How to Ensure a Successful Lean Bulk
Options
Replies
-
yes1
-
Some may argue it, but I've never seen anything that suggests timing matters as long as nutrient/caloric needs are being met.
Any other one off issues aside that is, like potential medical issues and so on.3 -
lukejoycePT wrote: »There is no reason why you can't add muscle without gaining little to no fat. you've just got to be sensible about your calories and macros, it's really about experimenting until you find your sweet spot. Something else to take note of... The fatter you become the less muscle you will build. In other words keep your body fat low and you'll produce more muscle. For gents it's keeping your body fat around 12% and women around 20% if you go over this you'll be better off cutting for a while before trying to eat a bit more.
Bulking is just outdated information and it just really isn't good for you to do it. Remember every time you add a lot of weight it gets harder to lose it. Your body doesn't care about how good you look. It just cares about your survival, if you are going through a period of low calories your brain will start slowing things down and as soon as you increase calories your body will want to hold onto any and all calories you don't use and hold it in the form of fat.
Ah, the partitioning-ratio. My understanding is that it has been questioned because the research suggesting a lower body fat leads to a better p-ratio comes from looking at people who were naturally lean, rather than comparing people who have been dieted down into leanness. The biggest reason to avoid high body fat is it is just that much longer one needs to spend cutting.
Recomping is certainly possible, but most people find it frustrating, particular people at the novice to intermediate level.3 -
Another question: I am in the hospital all day from 4am to sometimes 9pm without much time to eat. On days when I get in so late after the gym (like 10pm or 11) is it ok to just backload my day’s calories and eat like 1400 at once between dinner and a large protein smoothie?
This is a pretty common picture of the importance of meal timing. In some cases there may be a small benefit, but for 99% of us we have much bigger fish to fry regarding nutrition (absent any specific medical condition)
3 -
The timing of meals is far less important than the calories you get. One prevents you from gaining, the other may make it slightly more optimal.1 -
Wow, there is a lot of misinformation in this thread. My .01 (after taxes)
- Increase calories above maintenance, but not so much that you are gaining excess fat. It's not worth the health complications to live half or more of your life obese. Furthermore, it's not necessary. Identify a healthy fat percentage and stay within that.
- Don't take steroids unless you have discussed it with your doctor and it is medically necessary.
- Heavy lifting isn't absolutely necessary. What needs to happen is that the muscle needs to be exercised to failure. It doesn't matter if it's 5 or 15 reps, as long as it's to failure. Focus on form and squeezing the muscle, which, in fact, suggests a slightly higher rep range. This is also less likely to cause injury.
- Don't go too low on eating fat. You need fat for healthy testosterone levels.
- Aim for about 0.8 to 1 gram of protein per pound of lean mass.
- It wouldn't hurt to get a blood test. Being deficient in certain things like zinc, magnesium and vitamin D, can negatively affect testosterone levels. If you are low, get more of them from your diet if you can, or from supplements. But only if you are low.
- Get enough sleep. Sleep is where a lot of repair and growth happens.
- Train each muscle group about two times per week. Combined with a good diet and sleep, this will keep you in an anabolic state most of the time.
- Be consistent. Consistency over time wins the race.
- Enjoy the process! The more you enjoy what you are doing, the more you are likely to stick with it. It does take time, so settle in for the long haul.
5 -
Wow, there is a lot of misinformation in this thread. My .01 (after taxes)
- Increase calories above maintenance, but not so much that you are gaining excess fat. It's not worth the health complications to live half or more of your life obese. Furthermore, it's not necessary. Identify a healthy fat percentage and stay within that.
- Don't take steroids unless you have discussed it with your doctor and it is medically necessary.
- Heavy lifting isn't absolutely necessary. What needs to happen is that the muscle needs to be exercised to failure. It doesn't matter if it's 5 or 15 reps, as long as it's to failure. Focus on form and squeezing the muscle, which, in fact, suggests a slightly higher rep range. This is also less likely to cause injury.
- Don't go too low on eating fat. You need fat for healthy testosterone levels.
- Aim for about 0.8 to 1 gram of protein per pound of lean mass.
- It wouldn't hurt to get a blood test. Being deficient in certain things like zinc, magnesium and vitamin D, can negatively affect testosterone levels. If you are low, get more of them from your diet if you can, or from supplements. But only if you are low.
- Get enough sleep. Sleep is where a lot of repair and growth happens.
- Train each muscle group about two times per week. Combined with a good diet and sleep, this will keep you in an anabolic state most of the time.
- Be consistent. Consistency over time wins the race.
- Enjoy the process! The more you enjoy what you are doing, the more you are likely to stick with it. It does take time, so settle in for the long haul.
In agreement with this as a general guideline. I do have an issue with point #1 "increase calories above maintenance, but not so much that you are gaining excess fat. It's not worth the health complications to live half or more of your life obese. Furthermore, it's not necessary. Identify a healthy fat percentage and stay within that."
Maybe it's just the way it's written but how does one increase calories so as you are not gaining too much fat, yet in the same point tell one it's not necessary to identify a healthy fat % and stay within that?
To me you, if one can't identify a healthy bodyfat range and stay within that, how does on know they are gaining too much fat?0 -
Wow, there is a lot of misinformation in this thread. My .01 (after taxes)
- Increase calories above maintenance, but not so much that you are gaining excess fat. It's not worth the health complications to live half or more of your life obese. Furthermore, it's not necessary. Identify a healthy fat percentage and stay within that.
- Don't take steroids unless you have discussed it with your doctor and it is medically necessary.
- Heavy lifting isn't absolutely necessary. What needs to happen is that the muscle needs to be exercised to failure. It doesn't matter if it's 5 or 15 reps, as long as it's to failure. Focus on form and squeezing the muscle, which, in fact, suggests a slightly higher rep range. This is also less likely to cause injury.
- Don't go too low on eating fat. You need fat for healthy testosterone levels.
- Aim for about 0.8 to 1 gram of protein per pound of lean mass.
- It wouldn't hurt to get a blood test. Being deficient in certain things like zinc, magnesium and vitamin D, can negatively affect testosterone levels. If you are low, get more of them from your diet if you can, or from supplements. But only if you are low.
- Get enough sleep. Sleep is where a lot of repair and growth happens.
- Train each muscle group about two times per week. Combined with a good diet and sleep, this will keep you in an anabolic state most of the time.
- Be consistent. Consistency over time wins the race.
- Enjoy the process! The more you enjoy what you are doing, the more you are likely to stick with it. It does take time, so settle in for the long haul.
You say there is misinformation and then promote misinformation. Going to failure is something that should be used sparingly due to the ability to recover. And there isn't much evidence suggesting that failure provides additional benefit. And for a large part of your training, an RPE of 7-8 is ideal. And if you do use failure, it should be reserved for a last for moves of your training program.7 -
Wow, there is a lot of misinformation in this thread. My .01 (after taxes)
- Increase calories above maintenance, but not so much that you are gaining excess fat. It's not worth the health complications to live half or more of your life obese. Furthermore, it's not necessary. Identify a healthy fat percentage and stay within that.
- Don't take steroids unless you have discussed it with your doctor and it is medically necessary.
- Heavy lifting isn't absolutely necessary. What needs to happen is that the muscle needs to be exercised to failure. It doesn't matter if it's 5 or 15 reps, as long as it's to failure. Focus on form and squeezing the muscle, which, in fact, suggests a slightly higher rep range. This is also less likely to cause injury.
- Don't go too low on eating fat. You need fat for healthy testosterone levels.
- Aim for about 0.8 to 1 gram of protein per pound of lean mass.
- It wouldn't hurt to get a blood test. Being deficient in certain things like zinc, magnesium and vitamin D, can negatively affect testosterone levels. If you are low, get more of them from your diet if you can, or from supplements. But only if you are low.
- Get enough sleep. Sleep is where a lot of repair and growth happens.
- Train each muscle group about two times per week. Combined with a good diet and sleep, this will keep you in an anabolic state most of the time.
- Be consistent. Consistency over time wins the race.
- Enjoy the process! The more you enjoy what you are doing, the more you are likely to stick with it. It does take time, so settle in for the long haul.
You say there is misinformation and then promote misinformation. Going to failure is something that should be used sparingly due to the ability to recover. And there isn't much evidence suggesting that failure provides additional benefit. And for a large part of your training, an RPE of 7-8 is ideal. And if you do use failure, it should be reserved for a last for moves of your training program.
This^ Mike Israetel describes training to failure increasing recovery exponentially. Not only does it not provide additional benefits but will affect training frequency and overall volume.4 -
To me you, if one can't identify a healthy bodyfat range and stay within that, how does on know they are gaining too much fat?
I use my waist as a proxy for accumulated fat, but of course there are better ways: skinfold calipers, InBody type of scales and hydrostatic weighing are just a few.
What I mean by this is that one should not allow them to become obese during a bulk. There are a lot of negative health outcomes associated with obesity, even if you have more muscle mass than the average individual. It's not good for the ticker! It's also not necessary.
2 -
A good article from Renaissance Periodization on the topic of effective training volume.
https://renaissanceperiodization.com/training-volume-landmarks-muscle-growth/1 -
You say there is misinformation and then promote misinformation. Going to failure is something that should be used sparingly due to the ability to recover. And there isn't much evidence suggesting that failure provides additional benefit. And for a large part of your training, an RPE of 7-8 is ideal. And if you do use failure, it should be reserved for a last for moves of your training program.
Misinformation? I don't think so. Clarification might be needed, perhaps. But something tells me you're not motivated by the desire to flesh out details so as to arrive at a more informed point of view. I hope I am mistaken.
I think it's safe to say, and for me to restate, that, from a longitudinal perspective, the current evidence does not fully support absolute failure in every single instance, every time. Is that better? Some do say this is necessary for maximum protein synthesis and hypertrophy, and some suggest that stopping within a couple of reps might achieve the same result. But to say that 7-8 reps is ideal without any context to put it in is also not correct and reflects an outdated approach. The point, as I'm sure you would concede, is to give the muscle something it is not used to so it is forced to adapt. 7-8 reps at 50 lbs means something different than 7-8 reps at 100lbs for any particular individual. The point is that it has to be tough, so to speak, in order to force the muscle to adapt.
I'm sure we could have a vigorous debate on this one point alone, although I suggest that our time would be better spent giving the original poster more overall, generally well-established advice that does not take him down a rabbit hole. What can you add to the discussion in that vein?
7 -
This^ Mike Israetel describes training to failure increasing recovery exponentially. Not only does it not provide additional benefits but will affect training frequency and overall volume.
Thanks for the tip! I'm looking forward to reading some of his stuff. Are you familiar with the work of Jorn Trommelen? Great stuff.
1 -
You say there is misinformation and then promote misinformation. Going to failure is something that should be used sparingly due to the ability to recover. And there isn't much evidence suggesting that failure provides additional benefit. And for a large part of your training, an RPE of 7-8 is ideal. And if you do use failure, it should be reserved for a last for moves of your training program.
Misinformation? I don't think so. Clarification might be needed, perhaps. But something tells me you're not motivated by the desire to flesh out details so as to arrive at a more informed point of view. I hope I am mistaken.
I think it's safe to say, and for me to restate, that, from a longitudinal perspective, the current evidence does not fully support absolute failure in every single instance, every time. Is that better? Some do say this is necessary for maximum protein synthesis and hypertrophy, and some suggest that stopping within a couple of reps might achieve the same result. But to say that 7-8 reps is ideal without any context to put it in is also not correct and reflects an outdated approach. The point, as I'm sure you would concede, is to give the muscle something it is not used to so it is forced to adapt. 7-8 reps at 50 lbs means something different than 7-8 reps at 100lbs for any particular individual. The point is that it has to be tough, so to speak, in order to force the muscle to adapt.
I'm sure we could have a vigorous debate on this one point alone, although I suggest that our time would be better spent giving the original poster more overall, generally well-established advice that does not take him down a rabbit hole. What can you add to the discussion in that vein?
Your assumptions are wrong. Volume and metabolic stress are the largest components of hypertrophy. You can see maximal hypertrophy and never do a set to failure. Is there an application for it, maybe? But to suggest that one needs to hit failure would be wrong.
There is a difference between one must do something vs there may be an application. That is my point.5 -
There is a difference between one must do something vs there may be an application. That is my point.
Fair point. I look forward to your additional tips/tricks which can help the OP.
1 -
This^ Mike Israetel describes training to failure increasing recovery exponentially. Not only does it not provide additional benefits but will affect training frequency and overall volume.
Thanks for the tip! I'm looking forward to reading some of his stuff. Are you familiar with the work of Jorn Trommelen? Great stuff.
I'm not familiar with him. I will take a look. Thanks0 -
man the level of bro science in this post is off the hook! So much outdated info.10
-
lukejoycePT wrote: »man the level of bro science in this post is off the hook! So much outdated info.
And the ironic comment of the day belongs to...9 -
lukejoycePT wrote: »man the level of bro science in this post is off the hook! So much outdated info.
And the ironic comment of the day belongs to...
Just because you have abs doesn't mean you know how to train. If you did you would have far more muscle mass than in your photo.10
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 391.3K Introduce Yourself
- 43.4K Getting Started
- 259.6K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.6K Food and Nutrition
- 47.3K Recipes
- 232.3K Fitness and Exercise
- 387 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.4K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 152.7K Motivation and Support
- 7.8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.2K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.2K MyFitnessPal Information
- 22 News and Announcements
- 911 Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.3K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions