Stronglift 5x5

dalerst

At what stage will I need to move on from the 5x5 stronglift programme? I've heard a lot of people say it's a good beginner programme but there is better for mover advanced lifts.

sgt1372

If you're a novice and are doing the program as prescribed, you should gain strength rapidly and should plateau on all lifts w/1-2 deloads w/in 4-6 months. After that, it's time to move on to an intermediate program.

bioklutz

Are you having to deload often? Here is a compiled list of programs that you might find helpful:

http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1

HamsterManV2

Stronglifts is a copy of Starting Strength, created by a guy with no real background other than reading stuff on the internet. You'll find your answer if you read the methodology and reasoning of Starting Strength program.

Basically it's a novice program, meaning you will be increasing the weights each session. So your squat can go up by +5lbs per day or +15lbs per week, your bench press/OHP up by +5 to +10lbs per week, and you deadlift by +10 to +20lbs per week. Couple with eating at a surplus (TDEE + 250 to 500 calories), you will be gaining weight and muscle. This program is ideal for underweight novices, especially on young men 18-25 years old. As you get older and/or less male, you need less food to drive this growth (so don't get fat doing this!).

To answer your question: Eventually, you will not be able to increase the weight any more session to session. Your body requires MORE stimulus to increase weight lifted and then you are meant to switch to an intermediate program, where you can increase the weight at a weekly rate, instead of daily. Programs like Upper/Lower splits (volume day 1+2, intensity day 3+4), texas method, etc.).

See the diagram below. The novice increases the strength the fastest, then it slows down when you become an intermediate, then it crawls at advanced.



Please note that 'novice' is not dictated by weight lifted, but rather by progression. There are some gifted individuals who can stay in novice range longer and maintain such a rapid increase in weight lifted (i.e. a guy can be squatting 500lbs for reps and still fall in the 'novice' category if he can do 505lbs the next squat day).

dalerst

HamsterManV2 wrote: »

Stronglifts is a copy of Starting Strength, created by a guy with no real background other than reading stuff on the internet. You'll find your answer if you read the methodology and reasoning of Starting Strength program.

Basically it's a novice program, meaning you will be increasing the weights each session. So your squat can go up by +5lbs per day or +15lbs per week, your bench press/OHP up by +5 to +10lbs per week, and you deadlift by +10 to +20lbs per week. Couple with eating at a surplus (TDEE + 250 to 500 calories), you will be gaining weight and muscle. This program is ideal for underweight novices, especially on young men 18-25 years old. As you get older and/or less male, you need less food to drive this growth (so don't get fat doing this!).

To answer your question: Eventually, you will not be able to increase the weight any more session to session. Your body requires MORE stimulus to increase weight lifted and then you are meant to switch to an intermediate program, where you can increase the weight at a weekly rate, instead of daily. Programs like Upper/Lower splits (volume day 1+2, intensity day 3+4), texas method, etc.).

See the diagram below. The novice increases the strength the fastest, then it slows down when you become an intermediate, then it crawls at advanced.



Please note that 'novice' is not dictated by weight lifted, but rather by progression. There are some gifted individuals who can stay in novice range longer and maintain such a rapid increase in weight lifted (i.e. a guy can be squatting 500lbs for reps and still fall in the 'novice' category if he can do 505lbs the next squat day).

Thanks for the information, it makes much more sense when you see it written down.

bioklutz wrote: »

Are you having to deload often? Here is a compiled list of programs that you might find helpful:

http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1

I'm not at the deload stage yet, still working on proper form before I start increasing the weights to much. especially on my deadlift.

HamsterManV2

Please note that after the first 2-3 weeks, you can add some abs and some arm work. Squat and Deadlift is good enough for lower body, but Bench or OHP is decent but lacks biceps work. Abs are good for both aesthetics and helps stability on your squat/deadlift.


Keep it simple. Don't ruin a soup by throwing in too many ingredients. Visualize it this way: Your body has 100 units for recovery. The more *kitten* you throw in, the less effective your body will recover - it gets diluted over too many exercises. As you get more experienced and stronger you can increase the number of exercises, but too much too soon will blunt your progress.

I like 3sets x (chin ups OR curls), 2-3 sets of abs (plank OR weighted plank OR abs wheel rollouts - all static exercises). Can replace abs with back extension every other day, they are very useful for your trunk strength.

i.e. Day 1: Chin ups and abs
Day 2: Curls and back extensions

This, with constantly increasing squat/bench/deadlift/OHP, will net you solid strength and muscle gains in the next few months. Enjoy your novice progression, it only happens once!

bioklutz

dalerst wrote: »

I'm not at the deload stage yet, still working on proper form before I start increasing the weights to much. especially on my deadlift.

Keep at it. Once you get to the point where deloads don't help get more weight on the bar it is time to switch programs. Or if you have been at it for 6 months and feeling bored - try a new program.

richardgavel

bioklutz wrote: »

dalerst wrote: »

I'm not at the deload stage yet, still working on proper form before I start increasing the weights to much. especially on my deadlift.

Keep at it. Once you get to the point where deloads don't help get more weight on the bar it is time to switch programs. Or if you have been at it for 6 months and feeling bored - try a new program.

Is this really true? What if you're lifting at a deficit? Then it's not really the program that's holding you back still and would switching programs help?

Markbooth8772

Every time you complete the five reps you progress to the next lifting weight.if you can't manage the five sets and five reps stay at that weight until you can. Or you Drop the weight a little

Markbooth8772

Each week the weight goes up an increment of 2 kg or less

StealthHealth

richardgavel wrote: »

bioklutz wrote: »

dalerst wrote: »

I'm not at the deload stage yet, still working on proper form before I start increasing the weights to much. especially on my deadlift.

Keep at it. Once you get to the point where deloads don't help get more weight on the bar it is time to switch programs. Or if you have been at it for 6 months and feeling bored - try a new program.

Is this really true? What if you're lifting at a deficit? Then it's not really the program that's holding you back still and would switching programs help?

As written, deficit is not recommend for either starting strength or 5x5. Both programs are primarily about getting stronger ASAP whilst gaining experience in compound lifts.

You can (and I have) run whilst on a deficit but as you say, a stall will occur sooner than at maintenance or surplus and it will be impossible/very difficult to rectify with a deload. In that case you need to decide whether to eat more and resume the program with weight increases, continue with the deficit and try to hold your performance for as long as possible, or switch to something else.

cs2thecox

I went and found a trainer when the following happened to me on Stronglifts 5x5...
- I was failing at the deadlifts EVERY TIME
- I plateaued at overhead press completely
- My squats were still getting heavier but I started worrying about my form
- I got bored...

It got me into lifting though, which was great. I now have a trainer set my plan and I see him maybe once every 3-4 weeks to check in and tweak things a little if I need. He also sorts out my nutrition, which has made a difference to the results I'm seeing.
Well worth it in my opinion - you don't have to spend lots on seeing a trainer multiple times a week, but 1 session a month or so can make a real difference.

DresdenSinn

I'm in the 108+ month category and gains don't come easy or quickly anymore

bioklutz

StealthHealth wrote: »

richardgavel wrote: »

bioklutz wrote: »

dalerst wrote: »

I'm not at the deload stage yet, still working on proper form before I start increasing the weights to much. especially on my deadlift.

Keep at it. Once you get to the point where deloads don't help get more weight on the bar it is time to switch programs. Or if you have been at it for 6 months and feeling bored - try a new program.

Is this really true? What if you're lifting at a deficit? Then it's not really the program that's holding you back still and would switching programs help?

As written, deficit is not recommend for either starting strength or 5x5. Both programs are primarily about getting stronger ASAP whilst gaining experience in compound lifts.

You can (and I have) run whilst on a deficit but as you say, a stall will occur sooner than at maintenance or surplus and it will be impossible/very difficult to rectify with a deload. In that case you need to decide whether to eat more and resume the program with weight increases, continue with the deficit and try to hold your performance for as long as possible, or switch to something else.

I usually find that switching programs helps. It might be the excitement of trying something new, or a different rep/set scheme, or an extra day between a certain lift or a combination of all of these things - It seems to help getting a little extra weight on the bar (even if it is a much smaller increase).

dalerst

So far I'm finding the programme to be beneficial but still early days. Currently eating at a surplus of around 200kcals per day and this week gained 1lb. My target weight for the minute is 12st 6lb so 10lb to gain.