Sugar Woo
Replies
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Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.
Me too, but my husband objects...14 -
100_PROOF_ wrote: »Just ignore the woo's.
Some are merited but many are not. You're free to express your opinion (as long as the 1st A remains intact in America) and many opinions woo'd in the past, have prevailed over time.
Despite the penchant on the Net (and on MFP) to cultivate "likes," "friends," and "followers," the people who buck the trend and think their own thoughts are "right" more often than not.
So don't let the woo-birds deter you. Speak your mind and be true to yourself.
So should misinformation go unchallenged then? Should people let misinformation that is potentially harmful to this community go just because some take offense to being wooed ?
How will newcomers learn the truth if we are letting misinformation be spread just to spare hurt feelings? especially in the " fake news" culture we live in. Shouldn't we be happy to see myths and bunk science be put to bed?
It’s only misinformation until it’s not.
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As to the herion/sugar/dopamine connection: whatever’s supplying the hit, there are some of us who can’t moderate, and the use of it gets out of control. And then this continued attempt and failure to control causes mental anguish. Total abstinence, for some people, is the only way to be free of this. I’m not suggesting that this works for everyone, it’s a just potential solution, because it does indeed work for some people. But there are people who have a hard time understanding that there are people out there whose control regulators are busted, and so of course it looks like bs to them. But if it works for people, I don’t think it should be discounted by members of a supportive community.22
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lemurcat12 wrote: »... and here’s the debate: you can find that heroin study. Two seconds on google; the actual study.
The issue seems to be that you misinterpreted or mischaracterized the study and suggested that sugar and heroin are especially alike (and unlike other substances) with the comment.
As another poster above pointed out, that's not true. To suggest that "lighting up a particular part of the brain" makes sugar more like heroin than, say, fat, or means that sugar must be addictive is, of course, incorrect (or even woo).I should have phrased the second part better and said; “When I eat a well balanced diet with whole fruits and veggies, lean meat, limited grains, and no processed food, I don’t get hungry.” Again; apologies. I used the second person and inferred first person. Woo that.
I am wondering if you are using a unique definition of "processed foods" because of course grains are processed, and almost no one eats NO processed foods. Many of them are even quite healthful and certainly don't cause hunger in the average person (no foods I eat cause me to be hungry, although some are less filling than others).
I mostly (and always have, even when I was overweight) cook from whole foods.
I also eat a variety of processed foods in varying amounts and think the idea that one should completely avoid them at all times or "be hungry" is odd. I go out to nice (and interesting) restaurants (I live in a city with a good restaurant culture), I occasionally eat dark chocolate or make a dessert, I'll eat grains, I eat tofu and tempeh and occasional protein powder. I'm not eating meat or dairy now, but when I do I eat cottage cheese and greek yogurt (plain) and lots of wonderful cheeses, and smoked salmon and smoked trout. I currently eat plenty of canned beans and always use canned tomatoes in the winter. Those are all processed foods that I don't see as bad for me and they don't make me hungry.
I worked til 10:30 last night and was out of leftovers and didn't feel like cooking, so I grabbed an Amy's frozen meal. Seemed reasonable from a nutrition perspective and didn't make me hungry. Not my preference (and extremely rare for me) since I am basically a home cooking/restaurant kind of snob, but hardly the end of the world or something that means I didn't eat well yesterday.
That's why pronouncements about processed food being inherently bad (and all the same) as if the actual ingredients did not matter tends to strike people the wrong way. That, plus the idea that we all get hungry based on the same foods -- there's clearly a ton of diversity there.
Different foods work for different folks. No pronouncements coming from me.5 -
Despite the penchant on the Net (and on MFP) to cultivate "likes," "friends," and "followers," the people who buck the trend and think their own thoughts are "right" more often than not.
Do you have any actual examples from, say, the last 30 years, of people who bucked the trend of scientific consensus and were right? Are Flat Earthers right ‘more often than not’?21 -
As to the herion/sugar/dopamine connection: whatever’s supplying the hit, there are some of us who can’t moderate, and the use of it gets out of control. And then this continued attempt and failure to control causes mental anguish. Total abstinence, for some people, is the only way to be free of this. I’m not suggesting that this works for everyone, it’s a just potential solution, because it does indeed work for some people. But there are people who have a hard time understanding that there are people out there whose control regulators are busted, and so of course it looks like bs to them. But if it works for people, I don’t think it should be discounted by members of a supportive community.
This supportive community has seen many "demon" sugar, and "I have absolutely no control" posts---lately it's a landslide. Why? Because the media is convincing people that this is their problem. It's very convincing. People that decide to completely eliminate sugar in their diet, first of all cannot, because: fruits and vegetables. Secondly, eventually they give up and binge--hence " I'm a binge eater, help!" threads. The people that are successful longtime on MFP have been there, and their advice is to learn to moderate. You can do whatever you'd like, but success speaks for itself.25 -
Despite the penchant on the Net (and on MFP) to cultivate "likes," "friends," and "followers," the people who buck the trend and think their own thoughts are "right" more often than not.
Do you have any actual examples from, say, the last 30 years, of people who bucked the trend of scientific consensus and were right? Are Flat Earthers right ‘more often than not’?
This is a typical contrarean and conspiracy theory line of thought. There might be one or two issolated cases out of tens of thousands of contrarean theories that actual pan out and these are held up as proof positive that those who have minority oppionons are somehow always the truth tellers.
It makes for good headlines but usually those who are on the opposite side of the major theories in science are their because their theories are wrong.10 -
As to the herion/sugar/dopamine connection: whatever’s supplying the hit, there are some of us who can’t moderate, and the use of it gets out of control. And then this continued attempt and failure to control causes mental anguish. Total abstinence, for some people, is the only way to be free of this. I’m not suggesting that this works for everyone, it’s a just potential solution, because it does indeed work for some people. But there are people who have a hard time understanding that there are people out there whose control regulators are busted, and so of course it looks like bs to them. But if it works for people, I don’t think it should be discounted by members of a supportive community.
You cannot totally abstain from consuming sugar unless you are planning to never eat fruits, vegetables, dairy, and other items in which sugar is naturally occurring. Additionally, there is no physically addictive substance in sugar, in any of the various forms of it. Do some people have difficulty moderating their intake of yummy foods, many of which are sweet in nature? Sure. That doesn’t make the sugar “addictive” in the same way that heroin/opiates are which is what your original claim which got woo’d suggests. Additionally, what is often pointed out but the “sugar is evil” camp never really discusses, is that the FOODS that people have control issues with are not exclusively sugar. They are usually a combination of sugar and fat: ice cream, cookies, etc. people who claim that sugar is just as bad as narcotics don’t describe the same desperation and rock bottom experiences that true addicts describe. Have you ever prostituted yourself for a hit of domino sugar? Have you ever stolen money from a loved one to get a fix of the cookies you crave?
No one here is saying that some people don’t have difficulty controlling their intake of certain foods - and that for some people restriction isn’t a viable option. What we are saying is that sugar isn’t addictive, and that you CAN learn to moderate it. Your receptors aren’t broken. Learning to moderate is challenging, and failure to do so can cause anguish - but there are countless people on these boards who thought, when they started, that they were just like what you were describing. That they would never be able to learn to control the urges and eat foods in moderation - that it was sugar or whatever their demon was to blame. So many of those people, through reading these boards with an open mind and engaging in some of the very helpful strategies that patient members have shared, have learned to be able to eat all the foods they love in moderation. There’s another group that feels abstinence/extreme restriction is a better choice for them. It’s a viable strategy for some, but it isn’t because sugar is addictive.29 -
As to the herion/sugar/dopamine connection: whatever’s supplying the hit, there are some of us who can’t moderate, and the use of it gets out of control. And then this continued attempt and failure to control causes mental anguish. Total abstinence, for some people, is the only way to be free of this. I’m not suggesting that this works for everyone, it’s a just potential solution, because it does indeed work for some people. But there are people who have a hard time understanding that there are people out there whose control regulators are busted, and so of course it looks like bs to them. But if it works for people, I don’t think it should be discounted by members of a supportive community.
Moderating intake is a controllable behaviour just like moderating any other activity or substance. To say people cannot moderate intake is rather a suspect statement since some people find it easy to blame their behaviours on things beyond their control rather than correct them e.g. "the devil made me do it" line of reasoning. If a person can abstain completely they can also find a way to control their consumption as well, and this is the same problem I see with the 12 steps programs, they prefer to say you are too weak because of circumstances beyond your control rather than dealing with behavioural issues directly.
As for supportive communities, support doesn't always have to be complete and unflinching affirmation, it can be a kick in the butt when that's required too.16 -
Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.
Me too, but my husband objects...
8 -
Obviously nearly everybody moderates their intake to one degree or another. Only breatharians abstain altogether and they are likely sneaking food.5
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Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.
Me too, but my husband objects...
Can there be jello involved?
4 -
Of course!3
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WinoGelato wrote: »As to the herion/sugar/dopamine connection: whatever’s supplying the hit, there are some of us who can’t moderate, and the use of it gets out of control. And then this continued attempt and failure to control causes mental anguish. Total abstinence, for some people, is the only way to be free of this. I’m not suggesting that this works for everyone, it’s a just potential solution, because it does indeed work for some people. But there are people who have a hard time understanding that there are people out there whose control regulators are busted, and so of course it looks like bs to them. But if it works for people, I don’t think it should be discounted by members of a supportive community.
You cannot totally abstain from consuming sugar unless you are planning to never eat fruits, vegetables, dairy, and other items in which sugar is naturally occurring. Additionally, there is no physically addictive substance in sugar, in any of the various forms of it. Do some people have difficulty moderating their intake of yummy foods, many of which are sweet in nature? Sure. That doesn’t make the sugar “addictive” in the same way that heroin/opiates are which is what your original claim which got woo’d suggests. Additionally, what is often pointed out but the “sugar is evil” camp never really discusses, is that the FOODS that people have control issues with are not exclusively sugar. They are usually a combination of sugar and fat: ice cream, cookies, etc. people who claim that sugar is just as bad as narcotics don’t describe the same desperation and rock bottom experiences that true addicts describe. Have you ever prostituted yourself for a hit of domino sugar? Have you ever stolen money from a loved one to get a fix of the cookies you crave?
No one here is saying that some people don’t have difficulty controlling their intake of certain foods - and that for some people restriction isn’t a viable option. What we are saying is that sugar isn’t addictive, and that you CAN learn to moderate it. Your receptors aren’t broken. Learning to moderate is challenging, and failure to do so can cause anguish - but there are countless people on these boards who thought, when they started, that they were just like what you were describing. That they would never be able to learn to control the urges and eat foods in moderation - that it was sugar or whatever their demon was to blame. So many of those people, through reading these boards with an open mind and engaging in some of the very helpful strategies that patient members have shared, have learned to be able to eat all the foods they love in moderation. There’s another group that feels abstinence/extreme restriction is a better choice for them. It’s a viable strategy for some, but it isn’t because sugar is addictive.
Exactly this.4 -
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ladyhusker39 wrote: »
Only the ones that are still alive.12 -
Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.
Me too, but my husband objects...
Can there be jello involved?
Only if it is sugar free jello.5 -
WinoGelato wrote: »Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.
Me too, but my husband objects...
Can there be jello involved?
Only if it is sugar free jello.
Ketogenic rasslin'!
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WinoGelato wrote: »Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.
Me too, but my husband objects...
Can there be jello involved?
Only if it is sugar free jello.
Ketogenic rasslin'!
I just thought of another use for coconut oil!11 -
WinoGelato wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.
Me too, but my husband objects...
Can there be jello involved?
Only if it is sugar free jello.
Ketogenic rasslin'!
I just thought of another use for coconut oil!
I'm going to assume you aren't the first!6 -
Coconut sugar free jello. I’m on it.2
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WinoGelato wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »I like being woo’d.
Me too, but my husband objects...
Can there be jello involved?
Only if it is sugar free jello.
Ketogenic rasslin'!
I just thought of another use for coconut oil!
And it's a much better use than BS woo like "bulletproof coffee". 3 -
I love that what I took away from this thread is puppies = heroin16
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Just ignore the woo's.
Some are merited but many are not. You're free to express your opinion (as long as the 1st A remains intact in America) and many opinions woo'd in the past, have prevailed over time.
Despite the penchant on the Net (and on MFP) to cultivate "likes," "friends," and "followers," the people who buck the trend and think their own thoughts are "right" more often than not.
So don't let the woo-birds deter you. Speak your mind and be true to yourself.
First amendment constrains only the gubmint, and only in the US, though, not - say - the UA folks who run this place, let alone fellow forum participants . . . and "woo" is equally 'free speech'.
Couldn't agree more that no one should feel wounded by "woo"s.
LOL at contrarians usually being right, though. Sometimes, sure. But it's a good self-check to consider whether critics might have a point, especially when they're numerous.13 -
I once got woo-ed for the simple statement "I dont like cucumbers" - that was literally all my post said.
Couldnt understand anyone woo-ing that - Not exactly MFP contribution of the year but not woo worthy either (although cucumber lover Pav thought so, he later confessed to cucumber woo-ing )
However when people make statements like sugar is addictive, it lights up the brain like heroin (as if nothing else lights up the brain but addictive substances) then yes , I can understand why it was woo-ed4 -
paperpudding wrote: »I once got woo-ed for the simple statement "I dont like cucumbers" - that was literally all my post said.
I got woo'd for saying I was sad when I realized how many calories olives have.2 -
I recently replied to a member’s post who was looking for ideas about how to fight sugar cravings, and my reply got woo’d. My apologies for that reply, it was my first and I obviously didn’t know the culture in this particular community. I didn’t think my comment was woo, at least no more so than anyone else’s replies. I’m willing to accept that the woo-laid that others drink may be a different flavor than my own, and I do wish everyone the best in whatever their fitness and health goals may be.
dictionary.com/browse/woo
Just run with this official meaning instead of some unknown made up meaning.
12 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »I recently replied to a member’s post who was looking for ideas about how to fight sugar cravings, and my reply got woo’d. My apologies for that reply, it was my first and I obviously didn’t know the culture in this particular community. I didn’t think my comment was woo, at least no more so than anyone else’s replies. I’m willing to accept that the woo-laid that others drink may be a different flavor than my own, and I do wish everyone the best in whatever their fitness and health goals may be.
dictionary.com/browse/woo
Just run with this official meaning instead of some unknown made up meaning.
Or you could accept and embrace the fact that on the internet and especially on internet forums there are words that may not exist in a formal dictionary.
Words like
woo
w00t
l33t
etc.
10 -
stanmann571 wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »I recently replied to a member’s post who was looking for ideas about how to fight sugar cravings, and my reply got woo’d. My apologies for that reply, it was my first and I obviously didn’t know the culture in this particular community. I didn’t think my comment was woo, at least no more so than anyone else’s replies. I’m willing to accept that the woo-laid that others drink may be a different flavor than my own, and I do wish everyone the best in whatever their fitness and health goals may be.
dictionary.com/browse/woo
Just run with this official meaning instead of some unknown made up meaning.
Or you could accept and embrace the fact that on the internet and especially on internet forums there are words that may not exist in a formal dictionary.
Words like
woo
w00t
l33t
etc.
Here here!2
This discussion has been closed.
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