Hungrier as you get thinner?
RedheadedPrincess14
Posts: 415 Member
I'm wondering if anyone else has dealt with this. I used to eat around 1200 calories a day and be totally full to lose 20 pounds at a pretty reasonable rate. About 2 pounds a week for the first 5 and then 1 pound a week after that. Now that I am 135 and 5 foot 8, I actually am hungrier eating the same food and tend to need about 1400 -1500 calories a day to feel full. I can eat less but I'm still hungry where as before I was full. Of course, my weight loss is very very slow at this point (especially since I had surgery and can't get in the gym right now) Well, I'm not terribly concerned but I do want to lose the last 10 pounds. Anyone else experience this? Is it just from prolonged dieting?
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Replies
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When was the last time you took a deficit break and ate at maintenance?7
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Yeah, it happens to a lot of people. I think part of it is your body increasing other hormones to preserve body fat. But hard to separate that from diet fatigue3
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Seems to me you are at a fine weight, maybe your body is ready to eat maintenance.8
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I'm not an expert and have absolutely no scientific proof but my theory is that since the body is actually designed to store fat, a prolonged deficit may play with whatever hormone is responsible for huger queues. During times of scarcity I would imagine this was very handy, not so much today lol3
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Chef_Barbell wrote: »When was the last time you took a deficit break and ate at maintenance?
I haven't really taken more then two days off in a row for the last 4 months. I don't really have cheat days but I've had some holidays in there. Not a real break though0 -
so what's the usual course of action in these cases? Lollemurcat12 wrote: »Yeah, it happens to a lot of people. I think part of it is your body increasing other hormones to preserve body fat. But hard to separate that from diet fatigue
1 -
RedheadedPrincess14 wrote: »Chef_Barbell wrote: »When was the last time you took a deficit break and ate at maintenance?
I haven't really taken more then two days off in a row for the last 4 months. I don't really have cheat days but I've had some holidays in there. Not a real break though
Sometimes people benefit from a diet break.4 -
RedheadedPrincess14 wrote: »
so what's the usual course of action in these cases? Lollemurcat12 wrote: »Yeah, it happens to a lot of people. I think part of it is your body increasing other hormones to preserve body fat. But hard to separate that from diet fatigue
What are your fitness/physique goals?0 -
I'm hungry fat and skinny5
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bigmuneymfp wrote: »I'm hungry fat and skinny
ikr lol0 -
135 at 5'8" is a healthy weight. Trying to get thinner/leaner just gets harder from here. For me, it's easier to be gung-ho at first, but as time goes on more hunger sets in and losing becomes more difficult. This is especially true when I'm already at a thin/healthy weight and trying to get thinner (well leaner).
I'm 5'7" and getting anywhere under 132-135 is always the hardest. I've done it, but it's a struggle and I don't think I could ever maintain it. Besides the surgery recovery, do you normally exercise? You may get (or be at) a point where recomposition will be a much better option.2 -
I honestly just want to get back to my high school weight of 125 so I can get back into all my clothes. Of course, if I had more muscle and less fat, and hence was a smaller size but the same weight as I am now, I wouldn't mind. I just want to look the way I did in clothes as I used to lolmrsnattybulking wrote: »RedheadedPrincess14 wrote: »
so what's the usual course of action in these cases? Lollemurcat12 wrote: »Yeah, it happens to a lot of people. I think part of it is your body increasing other hormones to preserve body fat. But hard to separate that from diet fatigue
What are your fitness/physique goals?
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So eating at maintenance is a diet break, right? How long are diet breaks usually meant to be taken for? I don't know much about it. I've actually never heard of it until coming to MFP forumsChef_Barbell wrote: »RedheadedPrincess14 wrote: »Chef_Barbell wrote: »When was the last time you took a deficit break and ate at maintenance?
I haven't really taken more then two days off in a row for the last 4 months. I don't really have cheat days but I've had some holidays in there. Not a real break though
Sometimes people benefit from a diet break.
1 -
RedheadedPrincess14 wrote: »
So eating at maintenance is a diet break, right? How long are diet breaks usually meant to be taken for? I don't know much about it. I've actually never heard of it until coming to MFP forumsChef_Barbell wrote: »RedheadedPrincess14 wrote: »Chef_Barbell wrote: »When was the last time you took a deficit break and ate at maintenance?
I haven't really taken more then two days off in a row for the last 4 months. I don't really have cheat days but I've had some holidays in there. Not a real break though
Sometimes people benefit from a diet break.
I'm no expert but from what I read on here it seems to help mentally and also move some weight.
Anyone else feel free to chime in with science type stuff. I'm on my phone and lazy.
Eta- Yes eat at maintenance is what it's about.1 -
I was excercising for 3 months until I messed up my knee and then had surgery but to be honest I've never been really consistent with excercise for more than 6 months at a time for my whole life so that's definitely something I want to work on when I get the go ahead to workout in 5-6 weeks depending on what my doctor says.135 at 5'8" is a healthy weight. Trying to get thinner/leaner just gets harder from here. For me, it's easier to be gung-ho at first, but as time goes on more hunger sets in and losing becomes more difficult. This is especially true when I'm already at a thin/healthy weight and trying to get thinner (well leaner).
I'm 5'7" and getting anywhere under 132-135 is always the hardest. I've done it, but it's a struggle and I don't think I could ever maintain it. Besides the surgery recovery, do you normally exercise? You may get (or be at) a point where recomposition will be a much better option.
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Seems to me you still want to lose that 10 lbs and get to your goal. The only way to do it is to increase your deficit, but you know that. How you do it is up to you, but since you have a knee issue then exercise really isn't much of an option, but there are several things that might help you.
So mostly the reason you've leveled off is because as you lose bodyweight, your body needs less calories. That means that if you don't adjust your calories in, you'll end up at maintenance unless your deficit is quite large. Having the loss be slower and slower is normal.
On being hungrier. A lot of people notice that when they eat a little more, they correspondingly are more hungry. I don't know why, but it's the case with me.
Exercise will make you hungry. People sometimes do lots of exercise only to find out they are gaining weight. What happens is that the exercise you do makes you hungry (makes sense), but then you overeat. Makes a lot of sense because a typical exercise might be 100-300 calories, but it takes no time at all to eat that much so it's easy to over eat.
On getting less hungry. Two things in particular have helped me and many others. Protein is a big one. Protein does two things, the one your after is it's satiating effect. I had read about this before losing weight but never really felt it until I needed to feel less hungry, if you increase your protein (I'm talking about up to around 1g/lb of body weight for a rough guideline, but you decide after some trial and error) and eat it earlier in the day, you'll generally feel like eating less throughout the day. One study I don't recall where found that eating eggs in the morning resulted in an average daily calorie deficit of about 400. That's huge.
Another more extreme thing you could try that helped me lose the last 5 lbs was intermittent fasting. I basically just skipped breakfast. No before you feel weird about this, it doesn't involve changing your calorie deficit to crazy low numbers, but it does help you to meet the goal (whatever goal that is for the day) because you tend to eat your calories during a set time period and it is harder to eat more. It's pretty simple. Doing this also has one really distinct advantage, it helps you feel less hungry once you get used to it. Seriously. It does take a few weeks, but once you are used to it, you'll find that you no longer get hungry in the morning, or until much later in the day. You also tend to be able to control cravings (at least I was able to), because essentially you are practicing every morning. I've found it is a pretty great strategy for loss and control of calories that's worth a try.1 -
Seems to me you still want to lose that 10 lbs and get to your goal. The only way to do it is to increase your deficit, but you know that. How you do it is up to you, but since you have a knee issue then exercise really isn't much of an option, but there are several things that might help you.
So mostly the reason you've leveled off is because as you lose bodyweight, your body needs less calories. That means that if you don't adjust your calories in, you'll end up at maintenance unless your deficit is quite large. Having the loss be slower and slower is normal.
On being hungrier. A lot of people notice that when they eat a little more, they correspondingly are more hungry. I don't know why, but it's the case with me.
Exercise will make you hungry. People sometimes do lots of exercise only to find out they are gaining weight. What happens is that the exercise you do makes you hungry (makes sense), but then you overeat. Makes a lot of sense because a typical exercise might be 100-300 calories, but it takes no time at all to eat that much so it's easy to over eat.
On getting less hungry. Two things in particular have helped me and many others. Protein is a big one. Protein does two things, the one your after is it's satiating effect. I had read about this before losing weight but never really felt it until I needed to feel less hungry, if you increase your protein (I'm talking about up to around 1g/lb of body weight for a rough guideline, but you decide after some trial and error) and eat it earlier in the day, you'll generally feel like eating less throughout the day. One study I don't recall where found that eating eggs in the morning resulted in an average daily calorie deficit of about 400. That's huge.
Another more extreme thing you could try that helped me lose the last 5 lbs was intermittent fasting. I basically just skipped breakfast. No before you feel weird about this, it doesn't involve changing your calorie deficit to crazy low numbers, but it does help you to meet the goal (whatever goal that is for the day) because you tend to eat your calories during a set time period and it is harder to eat more. It's pretty simple. Doing this also has one really distinct advantage, it helps you feel less hungry once you get used to it. Seriously. It does take a few weeks, but once you are used to it, you'll find that you no longer get hungry in the morning, or until much later in the day. You also tend to be able to control cravings (at least I was able to), because essentially you are practicing every morning. I've found it is a pretty great strategy for loss and control of calories that's worth a try.
Thanks for such a detailed reply with so many great tips! I actually already do 16:8 fasting which has helped a ton. I don't think I would have gotten this far without it and I still do it everyday. I am vegan so my protein is pretty low (still enough to be healthy, as my blood tests are perfect but maybe not ideal for satiety,) but I'm going to probably play around with my macros a bit to get my protein up with legumes and dark greens. I think that may help. Thanks again!0 -
RedheadedPrincess14 wrote: »Seems to me you still want to lose that 10 lbs and get to your goal. The only way to do it is to increase your deficit, but you know that. How you do it is up to you, but since you have a knee issue then exercise really isn't much of an option, but there are several things that might help you.
So mostly the reason you've leveled off is because as you lose bodyweight, your body needs less calories. That means that if you don't adjust your calories in, you'll end up at maintenance unless your deficit is quite large. Having the loss be slower and slower is normal.
On being hungrier. A lot of people notice that when they eat a little more, they correspondingly are more hungry. I don't know why, but it's the case with me.
Exercise will make you hungry. People sometimes do lots of exercise only to find out they are gaining weight. What happens is that the exercise you do makes you hungry (makes sense), but then you overeat. Makes a lot of sense because a typical exercise might be 100-300 calories, but it takes no time at all to eat that much so it's easy to over eat.
On getting less hungry. Two things in particular have helped me and many others. Protein is a big one. Protein does two things, the one your after is it's satiating effect. I had read about this before losing weight but never really felt it until I needed to feel less hungry, if you increase your protein (I'm talking about up to around 1g/lb of body weight for a rough guideline, but you decide after some trial and error) and eat it earlier in the day, you'll generally feel like eating less throughout the day. One study I don't recall where found that eating eggs in the morning resulted in an average daily calorie deficit of about 400. That's huge.
Another more extreme thing you could try that helped me lose the last 5 lbs was intermittent fasting. I basically just skipped breakfast. No before you feel weird about this, it doesn't involve changing your calorie deficit to crazy low numbers, but it does help you to meet the goal (whatever goal that is for the day) because you tend to eat your calories during a set time period and it is harder to eat more. It's pretty simple. Doing this also has one really distinct advantage, it helps you feel less hungry once you get used to it. Seriously. It does take a few weeks, but once you are used to it, you'll find that you no longer get hungry in the morning, or until much later in the day. You also tend to be able to control cravings (at least I was able to), because essentially you are practicing every morning. I've found it is a pretty great strategy for loss and control of calories that's worth a try.
Thanks for such a detailed reply with so many great tips! I actually already do 16:8 fasting which has helped a ton. I don't think I would have gotten this far without it and I still do it everyday. I am vegan so my protein is pretty low (still enough to be healthy, as my blood tests are perfect but maybe not ideal for satiety,) but I'm going to probably play around with my macros a bit to get my protein up with legumes and dark greens. I think that may help. Thanks again!
OOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! Even more perfecter
Vegetable protein is much more satiating than animal protein, boy are you in luck!!
You can solve two problems here perfectly. Work in Edamame beans into your meals or as snacks, chick peas as snacks or in meals as well. Other beans are good, but don't work as well as snacks. I did have dried Cajun black beans last night that were ok though. Edamame were the very best I could find and they drastically reduced my hunger. Drastically.
I used to buy bags of frozen Edamame, put 1/2 - 1 cup in a zip loc and bring it to work, by the time I wanted to eat something, they were thawed out. They are high in fiber too so you don't have to worry about the calories much either.1 -
Yeah, I actually used to eat a lot of those steamer bags of edamame when I first went vegan and add chickpeas to my salads as well as make oil free humus so I'll probably just start doing that again. High carb worked up until this point but it's looking like a bit more plant based protein is in order. I keep it 99% whole foods so I'm sure all of the food I eat is going to be healthy for the most part but maybe a macro switch up will help for satietyRedheadedPrincess14 wrote: »Seems to me you still want to lose that 10 lbs and get to your goal. The only way to do it is to increase your deficit, but you know that. How you do it is up to you, but since you have a knee issue then exercise really isn't much of an option, but there are several things that might help you.
So mostly the reason you've leveled off is because as you lose bodyweight, your body needs less calories. That means that if you don't adjust your calories in, you'll end up at maintenance unless your deficit is quite large. Having the loss be slower and slower is normal.
On being hungrier. A lot of people notice that when they eat a little more, they correspondingly are more hungry. I don't know why, but it's the case with me.
Exercise will make you hungry. People sometimes do lots of exercise only to find out they are gaining weight. What happens is that the exercise you do makes you hungry (makes sense), but then you overeat. Makes a lot of sense because a typical exercise might be 100-300 calories, but it takes no time at all to eat that much so it's easy to over eat.
On getting less hungry. Two things in particular have helped me and many others. Protein is a big one. Protein does two things, the one your after is it's satiating effect. I had read about this before losing weight but never really felt it until I needed to feel less hungry, if you increase your protein (I'm talking about up to around 1g/lb of body weight for a rough guideline, but you decide after some trial and error) and eat it earlier in the day, you'll generally feel like eating less throughout the day. One study I don't recall where found that eating eggs in the morning resulted in an average daily calorie deficit of about 400. That's huge.
Another more extreme thing you could try that helped me lose the last 5 lbs was intermittent fasting. I basically just skipped breakfast. No before you feel weird about this, it doesn't involve changing your calorie deficit to crazy low numbers, but it does help you to meet the goal (whatever goal that is for the day) because you tend to eat your calories during a set time period and it is harder to eat more. It's pretty simple. Doing this also has one really distinct advantage, it helps you feel less hungry once you get used to it. Seriously. It does take a few weeks, but once you are used to it, you'll find that you no longer get hungry in the morning, or until much later in the day. You also tend to be able to control cravings (at least I was able to), because essentially you are practicing every morning. I've found it is a pretty great strategy for loss and control of calories that's worth a try.
Thanks for such a detailed reply with so many great tips! I actually already do 16:8 fasting which has helped a ton. I don't think I would have gotten this far without it and I still do it everyday. I am vegan so my protein is pretty low (still enough to be healthy, as my blood tests are perfect but maybe not ideal for satiety,) but I'm going to probably play around with my macros a bit to get my protein up with legumes and dark greens. I think that may help. Thanks again!
OOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! Even more perfecter
Vegetable protein is much more satiating than animal protein, boy are you in luck!!
You can solve two problems here perfectly. Work in Edamame beans into your meals or as snacks, chick peas as snacks or in meals as well. Other beans are good, but don't work as well as snacks. I did have dried Cajun black beans last night that were ok though. Edamame were the very best I could find and they drastically reduced my hunger. Drastically.
I used to buy bags of frozen Edamame, put 1/2 - 1 cup in a zip loc and bring it to work, by the time I wanted to eat something, they were thawed out. They are high in fiber too so you don't have to worry about the calories much either.
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I think it's possible that when you have a lot of stored body fat you can eat less and the body will make up for the deficit by mobilizing body fat as you get lower in fat stores the body is way more reluctant to release the stored fat it still has so it ramps up hunger to force you to eat and preserve what little body fat it still has. I have no science to back that up and not looking for a debate it just makes sense to me on why you could eat less with less hunger at a heavier weight and are hungrier now that you're at a healthy weight.
Edited for wording3 -
Yeah, that seems to make sense to me too. I do remember dr.doug lisle (a psychologist and author of the pleasure trap,) saying that when you are overweight your body releases hormones to make you feel full off less calories as long as you're not hijacking your taste buds with hyper palatable, addictive foods. He's the only one I've heard say that though so I'm not entirely sure hahatiffanifair wrote: »I think it's possible that when you have a lot of stored body fat you can eat less and the body will make up for the deficit by mobilizing body fat as you get lower in fat stores the body is way more reluctant to release the stored fat it still has so it ramps up hunger to force you to eat and preserve what little body fat it still has. I have no science to back that up and not looking for a debate it just makes sense to me on why you could eat less with less hunger at a heavier weight and are hungrier now that you're at a healthy weight.
Edited for wording
1 -
Just guessing here, but you're already at a lowish weight for your height. Be prepared for a white knuckle hunger ride if you manage to get all the way down to 125.7
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OK @RedheadedPrincess14!
First of all congratulations on being so close to where you want to be in spite of injuries and all.
Second I caution you to consider that high school weight may or may not be a reasonable and long terms sustainable goal.
Third I caution you to consider that your lean mass in high school was probably higher than it is now especially if you have been relatively sedentary in the intervening years.
Fourth let's look at what you're eating. I've quickly looked through May and June.
What jumps out is not the ~0.5g of protein per lb of bodyweight that you're eating, even though it is slightly less than what many of us would consider optimum for the preservation of lean body mass in a deficit.
What jumps out in spades is that you are eating about 1/3 the amount of fat that is recommended for women. ONE THIRD or, eyeballing things, a bit LESS at times!
In any case your fat intake is WAY below the level of fat recommended for women which is 25% to 30% of total calories! Often people express this as between 0.3g and 0.4g of fat per lb of bodyweight.
Fats from fish and poly and mono unsaturated sources are what you want. NOT saturated fats by preference (and yes, that includes magical coconut fat which most heart associations do not consider to be so magical).
Lack of fat intake can have an effect on hormones and could well be derailing you all and by itself.
http://healthyeating.sfgate.com/recommended-daily-fat-intakes-females-6305.html
http://woman.thenest.com/grams-protein-fat-carbs-lean-muscle-12000.html
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/248641356 -
OK @RedheadedPrincess14!
First of all congratulations on being so close to where you want to be in spite of injuries and all.
Second I caution you to consider that high school weight may or may not be a reasonable and long terms sustainable goal.
Third I caution you to consider that your lean mass in high school was probably higher than it is now especially if you have been relatively sedentary in the intervening years.
Fourth let's look at what you're eating. I've quickly looked through May and June.
What jumps out is not the ~0.5g of protein per lb of bodyweight that you're eating, even though it is slightly less than what many of us would consider optimum for the preservation of lean body mass in a deficit.
What jumps out in spades is that you are eating about 1/3 the amount of fat that is recommended for women. ONE THIRD or, eyeballing things, a bit LESS at times!
In any case your fat intake is WAY below the level of fat recommended for women which is 25% to 30% of total calories! Often people express this as between 0.3g and 0.4g of fat per lb of bodyweight.
Fats from fish and poly and mono unsaturated sources are what you want. NOT saturated fats by preference (and yes, that includes magical coconut fat which most heart associations do not consider to be so magical).
Lack of fat intake can have an effect on hormones and could well be derailing you all and by itself.
http://healthyeating.sfgate.com/recommended-daily-fat-intakes-females-6305.html
http://woman.thenest.com/grams-protein-fat-carbs-lean-muscle-12000.html
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24864135
Thanks so much for all your information! I really don't care about the weight as much as being the same clothing size, so yeah, if I was to increase my muscle mass and decrease my fat I would be probably even happier than gettting back to that weight as long as I can wear the same type of clothing. I am definitely open to upping my protein but the reason I eat so little fat is actually because of my hormones. I had terrible acne and irregular periods which was only resolved when I stopped eating overt-fats at the recommendation of a dermatologist. I have a suspicion that the problem may have been particular types of fat (maybe oil, maybe nuts, ) and that maybe not all fats will trigger this response but I'm very scared to add fats back in because I don't want the horrible response I was getting before. My doctor agrees with you however and has hence sent me for blood work which is all actually perfect and way better than it was before ( to be fair though, I did make a lot of lifestyle changes since the previous test.) I did have an extensive work up done and after a year of eating low fat like this, everything shows up as perfect. My doctor was actually shocked.
I do think I am eating even lower fat lately though just because I'm so happy that my skin is clear and energy has improved. So perhaps slowly experimenting with my macros is a good idea. I'll maybe try some seeds again since I used to eat chia seeds and flaxseeds everyday but I suppose I fell out of the habit. I do, however, hit my omega 3-6 ratio everyday ( I use chronometer to track my nutrients) just because of the amount of green vegetables I eat. And I'm at a good ratio of 1-2.5 usually. I do understand, however, that fat in general is important for hormones so the seeds are probably a good start from here! Thanks for bringing this up. I am vegan so I will not be eating fish but I also realize that coconut is not the best kind of fat. I actually just started post secondary education in nutrition but i haven't learned enough yet to know more than what I read about on my own as they really just start with basic science and such. Sorry for the lengthy response and thanks for your time!
@PAV88884 -
Lol I'm prepared. I've done it before so I can do it again! I just know it will take longer than the first bit of weight. That's always how it goes lolChristine_72 wrote: »Just guessing here, but you're already at a lowish weight for your height. Be prepared for a white knuckle hunger ride if you manage to get all the way down to 125.
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RedheadedPrincess14 wrote: »I am vegan so I will not be eating fish
Oopsies! My bad!
I guess my 300g tomatoes, 300g cucumbers, 100g onion, 30g pickled veggies or olives, 175g 0% Greek yogurt, and ~5g to ~10g olive oil salad would also run into a vegan clash
Ha, sounds like I should be hitting you for nutritional advice in the near future 1 -
Lol, maybe a bit haha but I'm glad we both eat lots of veg!RedheadedPrincess14 wrote: »I am vegan so I will not be eating fish
Oopsies! My bad!
I guess my 300g tomatoes, 300g cucumbers, 100g onion, 30g pickled veggies or olives, 175g 0% Greek yogurt, and ~5g to ~10g olive oil salad would also run into a vegan clash
Ha, sounds like I should be hitting you for nutritional advice in the near future
0 -
Absolutely, the leaner I get, the more of an appetite I get. Interestingly, I have also noticed that as I have gotten much leaner, I also need more carbs to feel satisfied.0
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Absolutely, the leaner I get, the more of an appetite I get. Interestingly, I have also noticed that as I have gotten much leaner, I also need more carbs to feel satisfied.
Weird phenomenon! Now I don't know if I should do a diet break or play with my macros. Anyone know how long you do a diet break for ?0 -
I can't even fit a 300 calorie treat without being hungry anymore - and that's with a TDEE of 2400. Totally ridiculous. I was 2 lbs from my goal 3 years ago but gained back 6 since because I just can't maintain such a low (not even THAT low for my height) weight without being miserable. To be fair, it's taking a diet break on vacation that booster my appetite, unfortunately. It's been insane since...
And yeah, I feel worse if I eat low carb. I need the carbs or I feel exhausted and get hangry. Go figure.
In comparison, when I was obese, I ate whatever I wanted on 1600 calories and I wasn't hungry (my TDEE was 2300 or something then).2
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