Zero sodium bread
In one forum I mentioned that one does NOT need salt in most bread recipes to make bread. Well, the "experts" tried to tell me differently. Salt is added to bread to enhance flavor, it does NOTHING ELSE in most recipes (I've not found one yet and I've been baking bread since I was twelve years old).
So today I decided to prove it.
The recipe is in the link and the proof is in the bread selfie!
Two loaves, 12 helpings, NO SODIUM!
So today I decided to prove it.
The recipe is in the link and the proof is in the bread selfie!
Two loaves, 12 helpings, NO SODIUM!
6
Replies
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How did it taste without salt?1
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monkeefan1974 wrote: »How did it taste without salt?
"Regular" homemade breads is not all that salty anyway. Sodium does help out the structure a bit. "Salt plays a role in tightening the gluten structure and adding strength to your dough. It helps the loaf to hold on to the carbon dioxide gas that is formed during fermentation, supporting good volume."
Commercial (store bought) bread is likely much higher in sodium due to the preservative factor.
Looks yummy!5 -
monkeefan1974 wrote: »How did it taste without salt?
The no-salt bread we make at home tastes like bread.2 -
monkeefan1974 wrote: »How did it taste without salt?
The no-salt bread we make at home tastes like bread.
Cool! I don’t need to watch my sodium so it’s all the same to me but I was curious about the taste and if it affected texture. I wonder if manufacturers use salt in bread not only as a flavor enhancer but as a preservative too? Perhaps it lengthens the shelf life of the bread?0 -
monkeefan1974 wrote: »monkeefan1974 wrote: »How did it taste without salt?
The no-salt bread we make at home tastes like bread.
Cool! I don’t need to watch my sodium so it’s all the same to me but I was curious about the taste and if it affected texture. I wonder if manufacturers use salt in bread not only as a flavor enhancer but as a preservative too? Perhaps it lengthens the shelf life of the bread?
Salt also helps regulate the yeast -- i.e., if you added too much salt, it would inhibit the yeast so much that the bread wouldn't rise. But in some breads it's desirable to keep the yeast from getting carried away.3 -
In my bread maker experiments I could reduce the sugar but not the salt.
I just couldn’t get enough loft.
It’s not like a lot of salt is needed.4 -
In one forum I mentioned that one does NOT need salt in most bread recipes to make bread. Well, the "experts" tried to tell me differently. Salt is added to bread to enhance flavor, it does NOTHING ELSE in most recipes (I've not found one yet and I've been baking bread since I was twelve years old).
If it's the thread I'm thinking of a. I'm definitely not an expert (though I pointed you to some resources that were written by people who are, arguably, experts) and b. salt does more than enhance flavor. Of course you can bake bread without salt. You can also make chicken stock without salt. The only things that easily come to mind you can't make without salt is various preserved items that rely on salt (preserved lemons for instance), salt crusted (baked) fish, salt cod, etc.
I mean you can bake bread without wheat, that doesn't mean that wheat doesn't do anything for bread.5 -
monkeefan1974 wrote: »How did it taste without salt?
My family loved it!
I liked it very much as well
1 -
monkeefan1974 wrote: »How did it taste without salt?
"Regular" homemade breads is not all that salty anyway. Sodium does help out the structure a bit. "Salt plays a role in tightening the gluten structure and adding strength to your dough. It helps the loaf to hold on to the carbon dioxide gas that is formed during fermentation, supporting good volume."
Commercial (store bought) bread is likely much higher in sodium due to the preservative factor.
Looks yummy!
But it certainly isn't necessary. I've made breads for years and always thought it was. But as you can see, mine held up quite well and did everything necessary to become tasty and good. Personally I think that the chemical reactions are variable.1 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »monkeefan1974 wrote: »monkeefan1974 wrote: »How did it taste without salt?
The no-salt bread we make at home tastes like bread.
Cool! I don’t need to watch my sodium so it’s all the same to me but I was curious about the taste and if it affected texture. I wonder if manufacturers use salt in bread not only as a flavor enhancer but as a preservative too? Perhaps it lengthens the shelf life of the bread?
Salt also helps regulate the yeast -- i.e., if you added too much salt, it would inhibit the yeast so much that the bread wouldn't rise. But in some breads it's desirable to keep the yeast from getting carried away.
Someone else said that on facebook however, I found that my dough rose perfectly, did not get carried away, and was perfectly healthy and happy without salt.
So I'm not sure that "sing the praises of salt" is as important as what you put in and processes used.2 -
In one forum I mentioned that one does NOT need salt in most bread recipes to make bread. Well, the "experts" tried to tell me differently. Salt is added to bread to enhance flavor, it does NOTHING ELSE in most recipes (I've not found one yet and I've been baking bread since I was twelve years old).
If it's the thread I'm thinking of a. I'm definitely not an expert (though I pointed you to some resources that were written by people who are, arguably, experts) and b. salt does more than enhance flavor. Of course you can bake bread without salt. You can also make chicken stock without salt. The only things that easily come to mind you can't make without salt is various preserved items that rely on salt (preserved lemons for instance), salt crusted (baked) fish, salt cod, etc.
I mean you can bake bread without wheat, that doesn't mean that wheat doesn't do anything for bread.
if you're making wheat bread well of course it "does something" for the wheat bread. But if you're making a bread from almond flour and other alternatives, then wheat basically ruins the purpose of the bread.
Maybe baking bread since I was twelve doesn't qualify me as an expert. But I've been doing it since then and this floored me. Like many I thought it NECESSARY to add salt. Until I tried this.
The key is in not adding TOO much flour and in working your gluten. So allow me to share the recipe.
1 cup whole wheat flour
1 cup all purpose flour
1 package rapid rise yeast
1 tbsp regular sugar
1-1.5 cups TAP HOT water
Dissolve your sugar, stirring, in 1 cup tap hot water. Once its completely dissolved (it will cool in this process), add in your yeast and give it a light stir.
In a large bowl, whisk together the flours to make sure they're incorporated well. Make a well in the middle.
Once the yeast has grown up and become a bubbly brown family
pour into the flours and slowly mix together. You may need to add more WARM water. It should be very loose and wet in appearance but not watery.
Place in a larger bowl that is partially filled with tap warm water *do not overfill* and cover with a warm, damp towel.
It will double up quickly.
Once its doubled, add in 1/4 cup all purpose flour and stir it around. Then dump the mixture out on to a well floured surface and begin kneading. Knead for around 5 minutes or until its smooth as a baby's butt.
Place in a prepared pan of your choice and cover with a damp warm cloth. Let it rise. Then bake at 400 degrees until it sounds hollow when you thump it in the middle.
Very simple. I added Herbs de Provencial to my dough to give it an herby flavor.
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This is the oat loaf. Made essentially the same way only with oat flour added at the end while kneading.
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By expert I meant someone who has studied how to make bread and does so/teaches people how to do so as a job - though I recognize that expertise doesn't have to come from a classroom or schooling. I mean I've been baking bread and pasteries since I was 9 or 10 years old - not as long as you have as I suspect you're decades older than me, but I enjoy baking and am very proficient. The example I gave last year was this page from King Arthur's Flour - I can't imagine they have ties to "Big Salt"In one forum I mentioned that one does NOT need salt in most bread recipes to make bread. Well, the "experts" tried to tell me differently. Salt is added to bread to enhance flavor, it does NOTHING ELSE in most recipes (I've not found one yet and I've been baking bread since I was twelve years old).
If it's the thread I'm thinking of a. I'm definitely not an expert (though I pointed you to some resources that were written by people who are, arguably, experts) and b. salt does more than enhance flavor. Of course you can bake bread without salt. You can also make chicken stock without salt. The only things that easily come to mind you can't make without salt is various preserved items that rely on salt (preserved lemons for instance), salt crusted (baked) fish, salt cod, etc.
I mean you can bake bread without wheat, that doesn't mean that wheat doesn't do anything for bread.
if you're making wheat bread well of course it "does something" for the wheat bread. But if you're making a bread from almond flour and other alternatives, then wheat basically ruins the purpose of the bread.
Maybe baking bread since I was twelve doesn't qualify me as an expert. But I've been doing it since then and this floored me. Like many I thought it NECESSARY to add salt. Until I tried this.
The key is in not adding TOO much flour and in working your gluten. So allow me to share the recipe. They're just talking about the various things that salt does to bread. It's more than flavoring and preservation.
Yes my wheat example was a bit drastic, but you could say the same thing about yeast (or lack their of) in various types of quick breads. You don't need yeast to bake bread - see soda bread. I don't wouldn't say that adding wheat flour to a bread made of almond meal necessarily "ruins the purpose of the bread" because what is "the purpose of the bread"? If your point is to make a wheat free bread, then yeah. But if your point is to make a bread that is [primarily] almond meal/flour based then no, it doesn't. If my goal is to make almond cake for Passover, adding wheat flour most definitely ruins the purpose - in a really major way. If I want to make almond cake the rest of the year, I'd prefer a recipe that also includes wheat flour.
Also I could see the herbs de provence playing well with that bread recipe. My [belabored] point isn't that you can't bake bread without salt. It's that salt does more than flavor bread.3 -
King Arthur is a good company. And I'm 63 so yeah I'm likely much older. I've never even touched a bread machine. No desire to. Do it all old fashioned. Anyway, all I know is the end result turned out as good, flavorful and soft inside and crusty outside as with salt. And I know you don't need yeast to bake bread. I made some beer bread the other day as well.
Now nut-flour based breads are a whole other creature. I have used flour to make matzos, no yeast obviously in those but they're flat and, well, not noted for flavor lol. I had to make 400 of those suckers for a passover meal at our church. And to do it kosher? I did everything but the Rabbi- I didn't have one nearby.
Apparently I made bread without salt (the photos are mine). But if you don't think so, ok. But I did it
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King Arthur is a good company. And I'm 63 so yeah I'm likely much older. I've never even touched a bread machine. No desire to. Do it all old fashioned. Anyway, all I know is the end result turned out as good, flavorful and soft inside and crusty outside as with salt. And I know you don't need yeast to bake bread. I made some beer bread the other day as well.
Now nut-flour based breads are a whole other creature. I have used flour to make matzos, no yeast obviously in those but they're flat and, well, not noted for flavor lol. I had to make 400 of those suckers for a passover meal at our church. And to do it kosher? I did everything but the Rabbi- I didn't have one nearby.
Apparently I made bread without salt (the photos are mine). But if you don't think so, ok. But I did it
I definitely didn't say you didn't make bread or that you can't make bread without salt. If I thought that, most of what I wrote would be totally moot! And yeah - I've also never used a bread machine. The only sort of pastry that I strongly prefer to buy is filo or strudel dough, though I've been known to make that by hand as well (I have a goal of it becoming an undaunting task). I mean I'll buy other dough based things, but filo and strudel dough is a bit of a pain comparatively speaking
I haven't made matzo from scratch, but I might this year depending on how much time I have and where I am (last year I was out of town during the first two nights of Passover). There are some brands of matzo that are good, and there are some things that you can make out of matzo that taste good, but on it's own it's far from my favorite cracker. Wheat flour is used to make matzo (unless you get gluten free matzo), the issue is how long it's left in it's unbaked state once the water hits the flour. There's also a really good bakery near me that makes it every year (though it isn't kosher for Passover - no rabbi oversees the making of it and who knows about the flour), so I might order some from them as well.0 -
My real name is Leah and I'm a fairly Kosher kind of gal.
You can read more about it here
A dear friend of our family, for whom I was named, had mentioned that the flour had to be "watched". In Israel, where she was from, this meant the Rabbi coming in and literally watching the processes, from deliver to manufacturing the matzah itself. Now if you want to argue this, go ahead. You'll be arguing against what a Jewish lady taught us who is from Israel and comes from a long line of Sephardic Jews.
In any case, we shall agree to disagree and put this topic to rest. You have your opinion as do I when it comes to the baking of both regular bread and matzah. And I very much enjoyed the Seder. Try making your own matzah some time (or matzos). You'll find if you do it as per requirement its not easy. Here's the outline of a good kosher product.
The only parts I was truly able to stick to was the 18 minute time limit and the perforation.
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Great info!1
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King Arthur is a good company. And I'm 63 so yeah I'm likely much older. I've never even touched a bread machine. No desire to. Do it all old fashioned. Anyway, all I know is the end result turned out as good, flavorful and soft inside and crusty outside as with salt. And I know you don't need yeast to bake bread. I made some beer bread the other day as well.
Now nut-flour based breads are a whole other creature. I have used flour to make matzos, no yeast obviously in those but they're flat and, well, not noted for flavor lol. I had to make 400 of those suckers for a passover meal at our church. And to do it kosher? I did everything but the Rabbi- I didn't have one nearby.
Apparently I made bread without salt (the photos are mine). But if you don't think so, ok. But I did it
I had been baking bread the old-fashioned way for 30 years when someone gave me a bread machine for Christmas about 15 years ago. Although I think I managed to hide it very well, I was really insulted. What did I need a bread machine for? What a waste of counter space! But I tried it, because it was a gift and I felt like I needed to be able to tell the giver how "great" it worked, and I actually found there are benefits. In summer, I don't have to heat up the house baking in the oven. When I only want one small loaf, I don't have to waste energy heating the oven. And sometimes, I just want to have some homemade bread, but I'm busy and don't want to have to think about it after I toss the ingredients together. I still make it the old-fashioned way a lot of the time. I enjoy it. I think it usually tastes better -- I don't think a machine can knead as well as I can, and it's much easier to judge the texture and water-flour balance if I'm kneading by hand. But it's not an either-or world. I can do the bread machine when that makes sense, and I can make it by hand when that makes sense.
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Maybe one day I will break down and buy one. Another old fashioned baker suggests something- I'll listen! It could make things easier as I age also.
I know I resisted the Instant Pot at first, now I have a love affair going with it ! lol
Thanks for the inuput!1 -
Maybe one day I will break down and buy one. Another old fashioned baker suggests something- I'll listen! It could make things easier as I age also.
I know I resisted the Instant Pot at first, now I have a love affair going with it ! lol
Thanks for the inuput!
Hmmm ... I feel pretty much the same way about the InstaPot as I did about the bread machine before I got one. (What do I need one of those for??) Maybe I need to break down and give it a try.
ETA: But I absolutely draw the line at an electric can opener. No way. No how.2 -
monkeefan1974 wrote: »monkeefan1974 wrote: »How did it taste without salt?
The no-salt bread we make at home tastes like bread.
Cool! I don’t need to watch my sodium so it’s all the same to me but I was curious about the taste and if it affected texture. I wonder if manufacturers use salt in bread not only as a flavor enhancer but as a preservative too? Perhaps it lengthens the shelf life of the bread?
When used properly, salt should not make items taste salty. It actually enhances overall flavor and makes products taste more like themselves (that last part is from Thomas Keller's Ad Hoc at Home cookbook). Ask any chef and they'll tell you, living without salt is by far the hardest thing to do because it's so critical to flavor.
Yes, you can make bread or rice, etc. without salt but they'll taste relatively flat. Fine if you will be using them with other salty ingredients, but not really the best if to be eaten on their own.3 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »Maybe one day I will break down and buy one. Another old fashioned baker suggests something- I'll listen! It could make things easier as I age also.
I know I resisted the Instant Pot at first, now I have a love affair going with it ! lol
Thanks for the inuput!
Hmmm ... I feel pretty much the same way about the InstaPot as I did about the bread machine before I got one. (What do I need one of those for??) Maybe I need to break down and give it a try.
ETA: But I absolutely draw the line at an electric can opener. No way. No how.
I agree! No electric can opener for me.. I had one once upon a nightmare...0 -
Can you guys get that crispy skin of an artisan baked bread (no kneed bread for example) in from the bread machine or can this only be done baking in an oven?
I can get a crisper crust than standard commercial bakery bread (the pre-sliced in a plastic wrapper bread), but on average, I would say, "artisanal" bread will have a harder crust than a bread machine loaf. Personally, I'm not a fan of an overly hard or thick crust, but I guess "overly hard or thick" is in the teeth of the chewer.
As I said, if I have time and energy and it's cool weather, or I'm doing multiple loaves at once, I'll generally knead by hand and proof wherever (on range top, in steamy microwave, in oven) makes sense based on the weather/indoor temp (I don't have a proofing drawer) and bake in my oven (although you can use most bread machines to knead for you and then bake in your oven, which makes sense for a shaped or braided loaf, obviously, or you can knead the dough by hand and pop it into the machine for a rise-and-bake cycle only).
But there are days when time and energy constraints, or sanity about energy use, come down in favor of using the bread machine.0 -
There is the dough setting on the bread maker which takes out the lions share of the labour.
Experienced bakers can correct me if I am wrong on this but a higher temp oven will give a crispier crust.1 -
We let the dough setting of the bread maker do the kneading, then we take it out and bake it in the oven; we like the results better that way.
We also have an Instant Pot and I love it. I made a fresh batch of homemade yogurt last night.
My preferred can opener is the kind that unseals the lid rather than cutting through the metal. 1 -
My real name is Leah and I'm a fairly Kosher kind of gal.
You can read more about it here
A dear friend of our family, for whom I was named, had mentioned that the flour had to be "watched". In Israel, where she was from, this meant the Rabbi coming in and literally watching the processes, from deliver to manufacturing the matzah itself. Now if you want to argue this, go ahead. You'll be arguing against what a Jewish lady taught us who is from Israel and comes from a long line of Sephardic Jews.
In any case, we shall agree to disagree and put this topic to rest. You have your opinion as do I when it comes to the baking of both regular bread and matzah. And I very much enjoyed the Seder. Try making your own matzah some time (or matzos). You'll find if you do it as per requirement its not easy. Here's the outline of a good kosher product.
The only parts I was truly able to stick to was the 18 minute time limit and the perforation.
I'm not sure what we're disagreeing on. Would you care to elaborate @dauchsmom? I never said you weren't making bread (I actually said a number of times that you were making bread without salt). I also never said that you weren't making matzah. I never really remarked on your making it for your church's seder. Note the quote from one of my posts above: "I definitely didn't say you didn't make bread or that you can't make bread without salt."
And yes, I'm Jewish and I know about the process of making kosher for Passover matzah.1 -
My mom had one of those and swore by it too!so far Im still on the old fashioned one lolWe let the dough setting of the bread maker do the kneading, then we take it out and bake it in the oven; we like the results better that way.
We also have an Instant Pot and I love it. I made a fresh batch of homemade yogurt last night.
My preferred can opener is the kind that unseals the lid rather than cutting through the metal.
1
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