Fasted cardio?
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Finafoshizzle93 wrote: »Anyone have any anecdotal success with "faster" fat loss by incorporating fasted cardio?
That's not how fat loss works.
The fuel you use during exercise or whether that exercise is partially fuelled from food just eaten or eaten and stored at some point in the past isn't what's important - it's your long term calorie balance.
If training fasted suits you then great, it gives you more scheduling options, some people may feel and perform better.
If it doesn't suit you then your exercise performance and calorie burn from your exercise will also drop.
I saw something on You Tube recently suggesting Fasted Cardio increased results and it reminded me of something I read 20 years ago and would so do it occasionally mainly due to preferring not to eat first thing rather than for any expected benefit
Now my understanding of how we fuel exercise is limited but don't we use carbs from muscle first then from the stomach and then from fat stores? If that is correct (More than happy to be stood corrected) then if you are able to work out for long enough then wouldn't there be extra fat loss if in a fasted state? I know from cycle rides my performance would drop if I don't take on fuel during the ride so I certainly try and avoid that state now.
@ap1972
No that's not how it works, you don't use fuels sequentially. People look at the exercising muscle and ignore the total body expenditure....
In reality for the vast majority of the time you are exercising you are using a blend of fuels and that blend is dependant on exercise intensity primarily. The lower the activity / exercise the higher proportion of fat is being used (but remember a low calorie burn rate).
Gentle zone 3 is about 50/50 fat and carbs for me for example - my all day cycling pace.
As you have enough carbs onboard in the form of glycogen (muscle and liver mostly) for about two hours intense exercise it's pretty irrelevant for the majority of people whether you are fasted or not.
And if you have ever bonked (complete glycogen depletion) you would know that at that point exercise stops with crushing fatigue and mental confusion!
I don't fuel any bike rides under two hours, it just fits in my day. It's only for rides approx 60 miles and over I get serious about more precise fuelling.
What fasted cardio can do is make you better at fasted cardio as you do adapt to it. But still weight loss is down to calories not fuels. For weight loss it doesn't matter when you ingested your carb/fat fuels, just now, today, yesterday, last week - same as filling up your car's fuel tank the fuel level depends on the amount of fuel put in and fuel used, not when you topped up.
Interesting you can go for 2 hours in a fasted state, when I was cycling regularly I would start to suffer after an hour or so. If I have breakfast before my ride that point would probably be 30-45 mins later so I would generally fuel as I went for anything over an hour unless I was trying to improve my fasted state performance. In those days cycling was primarily for fun and not for weight loss so I wasn't even considering whether it had an impact on burning fat.
The car analogy is a little off as the fuel tank (Our stomach) is the only source of fuel and cannot be allowed to run out whereas our body uses energy stored in multiple ways all of which are replenished in different ways.
If you exercise in a fasted state and burn 1000 calories causing a loss of 0.2 lb of fat and then eat 1000 calories when and how does that fat get replaced?
That 2 hr reference wasn't to fasted like overnight, but just what people normally have available in fed state.
That's the 2 hr "hitting the wall" in marathons or bonking on rides when you go out too hard, and have more to do.
The pro's and those experienced know that pace that uses just enough glucose stores and fat as source to make it the distance/time.
And they won't do a race fasted of course, perhaps light breakfast.
That being said, I have done an almost 2 hr ride in evening after not eating since prior midnight, very sedentary desk job though, and barely made it. But wasn't near race speed either. Definition of fun & fast is very flexible at those times.0 -
Ref the bold.....Finafoshizzle93 wrote: »Anyone have any anecdotal success with "faster" fat loss by incorporating fasted cardio?
That's not how fat loss works.
The fuel you use during exercise or whether that exercise is partially fuelled from food just eaten or eaten and stored at some point in the past isn't what's important - it's your long term calorie balance.
If training fasted suits you then great, it gives you more scheduling options, some people may feel and perform better.
If it doesn't suit you then your exercise performance and calorie burn from your exercise will also drop.
I saw something on You Tube recently suggesting Fasted Cardio increased results and it reminded me of something I read 20 years ago and would so do it occasionally mainly due to preferring not to eat first thing rather than for any expected benefit
Now my understanding of how we fuel exercise is limited but don't we use carbs from muscle first then from the stomach and then from fat stores? If that is correct (More than happy to be stood corrected) then if you are able to work out for long enough then wouldn't there be extra fat loss if in a fasted state? I know from cycle rides my performance would drop if I don't take on fuel during the ride so I certainly try and avoid that state now.
@ap1972
No that's not how it works, you don't use fuels sequentially. People look at the exercising muscle and ignore the total body expenditure....
In reality for the vast majority of the time you are exercising you are using a blend of fuels and that blend is dependant on exercise intensity primarily. The lower the activity / exercise the higher proportion of fat is being used (but remember a low calorie burn rate).
Gentle zone 3 is about 50/50 fat and carbs for me for example - my all day cycling pace.
As you have enough carbs onboard in the form of glycogen (muscle and liver mostly) for about two hours intense exercise it's pretty irrelevant for the majority of people whether you are fasted or not.
And if you have ever bonked (complete glycogen depletion) you would know that at that point exercise stops with crushing fatigue and mental confusion!
I don't fuel any bike rides under two hours, it just fits in my day. It's only for rides approx 60 miles and over I get serious about more precise fuelling.
What fasted cardio can do is make you better at fasted cardio as you do adapt to it. But still weight loss is down to calories not fuels. For weight loss it doesn't matter when you ingested your carb/fat fuels, just now, today, yesterday, last week - same as filling up your car's fuel tank the fuel level depends on the amount of fuel put in and fuel used, not when you topped up.
Interesting you can go for 2 hours in a fasted state, when I was cycling regularly I would start to suffer after an hour or so. If I have breakfast before my ride that point would probably be 30-45 mins later so I would generally fuel as I went for anything over an hour unless I was trying to improve my fasted state performance. In those days cycling was primarily for fun and not for weight loss so I wasn't even considering whether it had an impact on burning fat.
The car analogy is a little off as the fuel tank (Our stomach) is the only source of fuel and cannot be allowed to run out whereas our body uses energy stored in multiple ways all of which are replenished in different ways.
If you exercise in a fasted state and burn 1000 calories causing a loss of 0.2 lb of fat and then eat 1000 calories when and how does that fat get replaced?
From your next meal.
You are shuttling fat into storage and taking it out of storage multiple times a day. It's the balance that matters.
It's part of the reason to look outside the exercise period and put it in context of the day/week/month.
Thanks
Interesting that we cycle the fat in our bodies like that0 -
I do my runs fasted (or maybe with a protein shake) because it helps me avoid stomach cramping, but I agree with others that it is not shown to help with weight loss.0
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I eat before I workout in the morning. I'm focusing mostly on strength and speed goals right now. I feel like having the food in my stomach about an hour and a half before I work out help push me through. But, I'm not a big dinner eater, so I wake up feeling pretty empty.0
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Fasted cardio literally makes no difference. The caloric deficit is what matters.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEbWdoceH-A
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I have to say that MFPers (which includes me) are a self selected bunch who all believe in mean caloric deficit/surplus (CICO), period.
There are several important factors not captured in this mantra:
- Controlling intake means controlling appetite. Fasted exercise and fasting in general can be instrumental in controlling appetite. I find that cardo dulls mine and I eat less afterward (so long as I don't wait too long). (Eating low carb can also help control appetite.)
- Energy level. Exercising fasted in the morning can have an effect on energy level both during and after exercise. I personally get a huge energy boost from morning fasted exercise (when I do it, which isn't often enough). But, this only works for sub 60min efforts. Longer workouts (like a 2 hour bike ride) benefit incredibly from eating carbs beforehand or during.
So, CICO rules but so are feelings. You should do what makes you feel your best overall and makes it easiest to attain your goals. It is worth experimenting with a range of approaches. (I would like to experiment with exercising in the morning, for example.)4 -
I only do cardio fasted as it's first thing in the morning and I couldn't manage to get up any earlier to eat0
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I only do cardio fasted as it's first thing in the morning and I couldn't manage to get up any earlier to eat
To be clear, there's nothing wrong with doing fasted cardio. If it fits your schedule best or works best for your eating habits or whatever, that's perfectly fine. The error comes in people thinking that it somehow has magical properties that make it superior to non-fasted cardio.0 -
I only do cardio fasted as it's first thing in the morning and I couldn't manage to get up any earlier to eat
To be clear, there's nothing wrong with doing fasted cardio. If it fits your schedule best or works best for your eating habits or whatever, that's perfectly fine. The error comes in people thinking that it somehow has magical properties that make it superior to non-fasted cardio.
What if it helped you to control you appetite? That's a kind of magic.1 -
Jthanmyfitnesspal wrote: »I only do cardio fasted as it's first thing in the morning and I couldn't manage to get up any earlier to eat
To be clear, there's nothing wrong with doing fasted cardio. If it fits your schedule best or works best for your eating habits or whatever, that's perfectly fine. The error comes in people thinking that it somehow has magical properties that make it superior to non-fasted cardio.
What if it helped you to control you appetite? That's a kind of magic.
I figured that was implicit in "fits your schedule best or works best for your eating habits".2
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