TDEE is not beneficial to her EXACT questions in this post, then you're simply trying to rob her of exceptional advice on how to move forward and using MFP as a tool, but using an external calculator to get an idea of what she should do so she knows why her net calories are what they are, whether she should eat her deficit gained from workouts back, etc.
Cheers.deannalfisher wrote: »have you actually read about how MFP determines calories - because unless you have done that, your advice is less than useful
https://myfitnesspal.desk.com/customer/en/portal/articles/410332-how-does-myfitnesspal-calculate-my-initial-goals-
TDEE is only as good as your estimations and work outs (i.e. If I say that I am moderately active and yet for one week am only lightly active, or vice versa, heavily active) - then my TDEE will change since my daily energy expenditure has changed - so its not a one size fits all equation
Have you actually read what I am saying? The purpose of using the calculator is to understand the WHY. I didn't say eat your calories based on TDEE, I said you use the calculator to learn your BMR/TDEE to then move accordingly. Understanding WHY you are eating x calories a day is how you learn how to adjust based on your activity levels. That's the ENTIRE POINT.
You're sitting here saying that TDEE gives you a one all answer to what you should do, but doesn't account for weeks where you have less activity--you do understand that MFP also does not? Changing your weekly goals based on fitness activity is inconsistent and if anyone here knows anything, inconsistency is a very poor way to lose weight. You use it so you have an idea of what you're burning based on what your activity level is. You use the BMR to know what your body is very likely, and quite accurately may I add, burning based on normally existing. You then have two numbers to work from instead of a random one MFP gives you without telling you WHY. I could not make this any simpler. OP's questions would be answered with this type of knowledge, which is why I am trying to share it.
I also don't think you really understand MFP's method. Your explanation is too complicated for some folks on here--in my opinion. The OP was already confused and needs a simple answer. Unfortunately yours isn't. However your method is useful for people that have been on here a long time, and, or know the basics. There are lots of lurkers.4 -
Get a fit bit. This will give you yoir calories burned for the day. Calculate your BMR as well and you will see what you burn in a day without doing any activity. These are guides. Mfp already set a calori deficit for you based on the info you entered about yourself ....how active you are...your weight and your weight loss goals1
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deannalfisher wrote: »what is your age/height/current weight/goal weight? 1200 might be too aggressive for your goals
OP if you are still around - this is an important question that would be helpful for you to address. You mentioned feeling hungry on 1200 (no doubt because you weren't eating back exercise calories and were netting far under that). It's worth noting that 1200 is the minimum recommended calorie amount and that most people can lose weight eating more than 1200. Often during set up, people choose an aggressive rate of loss, thinking faster is better, not realizing it may not be appropriate for how much weight they have to lose total.1 -
Tacklewasher wrote: »@Charabz69
Are you still confused with how MFP works and how much you should be eating, or do you have more questions? Ignore the sidetrack, but if there is more you need help with, please ask.
I am now totally confused......TDEE?
I will google it!
I use a Myzone HRM which is where I get my 'calories burned' from, I do various types of exercise through the week, running, Spin, Body Attack, CX Works, Weights. I average 600 (I generally do 2 hours exercise, 5 days a week, 1 hour am and 1 hour pm), I realise that the calories burned is generally over-estimated on HRM and so as a rule I only 'eat back' 50%.
My main concern is that at 1200 a day I'm not actually 'fuelling' my body correctly and that is why I asked about the calorie deficit . I guess I need to pay more attention to macros?0 -
@Charabz69 I get the confusion. I going to make a couple of posts to explain things, but the short answer will be to eat back 1/2 your calories and see how your weight comes off over a month or so. If you lose too little, eat a bit more. If you feel out of energy, eat a bit more. There is no set answer and it confused partly by you not having a tremendous amount to lose and MFP given you 1200, which is as low as it will go. You certainly need to net 1200, so be sure to eat back some of your exercise calories.1
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Here's a bit of a primer on what people are talking about. And, if it's okay, I'll use myself as an example. I'm male, 6' 52 yrs old and 240 lbs. I'm also sedentary in my normal activities.
BMR is your basal metabolic rate. It's the number of calories your body burns to exist. So imagine a near coma life and that is BMR. It's also the normal starting point for any of these calculations. The calculators you find for this can use a variety of formulas, and they are all estimates. My BMR is ~2100 calories according to http://www.bmi-calculator.net/bmr-calculator/
NEAT is Non-exercise activity thermogenesis. It's the amount of calories you burn in a normal day. This is what MFP bases the calories it give you on. MFP basically calculates your BMR from your stats and gives you a multiple of this based on your activity level. I think the sedentary factor is 1.2. So, my Neat should be ~2100 X 1.2 or 2520.
Now, to lose 1 lb a week, you need to reduce your calories (for the week) by 3500. Or 500 a day. I'm currently trying to lose 1.5 lbs per week, so my reduction is 750 cals per day so MFP gives me 1770 calories (it is actually giving me 1720, but I'm not quite 240). The point is that my weight loss goal is built into the number MFP gives me. So if I exercise and don't eat those back, I would lose weight faster than I should for good health. Or, more to the point, I would lose muscle where I want to lose fat.
Now, if I wanted to lose 2 lb per week, and MFP has my NEAT at 2470 (the real number MFP has, not my calc above), then MFP would give me 1500 cals. If my NEAT was 2000 and I wanted to lose 2 lb per week, MFP would still give me 1500 cals as I shouldn't be eating less than that, but I wouldn't be losing 2 lb per week.
I think that may be where you are at. MFP won't go below 1200 for a female, regardless of what you put in for your weight loss. So, you need to just try things for a while, eating back 1/2 your calories and seeing where your weight loss ends up.
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I put this in a separate post, so ignore it if you want.
TDEE is your total daily energy expenditure and includes all of the above and your intentional exercise. So if I did a regular 500 calorie a day exercise, I would add 500 cals to my neat calculation and be ~3000 cals a day. The n I would deduct what I want to lose (750 cals for 1.5 lbs) and eat 2250 but NOT eat back any exercise calories as I've already got them in my TDEE. Now if you look at TDEE calculators, they will say to eat your TDEE - 20% (or 25%) as the most aggressive loss. I'm not sure why they don't just stick with 500 cals or something relating to pounds lost, and no one has ever explained it to me clearly.
My problem is I don't do 500 cals of exercise per day, or a standard amount per week. I'm not consistent in what I do so TDEE doesn't work for me and MFP will have me eating different amounts every day based on what exercising I've done. If you are consistent week over week, than doing TDEE can make sense. But you then have to turn off tracking, set manual goals and basically force MFP to work how you want it to and not how it was designed.
My suggestion is to get comfortable with how MFP works and then see if TDEE works for you.
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Tacklewasher wrote: »@Charabz69
Are you still confused with how MFP works and how much you should be eating, or do you have more questions? Ignore the sidetrack, but if there is more you need help with, please ask.
I am now totally confused......TDEE?
I will google it!
I use a Myzone HRM which is where I get my 'calories burned' from, I do various types of exercise through the week, running, Spin, Body Attack, CX Works, Weights. I average 600 (I generally do 2 hours exercise, 5 days a week, 1 hour am and 1 hour pm), I realise that the calories burned is generally over-estimated on HRM and so as a rule I only 'eat back' 50%.
My main concern is that at 1200 a day I'm not actually 'fuelling' my body correctly and that is why I asked about the calorie deficit . I guess I need to pay more attention to macros?
Asked above, but will ask again. How much weight (total) are you trying to lose? What rate of loss did you select when you set up your MFP profile?1 -
@Tacklewasher Great explanation
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I like TDEE, because I have a consistent workout routine and it works well for me. OP - it's all about personal preference and what you're comfortable with using. TDEE requires a little more 'work', since MFP isn't doing the math for you, but if you do better with patterns and routine, it's worth exploring because you eat the same amount of calories everyday, even on a 'rest day'. It makes meal planning much easier (for me).
Regardless of if you use MFP/NEAT or TDEE, it may take a month or so to really understand what your body is doing with your weight loss, but the cool thing is that if you log accurately and track workouts and weigh-ins consistently (to whatever degree you like), data is fun!1 -
WinoGelato wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »@Charabz69
Are you still confused with how MFP works and how much you should be eating, or do you have more questions? Ignore the sidetrack, but if there is more you need help with, please ask.
I am now totally confused......TDEE?
I will google it!
I use a Myzone HRM which is where I get my 'calories burned' from, I do various types of exercise through the week, running, Spin, Body Attack, CX Works, Weights. I average 600 (I generally do 2 hours exercise, 5 days a week, 1 hour am and 1 hour pm), I realise that the calories burned is generally over-estimated on HRM and so as a rule I only 'eat back' 50%.
My main concern is that at 1200 a day I'm not actually 'fuelling' my body correctly and that is why I asked about the calorie deficit . I guess I need to pay more attention to macros?
Asked above, but will ask again. How much weight (total) are you trying to lose? What rate of loss did you select when you set up your MFP profile?
I'm down for 1.5lbs a week, I would like to lose about 10lbs. I try to stay away from weighing myself generally and go by measurements and I have always used MFP as a guide, but recently I have been eating far too much rubbish and really just wanted to rein myself in and decided to use MFP properly and I have really confused myself with TDEE/NEAT etc. Although they now all make more sense after all your comments.
Thanks again, I really appreciate it xx1 -
With only 10lb to lose you are better off dropping down your weight loss rate to 0.5-1lb per week and tightening up your logging. Better to lose it and keep it off 1
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tinkerbellang83 wrote: »With only 10lb to lose you are better off dropping down your weight loss rate to 0.5-1lb per week and tightening up your logging. Better to lose it and keep it off
Would that give me more that 1200 per day?0 -
It should really, unless you are particularly slim or short to start with, 0.5lb per week will give you a defict of your NEAT - 250 Calories per day and 1lb per week would be NEAT -500 calories per day. If you're currently set to 1.5lb per week it's your NEAT-750 calories per day (although if your NEAT is quite low it won't get any lower than 1200 calories).1
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From OP's post, it sounds like her workouts are consistent too... thus solidifying, even further, that a TDEE
How is saying " I work out most days, burning about 600+ calories" consistent?!?
Consistent: acting or done in the same way over time, especially so as to be fair or accurate
Some "most days" and "600+" are statements that show lack of consistency.
Also, we do not know what her exercise is. If she runs a 5K every day, that is consistent. If she does pilates one day, runs the next, walks one day, she is not being consistent.
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WinoGelato wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »@Charabz69
Are you still confused with how MFP works and how much you should be eating, or do you have more questions? Ignore the sidetrack, but if there is more you need help with, please ask.
I am now totally confused......TDEE?
I will google it!
I use a Myzone HRM which is where I get my 'calories burned' from, I do various types of exercise through the week, running, Spin, Body Attack, CX Works, Weights. I average 600 (I generally do 2 hours exercise, 5 days a week, 1 hour am and 1 hour pm), I realise that the calories burned is generally over-estimated on HRM and so as a rule I only 'eat back' 50%.
My main concern is that at 1200 a day I'm not actually 'fuelling' my body correctly and that is why I asked about the calorie deficit . I guess I need to pay more attention to macros?
Asked above, but will ask again. How much weight (total) are you trying to lose? What rate of loss did you select when you set up your MFP profile?
I'm down for 1.5lbs a week, I would like to lose about 10lbs. I try to stay away from weighing myself generally and go by measurements and I have always used MFP as a guide, but recently I have been eating far too much rubbish and really just wanted to rein myself in and decided to use MFP properly and I have really confused myself with TDEE/NEAT etc. Although they now all make more sense after all your comments.
Thanks again, I really appreciate it xx
It's easy to get confused and overwhelmed with all the different advice here. If you are only trying to lose 10 lbs, 0.5 lb/week is a more appropriate rate of loss for you. This will give you more calories to begin with, and help ensure that the weight you lose is not so rapid that when you add back in calories you gain it back, it preserves lean body mass, etc. I would readjust for that rate of loss, then log as accurately as possible and eat back at least a portion of those calorie burns from exercise, monitor and adjust after about 6-8 weeks when you should be nearly halfway to your goal.3 -
tinkerbellang83 wrote: »It should really, unless you are particularly slim or short to start with, 0.5lb per week will give you a defict of your NEAT - 250 Calories per day and 1lb per week would be NEAT -500 calories per day. If you're currently set to 1.5lb per week it's your NEAT-750 calories per day (although if your NEAT is quite low it won't get any lower than 1200 calories).
I'm 5ft 3" and small frame!0 -
From OP's post, it sounds like her workouts are consistent too... thus solidifying, even further, that a TDEE
How is saying " I work out most days, burning about 600+ calories" consistent?!?
Consistent: acting or done in the same way over time, especially so as to be fair or accurate
Some "most days" and "600+" are statements that show lack of consistency.
Also, we do not know what her exercise is. If she runs a 5K every day, that is consistent. If she does pilates one day, runs the next, walks one day, she is not being consistent.
My work outs are consistent week to week as I do the same classes every week. Some days my HRM is showing over 1000 calories burned (I run a 10K on a Tuesday + a class in the morning). 0 -
WinoGelato wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »@Charabz69
Are you still confused with how MFP works and how much you should be eating, or do you have more questions? Ignore the sidetrack, but if there is more you need help with, please ask.
I am now totally confused......TDEE?
I will google it!
I use a Myzone HRM which is where I get my 'calories burned' from, I do various types of exercise through the week, running, Spin, Body Attack, CX Works, Weights. I average 600 (I generally do 2 hours exercise, 5 days a week, 1 hour am and 1 hour pm), I realise that the calories burned is generally over-estimated on HRM and so as a rule I only 'eat back' 50%.
My main concern is that at 1200 a day I'm not actually 'fuelling' my body correctly and that is why I asked about the calorie deficit . I guess I need to pay more attention to macros?
Asked above, but will ask again. How much weight (total) are you trying to lose? What rate of loss did you select when you set up your MFP profile?
I'm down for 1.5lbs a week, I would like to lose about 10lbs. I try to stay away from weighing myself generally and go by measurements and I have always used MFP as a guide, but recently I have been eating far too much rubbish and really just wanted to rein myself in and decided to use MFP properly and I have really confused myself with TDEE/NEAT etc. Although they now all make more sense after all your comments.
Thanks again, I really appreciate it xx
It's easy to get confused and overwhelmed with all the different advice here. If you are only trying to lose 10 lbs, 0.5 lb/week is a more appropriate rate of loss for you. This will give you more calories to begin with, and help ensure that the weight you lose is not so rapid that when you add back in calories you gain it back, it preserves lean body mass, etc. I would readjust for that rate of loss, then log as accurately as possible and eat back at least a portion of those calorie burns from exercise, monitor and adjust after about 6-8 weeks when you should be nearly halfway to your goal.
Thank you for that I will go and change it to 0.5lbs. I appreciate your help. x1 -
From OP's post, it sounds like her workouts are consistent too... thus solidifying, even further, that a TDEE
How is saying " I work out most days, burning about 600+ calories" consistent?!?
Consistent: acting or done in the same way over time, especially so as to be fair or accurate
Some "most days" and "600+" are statements that show lack of consistency.
Also, we do not know what her exercise is. If she runs a 5K every day, that is consistent. If she does pilates one day, runs the next, walks one day, she is not being consistent.
My work outs are consistent week to week as I do the same classes every week. Some days my HRM is showing over 1000 calories burned (I run a 10K on a Tuesday + a class in the morning).
Do you run a 10k everyday? Because if not your workouts aren't consistent every day. You would need to be burning roughly the same amount daily to benefit from using the TDEE method. Personally, I would just stick to MFP's NEAT method for now and monitor it for a month, now that you've changed your settings to 0.5lb per week, eating either all of your calories back or a fixed percentage of them and reviewing at the end of the month to see if you're losing at the expected rate and adjust accordingly.2 -
Another thing to think about is what you are eating and why you are still hungry -- when you add the exercise calories back in. Some people seem to do better on high fat / high protein and low carb / sugar in terms of satiety.
See this website for a list: http://paleoiq.com/best-paleo-diet-blogs/ for ideas.
It took several months of tweaking before I finally found my "sweet spot" in terms of balance between carbs and protein and (since January I have lost about 30 pounds). And... I am only complaint calorie wise about 75% - 80% of the time. I have some health issues and can't really exercise. Despite this and being tied to a desk all day, I have lost and continue to lose weight. For me, eating low carb and low sugar all of the time some amazing things happened:- I don't crave sugar (I have an entire box of Charms Wild Berry Blow Pops in my file drawer that I haven't touched since November because I don't crave sugar; I once measured my stress level by how many of them I consumed in one day);
- My moods are more even and I don't have blood sugar spikes and crashes;
- By consuming more healthy fats my joints don't hurt as much and I am more or less satiated on 1400 calories.
Just a thought...1 -
tinkerbellang83 wrote: »
From OP's post, it sounds like her workouts are consistent too... thus solidifying, even further, that a TDEE
How is saying " I work out most days, burning about 600+ calories" consistent?!?
Consistent: acting or done in the same way over time, especially so as to be fair or accurate
Some "most days" and "600+" are statements that show lack of consistency.
Also, we do not know what her exercise is. If she runs a 5K every day, that is consistent. If she does pilates one day, runs the next, walks one day, she is not being consistent.
My work outs are consistent week to week as I do the same classes every week. Some days my HRM is showing over 1000 calories burned (I run a 10K on a Tuesday + a class in the morning).
Do you run a 10k everyday? Because if not your workouts aren't consistent every day. You would need to be burning roughly the same amount daily to benefit from using the TDEE method. Personally, I would just stick to MFP's NEAT method for now and monitor it for a month, now that you've changed your settings to 0.5lb per week, eating either all of your calories back or a fixed percentage of them and reviewing at the end of the month to see if you're losing at the expected rate and adjust accordingly.
No, I only run 10K on a Tuesday (I'm in a running club) x0 -
Agree on going down to 0.5 lbs per week, maybe 1 at most.
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