Anyone get headaches?

2»

Replies

  • shaumom
    shaumom Posts: 1,003 Member
    Nony_Mouse wrote: »
    'When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras'. I would try some of the simple suggestions (like a snack before workouts) before jumping to something like elevated histamine levels.

    This saying is used mostly to help remind new doctors not to jump to conclusions that symptoms are a rare disorder, right off the bat. However, diagnosticians also say that 'zebra' type diagnoses shouldn't be dismissed immediately any more than common illnesses should.

    "In making the diagnosis of the cause of illness in an individual case, calculations of probability have no meaning. The pertinent question is whether the disease is present or not. Whether it is rare or common does not change the odds in a single patient..." — A. McGehee Harvey, James Bordley II, Jeremiah Barondess, Differential Diagnosis (3rd ed.)

    That said...higher histamine levels isn't actually a zebra-type situation, not unless we're saying that things that elevate histamine - like hay fever and allergies - are so rare as to be medical 'zebras.' The knowledge that this can be an issue is not well known among lay people, but the situation itself is actually not that uncommon.
  • kimny72
    kimny72 Posts: 16,011 Member
    edited February 2020
    shaumom wrote: »
    Nony_Mouse wrote: »
    'When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras'. I would try some of the simple suggestions (like a snack before workouts) before jumping to something like elevated histamine levels.

    This saying is used mostly to help remind new doctors not to jump to conclusions that symptoms are a rare disorder, right off the bat. However, diagnosticians also say that 'zebra' type diagnoses shouldn't be dismissed immediately any more than common illnesses should.

    "In making the diagnosis of the cause of illness in an individual case, calculations of probability have no meaning. The pertinent question is whether the disease is present or not. Whether it is rare or common does not change the odds in a single patient..." — A. McGehee Harvey, James Bordley II, Jeremiah Barondess, Differential Diagnosis (3rd ed.)

    That said...higher histamine levels isn't actually a zebra-type situation, not unless we're saying that things that elevate histamine - like hay fever and allergies - are so rare as to be medical 'zebras.' The knowledge that this can be an issue is not well known among lay people, but the situation itself is actually not that uncommon.

    The idea would be that OP should attempt to fix the easy to fix stuff first, like to eat a little something before her workout, double check that her deficit isn't too aggressive, and consider her form, before assuming it's some kind of medical problem she needs to tackle.

    If she corrects all the simple stuff and is still struggling with headaches, THEN consider supplementation or medical evaluation. Unfortunately, when an OP gets a bunch of responses, they often would rather assume it's something complicated that makes them unusual, rather than simply tweak the plan they've decided on, it just seems to be human nature. :smile:
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    kimny72 wrote: »
    shaumom wrote: »
    Nony_Mouse wrote: »
    'When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras'. I would try some of the simple suggestions (like a snack before workouts) before jumping to something like elevated histamine levels.

    This saying is used mostly to help remind new doctors not to jump to conclusions that symptoms are a rare disorder, right off the bat. However, diagnosticians also say that 'zebra' type diagnoses shouldn't be dismissed immediately any more than common illnesses should.

    "In making the diagnosis of the cause of illness in an individual case, calculations of probability have no meaning. The pertinent question is whether the disease is present or not. Whether it is rare or common does not change the odds in a single patient..." — A. McGehee Harvey, James Bordley II, Jeremiah Barondess, Differential Diagnosis (3rd ed.)

    That said...higher histamine levels isn't actually a zebra-type situation, not unless we're saying that things that elevate histamine - like hay fever and allergies - are so rare as to be medical 'zebras.' The knowledge that this can be an issue is not well known among lay people, but the situation itself is actually not that uncommon.

    The idea would be that OP should attempt to fix the easy to fix stuff first, like to eat a little something before her workout, double check that her deficit isn't too aggressive, and consider her form, before assuming it's some kind of medical problem she needs to tackle.

    If she corrects all the simple stuff and is still struggling with headaches, THEN consider supplementation or medical evaluation. Unfortunately, when an OP gets a bunch of responses, they often would rather assume it's something complicated that makes them unusual, rather than simply tweak the plan they've decided on, it just seems to be human nature. :smile:

    Yep, this was exactly my point :) And that's from someone who actually has a 'zebra' condition.
  • shaumom
    shaumom Posts: 1,003 Member
    sdavis484 wrote: »
    ...This makes perfect sense. I deal with eczema and just am sensitive to a lot of things - hives, etc. I am hesitant to take anticholinergics like antihistamines though. I do sometimes but I try not to because they increase the risk of dementia.

    Thank you for sharing your knowledge with this thoughtful answer!

    You're welcome, and I hope it helps! My own disorder makes me react to the stupid medicine that's supposed to help me WITH reactions (seriously ridiculous), so I totally understand wanting to avoid medication. I and my doctors have had to find sort of 'run-arounds' and try things like the flavonoids and such to help me instead.

    Hearing about hives and things, I would doubly recommend the mast cell stabilizing bioflavonoids as something to check out. There are a lot of them out there - plant based, typically found in foods and beverages - and seriously, some of these have made a world of difference for me.

    There's a website that is still kept up right now, from a gal who had histamine issues and used to be an investigative journalist. She started researching histamine stuff when she started getting ill, and has a lot of interesting interviews and information on the site. She passed away from cancer a few years ago (like myself, she reacted to lots of meds and such), but has a lot of loved ones still here who keep up the site. Some of the suggestions on it helped me so, so much when looking for help.

    Like, this page is about teas that contain mast cell stabilizing compounds (so help inhibit release of histamine and inflammatory mediators) and may be helpful even just for folks with allergies. She has references for the information, including links to the relevant studies if they exist.

    https://healinghistamine.com/5-best-histamine-intolerance-teas/


    I hope you feel better soon!
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    PAV8888 wrote: »
    Zebra hoofbeats and all that. I mean I did learn something about histamines that I did not know and I am thankful for that actually. But, like, we know the OP has been under-eating... because she has said so. So she exercises and has a headache around that time and has been under-eating.

    Options? a) have a snickers bar and repeat the exercise. See how you feel this time! b) start an elimination diet consider your medical history and investigate one of thousands of possible other etiologies that may exist for a headache while expending energy while under-eating BEFORE you try eating a snickers bar first?!

    Hmmm..... unless there exists a peanut allergy--in which case an almond snickers may be more appropriate--I know which option *I* would try out FIRST!

    I knew about the histamine thing (it's possibly maybe probably something I deal with), still was not the first thing that sprung to mind as an explanation. It's kind of like someone saying they're tired/fatigued all the time and me immediately jumping to 'oh maybe you have ME/CFS!', just because I do, rather than starting with things like 'are you eating enough?'.
  • sdavis484
    sdavis484 Posts: 160 Member
    PAV I am decidedly NOT undereating as my calories are set to 1200 but I was eating back a good portion of my activity calories, which if you followed the post that I originally said I was eating 1200, explained ALL that. That being said, I have dealt with headaches when exercising despite hydrating, eating, extra sleep, etc since I was 20 (15 years). I don't have headaches 100% or even 50% of the time and I was just looking to commiserate with others in my situation of the occasional exercise headache.
  • Psychgrrl
    Psychgrrl Posts: 3,177 Member
    Could you be tensing up and holding your breath? That can contribute to tension headaches. I used to do that when I lift. I am very intentional about breathing now. Also helps when I exhale on the exertion portion of the lift.
  • sdavis484
    sdavis484 Posts: 160 Member
    edited February 2020
    aokoye wrote: »
    sdavis484 wrote: »
    PAV I am decidedly NOT undereating as my calories are set to 1200 but I was eating back a good portion of my activity calories, which if you followed the post that I originally said I was eating 1200, explained ALL that. That being said, I have dealt with headaches when exercising despite hydrating, eating, extra sleep, etc since I was 20 (15 years). I don't have headaches 100% or even 50% of the time and I was just looking to commiserate with others in my situation of the occasional exercise headache.

    How much weight are you losing a week on average with your net calories at 1,200 (eating back exercise calories). I ask because the idea from a complete stranger that you may have mast cell disorder (which you seem okish with someone posing but I could be wrong) seems far more far fetched than the idea that you may potentially be eating too few calories (something that is far more straightforward to fix).

    I have it set to 1 pound per week fairly recently but honestly that extra 40 calories per day when I switched from losing 2lbs is pretty darn trivial.

    I have no idea what mast cell disorder is. I simply found the fact that the body releases histamines during stress like exercise to be rather enlightening. 🤷
  • sdavis484
    sdavis484 Posts: 160 Member
    I don't know if I can handle these boards. Random, unnamed people disagree with me but never actually say why they disagree. I'm a sensitive person and honestly it hurts my feelings, as silly as that is. Surely that's why people click it, I guess.
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    No one is disagreeing with you just to hurt your feelings, they're disagreeing with something you've said. Obviously it's helpful for at least one person to say what it is they're disagreeing with, but it doesn't always happen. Personally, I ignore any random single disagrees.
  • PAV8888
    PAV8888 Posts: 14,238 Member
    I would suspect that disagree was because of 1200 calories and you implying that this means you're eating enough or whoever clicked it interpreting that this was what you meant.

    it's a long-standing argument that 1200 is suitable for some but not for most of the people who try it.

    I hugged you instead.... because headaches suck! 🤗
  • aokoye
    aokoye Posts: 3,495 Member
    sdavis484 wrote: »
    aokoye wrote: »
    sdavis484 wrote: »
    PAV I am decidedly NOT undereating as my calories are set to 1200 but I was eating back a good portion of my activity calories, which if you followed the post that I originally said I was eating 1200, explained ALL that. That being said, I have dealt with headaches when exercising despite hydrating, eating, extra sleep, etc since I was 20 (15 years). I don't have headaches 100% or even 50% of the time and I was just looking to commiserate with others in my situation of the occasional exercise headache.

    How much weight are you losing a week on average with your net calories at 1,200 (eating back exercise calories). I ask because the idea from a complete stranger that you may have mast cell disorder (which you seem okish with someone posing but I could be wrong) seems far more far fetched than the idea that you may potentially be eating too few calories (something that is far more straightforward to fix).

    I have it set to 1 pound per week fairly recently but honestly that extra 40 calories per day when I switched from losing 2lbs is pretty darn trivial.

    I have no idea what mast cell disorder is. I simply found the fact that the body releases histamines during stress like exercise to be rather enlightening. 🤷

    You have it sent to 1lb per week but how much are you actually losing?

    Also the disagree button has nothing to do with liking or disliking a person nor about some desire to hurt people's feelings. If, for instance, someone said "I'm going to consume 700 calories a day" they would get a number of people replying saying how unhealthy that idea is and they would get significantly more people clicking the disagree button. While they probably won't like those multiple replies, they would likely be even more unhappy if all of those people who clicked disagree also replied saying how poor of an idea eating 700 calories a day is.
  • YvetteK2015
    YvetteK2015 Posts: 654 Member
    It also could be something as simple as an exertion headache, despite enough food and despite enough hydration. Those do exist, and they are not uncommon. They are not anything to be worried about, and it just means you have to ease into your exercise a bit slower. Just maybe something to google to see if it fits.
  • sdavis484
    sdavis484 Posts: 160 Member
    edited February 2020
    YvetteK2015 wrote: »
    It also could be something as simple as an exertion headache, despite enough food and despite enough hydration. Those do exist, and they are not uncommon. They are not anything to be worried about, and it just means you have to ease into your exercise a bit slower. Just maybe something to google to see if it fits.

    Thanks, Yvette. This sounds like what my PCP diagnosed it as 15 years ago.. He didn't call it an "exertion headache" per say but did say I was needed to ease into it bc I was starting out too hard. Thanks for your insight!
  • earlnabby
    earlnabby Posts: 8,171 Member
    sdavis484 wrote: »
    aokoye wrote: »
    sdavis484 wrote: »
    PAV I am decidedly NOT undereating as my calories are set to 1200 but I was eating back a good portion of my activity calories, which if you followed the post that I originally said I was eating 1200, explained ALL that. That being said, I have dealt with headaches when exercising despite hydrating, eating, extra sleep, etc since I was 20 (15 years). I don't have headaches 100% or even 50% of the time and I was just looking to commiserate with others in my situation of the occasional exercise headache.

    How much weight are you losing a week on average with your net calories at 1,200 (eating back exercise calories). I ask because the idea from a complete stranger that you may have mast cell disorder (which you seem okish with someone posing but I could be wrong) seems far more far fetched than the idea that you may potentially be eating too few calories (something that is far more straightforward to fix).



    I have no idea what mast cell disorder is. I simply found the fact that the body releases histamines during stress like exercise to be rather enlightening. 🤷

    A mast cell is a tumor that produces histamine.

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