Protein
jcard369
Posts: 9 Member
What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
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Replies
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What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
I try and get my protein mainly from foods. I like ON protein powders.or muscletech brand for when I have to supplement and they are a decent price.2 -
How much would the equivalent 20 day supply of lean ground beef or chicken breast cost you?
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That’s the thing. I have a hard time eating since I been trying to cut and watch my foods I eat I tend to struggle eating 6-8 meals daily0
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agree with this. I could never eat that many meals either.2 -
That’s the thing. I have a hard time eating since I been trying to cut and watch my foods I eat I tend to struggle eating 6-8 meals daily
why do you think you need 6-8 meals a day? you dont just eat your calories throughout the day,if you rather have 3 meals a day do that, or if you rather have less then you can do that and still get in your calories.many people here do OMAD(one meal a day) I do 2 meals usually and 1-2 snacks a day,some days I eat more snacking and others I dont hardly eat any. I manage to get my calories in and have had no issues.0 -
What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?0 -
MyProtein and ON is pretty affordable. Also you can save a bit by taking less servings. I only take whey when I am short on my protein goal.0
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I usually buy them on canadianprotein.com (similar to myprotein.com but for canadians although they sell to US customers and I think it would cost cheaper due to the exchange rate). I usually buy a big bag and it lasts me forever considering I get most of my proteins from food. But protein powder is good to have around when I don't know what protein food to eat.0
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I use bare performance cinnamon roll lately. Love the flavor and it has a high % of protein per grand in each serving.0
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TavistockToad wrote: »What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?
This^^
0.8 to 1.2 grams of protein per pound of LEAN BODY MASS is all your body can handle.4 -
quiksylver296 wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?
This^^
0.8 to 1.2 grams of protein per pound of LEAN BODY MASS is all your body can handle.
The juries still out on that, nice little read of how
Eric helmes view on optimum protein intake has changed In the last 5 years and how it might get change again with upcoming studies
https://www.strongerbyscience.com/reflecting-on-five-years-studying-protein/2 -
quiksylver296 wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?
This^^
0.8 to 1.2 grams of protein per pound of LEAN BODY MASS is all your body can handle.
The juries still out on that, nice little read of how
Eric helmes view on optimum protein intake has changed In the last 5 years and how it might get change again with upcoming studies
https://www.strongerbyscience.com/reflecting-on-five-years-studying-protein/
And not to be pedantic, but it's not a matter of "all your body can handle". While the specific recommendations vary, they're talking about what is optimal for stimulating muscle protein synthesis, and that higher levels are not necessarily more beneficial in that regard. Not that they're "all your body can handle".4 -
"Despite being inconclusive, two lines of evidence provide an informed estimate of the optimal protein dose for stimulating a maximal response of MPS in older adults. First, previous work has demonstrated that ingesting >36 g of beef protein [56] or 35–40 g of whey protein [55,58] stimulated a pronounced increase in the rate of irreversible amino acid oxidation. These data [55,58] imply the rate of MPS was approaching, or had indeed reached, an upper limit with ingestion of 35–40 g of protein. Second, the maximal effective protein dose at rest is higher in older compared with young adults. A retrospective analysis of previous studies [60] estimated that, when expressed relative to body mass, the dose of protein required to stimulate a maximal response of MPS at rest was ~68% greater in older (0.40 g/kg body mass) vs. young (0.24 g/kg body mass) adults. Moving forward, to refine the optimal protein dose for the maximal stimulation of MPS in middle-aged or older adults, future studies should measure the postprandial response of myofibrillar-MPS to 0, 20–40 and 50–60 g doses of ingested protein.
In addition to age, several other nutritional, physiological and/or methodological factors could impact the optimal dose of protein for the maximal postprandial stimulation of MPS in young and older adults. Protein source has been shown to affect the dose-response relationship in older adults. A greater dose of soy protein (≥40 g) [57] was required to stimulate a comparable postprandial MPS response to whey (≥20 g) protein [58]. As such, a rightwards shift in the dose-response relationship was observed with soy protein compared with whey protein. Intuitively, these findings suggest that protein source alters the optimal protein dose for the maximal stimulation of MPS in older adults." - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4848650/
While it may not matter, there is evidence that over 40g of protein may be the maximally effective dose of protein for MPS for an older adult.
On top of that, there are other studies that say a feeding every 3-5 hours is optimal for MPS. Note this is not 6 meals a day but 4 and in that study they recommended, I believe 20-25g per feeding.
The linked meta does agree that post-exercise feeding is not required. Basically, if you want a tiny advantage, get 4 meals with your protein evenly distributed. It won't matter much but is likely far more beneficial than many crap supplements.3 -
quiksylver296 wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?
This^^
0.8 to 1.2 grams of protein per pound of LEAN BODY MASS is all your body can handle.
I'll be more blunt, this is simply nonsense.
I also take issue w/using LBM as the standard of measurement for determing how much protein one "should" eat, since there is no way to determine exactly what your LBM is unless you get it measured. Otherwise, wharever number you use for LBM is just a guess at best.
Grams per pound or kg of bodyweight is a more practical and realistic standard and 0.8-1.2g/pound BW is not too much for anyone actively exercising, lifting and/or training.
While your body may not be able to make use of all of the amino acids in the protein you eat for the purpose of muscle maintenance or growth, no one really knows how much your body will actually need, given the specific circumstances. So, like $, it's better to have more available than not enough.
What ever protein is left over will be converted into sugar to use as energy if in a deficit or glycogen/fat if in a surplus; just like excess carbs which contain no amino acids and can only be used for energy and other nutritional needs. The digestion of fat which is converted into free fatty acids is a different and more complicated matter.9 -
quiksylver296 wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?
This^^
0.8 to 1.2 grams of protein per pound of LEAN BODY MASS is all your body can handle.
I'll be more blunt, this is simply nonsense.
I also take issue w/using LBM as the standard of measurement for determing how much protein one "should" eat, since there is no way to determine exactly what your LBM is unless you get it measured. Otherwise, wharever number you use for LBM is just a guess at best.
Grams per pound or kg of bodyweight is a more practical and realistic standard and 0.8-1.2g/pound BW is not too much for anyone actively exercising, lifting and/or training.
While your body may not be able to make use of all of the amino acids in the protein you eat for the purpose of muscle maintenance or growth, no one really knows how much your body will actually need, given the specific circumstances. So, like $, it's better to have more available than not enough.
What ever protein is left over will be converted into sugar to use as energy if in a deficit or glycogen/fat if in a surplus; just like excess carbs which contain no amino acids and can only be used for energy and other nutritional needs. The digestion of fat which is converted into free fatty acids is a different and more complicated matter.
I know you’ve mentioned your maintenance being on the low side, so I’m curious about your thoughts on using goal weight for people who are overfat and eating in a deficit. I weigh around 160 lbs and am eating around 1500-1700 calories a day while exercising and lifting. I’ve struggled to get my protein up to .8/1 g per lb using 120-130 lbs (goal weight). Trying for an intake based on my current weight seems pretty hight, especially at these calories.1 -
I've been using MyProtein for a while and cannot complain. It's way cheaper than most anything at GNC, especially if you catch a good sale, which they rotate pretty constantly. No frills, direct-to-consumer model. Comes in big bags vs. tubs. Tastes pretty good and mixes ok in just water or if you're making something fancier with milk, juice, frozen fruit, etc.0
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MegaMooseEsq wrote: »quiksylver296 wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?
This^^
0.8 to 1.2 grams of protein per pound of LEAN BODY MASS is all your body can handle.
I'll be more blunt, this is simply nonsense.
I also take issue w/using LBM as the standard of measurement for determing how much protein one "should" eat, since there is no way to determine exactly what your LBM is unless you get it measured. Otherwise, wharever number you use for LBM is just a guess at best.
Grams per pound or kg of bodyweight is a more practical and realistic standard and 0.8-1.2g/pound BW is not too much for anyone actively exercising, lifting and/or training.
While your body may not be able to make use of all of the amino acids in the protein you eat for the purpose of muscle maintenance or growth, no one really knows how much your body will actually need, given the specific circumstances. So, like $, it's better to have more available than not enough.
What ever protein is left over will be converted into sugar to use as energy if in a deficit or glycogen/fat if in a surplus; just like excess carbs which contain no amino acids and can only be used for energy and other nutritional needs. The digestion of fat which is converted into free fatty acids is a different and more complicated matter.
I know you’ve mentioned your maintenance being on the low side, so I’m curious about your thoughts on using goal weight for people who are overfat and eating in a deficit. I weigh around 160 lbs and am eating around 1500-1700 calories a day while exercising and lifting. I’ve struggled to get my protein up to .8/1 g per lb using 120-130 lbs (goal weight). Trying for an intake based on my current weight seems pretty hight, especially at these calories.
My thinking on this is that, if you are overweight, eating at a calorie deficit should be your primary concern and that macros are secondary and need to be adjusted w/in that limit taking into account your specific nutritional and physical needs.
Using your info as an example, if you set your cal limit at 1600, you can choose to allocate your macros in whatever way that bests meets your needs.
What gets lost in the discussion is that, if you are NOT lifting heavy or actively engaged in exercise or athletic training, there probably is no need for you to eat 0.8-1.2g protein/#BW/day but eating THAT much protein isn't necessarily bad or wasteful either.
What I object to is the apparently knee jerk response of many people on MFP who say that you don't need to eat more than the minimum RDA recommended amount of protein (or any other stated amount) w/o regard to the individual's specific needs/goals.
MFP defaults to macros (20P/50C/30F) that I personally do not follow because they DO NOT take into account the greater protein needs of athletes, weight lifters and/or senior (which are all categories that apply to me).
However, , if you are not in these categories, the MFP default would meet your basic nutritional needs. This would work out to 80gP/200gC/53gF on 1600 cals/day and would only require you to eat about 0.5g protein/#BW/day which would slightly exceed the RDA minimum allowance.
Just recognize that if you are older and or begin to engage in a heavy lifting or rigourous exercise program (as I am and have been doing), you probably will need to increase your protein intake to somewhere around 0 8-1.2g/#BW, which would better meet your needs for strength and muscular development or maintenance. The lower end of this range is fine for most purposes.
Whether you need THAT much protein depends on what kind of exercise, training and/or lifting that you are doing. The less heavy/rigourous the lifting/exercise, the less protein you probably will need. There is no exact way to measure it.
Strength, endurance, weightloss and BF% are proxies at best but IMO more protein is always better than less, subject to the 0.8-1.2 range on the upper end. If you can't manage to eat that much protein, just do the best you can.
As for how to eat THAT much protein on a restricted cal diet, it depends. It's possible but difficult to do it eating real food but I don't think it is practical to do this w/o using protein supplements (at least in part).
I weigh 156 and am on a 1600 cal NET cal daily diet but I actually eat about 2100 cal/day and burn about 600 cal/day lifting and rowing; mainly rowing. This allows me to eat more, which makes it a bit easier to achieve my 0.8-1.2g protein/#BW goal BUT I still use supplements to achieve this.
I have used and stock a variety of supplements, including powder (MyProtein and Cytosport), protein bars and cookies (Pure Protein and MyProtein) and drinks (Vitamin Shoppe).
I use whichever best meets my caloric and protein needs for a specific meal/day but the one I currently use most often is Isotech42 (Vitamin Shoppe), which provides 42g of whey protein isolate (with only.0.5g fat and 4g carbs) in just 190 cals.
It's not cheap ($2-3/bottle depending on when I buy it and the discounts I can get) but it is an almost totally pure protein supplement (88% based on cals) that provides the most protein for the fewest cals consumed. I drink 1-2 bottles of this a day combined w/lots of fruit, veggies and other protein sources.
What anyone else chooses to do will depend on his/her specific nutritional and physical goals/needs, budget and personal views on what kinds of food they think are "acceptable" to eat.3 -
MegaMooseEsq wrote: »quiksylver296 wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?
This^^
0.8 to 1.2 grams of protein per pound of LEAN BODY MASS is all your body can handle.
I'll be more blunt, this is simply nonsense.
I also take issue w/using LBM as the standard of measurement for determing how much protein one "should" eat, since there is no way to determine exactly what your LBM is unless you get it measured. Otherwise, wharever number you use for LBM is just a guess at best.
Grams per pound or kg of bodyweight is a more practical and realistic standard and 0.8-1.2g/pound BW is not too much for anyone actively exercising, lifting and/or training.
While your body may not be able to make use of all of the amino acids in the protein you eat for the purpose of muscle maintenance or growth, no one really knows how much your body will actually need, given the specific circumstances. So, like $, it's better to have more available than not enough.
What ever protein is left over will be converted into sugar to use as energy if in a deficit or glycogen/fat if in a surplus; just like excess carbs which contain no amino acids and can only be used for energy and other nutritional needs. The digestion of fat which is converted into free fatty acids is a different and more complicated matter.
I know you’ve mentioned your maintenance being on the low side, so I’m curious about your thoughts on using goal weight for people who are overfat and eating in a deficit. I weigh around 160 lbs and am eating around 1500-1700 calories a day while exercising and lifting. I’ve struggled to get my protein up to .8/1 g per lb using 120-130 lbs (goal weight). Trying for an intake based on my current weight seems pretty hight, especially at these calories.
My thinking on this is that, if you are overweight, eating at a calorie deficit should be your primary concern and that macros are secondary and need to be adjusted w/in that limit taking into account your specific nutritional and physical needs.
Using your info as an example, if you set your cal limit at 1600, you can choose to allocate your macros in whatever way that bests meets your needs.
What gets lost in the discussion is that, if you are NOT lifting heavy or actively engaged in exercise or athletic training, there probably is no need for you to eat 0.8-1.2g protein/#BW/day but eating THAT much protein isn't necessarily bad or wasteful either.
What I object to is the apparently knee jerk response of many people on MFP who say that you don't need to eat more than the minimum RDA recommended amount of protein (or any other stated amount) w/o regard to the individual's specific needs/goals.
MFP defaults to macros (20P/50C/30F) that I personally do not follow because they DO NOT take into account the greater protein needs of athletes, weight lifters and/or senior (which are all categories that apply to me).
However, , if you are not in these categories, the MFP default would meet your basic nutritional needs. This would work out to 80gP/200gC/53gF on 1600 cals/day and would only require you to eat about 0.5g protein/#BW/day which would slightly exceed the RDA minimum allowance.
Just recognize that if you are older and or begin to engage in a heavy lifting or rigourous exercise program (as I am and have been doing), you probably will need to increase your protein intake to somewhere around 0 8-1.2g/#BW, which would better meet your needs for strength and muscular development or maintenance. The lower end of this range is fine for most purposes.
Whether you need THAT much protein depends on what kind of exercise, training and/or lifting that you are doing. The less heavy/rigourous the lifting/exercise, the less protein you probably will need. There is no exact way to measure it.
Strength, endurance, weightloss and BF% are proxies at best but IMO more protein is always better than less, subject to the 0.8-1.2 range on the upper end. If you can't manage to eat that much protein, just do the best you can.
As for how to eat THAT much protein on a restricted cal diet, it depends. It's possible but difficult to do it eating real food but I don't think it is practical to do this w/o using protein supplements (at least in part).
I weigh 156 and am on a 1600 cal NET cal daily diet but I actually eat about 2100 cal/day and burn about 600 cal/day lifting and rowing; mainly rowing. This allows me to eat more, which makes it a bit easier to achieve my 0.8-1.2g protein/#BW goal BUT I still use supplements to achieve this.
I have used and stock a variety of supplements, including powder (MyProtein and Cytosport), protein bars and cookies (Pure Protein and MyProtein) and drinks (Vitamin Shoppe).
I use whichever best meets my caloric and protein needs for a specific meal/day but the one I currently use most often is Isotech42 (Vitamin Shoppe), which provides 42g of whey protein isolate (with only.0.5g fat and 4g carbs) in just 190 cals.
It's not cheap ($2-3/bottle depending on when I buy it and the discounts I can get) but it is an almost totally pure protein supplement (88% based on cals) that provides the most protein for the fewest cals consumed. I drink 1-2 bottles of this a day combined w/lots of fruit, veggies and other protein sources.
What anyone else chooses to do will depend on his/her specific nutritional and physical goals/needs, budget and personal views on what kinds of food they think are "acceptable" to eat.
Thank you! I partially misunderstood your comment, so my question was a bit off-base. I appreciate the thoughts. I've been losing for a while now, so I'm confident in my ability to hit and maintain a deficit. I definitely didn't pay attention to macros much at the beginning, but it's more or less on auto-pilot now, so I'm focusing on other things, like lifting heavy and along with that, getting sufficient protein. As it happens, I reviewed my last three months of data yesterday and realized that I'm losing about a pound and a half per month faster than planned, which freed up enough calories to fit in more protein shakes and get my numbers up at least around 100-130 or so, which seems like a good start.2 -
Thus far I've been getting all my protein from food.0
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Whey protein shakes, meats, vegetables, eggs, fish, cottage cheese, milk, greek yogurt.0
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quiksylver296 wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?
This^^
0.8 to 1.2 grams of protein per pound of LEAN BODY MASS is all your body can handle.
I disagree. That is the minimal for what you need not to be deficient, not for optimal performance, aesthetics, or health. Not only that, the body can handle much much more than that percentage. If the body couldn't, one would have explosive diarrhea when they consume more protien rate We absorb 100% of the protien we eat, how we utilize it is another story.
The amount of protien needed for optimal results is quite complex. Factors such as how male you are, how advanced age, how carnivorous, if we are eating in a deficit or surplus, and your health are will effect how much protien will be optimal.
A 58 year old female vegan powerlifter who has a autoimmune disease will need a more higher percentage of protien than a 19 year old male beef devouring healthy powerlifter when comparing LBM. As we age we are much more sensitive to not only the amount, but quality of protein.
LBM will hold slightly more weight when we are talking somebody who is quite overweight then somebody who is of average body fat.
The catch all for optimal protien intake for a person with average body fat who is resistance training with muscle synthesis is a gram per lb of bodyvweight. We adjust from there if needed.1 -
There's no way that 0.7-0.8 grams of protein per pound of LBM would not be enough to prevent a deficiency for most people. I can buy that if we're talking about doing several hours of resistance training plus extensive cardio each week. But for the average person who's doing less, I don't think that's right. A bit more protein may be optimal, but it should be enough to prevent deficiency.quiksylver296 wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?
This^^
0.8 to 1.2 grams of protein per pound of LEAN BODY MASS is all your body can handle.
I disagree. That is the minimal for what you need not to be deficient, not for optimal performance, aesthetics, or health.
4 -
ForecasterJason wrote: »
There's no way that 0.7-0.8 grams of protein per pound of LBM would not be enough to prevent a deficiency for most people. I can buy that if we're talking about doing several hours of resistance training plus extensive cardio each week. But for the average person who's doing less, I don't think that's right. A bit more protein may be optimal, but it should be enough to prevent deficiency.quiksylver296 wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »What does everyone use for a protein. I’ve had about 12 different kinds and as of right now I use gnc wheybolic alpha. It’s starting to become a hassle spending $60 on a tub every 20 days. What’s some advice?? What’s good protein vs bad protein? Expensive proteins vs cheap proteins??
How much protein are you eating per day?
This^^
0.8 to 1.2 grams of protein per pound of LEAN BODY MASS is all your body can handle.
I disagree. That is the minimal for what you need not to be deficient, not for optimal performance, aesthetics, or health.
I didnt say most people. I actually stated specific groups whose protien goals are higher than not being in a deficiency. People who ARE resistance training, who want to optimism muscle synthesis those are the people I speak of.
Not beong in a state of deficiency doesn't equate to optimal results.
2 -
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10657380/mps-2-part-youtube-video#latest
I posted this but since it’s a long video series I don’t think people will watch it.
.8-1.6g per pound (not LBM) is shown in research to be optimal for MPS. Older populations, heavy resistance training, and caloric deficit push the amount up to higher end of this range. There is no negative side to health if normal person with even 1.6 as excess will just be converted to energy.0 -
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10657380/mps-2-part-youtube-video#latest
I posted this but since it’s a long video series I don’t think people will watch it.
.8-1.6g per pound (not LBM) is shown in research to be optimal for MPS. Older populations, heavy resistance training, and caloric deficit push the amount up to higher end of this range. There is no negative side to health if normal person with even 1.6 as excess will just be converted to energy.
Thanks for cross-posting the link to the videos.
I watched them and anyone who wants to be better informed on the topic should too.
FWIW, I don't think you're getting much attn there because few people know what "MPS" stands for.
If the title was captioned "Understanding Muscle Protein Synthesis," you'd probably have many pages of comments.
2 -
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10657380/mps-2-part-youtube-video#latest
I posted this but since it’s a long video series I don’t think people will watch it.
.8-1.6g per pound (not LBM) is shown in research to be optimal for MPS. Older populations, heavy resistance training, and caloric deficit push the amount up to higher end of this range. There is no negative side to health if normal person with even 1.6 as excess will just be converted to energy.
Thanks for cross-posting the link to the videos.
I watched them and anyone who wants to be better informed on the topic should too.
FWIW, I don't think you're getting much attn there because few people know what "MPS" stands for.
If the title was captioned "Understanding Muscle Protein Synthesis," you'd probably have many pages of comments.
Or maybe just “protein video”
2
This discussion has been closed.
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