Need alternative to Crunches

jeffjeff85

Azdak wrote: »

I’m not sure where you stand in the whole “facts vs opinions” debate, but the preeminent expert in back biomechanics would disagree with you.


https://www.macleans.ca/society/health/the-man-who-wants-to-kill-crunches/

Strange what some are willing to call' evidence'.

Muscle strengthens by performing "work". Eccentric, concentric, or isometric - not without purpose.
'Planks' are. 'good', compared to couch sitting. But this isometric contraction can never equate to the flexion/extension of concentric and eccentric motion.
Anybody thinks that's false should probably be doing bench presses by picking up the weight, lowering it 2 inches, hold it for a period then rack it. STILL better than couch sitting, but minimally beneficial to building the chest.

Your spine has segments. For a reason. It was MADE to flex. Strengthening the core muscles will lead to LESS back problems, not more.

goatg

I do sit ups with a 40 lb dumbbell on my chest (after a decent warmup). I've been doing them for years, feel like I have good form/control, and enjoy the load on my biceps, shoulders, and back. But...I've always wondered at the general efficiency/safety.

Katmary71

Interesting that this was said, I've been given the half crunches where you just slightly curl up before going back down after my back surgeries and in three different clinics. For sure don't do the crunch machine at the gym, I was told not to pre-surgery and thought post surgery it might be ok, I only put 10lbs on and couldn't walk for a few days!

I'm just upping my core workout but do planks, obliques similar to bicycles, side planks, and straight-legs one at a time off the ground (like hard dead bugs).

Azdak

Katmary71 wrote: »

Interesting that this was said, I've been given the half crunches where you just slightly curl up before going back down after my back surgeries and in three different clinics. For sure don't do the crunch machine at the gym, I was told not to pre-surgery and thought post surgery it might be ok, I only put 10lbs on and couldn't walk for a few days!

I'm just upping my core workout but do planks, obliques similar to bicycles, side planks, and straight-legs one at a time off the ground (like hard dead bugs).

What is a foundational exercise for basic rehab is not always a good choice for regular training. PT clinics tend to see people at their weakest and people who need specific exercises. By the time they get to the point where they are able or need more advanced exercises, they are out of PT.

Also, curl up you describe does not involve (loaded) flexion of the spine, which is the main concern with sit ups (other than the fact that it is a mediocre exercise). So it’s actually a different exercise. There is nothing wrong with a curl up other than the fact that it is a very basic exercise that even a beginner will outgrow very quickly.

Azdak

goatg wrote: »

I do sit ups with a 40 lb dumbbell on my chest (after a decent warmup). I've been doing them for years, feel like I have good form/control, and enjoy the load on my biceps, shoulders, and back. But...I've always wondered at the general efficiency/safety.

I had a detailed answer written which disappeared when I was checking another source

In short: for an athlete such as yourself, doing those crunches poses little risk of injury, but IMO they are not the best in terms of the effort:benefit ratio. If you work hard enough, even at a mediocre movement, you can get some benefits. But with the same time and effort you could probably do better.

My cycling coaching experience and skills are not at the same level as your new bike, so I am not going to suggest any specific alternate exercises. But I would recommend reaching out to some people with specific experience training higher level cyclists and see if they have any additional exercises.

grob49

cherylseptember wrote: »

After back surgery my neurosurgeon told me to never do crunches again. What are the best ab workouts that don’t involve crunches?

Take a look at planks and the plank challenge

goatg

Azdak wrote: »

goatg wrote: »

I do sit ups with a 40 lb dumbbell on my chest (after a decent warmup). I've been doing them for years, feel like I have good form/control, and enjoy the load on my biceps, shoulders, and back. But...I've always wondered at the general efficiency/safety.

I had a detailed answer written which disappeared when I was checking another source

In short: for an athlete such as yourself, doing those crunches poses little risk of injury, but IMO they are not the best in terms of the effort:benefit ratio. If you work hard enough, even at a mediocre movement, you can get some benefits. But with the same time and effort you could probably do better.

My cycling coaching experience and skills are not at the same level as your new bike, so I am not going to suggest any specific alternate exercises. But I would recommend reaching out to some people with specific experience training higher level cyclists and see if they have any additional exercises.

Thanks Azdak! Highly appreciated. I spend a crazy amount of time on my core relative to benefit...but it is pretty strong. I’d love some lore, full body movements. My abs routine is long/involved but no doubt redundant.

Highly appreciate the input. Thanks (my approach to fitness doesn’t optimize for triathlon/cycling —more of a hodgepodge with room for improvement)

Merry Christmas 🙃