Why is it hard to maintain weight for years through intuitive eating?
alondrakar
Posts: 67 Member
I'm just looking for thoughts. A watched a video by Natasha Oceane on YT who is a huge advocate of IE. Not going to lie, it is disheartening watching someone eat whatever they want in moderation and know that is something I can't do myself without watching the weight creep back up. I don't want to count calories forever.
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IMHO, intuitive eating doesn't work for many of us because our environment doesn't make sense. There is food available all the time, everywhere, often quite calorie dense. More calories than we could ever need or want.
I suppose if I didn't have a care in the world, and my time was entirely my own, I could become completely in tune with my body's needs, focus on separating out the false "needs" for food, and set up my environment to make all of that make sense. But life is more complicated than that!
Plus, our environment used to force food regulation. You had to kill something or climb a tree or walk for miles to find food. You occasionally had to run like the dickens to not become food. You had to fatten up for winter when food would be scarce no matter how hard you looked.
To be blunt, I think people who say they are "intuitive eaters" are usually really just people whose activity level naturally matches their appetite. I have found it much easier to control my eating as I have become more and more active throughout the day - short walks, minding my screen time (and sitting and reading time), choosing the more physical way to get something done. But I still log (after 4 years) because it is way too easy for me to nibble on an extra 50 cals a day, and that's 5 lbs per year I don't need. I also find after all this time, logging takes me barely a couple of minutes a day, and honestly I think that's a small price to pay for eating in the way I want and being a healthy weight. Hang in there!45 -
I've been in maintenance for about a year and a half now and I still log my food every day. I don't find it a burden and it keeps me on track. As time goes on I think you'll find it's a very small price to pay. I cannot eat intuitively and wouldn't try because I definately don't want to regain the weight but my eating style definately changed when I started losing. It was a process over time and now I can't eat my old way without feeling ill. Those big quantities of food don't fit anymore, lol.13
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Because there is nothing intuitive about eating. This is a logical fallacy.
For centuries we have adapted with a minimal amount of food. It is only recent that we have had to manage with food abundance.
@kimny72 is absolutely correct. Without tracking and calorie counting one's experience is solely subjective and meaningless to everyone else. This is why athletes overwhelmingly gain weight after leaving their sport, veterans after leaving the military, and everyone else where a high level of physical activity was required and this changes to a minimal amount of activity.
Think of this in terms of a financial budget. If your income is minimal you have to budget every penny to ensure you can make ends meet. As income increases your need to budget is no longer necessary (although certainly desirable). What happens when a change in income occurs? Without the skills learned in budgeting disaster occurs because habits have been established based upon a temporary situation.
With the advent of smartphones and counting apps the activity around this is minimal. I've been at this for four years and spend ~ 10 mins/day actually counting and budgeting.13 -
But the options aren't just intuitive eating or calorie counting.
I eat mindfully, calorie aware but in a general sense rather than a precise sense - I simply don't need precision and food logging. I weigh myself regularly and make adjustments based on trends.
My assumption would be that this style of conscious eating is more common amongst people who have never been significantly overweight, the demographic on MyFitnessPal isn't entirely representative.
If I seriously screw up at some stage in the future then counting is of course still there as a tool in my tool box.19 -
IMHO, intuitive eating doesn't work for many of us because our environment doesn't make sense. There is food available all the time, everywhere, often quite calorie dense. More calories than we could ever need or want.
I suppose if I didn't have a care in the world, and my time was entirely my own, I could become completely in tune with my body's needs, focus on separating out the false "needs" for food, and set up my environment to make all of that make sense. But life is more complicated than that!
Plus, our environment used to force food regulation. You had to kill something or climb a tree or walk for miles to find food. You occasionally had to run like the dickens to not become food. You had to fatten up for winter when food would be scarce no matter how hard you looked.
To be blunt, I think people who say they are "intuitive eaters" are usually really just people whose activity level naturally matches their appetite. I have found it much easier to control my eating as I have become more and more active throughout the day - short walks, minding my screen time (and sitting and reading time), choosing the more physical way to get something done. But I still log (after 4 years) because it is way too easy for me to nibble on an extra 50 cals a day, and that's 5 lbs per year I don't need. I also find after all this time, logging takes me barely a couple of minutes a day, and honestly I think that's a small price to pay for eating in the way I want and being a healthy weight. Hang in there!
This is what I think, too. I am a fan of whatever works for the individual at the time. Also, I pay little attention to what "other people" do or don't do. Comparison is the thief of joy
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Can't say what others need to do but for me, routine is the key. Eating regular meals whether I am hungry or not tells my body not to store calories. If I wait until I am hungry I eat too fast and too much. If meals are more like brushing my teeth - something I have to do, not something that is a pleasure - then overeating is very easy to resist. (Still have to avoid bad foods and snacks)1
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If I ate "intuitively" my weight would creep back up to where it was for years. I happen to feel comfortable and satisfied by eating more calories than I burn, unfortunately. I didn't partiiiicularly abuse junk food nor sweets nor drinks. I pretty much had common (and pretty "healthy") meals and snacks... just happened to be more than I burn naturally.
So I definitely have to eat "mindfully" to lose and maintain weight. It does become second nature, to be more positive! But full blown intuitiveness doesn't work for me in the end.
P.S. I love Natasha, but she's super young and trains like a beast, so you have to take that into considaration. Also, you can never really be sure just how truthfull youtubers are, even sweeties like her (whom I love).5 -
alondrakar wrote: »I'm just looking for thoughts. A watched a video by Natasha Oceane on YT who is a huge advocate of IE. Not going to lie, it is disheartening watching someone eat whatever they want in moderation and know that is something I can't do myself without watching the weight creep back up. I don't want to count calories forever.
I've been maintaining for 6 years without calorie counting. I wouldn't call what I do "intuitive eating". I have a routine...I eat 3 meals per day and typically and afternoon snack or maybe two. I'm mindful of how I'm eating...I don't just eat whatever the hell I want all the time...I mean usually I want pizza and burgers...I do eat that in moderation if you consider moderation a couple slices on Friday night and grilling some burgers poolside on a Saturday evening. They aren't everyday foods that I try to fit in.
I have routine and I have various rules for myself along with exceptions to those rules...so long as the exceptions don't become the rule I'm fine. I focus on quality nutrition for the most part along with regular exercise.
Also, you have to consider a persons activity level/training, etc. There was a time over the course of a couple of years that I was doing a lot of heavy training for endurance cycling races...when I was doing that, I was spending a minimum of 10 hours per week training...minimum...and that was an easy week...and yeah...I didn't really have to think about food and could do pretty much whatever I wanted with it. I'm nowhere near that now due to other life obligations so I have to be much more mindful of what I'm eating on the regular.7 -
Some people are able to maintain without counting, I am not one of those people! I think of it as a healthy habit, something I have to do every day to take care of my body. Take brushing your teeth for example, it is something you should do every day for your health and it takes 2 minutes twice a day so 4 minutes total. I see calorie counting as the same, a healthy habit that takes me maybe 5 minutes a day so not much longer than brushing my teeth.4
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I've been maintaining for years without counting/logging. But, from the experience of logging on MFP while I was losing weight, I got an education on portion size, calorie counts, and what foods are/are not worth the calories to me.
These things are still in my head every day, and while I don't log in the app, I'm still kind of logging in my head. I know my maintenance calories and try to roughly stick to that.
So, probably "mindful eating" is a good term for this. It's definitely not intuitive...my intuition says to eat all the cookies in the break room.12 -
SuzySunshine99 wrote: »I've been maintaining for years without counting/logging. But, from the experience of logging on MFP while I was losing weight, I got an education on portion size, calorie counts, and what foods are/are not worth the calories to me.
These things are still in my head every day, and while I don't log in the app, I'm still kind of logging in my head. I know my maintenance calories and try to roughly stick to that.
So, probably "mindful eating" is a good term for this. It's definitely not intuitive...my intuition says to eat all the cookies in the break room.
Exactly. And yes, I always have a loose tally going in my head.3 -
But the options aren't just intuitive eating or calorie counting.
I eat mindfully, calorie aware but in a general sense rather than a precise sense - I simply don't need precision and food logging. I weigh myself regularly and make adjustments based on trends.
My assumption would be that this style of conscious eating is more common amongst people who have never been significantly overweight, the demographic on MyFitnessPal isn't entirely representative.
If I seriously screw up at some stage in the future then counting is of course still there as a tool in my tool box.
This.
Op, I've been in maintenance for over 6 years now. In that time I've had periods where I've tracked calorie and then other times where I haven't tracked them. I was looking at my bloodwork/health screenings history earlier today and in the past 5 years (what I have data from), my BMI has fluctuated very little. I keep on track by having a weight management plan in place, that I've created over time through some trial and error.
-I weigh-in every.single.day-NO exceptions. (I track my weigh-ins on a trending app). There were a few months last year where I got overly confident in myself and stopped the weigh-ins. I promptly re-gained some weight. I know better now
-I'm mindful of my food choices. I've experimented with various styles of eating (currently playing around with lower carb), but throughout all of that I still am intentional about what I eat. I plan out my day in advance and rarely stray from that plan. I stay away from certain foods that I know I'm not good at moderating. I haven't eliminated any of the foods that I like, but I don't eat some of them daily, or even weekly
-I pay attention to portion sizes and use my food scale almost every day, along with other measuring utensils
-I do log periodically over on cronometer, to get an idea of where I'm at. Usually 1-2 times a month
-I rarely eat breakfast or eat later at night. Setting parameters for when I eat has cut out extra calories that I don't even miss
This is my weight management plan, yours will be different and tailored to your specific needs. The important thing is to have a plan in place that you can use to keep you on track. That may or may not include daily calorie tracking.7 -
I can maintain my weight and even lose weight without counting calories, but it's definitely not without mental effort. I have to stick to a routine and eat my three meals plus 1 or two snacks that fit within a reasonable range of calories. I limit my treats either to small portions every day, or a larger portion but only once a week or so. From years of off and on calorie counting I have a good idea what foods are good choices and what foods are bad choices. I find it's not much easier than just keeping a damn food diary here on MFP. At least with MFP I know what I can afford to eat and what I can't.2
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My wife has been the same weight for 20 years and I have been up and down 50 lbs twice now. Both times up I was not just throwing in the towel but trying to eat "healthy". Just for whatever reason I tend to overeat and she doesn't. I think IE might work for some people but not others.8
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My "intuition" is off...12
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I'm intuitively hungry.
All the time.
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Most of us live in a situation of abundant, tasty, food that is easily obtainable for minimal labour, time, and cost.
The 1,000 Calorie Baconator on special at Wendy's last night was less expensive than the 500 Calorie baked potato and small chili I ordered--and the last two are from the "value" menu to begin with!
So we can have rules that we follow and which help us control our weight:
"I don't eat too early or too late"
"I eat a light breakfast and lunch and a more substantial dinner"
"OMAD"
"I only eat when I am hungry"
"Why would I have some of this delicious looking dessert: I am no longer hungry"
"I don't eat more than 30g of "added" sugar a day"
"I exercise an hour a day and never go back for seconds"
"I don't like eating this, that or the other"
"I stick close to eating my weekly TDEE and correct based on my weight trend"
These are all self imposed rules, limits, and preferences/
Some appear to be more stringent than others. And for some of us some of them may be harder for some of us to follow.
Overall though even the most "intuitive" eaters follow some sort of rules!
I find calorie counting to be liberating and restricting at the same time.
It is liberating because I can eat ANYTHING as long as I account for it.
And it is restricting when I realize how many things I cannot eat as much off and as often as I would like!
But I would rather eat at 2:00am and count calories as opposed to pass on dessert every time!
That's just me.
<and if I stop adjusting and reacting to what the scale shows I have little doubt as to what will happen>7 -
Hey y'all, thank you so much for your input. I waited a few hours before responding on purpose so that I could get as many thoughts as possible. It was nice to know one of you knew who I was talking about (Youtuber) and so many of you made the act of counting seem less lame. I guess I get overwhelmed more so when I think about cooking meals and not being able to account for them (I know I can.. but it is a lot of work). I then ask myself "can I really do this forever?" Same thing on weekends as my mother hands me my favorite home cooked meals and there's no way for me to track it. Mexican mom's like to add a 'pinch' of anything and everything.
Again, this really helped in making things less scary for me when I finally hit my goal weight in the next few weeks. A billion times, thank you!3 -
I.E.? Does it count if I intuitively want to eat everything???🤔5
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Most of our bodies have crappy intuitions. Advocates of IE are incapable of seeing outside their own perspective with the understanding that not everybody is wired the same way.
Our physiology is such that it's common for our bodies to have a bias towards surplus. Build up stores while food is available in order to survive the leaner times. While this was useful in our early days it's not really relevant for most of us today. The only problem is that our bodies haven't really adjusted - we mistake stress caused by general life with the stress we used to feel from lack of food so our bodies still believe it beneficial to chase a surplus.8 -
alondrakar wrote: »Hey y'all, thank you so much for your input. I waited a few hours before responding on purpose so that I could get as many thoughts as possible. It was nice to know one of you knew who I was talking about (Youtuber) and so many of you made the act of counting seem less lame. I guess I get overwhelmed more so when I think about cooking meals and not being able to account for them (I know I can.. but it is a lot of work). I then ask myself "can I really do this forever?" Same thing on weekends as my mother hands me my favorite home cooked meals and there's no way for me to track it. Mexican mom's like to add a 'pinch' of anything and everything.
Again, this really helped in making things less scary for me when I finally hit my goal weight in the next few weeks. A billion times, thank you!
Just to add, guesstimating gets easier as you get more experienced. Ask your mom what's in the food, I'm sure she'll be happy to share with you. You might not know the exact amounts or there might be a pinch of something she doesn't remember, but logging a rough estimate is good practice. And at least for me, logging everything really helped make it a habit. I eat dinner at my parents 2 or 3 times a week, and it's worked out fine.
When you weigh out a serving at home, really take a mental picture of it. Notice how full you feel after a meal you weighed out all the ingredients. Eating mindfully like that will make it easier to estimate meals by eye and by how you feel afterwards (after some practice) 7 -
when i try to eat intuitively, i end up eating a pint of frozen custard. i need to keep closer track of my food. as others have said, my intuition is broken6
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cwolfman13 wrote: »SuzySunshine99 wrote: »I've been maintaining for years without counting/logging. But, from the experience of logging on MFP while I was losing weight, I got an education on portion size, calorie counts, and what foods are/are not worth the calories to me.
These things are still in my head every day, and while I don't log in the app, I'm still kind of logging in my head. I know my maintenance calories and try to roughly stick to that.
So, probably "mindful eating" is a good term for this. It's definitely not intuitive...my intuition says to eat all the cookies in the break room.
Exactly. And yes, I always have a loose tally going in my head.
and me too, I keep a rough tally in my head (6 yrs in maintenance).0 -
I'm not sure, but for me to maintain my weight I need to plan my meals and track them.
This allows me to eat what I want and fit things in and not gain (or lose) weight.
I'm willing to do whatever it takes not to regain, so taking a few minutes out of my day to journal is totally worth the effort and peace of mind.14 -
SuzySunshine99 wrote: »I've been maintaining for years without counting/logging. But, from the experience of logging on MFP while I was losing weight, I got an education on portion size, calorie counts, and what foods are/are not worth the calories to me.
These things are still in my head every day, and while I don't log in the app, I'm still kind of logging in my head. I know my maintenance calories and try to roughly stick to that.
So, probably "mindful eating" is a good term for this. It's definitely not intuitive...my intuition says to eat all the cookies in the break room.
This is how I hope to be once I hit maintenance. I think this is part of what we learn using MFP/logging calories. If I go to a restaurant that has no calorie count, I can already guestimate which dishes will have more and which ones won't. This is especially true when you use the recipe calorie count option for homemade meals. I also think keeping a daily log teaches us how to tell if we're eating because we're hungry or {FILL IN THE BLANK}. It even teaches us to stop eating when full to "save" calories for later.
Like OP, I don't want to have to log food in my diary forever. But I do expect to have to continue for at least a year or two after reaching my goal weight.1 -
This is how I hope to be once I hit maintenance. I think this is part of what we learn using MFP/logging calories. If I go to a restaurant that has no calorie count, I can already guestimate which dishes will have more and which ones won't. This is especially true when you use the recipe calorie count option for homemade meals. I also think keeping a daily log teaches us how to tell if we're eating because we're hungry or {FILL IN THE BLANK}. It even teaches us to stop eating when full to "save" calories for later.
Like OP, I don't want to have to log food in my diary forever. But I do expect to have to continue for at least a year or two after reaching my goal weight.
So true. It's also good for thinking about portion sizes when eating out, particularly given how much upward creep there has been over the last few decades. I can reach satiety and quit, rather than just eat it because it happens to be on my plate.0 -
I log as guesswork a lot of the time, because I tend to eat sandwiches in cafes, or go out to eat with friends, or whatever. If I can make an informed guess that the tuna melt sandwich I had was probably around 500ish calories, then I know vaguely how much to budget for the rest of the day.
I logged for like 50 days and then took a little over a week off counting for curiosity's sake. Almost immediately I started shifting back into bad habits--not eating until 1 or 2 pm (which for me is an eating disorder mindset rather than IF per se, it doesn't set me up well mentally), grabbing random fast snacks from the cupboard rather than having something more balanced (having 2 muffins for dinner is fine now and again, but for 3 days in a row?), snacking and nibbling and a couple of quasi-binges. Because I didn't know how much I was eating, in my head I'd start spiralling and thinking I ate 4000 calories, even when I probably didn't.
Much as calorie counting can be a mild annoyance, I seem to be a lot more even when I'm counting, even if I take a day off here and there or I'm very loose with my logging. It's enough to keep me mindful.3 -
I "intuitively" maintained my weight well into my early 30's. Ate what I wanted, when I wanted, and in quantities I wanted. If I was putting on a couple extra pounds, I'd just trim back on the known "bad" things like fast food.
THEN, I got the "dreaded" (but much better paying) desk job. Done with school, and no more hiking around a campus. Sitting on my bum all day, and still having to go home at night and take care of "life" stuff. Any workouts had to be now added to my day, and were no longer a part of what I was already doing, but ANOTHER thing on my to-do list.
The weight crept on and up.
Basically, what it boiled down to, was my appetite and "hunger" levels were well tuned to my (then) active lifestyle. Once I got the professional job and the life that went with it, my activity levels plummeted (comparatively) but my appetite and hunger signals did NOT change.
In fact, I think they have yet to change....now, I have to keep an eye on things, and if I want to lose, I need to track things, because my body still sends signals that were in line with my old lifestyle, not my current one. "Intuition" doesn't work anymore, that's basically all there is to it for me.4 -
alondrakar wrote: »I don't want to count calories forever.
I'm quite sure that no one does.
For me it has been 50 years of (more or less intense) malnutrition, which lead to more than 100 lbs overweight.
Never expected that my journey would be over as soon as I reached the "goalweight-zone", never expected that 5 decades of "doing it wrong" get miraculously erased and replaced by "intuitively correct".
After three years of maintaining I finally seem to get a grip ... Don't really trust my body, yet. But it's getting better.
Hopefully in another two years I will finally be able to switch to (what I call it) "Intuitive counting" ... I will see.
The only thing I know for sure:
There is no way I will ever go back to obese. I'd rather count calories for the rest of my life.7 -
I'm a little more strict in maintenance than some as I still weigh out my lunch and snacks but beyond that I just keep a running tally of intake in my head. It helps that my maintenance program has been to generally only consume 50% of my maintenance needs through late afternoon (gross of exercise calories).
This means that I don't usually have to bother counting or tracking anything I eat for dinner/dessert because I have enough calories left to cover whatever, especially once exercise calories are factored into the mix.0
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