Weight Trend. Time to Increase Calories?

dpr73

I have been attempting a slow lean bulk over the past few weeks. I want to gain about 20lbs by mid-January. My weight trend is attached. I am wondering if I should add about 50-100 calories to my daily intake (currently 2800). There were a few days over these past two weeks where I did not count (maybe 4 days in total where I estimated a dinner out or a day out with family), so it is not 100% accurate. I dont know if that impacts things, so that is why I am asking your opinions here.

A bit about me:
Weight: currently 131 on gym scale, but I don't think I am actually that light...
Height: 5'7
Male
Age: 23 y/o
Activity: 1 day on chest (40 mins) + 7 minute warm up run, 1 day on legs (40 mins)+ 7 minute warm up run, 1 day on back and bi (40 mins) +7 minute warm up run, 1 day running 3-5 miles + 15 minutes abs, 1 day running 3-5 miles +20 minutes shoulders

TavistockToad

Have you thought about following an actual programme? You'll get better results

edickson76

If your surplus is 250 calories then trend looks fine, 1 pound over 2 weeks. If your surplus is 500 calories then you need to increase.

Agree with above comment that your workouts are sub-optimal. A proper beginner program would be more beneficial.

dpr73

edickson76 wrote: »

If your surplus is 250 calories then trend looks fine, 1 pound over 2 weeks. If your surplus is 500 calories then you need to increase.

Agree with above comment that your workouts are sub-optimal. A proper beginner program would be more beneficial.

Well, what I dislike about a lot of beginner programs is that they tend to focus upon less actual lifts (just a focus on the major ones as in strong lifts) for only about 3 days. I do not just lift weights and exercise for muscle building. It also helps control my anxiety. So, I like to have full 5 day workouts that total close to 45 minutes to an hour. How sub-optimal could my program be if I incorporate dead lifts, squats, bench, military press, and rows throughout the week?

singingflutelady

Do you have enough knowledge and experience to put together a program yourself? Plus you are only hitting each muscle group once a week.

dpr73

singingflutelady wrote: »

Do you have enough knowledge and experience to put together a program yourself? Plus you are only hitting each muscle group once a week.

I have been lifting for 5 years. I have lifted with body builders and frankly don't find my routine to be so different--a focus on the major compound lifts with accessory isolation exercises sprinkled in. I rotate exercises each week to continually challenge my body (I know that this is debated with many saying varying is unnecessary, but I like that my body sees different reps/sets each week). I keep my weight load high and my rep range low for the major lifts (occasionally, I finish sets with a low weight/high rep set). The isolation lifts are higher rep (8-12 range with occasional burnout sets or drop sets).

I owe my stall in progress more to my past as a former fat boy. Despite knowledge of what to do, I avoid the caloric surplus necessary out of fear of excess fat gain. I am hoping to get over that this time around.

dpr73

I am rehashing this thread mostly because my trend is beginning to confuse me. Over the past week and a half, my weight has bursted up about 2lbs on average. So while when I posted this trend, my app was calculating a trend of only 0.1 lbs/week. It has now shot up to nearly 1.0lbs/week since I started. I am going to post my trend again so that someone might be able to sort through it. My accuracy and routine has not changed at all. I still have one day a week where I don't count, and honestly...I have if anything eaten a bit less on those days recently rather than more.
JUST FYI I started my surplus on July 24...

TavistockToad

i still don't think you have enough data to change your calories. is a pound a week more than you wish to gain?

dpr73

TavistockToad wrote: »

i still don't think you have enough data to change your calories. is a pound a week more than you wish to gain?

I want the gain to be as lean as possible so I figured about 250 calories above maintenance was ideal

steveko89

dpr73 wrote: »

TavistockToad wrote: »

i still don't think you have enough data to change your calories. is a pound a week more than you wish to gain?

I want the gain to be as lean as possible so I figured about 250 calories above maintenance was ideal

Given your statement that you've been lifting for 5 years, I wouldn't go above 250 for a lean bulk. I sympathize as a fellow FFB and the fear of excess fat gain on a bulk. However, I think you'd be better off getting stimulus for each muscle group more often than once per week. There are some really well-vetted intermediate-level lifting plan out there that have you going 4-6 days/week depending on preference. I think something like PPL, PHAT or PHUL would be a better balance between good frequency on your mains and enough accessory work to satisfy you. The wikis on r/fitness and r/gainit both have a good repository of linked programs that's a little more concise and organized than the MFP thread on programs.

dpr73

steveko89 wrote: »

dpr73 wrote: »

TavistockToad wrote: »

i still don't think you have enough data to change your calories. is a pound a week more than you wish to gain?

I want the gain to be as lean as possible so I figured about 250 calories above maintenance was ideal

Given your statement that you've been lifting for 5 years, I wouldn't go above 250 for a lean bulk. I sympathize as a fellow FFB and the fear of excess fat gain on a bulk. However, I think you'd be better off getting stimulus for each muscle group more often than once per week. There are some really well-vetted intermediate-level lifting plan out there that have you going 4-6 days/week depending on preference. I think something like PPL, PHAT or PHUL would be a better balance between good frequency on your mains and enough accessory work to satisfy you. The wikis on r/fitness and r/gainit both have a good repository of linked programs that's a little more concise and organized than the MFP thread on programs.

So given that, do you think I might need to reduce? I am very frustrated because one week it looks like I'm gaining nothing (my cumulative average daily surplus last week was 34 calories!) And then suddenly it looksime I'm going Too Fast (now, cause of the weight change recently, my cumulated average daily surplus is something like 450 calories)

mmapags

steveko89 wrote: »

dpr73 wrote: »

TavistockToad wrote: »

i still don't think you have enough data to change your calories. is a pound a week more than you wish to gain?

I want the gain to be as lean as possible so I figured about 250 calories above maintenance was ideal

Given your statement that you've been lifting for 5 years, I wouldn't go above 250 for a lean bulk. I sympathize as a fellow FFB and the fear of excess fat gain on a bulk. However, I think you'd be better off getting stimulus for each muscle group more often than once per week. There are some really well-vetted intermediate-level lifting plan out there that have you going 4-6 days/week depending on preference. I think something like PPL, PHAT or PHUL would be a better balance between good frequency on your mains and enough accessory work to satisfy you. The wikis on r/fitness and r/gainit both have a good repository of linked programs that's a little more concise and organized than the MFP thread on programs.

Just want to agree in upper lower splits that hit all body parts 2x per week. There has been some recent research by Brad Shoenfeld and also some info from Mike Isrealtel and I think Eric Helms that show upper lower splits with a total of 2 days each have shown optimal results for hypertrophy.

I will personally endorse the P.H.U.L. program. I've been doing it for about 3 months and have seem great strength and body shape gains while being in a deficit. I don't know if I've added mass or it just looks like it because of fat loss. But progression overall, adding weight to the bar, and aesthetics have been remarkable.

It is the best program I've ever run in this regard. It has 2 days power and 2 days hypertrophy. It's been great in a deficit. I would imagine it would only be better in a surplus.

steveko89

dpr73 wrote: »

steveko89 wrote: »

dpr73 wrote: »

TavistockToad wrote: »

i still don't think you have enough data to change your calories. is a pound a week more than you wish to gain?

I want the gain to be as lean as possible so I figured about 250 calories above maintenance was ideal

Given your statement that you've been lifting for 5 years, I wouldn't go above 250 for a lean bulk. I sympathize as a fellow FFB and the fear of excess fat gain on a bulk. However, I think you'd be better off getting stimulus for each muscle group more often than once per week. There are some really well-vetted intermediate-level lifting plan out there that have you going 4-6 days/week depending on preference. I think something like PPL, PHAT or PHUL would be a better balance between good frequency on your mains and enough accessory work to satisfy you. The wikis on r/fitness and r/gainit both have a good repository of linked programs that's a little more concise and organized than the MFP thread on programs.

So given that, do you think I might need to reduce? I am very frustrated because one week it looks like I'm gaining nothing (my cumulative average daily surplus last week was 34 calories!) And then suddenly it looksime I'm going Too Fast (now, cause of the weight change recently, my cumulated average daily surplus is something like 450 calories)

Unfortunately, there's a limit to how quickly you can reasonably gain muscle naturally and that rate only drops the more experienced lifter you are.

Here's a good read on muscle gain math by Lyle McDonald: https://bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/muscle-gain-math.html/

I'll also weigh in with a second personal endorsement for PHUL. I'm currently running a version a slightly modified for home equipment availability and supplemented with some accessories for my personal lagging areas after reading the piece Isrealtel did on ideal frequency for hypertrophy. Really nice to work across a variety of rep ranges.

kimny72

Sorry, missed a post with key details, never mind

dpr73

steveko89 wrote: »

dpr73 wrote: »

steveko89 wrote: »

dpr73 wrote: »

TavistockToad wrote: »

i still don't think you have enough data to change your calories. is a pound a week more than you wish to gain?

I want the gain to be as lean as possible so I figured about 250 calories above maintenance was ideal

Given your statement that you've been lifting for 5 years, I wouldn't go above 250 for a lean bulk. I sympathize as a fellow FFB and the fear of excess fat gain on a bulk. However, I think you'd be better off getting stimulus for each muscle group more often than once per week. There are some really well-vetted intermediate-level lifting plan out there that have you going 4-6 days/week depending on preference. I think something like PPL, PHAT or PHUL would be a better balance between good frequency on your mains and enough accessory work to satisfy you. The wikis on r/fitness and r/gainit both have a good repository of linked programs that's a little more concise and organized than the MFP thread on programs.

So given that, do you think I might need to reduce? I am very frustrated because one week it looks like I'm gaining nothing (my cumulative average daily surplus last week was 34 calories!) And then suddenly it looksime I'm going Too Fast (now, cause of the weight change recently, my cumulated average daily surplus is something like 450 calories)

Unfortunately, there's a limit to how quickly you can reasonably gain muscle naturally and that rate only drops the more experienced lifter you are.

Here's a good read on muscle gain math by Lyle McDonald: https://bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/muscle-gain-math.html/

I'll also weigh in with a second personal endorsement for PHUL. I'm currently running a version a slightly modified for home equipment availability and supplemented with some accessories for my personal lagging areas after reading the piece Isrealtel did on ideal frequency for hypertrophy. Really nice to work across a variety of rep ranges.

I'll try PHUL next week. However, i am still wondering about my calories. I was very cautious about coming up to the surplus. I was losing steadily at 2500 calories and figured that 2800 was cautious given that I was dropping weight at 2500. However, this week my weight seems to be jumping quicker than it has the previous 3 weeks. So i am frustrated and unsure if i should reduce. Obviously, the concern is if i reduce i may also stip gaining altogether.

mmapags

dpr73 wrote: »

steveko89 wrote: »

dpr73 wrote: »

steveko89 wrote: »

dpr73 wrote: »

TavistockToad wrote: »

i still don't think you have enough data to change your calories. is a pound a week more than you wish to gain?

I want the gain to be as lean as possible so I figured about 250 calories above maintenance was ideal

Given your statement that you've been lifting for 5 years, I wouldn't go above 250 for a lean bulk. I sympathize as a fellow FFB and the fear of excess fat gain on a bulk. However, I think you'd be better off getting stimulus for each muscle group more often than once per week. There are some really well-vetted intermediate-level lifting plan out there that have you going 4-6 days/week depending on preference. I think something like PPL, PHAT or PHUL would be a better balance between good frequency on your mains and enough accessory work to satisfy you. The wikis on r/fitness and r/gainit both have a good repository of linked programs that's a little more concise and organized than the MFP thread on programs.

So given that, do you think I might need to reduce? I am very frustrated because one week it looks like I'm gaining nothing (my cumulative average daily surplus last week was 34 calories!) And then suddenly it looksime I'm going Too Fast (now, cause of the weight change recently, my cumulated average daily surplus is something like 450 calories)

Unfortunately, there's a limit to how quickly you can reasonably gain muscle naturally and that rate only drops the more experienced lifter you are.

Here's a good read on muscle gain math by Lyle McDonald: https://bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/muscle-gain-math.html/

I'll also weigh in with a second personal endorsement for PHUL. I'm currently running a version a slightly modified for home equipment availability and supplemented with some accessories for my personal lagging areas after reading the piece Isrealtel did on ideal frequency for hypertrophy. Really nice to work across a variety of rep ranges.

I'll try PHUL next week. However, i am still wondering about my calories. I was very cautious about coming up to the surplus. I was losing steadily at 2500 calories and figured that 2800 was cautious given that I was dropping weight at 2500. However, this week my weight seems to be jumping quicker than it has the previous 3 weeks. So i am frustrated and unsure if i should reduce. Obviously, the concern is if i reduce i may also stip gaining altogether.

Don't make decisions based on a 1 week trend.