A really good comprehensive post on keto?
Replies
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Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »Yes, I wasn't surprised to see Keto in there for quick weight loss, what you say makes perfect sense, but I wonder where ther got some of their facts from. KWIM?
The diets they said eliminate food groups do not. A diet based on ethics is ranked for weight loss. And the most effective diet for treating insulin resistance is not even mention for treating T2D.
Some of it makes sense, like WW does work well for some, and the Mediterranean diet seems like a solid choice for many, but some other things they discuss was incorrect.
unfortunate because many will take it at face value.
I wish the AP style book would have a listing/definition for "food groups". That's a pet peeve of mine as well.
Now I have to go and read the whole article. 😜
Yes, I think people are using "food groups" & "macros" interchangeably.0 -
Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »Yes, I wasn't surprised to see Keto in there for quick weight loss, what you say makes perfect sense, but I wonder where ther got some of their facts from. KWIM?
The diets they said eliminate food groups do not. A diet based on ethics is ranked for weight loss. And the most effective diet for treating insulin resistance is not even mention for treating T2D.
Some of it makes sense, like WW does work well for some, and the Mediterranean diet seems like a solid choice for many, but some other things they discuss was incorrect. unfortunate because many will take it at face value.
I wish the AP style book would have a listing/definition for "food groups". That's a pet peeve of mine as well.
Now I have to go and read the whole article. 😜
Yes, I think people are using "food groups" & "macros" interchangeably.
In this case it was one of their "experts". But even then, it's not an accurate statement. I know very few keto folks, or low carb folks that "eliminate" carbs. "Control", "limit" perhaps but not eliminate. This brings more confusion to the discussion. I see this often on here when folks say they "tried Atkins" and then go on to say they missed vegetables. eh? Atkins *requires* vegetables. Probably more than many folks ever eat.
I also, slightly, object to their implication that the other diets listed don't allow for "indulgences". I DO agree about Dukan. I watched a dear friend suffer on that one.
Thanks for the link folks!0 -
Yes, I wasn't surprised to see Keto in there for quick weight loss, what you say makes perfect sense, but I wonder where ther got some of their facts from. KWIM?
The diets they said eliminate food groups do not. A diet based on ethics is ranked for weight loss. And the most effective diet for treating insulin resistance is not even mention for treating T2D.
Some of it makes sense, like WW does work well for some, and the Mediterranean diet seems like a solid choice for many, but some other things they discuss was incorrect. unfortunate because many will take it at face value.
I don't know... seems like a decent jumping-off point for general comparison.
I assume the use of the term "eliminate" is casual. I think most would consider keeping carbs <20 g to be "eliminating" grains.
I probably have a stricter sense of the word eliminate than many do.
I'm a celiac with a son with a bad tree nut allergy. I go with the literal meaning of the word "eliminate" because there are repercussions if we don't.
The majority could use the word differently.
For me, eliminate =\= restrict. For others, eliminate may = restrict to small amounts.Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »Yes, I wasn't surprised to see Keto in there for quick weight loss, what you say makes perfect sense, but I wonder where ther got some of their facts from. KWIM?
The diets they said eliminate food groups do not. A diet based on ethics is ranked for weight loss. And the most effective diet for treating insulin resistance is not even mention for treating T2D.
Some of it makes sense, like WW does work well for some, and the Mediterranean diet seems like a solid choice for many, but some other things they discuss was incorrect. unfortunate because many will take it at face value.
I wish the AP style book would have a listing/definition for "food groups". That's a pet peeve of mine as well.
Now I have to go and read the whole article. 😜
Yes, I think people are using "food groups" & "macros" interchangeably.
In this case it was one of their "experts". But even then, it's not an accurate statement. I know very few keto folks, or low carb folks that "eliminate" carbs. "Control", "limit" perhaps but not eliminate. This brings more confusion to the discussion. I see this often on here when folks say they "tried Atkins" and then go on to say they missed vegetables. eh? Atkins *requires* vegetables. Probably more than many folks ever eat.
I also, slightly, object to their implication that the other diets listed don't allow for "indulgences". I DO agree about Dukan. I watched a dear friend suffer on that one.
Thanks for the link folks!
The indulgences thing struck a chord with me too. I have my treats too, they usually are not as high carb as what others may eat, just like the vegans would not eat my holiday cheesecakes. they would have their own indulgences. 0 -
Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »Yes, I wasn't surprised to see Keto in there for quick weight loss, what you say makes perfect sense, but I wonder where ther got some of their facts from. KWIM?
The diets they said eliminate food groups do not. A diet based on ethics is ranked for weight loss. And the most effective diet for treating insulin resistance is not even mention for treating T2D.
Some of it makes sense, like WW does work well for some, and the Mediterranean diet seems like a solid choice for many, but some other things they discuss was incorrect. unfortunate because many will take it at face value.
I wish the AP style book would have a listing/definition for "food groups". That's a pet peeve of mine as well.
Now I have to go and read the whole article. 😜
Is there any kind of consistent way of using that term. I don't think of it as having a clear meaning.
From an Australian site: https://www.eatforhealth.gov.au/food-essentials/five-food-groups
Fruit, grain, vegetables and legumes, meat, dairy.
MyPlate (so US gov't): https://kidshealth.org/en/teens/myplate.html
Vegetables, fruit, grains, protein, dairy
Older US = Basic 7 food groups: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_USDA_nutrition_guides
Green and yellow vegetables (some raw; some cooked, frozen or canned)
Oranges, tomatoes, grapefruit (or raw cabbage or salad greens)
Potatoes and other vegetables and fruits (raw, dried, cooked, frozen or canned)
Milk and milk products (fluid, evaporated, dried milk, or cheese)
Meat, poultry, fish, or eggs (or dried beans, peas, nuts, or peanut butter)
Bread, flour, and cereals (natural whole grain, or enriched or restored)
Butter and fortified margarine (with added Vitamin A)
Also Basic 4:
Vegetables and fruits
Milk (but included all dairy)
Meat
Cereals and breads
Basic 4 is what I grew up with, but in my house the final category would have included all grains (including corn) and tubers (not that we had sweet potatoes a lot, more potatoes). They did not count as vegetables, you needed some other vegetable with them.0 -
Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »Yes, I wasn't surprised to see Keto in there for quick weight loss, what you say makes perfect sense, but I wonder where ther got some of their facts from. KWIM?
The diets they said eliminate food groups do not. A diet based on ethics is ranked for weight loss. And the most effective diet for treating insulin resistance is not even mention for treating T2D.
Some of it makes sense, like WW does work well for some, and the Mediterranean diet seems like a solid choice for many, but some other things they discuss was incorrect. unfortunate because many will take it at face value.
I wish the AP style book would have a listing/definition for "food groups". That's a pet peeve of mine as well.
Now I have to go and read the whole article. 😜
Yes, I think people are using "food groups" & "macros" interchangeably.
In this case it was one of their "experts". But even then, it's not an accurate statement. I know very few keto folks, or low carb folks that "eliminate" carbs. "Control", "limit" perhaps but not eliminate. This brings more confusion to the discussion. I see this often on here when folks say they "tried Atkins" and then go on to say they missed vegetables. eh? Atkins *requires* vegetables. Probably more than many folks ever eat.
I also, slightly, object to their implication that the other diets listed don't allow for "indulgences". I DO agree about Dukan. I watched a dear friend suffer on that one.
Thanks for the link folks!
Having tried keto at a higher carb level than most use (under 20 seems popular, I aimed for 60 total, 35 net), I do think it effectively eliminates fruit and grains and tubers, and most beans but for black soy beans (and other soy-based foods).
Yes, you can fit in a tiny amount, depending on how many vegetables you choose to eat (since I found my carbs were used up with veg and nuts quite easily), but you are basically eliminating these things in any kind of regular way. (I know avocado and some "vegetables" like cucumbers and tomatoes are botanically fruits, but other than avocado they are culinarily veg and I think that's how they count for the food groups discussion.)
I mostly don't care, there's clearly no consistent meaning for "food group," but I would not take it to mean "macros."
Paleo eliminates dairy, grains, and legumes, so I think it's fair to say it eliminates food groups.1 -
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Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »Sabine_Stroehm wrote: »Yes, I wasn't surprised to see Keto in there for quick weight loss, what you say makes perfect sense, but I wonder where ther got some of their facts from. KWIM?
The diets they said eliminate food groups do not. A diet based on ethics is ranked for weight loss. And the most effective diet for treating insulin resistance is not even mention for treating T2D.
Some of it makes sense, like WW does work well for some, and the Mediterranean diet seems like a solid choice for many, but some other things they discuss was incorrect. unfortunate because many will take it at face value.
I wish the AP style book would have a listing/definition for "food groups". That's a pet peeve of mine as well.
Now I have to go and read the whole article. 😜
Yes, I think people are using "food groups" & "macros" interchangeably.
In this case it was one of their "experts". But even then, it's not an accurate statement. I know very few keto folks, or low carb folks that "eliminate" carbs. "Control", "limit" perhaps but not eliminate. This brings more confusion to the discussion. I see this often on here when folks say they "tried Atkins" and then go on to say they missed vegetables. eh? Atkins *requires* vegetables. Probably more than many folks ever eat.
I also, slightly, object to their implication that the other diets listed don't allow for "indulgences". I DO agree about Dukan. I watched a dear friend suffer on that one.
Thanks for the link folks!
Having tried keto at a higher carb level than most use (under 20 seems popular, I aimed for 60 total, 35 net), I do think it effectively eliminates fruit and grains and tubers, and most beans but for black soy beans (and other soy-based foods).
Yes, you can fit in a tiny amount, depending on how many vegetables you choose to eat (since I found my carbs were used up with veg and nuts quite easily), but you are basically eliminating these things in any kind of regular way. (I know avocado and some "vegetables" like cucumbers and tomatoes are botanically fruits, but other than avocado they are culinarily veg and I think that's how they count for the food groups discussion.)
I mostly don't care, there's clearly no consistent meaning for "food group," but I would not take it to mean "macros."
Paleo eliminates dairy, grains, and legumes, so I think it's fair to say it eliminates food groups.
Paleo eliminates groups of foods, sure.
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