All of it
Replies
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DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »SnackherBarrell wrote: »CaptainFantastic01 wrote: »SnackherBarrell wrote: »CaptainFantastic01 wrote: »SnackherBarrell wrote: »SnackherBarrell wrote: »cee134 correct me if I'm wrong but isnt fridays when @DeadliftsAndSprinkles is supposed to draw us something?
I want a unicorn flexing for Friday
As long as someone requests something.
Unicorn flexing? Wearing an RIP Ron Weasley shirt
IT MUST HAPPEN
Do it.
Instead of now I will say please
Do it please. Now.
Probably should tag her so she knows. @DeadliftsandMapleSyrup
So it's apparently impossible for me to draw a unicorn like how a human would flex so you're going to have to settle for a standing-normally-but-buff unicorn instead.
It’s everything I dreamed it’d be0 -
DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
well yeah that's what i mean- then you're getting into the wand is like "the one ring" from LOTR levels of sentience, which she never wrote about.
and fwiw- it's just a plothole lol.
she should've just written that Grindewald confronted him outside his home and beat him fair and square and took ownership of the wand that way. the whole "theft" thing just makes it more inconsistent.
and that's all my original comment was even about lol- she's got a lot of inconsistencies like those throughout the books, at least when put next to other writers who wrote comparable series.
also fwiw- i don't even really like the books or movies, I just like Voldemort because i always root for the bad guy.0 -
DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
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DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
that's part of the issue- he shot at gregorovitch with the wand, which the final fight scene in the same book at least, proves won't work. the wand won't turn against its own master. that's how Riddle loses in the end. Harry is pleading with him to put the wand down because it's not his. Riddle doesn't and he gets killed.
they tried to fix it in the movies somewhat, by establishing that Grindewald didn't even fire a spell, he just takes the wand and ducks out. but all that did was make the issue more inconsistent.
just a big plot hole that has the hilarious addition of making Voldemort the true master over the wand that kills him in the end. which is even funnier if you think the wand is sentient in some ways (in the movies at least)- because harry just snaps the wand in the end.0 -
DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »
Just bumping this to the next page.2 -
DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
that's part of the issue- he shot at gregorovitch with the wand, which the final fight scene in the same book at least, proves won't work. the wand won't turn against its own master. that's how Riddle loses in the end. Harry is pleading with him to put the wand down because it's not his. Riddle doesn't and he gets killed.
they tried to fix it in the movies somewhat, by establishing that Grindewald didn't even fire a spell, he just takes the wand and ducks out. but all that did was make the issue more inconsistent.
just a big plot hole that has the hilarious addition of making Voldemort the true master over the wand that kills him in the end. which is even funnier if you think the wand is sentient in some ways (in the movies at least)- because harry just snaps the wand in the end.
I'm enjoying looking up HP facts right now.0 -
DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
that's part of the issue- he shot at gregorovitch with the wand, which the final fight scene in the same book at least, proves won't work. the wand won't turn against its own master. that's how Riddle loses in the end. Harry is pleading with him to put the wand down because it's not his. Riddle doesn't and he gets killed.
they tried to fix it in the movies somewhat, by establishing that Grindewald didn't even fire a spell, he just takes the wand and ducks out. but all that did was make the issue more inconsistent.
just a big plot hole that has the hilarious addition of making Voldemort the true master over the wand that kills him in the end. which is even funnier if you think the wand is sentient in some ways (in the movies at least)- because harry just snaps the wand in the end.Grindelwald broke into the wandmaker's workshop, and succeeded in claiming ownership of the fabled wand by waiting until Gregorovitch came and then casting a stunning spell on him, making himself the rightful owner.
The Elder Wand which has already sworn its allegiance to Harry (another story altogether). Therefore, when Voldemort utters the Death Curse and Harry utters the Disarming Charm, the curse backfires on Voldemort, killing him.
So the only question I have is what wand did Grindelwald use to stun Gregorovitch.0 -
DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
that's part of the issue- he shot at gregorovitch with the wand, which the final fight scene in the same book at least, proves won't work. the wand won't turn against its own master. that's how Riddle loses in the end. Harry is pleading with him to put the wand down because it's not his. Riddle doesn't and he gets killed.
they tried to fix it in the movies somewhat, by establishing that Grindewald didn't even fire a spell, he just takes the wand and ducks out. but all that did was make the issue more inconsistent.
just a big plot hole that has the hilarious addition of making Voldemort the true master over the wand that kills him in the end. which is even funnier if you think the wand is sentient in some ways (in the movies at least)- because harry just snaps the wand in the end.Grindelwald broke into the wandmaker's workshop, and succeeded in claiming ownership of the fabled wand by waiting until Gregorovitch came and then casting a stunning spell on him, making himself the rightful owner.
The Elder Wand which has already sworn its allegiance to Harry (another story altogether). Therefore, when Voldemort utters the Death Curse and Harry utters the Disarming Charm, the curse backfires on Voldemort, killing him.
So the only question I have is what wand did Grindelwald use to stun Gregorovitch.
stupify?
I mean, which wand did he use. His own or the Elder Wand?0 -
Besides HP I'm also somehow reading about Kyle Gass.
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DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
that's part of the issue- he shot at gregorovitch with the wand, which the final fight scene in the same book at least, proves won't work. the wand won't turn against its own master. that's how Riddle loses in the end. Harry is pleading with him to put the wand down because it's not his. Riddle doesn't and he gets killed.
they tried to fix it in the movies somewhat, by establishing that Grindewald didn't even fire a spell, he just takes the wand and ducks out. but all that did was make the issue more inconsistent.
just a big plot hole that has the hilarious addition of making Voldemort the true master over the wand that kills him in the end. which is even funnier if you think the wand is sentient in some ways (in the movies at least)- because harry just snaps the wand in the end.Grindelwald broke into the wandmaker's workshop, and succeeded in claiming ownership of the fabled wand by waiting until Gregorovitch came and then casting a stunning spell on him, making himself the rightful owner.
The Elder Wand which has already sworn its allegiance to Harry (another story altogether). Therefore, when Voldemort utters the Death Curse and Harry utters the Disarming Charm, the curse backfires on Voldemort, killing him.
So the only question I have is what wand did Grindelwald use to stun Gregorovitch.
stupify?
I mean, which wand did he use. His own or the Elder Wand?
Also I didn't read what you said, obviously. I'm a skimmer and I nail it 50% of the time
50% of the time it works 100% of the time.1 -
DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
that's part of the issue- he shot at gregorovitch with the wand, which the final fight scene in the same book at least, proves won't work. the wand won't turn against its own master. that's how Riddle loses in the end. Harry is pleading with him to put the wand down because it's not his. Riddle doesn't and he gets killed.
they tried to fix it in the movies somewhat, by establishing that Grindewald didn't even fire a spell, he just takes the wand and ducks out. but all that did was make the issue more inconsistent.
just a big plot hole that has the hilarious addition of making Voldemort the true master over the wand that kills him in the end. which is even funnier if you think the wand is sentient in some ways (in the movies at least)- because harry just snaps the wand in the end.
If George Lucas owned Harry Potter then maybe in the future remasters of movie 8 he'd add in a little scream and some cgi blood
as long as they also cgi johnny depp out of all the new movies in the eventual remasters then i'd be happy with it.0 -
DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
that's part of the issue- he shot at gregorovitch with the wand, which the final fight scene in the same book at least, proves won't work. the wand won't turn against its own master. that's how Riddle loses in the end. Harry is pleading with him to put the wand down because it's not his. Riddle doesn't and he gets killed.
they tried to fix it in the movies somewhat, by establishing that Grindewald didn't even fire a spell, he just takes the wand and ducks out. but all that did was make the issue more inconsistent.
just a big plot hole that has the hilarious addition of making Voldemort the true master over the wand that kills him in the end. which is even funnier if you think the wand is sentient in some ways (in the movies at least)- because harry just snaps the wand in the end.
If George Lucas owned Harry Potter then maybe in the future remasters of movie 8 he'd add in a little scream and some cgi blood
as long as they also cgi johnny depp out of all the new movies in the eventual remasters then i'd be happy with it.
Personally I think they should've just had Jared Harris play a young Dumbledore because hello, wouldn't that have been great to have the actual son of the original actor to portray Dumbledore play him almost 20 years later???
Then Jude Law could've been Grindewald.
Much better.
Or Collin Ferrell could have been grendelwald. That was such a dope character he played! I’m for jude law as dumbledore. Johnny Depp needs a break.1 -
CaptainFantastic01 wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
that's part of the issue- he shot at gregorovitch with the wand, which the final fight scene in the same book at least, proves won't work. the wand won't turn against its own master. that's how Riddle loses in the end. Harry is pleading with him to put the wand down because it's not his. Riddle doesn't and he gets killed.
they tried to fix it in the movies somewhat, by establishing that Grindewald didn't even fire a spell, he just takes the wand and ducks out. but all that did was make the issue more inconsistent.
just a big plot hole that has the hilarious addition of making Voldemort the true master over the wand that kills him in the end. which is even funnier if you think the wand is sentient in some ways (in the movies at least)- because harry just snaps the wand in the end.
If George Lucas owned Harry Potter then maybe in the future remasters of movie 8 he'd add in a little scream and some cgi blood
as long as they also cgi johnny depp out of all the new movies in the eventual remasters then i'd be happy with it.
Personally I think they should've just had Jared Harris play a young Dumbledore because hello, wouldn't that have been great to have the actual son of the original actor to portray Dumbledore play him almost 20 years later???
Then Jude Law could've been Grindewald.
Much better.
Or Collin Ferrell could have been grendelwald. That was such a dope character he played! I’m for jude law as dumbledore. Johnny Depp needs a break.
for real- did you ever see the Fright Night remake where Colin played the lead evil vampire? man he was so good in it and had a lot of fun in the role too you could tell. he'd have been a great villain for this whole series.
instead, now we gotta suffer through yet another johhny depp movie where he wears too much makeup and makes goofy faces for 2 hours.0 -
DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »CaptainFantastic01 wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
that's part of the issue- he shot at gregorovitch with the wand, which the final fight scene in the same book at least, proves won't work. the wand won't turn against its own master. that's how Riddle loses in the end. Harry is pleading with him to put the wand down because it's not his. Riddle doesn't and he gets killed.
they tried to fix it in the movies somewhat, by establishing that Grindewald didn't even fire a spell, he just takes the wand and ducks out. but all that did was make the issue more inconsistent.
just a big plot hole that has the hilarious addition of making Voldemort the true master over the wand that kills him in the end. which is even funnier if you think the wand is sentient in some ways (in the movies at least)- because harry just snaps the wand in the end.
If George Lucas owned Harry Potter then maybe in the future remasters of movie 8 he'd add in a little scream and some cgi blood
as long as they also cgi johnny depp out of all the new movies in the eventual remasters then i'd be happy with it.
Personally I think they should've just had Jared Harris play a young Dumbledore because hello, wouldn't that have been great to have the actual son of the original actor to portray Dumbledore play him almost 20 years later???
Then Jude Law could've been Grindewald.
Much better.
Or Collin Ferrell could have been grendelwald. That was such a dope character he played! I’m for jude law as dumbledore. Johnny Depp needs a break.
for real- did you ever see the Fright Night remake where Colin played the lead evil vampire? man he was so good in it and had a lot of fun in the role too you could tell. he'd have been a great villain for this whole series.
instead, now we gotta suffer through yet another johhny depp movie where he wears too much makeup and makes goofy faces for 2 hours.
I watched a clip from Curb Your Enthusiasm yesterday that had Anton Yelchin in it. Normally when celebrities die it doesn't effect me but ugh, every time I see him on screen it's awful now
yeah i hate celebrity worship generally, but he seemed like a good kid. plus he was great as Odd Thomas in the movie, even though the movie itself was only okay. i can't read the books now without picturing him as the character at least.0 -
CaptainFantastic01 wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »DeadliftsAndSprinkles wrote: »I am a HP fan, but in no way an expert, and needed to look up this Elder Wand biz.
Perhaps the most famous fallacy surrounding the Elder Wand is the supposition that the prospective owner must kill the current one. This came at a cost for Lord Voldemort, who falsely assumed that murdering Severus Snape was the key to the wand’s control. Though killing has been a popular method of claiming the wand (see the ‘long and bloody history’ section for examples), it is by no means the only way.
We know the Elder Wand allied with Draco Malfoy, who disarmed rather than killed Albus Dumbledore. It later switched its loyalty to Harry Potter during his escape from Malfoy Manor. While deaths did occur in both situations (Dumbledore and Dobby respectively), neither Draco nor Harry committed the act. Similarly, Albus Dumbledore managed to control the Elder Wand without killing its previous master who, in fact, outlived him.
However, the belief that the Elder Wand will automatically switch allegiance whenever the owner is disarmed is also false, for one very important reason...
The Elder Wand decides its own destiny
Mr Ollivander’s famous statement ‘the wand chooses the wizard’ rings just as true for the Elder Wand as any other. However, according to J.K. Rowling, there are some distinct tendencies in its manner of choosing: ‘The Elder Wand knows no loyalty except to strength. So it’s completely unsentimental. It will only go where the power is.’
https://www.pottermore.com/features/everything-we-know-about-the-elder-wand
read that myself but its still a broken theory- to accept that theory, and the novels as written, you'd have to accept that Grindewald *did* take true ownership of the elder wand...
but he didn't win by power, he won by theft, a cowardly act. the elder wand most likely wouldn't respect ownership by a coward, by a person who didn't even risk his own life for it.
if anything- i'd think the wand *would* have chosen Riddle even more so after she made that statement. the wand, along with the other hallows, was meant to help make one the master of death. and Riddle had already done that on his own, without a single deathly hallow in his possession.
you could make an argument that the wand itself is truly sentient, and could maybe even have a way to determine it's own destiny, and thus it changed it's allegiance to wind up with whoever it wanted in the end sure...but that's taking things pretty far for something she never actually wrote.
Well, maybe it jumped a step? Maybe when Grindewald had it, it never truly belonged to him? And Dumbledore knew he shouldn't have it so when Dumbledore came along to take it from him the wand was like, "oh, thank god man, I've been with this dude for like, 50 years and I friggen hate it. Take me, I'm yours!"
Again I don't remember much from the books or movies as it's been awhile since I've read or watched them. But I'm curious if this is a plot hole or not.
Here is some interesting info.
Mykew Gregorovitch
At some point many years ago before 1899, the wand eventually ended up in the possession of the wandmaker Mykew Gregorovitch. Upon realising that it was the most powerful wand in existence, Gregorovitch began experimenting to try and duplicate its powers. Gregorovitch, somewhat foolish by nature and hoping it would improve business, started a rumour about him possessing the wand and his efforts to replicate its properties. The result came one night between 1899-1945 when Gregorovitch heard someone breaking into his workshop. He promptly ran inside and saw an intruder had taken the wand: a blonde haired young man who then promptly shot a Stunning Spell at Gregorovitch to acquire mastery of the wand [Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows] before leaping out the window. Gregorovitch never found out who stole the wand.
Gellert Grindelwald
Main article: Gellert Grindelwald
Gellert Grindelwald was considered to be one of the most powerful Dark Wizards of all time, second only to Lord Voldemort. He was schooled at Durmstrang Institute and later struck up a friendship with Albus Dumbledore, when he lived in Godric's Hollow for a summer with his great-aunt Bathilda Bagshot following his expulsion from Durmstrang. The two made plans to find the Deathly Hallows and create a world in which Muggles would, of necessity, be subservient to wizards and witches for the greater good. This partnership fell apart after the two were involved in a vicious three-way duel with Aberforth Dumbledore, which resulted in Ariana Dumbledore's accidental death.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Elder_Wand
So it seems the wand went with the most powerful wizard which would mean Grindelwald did master it. Which is why I think the next movie will show us what caused the Elder Wand to turn from Grindelwald to Dumbledore. (although they may draw it out with more movies)
that's part of the issue- he shot at gregorovitch with the wand, which the final fight scene in the same book at least, proves won't work. the wand won't turn against its own master. that's how Riddle loses in the end. Harry is pleading with him to put the wand down because it's not his. Riddle doesn't and he gets killed.
they tried to fix it in the movies somewhat, by establishing that Grindewald didn't even fire a spell, he just takes the wand and ducks out. but all that did was make the issue more inconsistent.
just a big plot hole that has the hilarious addition of making Voldemort the true master over the wand that kills him in the end. which is even funnier if you think the wand is sentient in some ways (in the movies at least)- because harry just snaps the wand in the end.
If George Lucas owned Harry Potter then maybe in the future remasters of movie 8 he'd add in a little scream and some cgi blood
as long as they also cgi johnny depp out of all the new movies in the eventual remasters then i'd be happy with it.
Personally I think they should've just had Jared Harris play a young Dumbledore because hello, wouldn't that have been great to have the actual son of the original actor to portray Dumbledore play him almost 20 years later???
Then Jude Law could've been Grindewald.
Much better.
Or Collin Ferrell could have been grendelwald. That was such a dope character he played! I’m for jude law as dumbledore. Johnny Depp needs a break.
for real- did you ever see the Fright Night remake where Colin played the lead evil vampire? man he was so good in it and had a lot of fun in the role too you could tell. he'd have been a great villain for this whole series.
instead, now we gotta suffer through yet another johhny depp movie where he wears too much makeup and makes goofy faces for 2 hours.
But really though! This one he’s in disguise and he’s sneaky sneaky “I’m not bad” but he is AND THEN THE WALL COMES DOWN and he’s just full on evil1 -
Plus it’s more likely Jude law would hook up with him over Johnny dep1
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So I figured out that if you put Meme in the title of a thread it gets closed because the noobs come on and post stuff they shouldn't.
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No one wanted to play guess what the Infinity Gauntlet can't do, today.
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