Am I working too hard?

AZTeri2016

Stats first - 63 yo female, CW 184, goal 160. I currently workout with a trainer 3 days a week followed by cardio, additional cardio two days a week. Saturdays are long bike rides. I’ve found lately that my rides on Saturday are becoming much more difficult. I probably didn’t have the best meal last night, chicken with asparagus - it didn’t have any carbs beyond what was in the asparagus. I just had no energy today. We did have a decent breakfast - I had an egg, Kodiak cake waffle, nectarine.

I used to be able to maintain a pace of roughly 12-13 miles per hour. Today I was struggling to keep it at 10. The route we took today has a fairly significant incline. We did stop after 11 miles and got a yogurt and fruit, which helped me finish.

I wonder if the workouts on Friday are hurting my ability to ride on Saturdays? Should I continue with the weight/strength training and just cut the extra (30 minutes) cardio? I noticed my average heart rate today was about 138. Recovery time is ok, usually about 5 minutes and it’s back down below 120.

There is a bike path called the Loop around Tucson. From our house, the entire Loop that circumnavigates the city is roughly 60 miles (not counting all the connector paths). I really want to ride it by the first of the year. What if anything should I change?

Food notes - I’m working with a nutritionist who has me on 40% fat, 30% carbs and protein. I’ve been really close to those numbers all the time. I do eat back most of my exercise calories. I will be meeting with her again on September 16 to see if I need to tweak what I’m eating when. But I’m open to suggestions in the meantime.

melissamurphy19

I would ask your coach to be sure. It could be burn out, it could be a restless sleep that left you feeling drained, or you could just be having a sluggish day. I am just starting my workout routine at a gym (first time), so I fear burn out also. I felt sluggish after my run today, but I think we will all have days where working out is just harder than usual. Maybe take a rest day, or if you feel like that again, do a little less of a hardcore workout (slower pace, same time).

alteredsteve175

Recovery does take longer for many seasoned citizens. I would not stop the weight training. I would cut back on the cardio - either after the weight training or on the off days. Three days during the week and a long ride on Saturdays would be plenty of cardio for me.

mmapags

I would say that you are. You don't have enough rest/ recovery built into your schedule and it sounds like that is starting to show up. Why so much cardio? Beyond a warmup, I don't do any intense cardio on weight training days. It is a 3 mile walk round trip to the gym and back and I do that at a leisurely pace.

Even if you went to every other day with the cardio on non weight training days, that still gives you 3 good sessions per week of cardio and then 1 complete rest day. There are 2 sides to the fitness cycle of progression: Work/ Rest and Recovery. I am 68 and I don't recover like I did in my 30s.

sijomial

AZTeri2016 wrote: »

I used to be able to maintain a pace of roughly 12-13 miles per hour. Today I was struggling to keep it at 10. The route we took today has a fairly significant incline.

Yes you could be working too hard / recovering too little but also.....
There's a world of difference between riding a fairly flat course and a course with "a fairly significant incline".
The problem could simply be that you aren't used to riding uphill.

aokoye

I'm part way with @sijomial on this one. Yes it could be that you're doing a bit too much/need more rest, but it could also be that you're just not used to the elevation gain. Also it doesn't matter how old you are, some people need more rest than others. This includes people in their 30s I personally need at least one rest day a week (I worked up to that over the course of multiple years) and know multiple people between the ages of 50-70 who take no rest days.

You're 60 mile goal is totally doable. It's a matter of gradually upping your long rides. A quick google of "metric century plan" will net you a lot of free plans. The way I worked up to a metric century (100km ~62 miles) it years ago was to add an extra 5 or 10 miles to my weekly long ride - I kept my other two rides around the same length I think. Note that I also did all of this while well over 200 pounds (I'm 5' 8.5").

quiksylver296

What’s your daily calorie goal?

AZTeri2016

quiksylver296 wrote: »

What’s your daily calorie goal?

. It is set at 1300. My BMR is 1483. As I said though I eat almost all my exercise calories every day, usually leaving less than 200, so the calories and macros change every day.

And thank you all. I really do think I must be overdoing it. Before I started working out so hard, it was easier on the bike, so I’ll make it a point to rest more this week and see what next week brings. I do take every Sunday off.

AnnPT77

How fast are you losing, on average? 1300 could be too low, especially if your BMR (not NEAT) really is 1483. Actual loss rate is what matters, calorically. Aggressive loss can have a worse energy/health penalty, at our age. (I'm 63, too.)

At age 59-60, I lost lost most of 50 pounds in less than a year at >1400 (quite a bit >, much of the way) plus exercise, starting from 183 pounds.

That won't work for everyone - I'm a good li'l ol' calorie burner - but the crucial indicator is actual weight loss rate, not some silly calorie "calculator". Those estimates are statistical, therefore approximate, not gospel.

I'm also a big believer in at least one real rest day per week, even after a decade plus of being routinely active. I might do stretching or yoga, maybe a casual walk, but nothing intense. If I don't, I notice.

Best wishes!

AZTeri2016

AnnPT77 - I have been stuck on a plateau for some time, but finally lost 4 pounds in the past two weeks, since I went on the macros recommended to me by the nutritionist. This week there was no loss, but a gain of 1 pound. As I said, i tend to eat nearly all of my exercise calories. For example, today I burned 842 calories, and only have 377 left over, since I do have the exercise calories added back. And I’m not hungry right now - we went to a late lunch/early dinner and while it wasn’t a lot, after 5 hours I’m not really hungry.

dmkoenig

Congrats on your regimen. I did my first Half Ironman triathlon 2 1/2 years ago at age 60, and lost about 30 pounds over a 14 week period as I prepared for the event. One of the best books I read on senior athletes is Fast Over Fifty by Joe Friel. To sum up the book, there are two things senior athletes need to maintain fitness and sustain activity: incorporate HIIT training and allow for extra recovery time. I think you are not giving yourself adequate recovery. Keep up the great work!

sijomial

To expand on my previous response from a cyclist's perspective.....

If Saturday is going to be your regular longer or more intense ride then what you do on the Friday should take that into account. On Fridays don't train legs in the gym (do upper body strength only), don't do cardio that causes fatigue (gentle ride or other cardio is fine). As your mileage increases make sure you are eating significant amounts of carbs Friday evening and Saturday morning if you decide to stay with your current fat dominant macro split.

But fixed macro percentages make less and less sense as your distance increases and your exercise calories and TDEE go up - suggest you talk to your nutritionist about the particular needs of doing endurance exercise, they are not the same as a regular person losing weight without long duration exercise. Your nutritionist may or may not know much about sports nutrition - ask them for their experience and knowledge in this specialist sphere.

Minimum goals for fat and protein with the majority of your exercise calories coming from carbs makes far more sense the longer you ride. e.g. On a day with a TDEE of 4,000+ cals on a bigger ride day there's no way I want to stick to high percentages for fat and protein!

I've found both my Garmin bike computer and Strava estimates for calories to be perfectly reasonable over many years and many thousands of miles. Not as accurate as my power meter but perfectly usable for purpose.

A lot of 100 km or 100 mile training plans are based around 4 rides a week.

1. My preference is for two easy rides (moderate speed, not attacking hills like mortal enemies....).
2. One fairly short for me but intense effort (either through speed or hill climbs).
3. One long ride that increases distance week on week.

Both the intense and the long rides need to be scheduled thoughfully into my exercise week to get the most benefit from them.

AnnPT77

AZTeri2016 wrote: »

AnnPT77 - I have been stuck on a plateau for some time, but finally lost 4 pounds in the past two weeks, since I went on the macros recommended to me by the nutritionist. This week there was no loss, but a gain of 1 pound. As I said, i tend to eat nearly all of my exercise calories. For example, today I burned 842 calories, and only have 377 left over, since I do have the exercise calories added back. And I’m not hungry right now - we went to a late lunch/early dinner and while it wasn’t a lot, after 5 hours I’m not really hungry.

That doesn't sound like crazy-fast loss, unless the 2 pounds a week pattern continues (might be a little aggressive for your current body weight, especially while being as active as you are). It's hard to say to what extent water retention could be masking fat loss, or water weight loss could be exaggerating it, in a small number of weeks. I would think 1-1.5 pounds a week would be a good goal. I started at about your weight (183), and 2 pounds a week was too fast, before long.

Part of my concern is that hunger may really not be the best guide. I felt fine eating the number of calories MFP estimated for me, when I first started here (around 154 pounds, back in 2015) . . . until I didn't, quite suddenly. I was losing too fast, around 2 pounds a week, and even though I corrected as soon as I realized, it took me several weeks to regain normal strength and energy level. Fatigue or underperformance is potentially a danger sign.

Like sijomial, I'd suggest talking with your nutritionist about whether you can set a minimum grams goal for protein and fats, and have the flexibility to increase carbs when you're very active, if you'd choose to do so.

At 1300 calories, it sounds like you'd be eating 520 calories of fat (about 58g); and 290 calories each of protein and carbs (about 98g of each). Though opinions differ, that seems pretty reasonable, to me.

But when you add 800 calories of exercise (a round number I picked simply because it's close to the 842 earned exercise calories you report for your one example day), you'd be at around 93g of fat, and 158g of protein and carbs. That seems like overkill on fats (unless you enjoy them), a little more protein than you probably can benefit from, and still a very moderate level (if that) of carbs for fueling endurance activity. Obviously, that's just my opinion.

Machka9

AZTeri2016 wrote: »

Stats first - 63 yo female, CW 184, goal 160. I currently workout with a trainer 3 days a week followed by cardio, additional cardio two days a week. Saturdays are long bike rides. I’ve found lately that my rides on Saturday are becoming much more difficult. I probably didn’t have the best meal last night, chicken with asparagus - it didn’t have any carbs beyond what was in the asparagus. I just had no energy today. We did have a decent breakfast - I had an egg, Kodiak cake waffle, nectarine.

I used to be able to maintain a pace of roughly 12-13 miles per hour. Today I was struggling to keep it at 10. The route we took today has a fairly significant incline. We did stop after 11 miles and got a yogurt and fruit, which helped me finish.

I wonder if the workouts on Friday are hurting my ability to ride on Saturdays? Should I continue with the weight/strength training and just cut the extra (30 minutes) cardio? I noticed my average heart rate today was about 138. Recovery time is ok, usually about 5 minutes and it’s back down below 120.

There is a bike path called the Loop around Tucson. From our house, the entire Loop that circumnavigates the city is roughly 60 miles (not counting all the connector paths). I really want to ride it by the first of the year. What if anything should I change?

Food notes - I’m working with a nutritionist who has me on 40% fat, 30% carbs and protein. I’ve been really close to those numbers all the time. I do eat back most of my exercise calories. I will be meeting with her again on September 16 to see if I need to tweak what I’m eating when. But I’m open to suggestions in the meantime.

The lack of carbs probably didn't help.

The incline could have slowed you down.

And I think you said somewhere else that your Saturday rides are your only rides each week. If your goal is to ride 60 miles, you need to focus on that and cycle more often each week. Try cycling at least 3 times each week ... cycling could replace whatever else you're doing for cardio.

BrianSharpe

30% carbs sounds a bit low, use a registered dietician rather than a "nutritionist", unfortunately there are many "nutritionist" certification programs that are lacking in rigour and promote some sketchy information.

AZTeri2016

Better ride today. Rested yesterday, but didn’t really eat much either. Today’s ride was 14.5 miles, all uphill the first half of it. Which means the ride home was all down hill - I hit 25 miles per hour . I think I’ve learned my lesson. No more training on Fridays, or at least very light. Thank you all for your help!

AZTeri2016

Update today - I met with my trainer and he's changed some of my routines to help me achieve the goal of 60 miles. I'll be working out with him Monday, Wednesday and Thursday now so I can take it easier on Friday. I'm going to add rides in on Tuesdays as well, even if at this point it's only on the bike at the gym. I have to learn how to ride with my clips! At least I can work on it there.

aokoye

AZTeri2016 wrote: »

Update today - I met with my trainer and he's changed some of my routines to help me achieve the goal of 60 miles. I'll be working out with him Monday, Wednesday and Thursday now so I can take it easier on Friday. I'm going to add rides in on Tuesdays as well, even if at this point it's only on the bike at the gym. I have to learn how to ride with my clips! At least I can work on it there.

Good deal - it really is a very achievable goal. By clips I'm assuming you mean clipless pedals (which you ride with using cycling shoes that have cleats attached to them). There's definitely a learning curve, but it gets better quickly, especially if your pedals are dual sided.

AZTeri2016

Yes, clipless pedals. And mine are dual sided. They just terrify me! I’m so afraid of getting stuck and falling!

aokoye

AZTeri2016 wrote: »

Yes, clipless pedals. And mine are dual sided. They just terrify me! I’m so afraid of getting stuck and falling!

You will fall at least once, which maybe isn't reassuring. What should be, however, is that that's true of everyone! Getting used to them on a bike path, as opposed to in traffic, is your best bet. Eventually (sooner rather than later) you'll get to a point where the hardest part is clipping in.

Machka9

AZTeri2016 wrote: »

Yes, clipless pedals. And mine are dual sided. They just terrify me! I’m so afraid of getting stuck and falling!

I ride with one foot clipped in ... and one foot not.