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Can diet affect your mental health?

Macy9336
Macy9336 Posts: 694 Member
edited November 18 in Debate Club
So someone was telling me the other day about how mentally unwell people tend to have bad diets and a higher risk for obesity. I looked this up and it's somewhat true. However, this person claimed that these people were mentally unwell BECAUSE they had a bad diet. This didn't make sense to me. I always thought that the mental illness came first and because of the illness, the person then has zero energy or motivation to shop, cook, etc and so often just eats crisps, microwave meals, takeaways/fast food etc which then leads to comorbid factors like obesity. What do you think?
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Replies

  • Need2Exerc1se
    Need2Exerc1se Posts: 13,575 Member
    Yes, of course it can. What we consume affects our entire body, and our brains are part of our body.
  • dfwesq
    dfwesq Posts: 592 Member
    A poor diet certainly isn't helping any tendency toward mental illness that someone may already have. And there seems to be a link between mental health and general physical health.

    This article might be of some help.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2738337/
  • Macy9336
    Macy9336 Posts: 694 Member
    ValeriePlz wrote: »
    I just read "Eat Move Sleep" by Tom Rath, and he demonstrates a lot of research to indicate that our diets, exercise, and sleep patterns greatly affect our daily mood.

    As far as mental health goes, that's a bigger issue and it really depends what you mean. I think depression / anxiety can be correlated with a bad diet / no exercise / no sleep, but it's not clear if one is causing the other or if they amplify each other.

    That's exactly how I feel, that it's a chicken and egg dilemma. I'm not clear which comes first. I know I feel physically good when I eat healthy. Unhealthy food tends to make me sluggish and have less concentration. But eating something unhealthy doesn't cause me to feel sad/depressed or anxious or have hallucinations. So maybe diet plays a role in boosting mental well being but I'm having a hard time pin pointing a poor diet as cause of mental illness.
  • StarBrightStarBright
    StarBrightStarBright Posts: 97 Member
    French_Peasant wrote: »
    lioness803 wrote: »
    I've read some things that links (and no, I have no info saved on it that I can share right now) the gut bacteria issues to anxiety and depression. I've had digestive issues (IBS) and anxiety for most of my life, so anecdotally it seems possible that its a contributing factor. I need to get better at taking probiotics regularly and see if anything improves. Also purely anecdotal, but some people found cutting back on sugar improves mental health issues, but I think its impossible to pinpoint if that's just sugar, or part of overall lifestyle changes.

    Scientists are definitely making some astounding discoveries with the microbiome, although the field is distinctly in its infancy. Apparently we are just crazy giant meat puppets controlled by our gut flora and fauna, if it is indeed true (as research is theorizing) that our microbiome can manipulate our hormones and such.

    However, pills and yogurts labeled "probiotic" are unproven and increasingly strike me as scammy; although I eat my fair share of yogurt, there is no way the commercial, industrialized strains of bacteria are going to have a fighting chance against the gut bacteria that is there dietically, familially and genetically. A more effective way of introducing and maintaining new gut taxa is by a long-term regimen of ingesting "crapsules" and having poop enemas, supported by an appropriately supportive course of prebiotics.

    Does autism fall under mental health? That is one of the most fascinating areas of current microbiome research:

    https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2015/11/how-microbes-shape-autism/416220/

    I have only recently started digging into this, but from the studies I have read, I would not be surprised if our microbiome may be able to play our mental state and emotions like a violin. It's super freaky and super cool at the same time.

    ETA: For more information on specifically depression and anxiety as related to microbiome and diet. It looks like this is an opinion piece, but it is layman-accessible and includes a robust list of citations for further reading: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Felice_Jacka/publication/268746977_OPINION_The_gut_microbiome_and_diet_in_psychiatry_focus_on_depression/links/54753b0c0cf2778985aec8ae.pdf

    Great links! We actually had a great but slightly hippy-dippy pediatrician who I think bought into microbiome/autism link. My oldest son had chronic ear infections and she really stressed feeding him healthy gut foods every single time she had to prescribe antibiotics.

    While this is a tangent from the food/mental health issue, your links made me think about the fecal transplants for weight loss theory . Has there been a thread for that?

  • French_Peasant
    French_Peasant Posts: 1,639 Member
    StarBrightStarBright wrote: »
    French_Peasant wrote: »
    lioness803 wrote: »
    I've read some things that links (and no, I have no info saved on it that I can share right now) the gut bacteria issues to anxiety and depression. I've had digestive issues (IBS) and anxiety for most of my life, so anecdotally it seems possible that its a contributing factor. I need to get better at taking probiotics regularly and see if anything improves. Also purely anecdotal, but some people found cutting back on sugar improves mental health issues, but I think its impossible to pinpoint if that's just sugar, or part of overall lifestyle changes.

    Scientists are definitely making some astounding discoveries with the microbiome, although the field is distinctly in its infancy. Apparently we are just crazy giant meat puppets controlled by our gut flora and fauna, if it is indeed true (as research is theorizing) that our microbiome can manipulate our hormones and such.

    However, pills and yogurts labeled "probiotic" are unproven and increasingly strike me as scammy; although I eat my fair share of yogurt, there is no way the commercial, industrialized strains of bacteria are going to have a fighting chance against the gut bacteria that is there dietically, familially and genetically. A more effective way of introducing and maintaining new gut taxa is by a long-term regimen of ingesting "crapsules" and having poop enemas, supported by an appropriately supportive course of prebiotics.

    Does autism fall under mental health? That is one of the most fascinating areas of current microbiome research:

    https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2015/11/how-microbes-shape-autism/416220/

    I have only recently started digging into this, but from the studies I have read, I would not be surprised if our microbiome may be able to play our mental state and emotions like a violin. It's super freaky and super cool at the same time.

    ETA: For more information on specifically depression and anxiety as related to microbiome and diet. It looks like this is an opinion piece, but it is layman-accessible and includes a robust list of citations for further reading: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Felice_Jacka/publication/268746977_OPINION_The_gut_microbiome_and_diet_in_psychiatry_focus_on_depression/links/54753b0c0cf2778985aec8ae.pdf

    Great links! We actually had a great but slightly hippy-dippy pediatrician who I think bought into microbiome/autism link. My oldest son had chronic ear infections and she really stressed feeding him healthy gut foods every single time she had to prescribe antibiotics.

    While this is a tangent from the food/mental health issue, your links made me think about the fecal transplants for weight loss theory . Has there been a thread for that?

    LOL I hope not. In my reading I have seen it emphasized again and again not to run out and start looking for poop pills, because as noted above, the science is in its infancy, and by infancy read: three-pounder in the NICU. There are particular taxa associated with low BMI, but it's not like the crapsules will be a quick fix for someone with entrenched overeating habits. I suspect it just makes things a touch easier. But after some of the things I have read here, I can see people lining up around the block for their high-priced poop pills...any kind of "magic" to avoid the tough process of actually cutting calories.

    Out of curiosity, what did she think the connection was between gut issues and ear infections? Just that a healthy gut might cure one problem so it might cure them all? Or was it to help re-establish his gut flora after the antibiotics did their damage to it?
  • StarBrightStarBright
    StarBrightStarBright Posts: 97 Member
    French_Peasant wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, what did she think the connection was between gut issues and ear infections? Just that a healthy gut might cure one problem so it might cure them all? Or was it to help re-establish his gut flora after the antibiotics did their damage to it?

    I think it was more about re-establishing gut flora because it might be so inter-related to our whole body. She'd say things like "Make sure he eats lots of fruits and vegetables and yogurt for the next month, you don't want to mess with bad microbes, we're going to be talking about guts a lot in the next 10 years."

    And also related to my previous post - PSA- MFP people, please don't try DIY poop pills :) That was purely a theoretical mention!

  • French_Peasant
    French_Peasant Posts: 1,639 Member
    StarBrightStarBright wrote: »
    French_Peasant wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, what did she think the connection was between gut issues and ear infections? Just that a healthy gut might cure one problem so it might cure them all? Or was it to help re-establish his gut flora after the antibiotics did their damage to it?

    I think it was more about re-establishing gut flora because it might be so inter-related to our whole body. She'd say things like "Make sure he eats lots of fruits and vegetables and yogurt for the next month, you don't want to mess with bad microbes, we're going to be talking about guts a lot in the next 10 years."

    And also related to my previous post - PSA- MFP people, please don't try DIY poop pills :) That was purely a theoretical mention!

    Cosign that PSA! :D
  • ChelzFit
    ChelzFit Posts: 292 Member
    I know for a fact when I was undereating and malnourished at one time my mental state was not okay. My hormones were all out of whack and I had no desire to do anything and I would cry at everything. Over time I got better and the more happier I became. I had more energy and wanted to do more things. I have read so many articles that discuss the effects of undereating and overtraining and depression and anxiety are both big red flags.
  • SoulRadiation
    SoulRadiation Posts: 1,060 Member
    It certainly can't help! From my own experience, when you're feeling low you also don't take care of yourself as well as you should...you can get out of shape and that feeds back into your negative feelings as your self-image is going to suffer as you become in poor shape.

    All of this stuff is probably intertwined, in my opinion. I think it would be associated with mood disorders and probably some other things as well.

    Now, I really don't think eating junk food is going to develop in you a dissociative identity or make you into a borderline personality or anything...but who knows? Bad food/chemicals could all be a factor in any number of things affecting your mental health.

    I just don't know how they would ever prove it if that were really true.

    But...it would only be a factor. I think your personal biology and the learning/stresses that affect you in your environment as you come to age are going to be way more of a factor than bad food.

    I also think that when you start to clean up your diet and exercise you're going to feel a lot better...I'm pretty sure that has been looked at before and found to be true but I don't have anything to reference. It does make sense that it would be true.
  • Macy9336
    Macy9336 Posts: 694 Member
    Thanks for the comments and links everyone. Really appreciate your input into this question.
  • crackpotbaby
    crackpotbaby Posts: 1,297 Member
    Eating 'clean' and nutritionally balanced meals helps my mood be more balanced (I have bipolar disorder), however it is not in itself enough to control my mental illness. I also take a mood stabiliser called lithium.

    When I am unwell - depressed, manic or mixed - I don't eat as well as my capacity to look after myself is diminished.

    It's like the pot conversation: does pot trigger mental illness in some (yes) or are some people who use pot drawn to pot and other drugs to self medicate (also yes) ... both explain the high coronation between certain types of mental illness but neither is difinitive in a cause and effect sense.

    Food/diet draws similar corolations.
  • LZMiner
    LZMiner Posts: 300 Member
    Actually, a very famous murder case was defended with "The Twinkie Defense." The man who murdered Harvey Milk received something crazy like 2 years in prison due to his junk food diet causing erratic behavior.
  • Tankiscool
    Tankiscool Posts: 11,105 Member
    Diet as what meaning? What someone eats? Or when someone is in a calorie deficit. Either way one could argue there is a very likely chance. When you go on a "diet" meaning you are eating less to loose weight you put stress on your body, top that with a moderate exercise regimen and your stressing it even more. We all know how stress can affect us mentally. The other way of what someones diet is when they eat *kitten*, they feel like *kitten*.
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