3 week cut with heavy workout program
tomjanecourtney
Posts: 97 Member
I’m a 61 yr old retired guy on a boat in London.
In March 17 I was 226 lbs/ 30% fat / 5’10”, too much good wine and food....
Never trained before but I do everything to excess.
1 month later I was 206 lbs, basically stopped eating.
May 17 joined a gym and got some PT and My Fitness Pal.
Trained 3 or 4 times a week since then, each session between 2 and 3 hrs weights, find cardio tedious.
Now, Oct 17 I am 188 lbs / 23% fat and , if I say so myself, looking pretty good (comparatively).
Target is 180 lbs / 15% fat.
The Question is, is this a realistic target at my age?
Determined to ignore and work through the seemingly weekly strains and injuries which are inevitable when you workout at my age
On a 3 week cut with Macros calculated from Michael Matthews’ book ‘Bigger, Leaner, Stronger’.
2150 cals, Protein 45% - Carbs 30% - Fat 25%
And
Working out 3 days @ 1 1/2 hrs ish
Day 1 - Chest / Shoulders
Day 3 - Back / Arms
Day 5 - Legs / core
A swim day
In March 17 I was 226 lbs/ 30% fat / 5’10”, too much good wine and food....
Never trained before but I do everything to excess.
1 month later I was 206 lbs, basically stopped eating.
May 17 joined a gym and got some PT and My Fitness Pal.
Trained 3 or 4 times a week since then, each session between 2 and 3 hrs weights, find cardio tedious.
Now, Oct 17 I am 188 lbs / 23% fat and , if I say so myself, looking pretty good (comparatively).
Target is 180 lbs / 15% fat.
The Question is, is this a realistic target at my age?
Determined to ignore and work through the seemingly weekly strains and injuries which are inevitable when you workout at my age
On a 3 week cut with Macros calculated from Michael Matthews’ book ‘Bigger, Leaner, Stronger’.
2150 cals, Protein 45% - Carbs 30% - Fat 25%
And
Working out 3 days @ 1 1/2 hrs ish
Day 1 - Chest / Shoulders
Day 3 - Back / Arms
Day 5 - Legs / core
A swim day
0
Replies
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tomjanecourtney wrote: »
Determined to ignore and work through the seemingly weekly strains and injuries which are inevitable when you workout at my age
working through DOMS, fine, working through injuries, stupid and counterproductive.1 -
Thee weeks to lose 8 pounds is quite aggressive and unhealthy. How are you calculating BF%? What program are you following? No program would have you lifting to the point of injury.
Ignoring and working through weekly injuries and strains sounds quite harsh to be doing to your body, your are in this to be healthy and strong not broken and weak.0 -
TavistockToad wrote: »tomjanecourtney wrote: »
Determined to ignore and work through the seemingly weekly strains and injuries which are inevitable when you workout at my age
working through DOMS, fine, working through injuries, stupid and counterproductive.
Agree mostly.
There are alot of injuries that can be worked around/with if done with reasonabe sense that actually promote healing then just resting and producing scar tissue.
Example 1: A torn intercostal muscle in the rib cage is very painful yet it's perfectly fine to still squat or deadlift.
Example 2: A strained hamstring can still benefit from light deadlifts or squats.tomjanecourtney wrote: »I’m a 61 yr old retired guy
Target is 180 lbs / 15% fat.
The Question is, is this a realistic target at my age?
On a 3 week cut with Macros calculated from Michael Matthews’ book ‘Bigger, Leaner, Stronger’.
Day 1 - Chest / Shoulders
Day 3 - Back / Arms
Day 5 - Legs / core
There isn't a age that goal isn't reasonable.
You.might find doing a four day routine with compound lifts a little easier and efficient on your body than doing a split routine.
Mon- Bench/light OHP
Tues- Squat/light deadlift
Thurs- OHP/light Bench
Fri- Deadlift/light squat
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The (optimistic) target of 180/15% is by April 18, should’ve made that more clear.
I expect I will be on another mini cut January and again in April. I’ve pencilled in 3 x 3 wk mini cuts followed by 10 week lean (hopefully) mini gains. This seems a logical program, time will tell
Working around the injuries /strains, not ignoring them and taking advice from Pros on how to do it.1 -
Why the impatience? 8 lbs in 3 weeks would almost certainly result in muscle mass loss. And losing 8 lbs won't drop BF% from 23 to 15%. Weight loss and BF loss is not a 1 to 1 ratio.1
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TavistockToad wrote: »tomjanecourtney wrote: »
Determined to ignore and work through the seemingly weekly strains and injuries which are inevitable when you workout at my age
working through DOMS, fine, working through injuries, stupid and counterproductive.
My post of 3.40 hopefully clarified my strategy, I am not stupid as you presumed, maybe a less harsh tone would have been more appropriate.....
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tomjanecourtney wrote: »
Yes, that makes more sense.0 -
tomjanecourtney wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »tomjanecourtney wrote: »
Determined to ignore and work through the seemingly weekly strains and injuries which are inevitable when you workout at my age
working through DOMS, fine, working through injuries, stupid and counterproductive.
My post of 3.40 hopefully clarified my strategy, I am not stupid as you presumed, maybe a less harsh tone would have been more appropriate.....
It's written text, there is no tone.2 -
Eventually, you'll reach a healthy weight and body fat percentage if you eat and exercise appropriately. Your age is not a limiting factor. Your idea of meeting a schedule is a limiting factor, so please discard that and just live appropriately.5
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TavistockToad wrote: »tomjanecourtney wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »tomjanecourtney wrote: »
Determined to ignore and work through the seemingly weekly strains and injuries which are inevitable when you workout at my age
working through DOMS, fine, working through injuries, stupid and counterproductive.
My post of 3.40 hopefully clarified my strategy, I am not stupid as you presumed, maybe a less harsh tone would have been more appropriate.....
It's written text, there is no tone.
“Stupid” you may as well have called me a toad......
or maybe it’s just your way.
My last comment on your ‘motivating’ post.
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JeromeBarry1 wrote: »Eventually, you'll reach a healthy weight and body fat percentage if you eat and exercise appropriately. Your age is not a limiting factor. Your idea of meeting a schedule is a limiting factor, so please discard that and just live appropriately.
You’re probably correct but I have always set targets for achievements and I find it works for me, well most of the time.
I need to have a measurement of progress towards goals. Just wish the Fat % on my ridiculously expensive scales was more accurate. Used a super duper body monitor at the gym which the PT reckons is accurate with his visual assessment of me. My scales show 4% more fat?????
‘Everything to excess’, just the way I’m wired
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Where is 3.40?
I've read that those bodyfat scales are often inaccurate because any flucuation in your water/hydration messes them up.
Calipers are better (and cheap).0 -
tomjanecourtney wrote: »JeromeBarry1 wrote: »Eventually, you'll reach a healthy weight and body fat percentage if you eat and exercise appropriately. Your age is not a limiting factor. Your idea of meeting a schedule is a limiting factor, so please discard that and just live appropriately.
You’re probably correct but I have always set targets for achievements and I find it works for me, well most of the time.
I need to have a measurement of progress towards goals. Just wish the Fat % on my ridiculously expensive scales was more accurate. Used a super duper body monitor at the gym which the PT reckons is accurate with his visual assessment of me. My scales show 4% more fat?????
‘Everything to excess’, just the way I’m wired
As long as you don't get crazy of things don't happen on the schedule you are planning for. The body and weight loss/ muscle building don't always go in the most optimum ways. BTW, there really is no completely accurate way short of an autopsy to measure BF%. All methods, even the best like Dexa or Hydrostatic have variables. When you get to the point where you like how you look and are satisfied, does it really matter what the exact BF% is?0 -
5 complete (successfull) days now on 2150 calories per day, a 20% reduction on my calculated TDEE (total daily energy expenditure) ie. average calories burned per day.
2150 Kcals from -
240g of Protein - 160g of Carbs - 60g of Fat
Weight training every second day.
Michael Mathews’ book ‘Bigger Better Stronger has excellent guidance on these calculations. We’ll see how good they are as I will stick to this and be within a couple of percent of the target calorie breakdown daily.
No specific target for weight loss in these mini cuts, just following the advice and looking in the mirror hoping to see an Ab pop up
Plan to weigh myself once per week for the 3 week duration of this mini cut, first weigh in Monday which is my 62nd birthday.1 -
tomjanecourtney wrote: »5 complete (successfull) days now on 2150 calories per day, a 20% reduction on my calculated TDEE (total daily energy expenditure) ie. average calories burned per day.
2150 Kcals from -
240g of Protein - 160g of Carbs - 60g of Fat
Weight training every second day.
Michael Mathews’ book ‘Bigger Better Stronger has excellent guidance on these calculations. We’ll see how good they are as I will stick to this and be within a couple of percent of the target calorie breakdown daily.
No specific target for weight loss in these mini cuts, just following the advice and looking in the mirror hoping to see an Ab pop up
Plan to weigh myself once per week for the 3 week duration of this mini cut, first weigh in Monday which is my 62nd birthday.
Sounds like you have it all planned. Good luck!0 -
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[filbo132
Of course 15% fat is realistic, you could even go to 10%
Training 3 times a week is perfect at your age and I suggest you follow Mike Matthews book, he gives good advice and has a solid workout program too.
Thx Filbo
Nice to wake up to some encouragement.
My will power and determination,
( bordering on OCD, )
will ensure I get results, hopefully my genetics can keep pace
Started the Training section of the book last week and at my following gym session added approximately 20% to my weights lifted. Was pleasantly surprised to find I managed the extra iron and enjoyed the rush it gave.
Struggling though with concept of one to one & half hour gym sessions. Normally I’m two & half to three hours. I feel guilty leaving ‘early’ and still able to walk and lift my arms:)
Like the weigh daily and take a weekly average concept so will include this.
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Definitely doing too much.
Everything to Excess is my mantra
Cut progress - TDEE 2650 kcals cut to 2150 kcals
Started on 16/10/17 at 188.2 lbs
Today 25/10/17 now 183.4 lbs
That’s a 4.8lb loss in 9 days, probably a bit too much.
Will add 200 kcals to my daily allowance making a 300 deficit (was 500 deficit)
Mirror mirror on the wall still showing a bit of a bulge on my loins and chest/underarm, a bit to go yet....0 -
tomjanecourtney wrote: »Now, Oct 17 I am 188 lbs / 23% fat and , if I say so myself, looking pretty good (comparatively).
Target is 180 lbs / 15% fat. The Question is, is this a realistic target at my age?
I'm 67 now and was 65.5 when I started my current weight loss effort. Lost 38# in 18 months from 196 to 158. Lost most of it in the 1st 7 months and have been maintaining at 158 +/- 3# ever since, while also reducing my BF from over 20% down to 10% as measured by hydro and 13% as measured by DXA, which averages out to 11.5%.
I think you said above that your goal was to reach 180 by April 2018 and that as of yesterday you are already at 183, so getting to 180 obviously will not be a problem. You actually have already essentially achieved your weight goal +/- 3#.
So, if you want to maintain this weight, the problem will be to continue to do so while also losing BF to drop from 23% down to 15% and in order to do that you have to recomp - - that is, gain muscle to make up for the weight of fat lost.
However, it is very hard (if not impossible) to gain muscle while on a deficit.
In my weight loss & maintenance effort, my LBM remained relatively constant at 140# +/-2# from my starting weight of 196 down to my current weight of 158, which means that all of the 38# that I lost was fat w/no appreciable muscle gain or loss while on a decifit & maintenance diet, despite working out and lifting heavy 3-5 days/wk and increasing my strength to an advanced and elite level when compared w/other men my age and weight.
Assuming that your current BF level is 23% (which I would NOT assume based on any bioelectrical device which is what I understand that you are currently using to measure you BF, but let's just assume this for now), at 183#, your LBM is 141# and your BF is 42#.
In order to reach 15%BF at 180#, you would need to increase your LBM by 12# to 153 and drop your BF by 15# to 27. Frankly, this would be impossible to do based on a deficit diet and would not be "realistic" regardless of your age.
However, based on my experience, I think that you could easily maintain your LBM at 141 +/- 2# and lose 15# of BF to reach 15% BF with a goal weight of 165.
If that is NOT something that you want to do, then to reach 15%BF at 180, I think that you would have to go on a surplus diet together w/a heavy lifting program to gain 12# of LBM 1st and then go back on a deficit diet to lose the fat you have now plus the fat that you put on in the process so that your LBM=153 and your BF=27. This would be a more "realistic" way to achieve that goal.
FWIW, at 5'10" and 165# w/15%BF, your BMI would be 24 (and considered "normal"), while at 183 and 23%BF, it is 26.3 (and considered "overweight"). Although BMI is an imperfect measuring device, in your case, I think it is a pretty accurate indicator of your status at those weights and BF levels.
In any event, I hope you find my comments informative and useful.
Good luck in achieving your weight and BF objectives!2 -
sgt1372
Impressive post, think you may have nailed it. What you say makes perfect sense, I think...
Will read it again in the morning with my calculator in hand.0
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