Dexa scan: how to chose provider? (and where in Netherlands?)
yirara
Posts: 9,944 Member
Dexascans don't seem to be a thing in the Netherlands. Well.. I found two providers now, both about 90 minutes traveling away from my home which is not really convenient. But anyway. I might...
The question is: How do I chose a good provider for this? What is important? One provider offers an I-DXA Total Body scan. They call it gold-standard to measure body fat. But then the further description only mentions differentiating between fat, bone and muscle per region of the body. No mention of differentiating between different types of fat. But like so often they might not want to confuse people with complicated things. Who knows... I looked at this also when I was in the US about two years ago, but the provider I looked at said one needs to be free of food for at least 4 hours, and only offered appointments in the afternoon. Not something I could do, especially not when on vacation, hiking and sightseeing. The Dutch providers don't mention this.
Thus any advice?
Note: for me it's finding out what my status quo is before picking up sport again. Basically, having a start 'number' and then another number much later on in the year. Also curious, as people are always surprised I have so much muscle. Yeah, I have. Despite no training for over a year.
The question is: How do I chose a good provider for this? What is important? One provider offers an I-DXA Total Body scan. They call it gold-standard to measure body fat. But then the further description only mentions differentiating between fat, bone and muscle per region of the body. No mention of differentiating between different types of fat. But like so often they might not want to confuse people with complicated things. Who knows... I looked at this also when I was in the US about two years ago, but the provider I looked at said one needs to be free of food for at least 4 hours, and only offered appointments in the afternoon. Not something I could do, especially not when on vacation, hiking and sightseeing. The Dutch providers don't mention this.
Thus any advice?
Note: for me it's finding out what my status quo is before picking up sport again. Basically, having a start 'number' and then another number much later on in the year. Also curious, as people are always surprised I have so much muscle. Yeah, I have. Despite no training for over a year.
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Replies
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Do have bod pod or dunk tank options available? My understanding is these 3 methods are all quite reliable.0
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No method is perfect but the bod pod is one of the leadt reliable methods of measuring BF. Hydrostatic testing (the "dunk tank") and DEXA are the best.
I use hydro and dexa. Hydo gives lower results than dexa but dexa gives you more data than hydro, most importantly a vat reading of your internal organ fat. Use 2 get both every 3 months but now do it just 1x/yr along w/my annual physical and blood tests.
While there is a margin of error in both methods, I prefer and think hydro is more accurate than dexa because it is based on a direct analog measurement of your wt under water while dexa is based on a digital algorithim that estinates your bf based on an xray scan of your body.
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I've had two Dexa scans in the past year, both done at a local university at low cost. It was run by the kinesiology department. I got print outs, a 10 min discussion of results and next steps to consider for body recomp.0
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No method is perfect but the bod pod is one of the leadt reliable methods of measuring BF. Hydrostatic testing (the "dunk tank") and DEXA are the best.
I use hydro and dexa. Hydo gives lower results than dexa but dexa gives you more data than hydro, most importantly a vat reading of your internal organ fat. Use 2 get both every 3 months but now do it just 1x/yr along w/my annual physical and blood tests.
While there is a margin of error in both methods, I prefer and think hydro is more accurate than dexa because it is based on a direct analog measurement of your wt under water while dexa is based on a digital algorithim that estinates your bf based on an xray scan of your body.
None of those exist here. Only dexa with what looks like Less than a handfull of providers. And would any bodypod etc measurement differentiate between underskin and organ fat or how it’s distributed? Do I need this anyway? As a data nerd just a total fat number sounds not that interesting tbo0 -
These things are rarely accurate even just using them to get a 'status quo'. In order to 'relatively' accurate gauge any changes you would have to use the same machine, with the same operator, lie in precisely the same manner, go at the same time of day, after having eaten the same food at the same time on that day, and consumed the same amount of water on that day at the same time.
Even then the accuracy will be dubious.
What exactly are you trying to achieve with this test result? What are your goals and how do you think this test actually aligns with them?1 -
No method is perfect but the bod pod is one of the leadt reliable methods of measuring BF. Hydrostatic testing (the "dunk tank") and DEXA are the best.
I use hydro and dexa. Hydo gives lower results than dexa but dexa gives you more data than hydro, most importantly a vat reading of your internal organ fat. Use 2 get both every 3 months but now do it just 1x/yr along w/my annual physical and blood tests.
While there is a margin of error in both methods, I prefer and think hydro is more accurate than dexa because it is based on a direct analog measurement of your wt under water while dexa is based on a digital algorithim that estinates your bf based on an xray scan of your body.
None of those exist here. Only dexa with what looks like Less than a handfull of providers. And would any bodypod etc measurement differentiate between underskin and organ fat or how it’s distributed? Do I need this anyway? As a data nerd just a total fat number sounds not that interesting tbo
Hydro only measures BF vs muscle, nonfat tissue and bone.
Dexa differentiates between BF, muscle & nonfat issue and bone BY body part. So, if all you want to know is what your overall BF level is, hydro would be all you need to do.
Your % VAT (visceral adipose tissue) which is rhe fat around your organs is an important indicator of your risk for diabetes and other diseases related 2 obesity.
Even if you don't look fat or don't have a high level of overall BF, the higher your VAT is your greater risk for such problems and, if you are going to get a DEXA scan, you will also venefit by that information
The Bodpod uses air displacement to measure BF. Like hydro it can only give you an overall BF% but while more convenient than hydro it is less accurate and reliable tgan hydro.
See: https://weightology.net/the-pitfalls-of-body-fat-measurement-part-3-bod-pod/
However, if you only have access to DEXA where you live, the comparisons are moot. Just find a DEXA site near you and go for it. It provides all of the data that you'd need0 -
If you are trying to change body composition for sporting performance improvement. Results are best measured in actual sporting performance improvements.
A number on a body composition test is irrelevant. Especially when that number can be impacted by so many things in these tests that aren't actually changes in actual body composition.1 -
Have a look at the private medical procedures, my local private hospital offers full MRI for just over the cost of a DEXA scan, far more accurate and lots more information
But as above no real need, other than curiosity0 -
Yes, it is simply curiosity! Wanting to know what the percentage of fat is, and what kind of fat, and how much muscle mass I have. I know it won't be precise, but it's worth a shot, especially as my employer is paying half of those scans. I can't go by sports performance as I have a whole pile of health problems, and chronic clumsiness. I can't even compare performance from one day to another, or might be out of training again due to an injury for a while. Especially with that in mind, which sometimes feels like one step ahead, two back it's nice to have some numbers to work with. My idea is to do the test fasting at the same time of the day by the same company. Not that I have any choice here anyway.0
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Yes, it is simply curiosity! Wanting to know what the percentage of fat is, and what kind of fat, and how much muscle mass I have. I know it won't be precise, but it's worth a shot, especially as my employer is paying half of those scans. I can't go by sports performance as I have a whole pile of health problems, and chronic clumsiness. I can't even compare performance from one day to another, or might be out of training again due to an injury for a while. Especially with that in mind, which sometimes feels like one step ahead, two back it's nice to have some numbers to work with. My idea is to do the test fasting at the same time of the day by the same company. Not that I have any choice here anyway.
DEXA will give you as "precise" a BF measurement as modern technology can provide. The only more precise method requires an autopsy using scientific equipment in a lab.
Don't know who told you that you can't eat before DEXA scan but providers in the US say that what's in your stomach has no effect on a DEXA scan.
Lastly, a single scan w/o testing w/o at least 1 later measurement to gauge whether your fat loss efforts have been sucessful or not.
I use to get a DEXA scan and hydro test quarterly when I was actively attempting to lose fat and build muscle but now only do it annually while maintenance.
You have to decide how often you "should" retest but if you are doing things to actively attempting to lose fat and gain muscle, I'd suggest getting another scan at least every 6 months.
Good luck!
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Thanks. I've decided on a provider now and will get two scans at least. Otherwise it's indeed useless. Well, if the resolution turns out to be good enough it might finally answer the question of why I don't have lower, lower legs but two stacked calves, and that can't all be muscle
One of my teenage year traumas, and a reason why I still don't like shorts and skirts 1 -
Yes, it is simply curiosity! Wanting to know what the percentage of fat is, and what kind of fat, and how much muscle mass I have. I know it won't be precise, but it's worth a shot, especially as my employer is paying half of those scans. I can't go by sports performance as I have a whole pile of health problems, and chronic clumsiness. I can't even compare performance from one day to another, or might be out of training again due to an injury for a while. Especially with that in mind, which sometimes feels like one step ahead, two back it's nice to have some numbers to work with. My idea is to do the test fasting at the same time of the day by the same company. Not that I have any choice here anyway.
DEXA will give you as "precise" a BF measurement as modern technology can provide. The only more precise method requires an autopsy using scientific equipment in a lab.
Don't know who told you that you can't eat before DEXA scan but providers in the US say that what's in your stomach has no effect on a DEXA scan.
Lastly, a single scan w/o testing w/o at least 1 later measurement to gauge whether your fat loss efforts have been sucessful or not.
I use to get a DEXA scan and hydro test quarterly when I was actively attempting to lose fat and build muscle but now only do it annually while maintenance.
You have to decide how often you "should" retest but if you are doing things to actively attempting to lose fat and gain muscle, I'd suggest getting another scan at least every 6 months.
Good luck!
According to last years study, dexa is that inaccurate that the paper questions wether it should be used in any clinical research1 -
Yes, it is simply curiosity! Wanting to know what the percentage of fat is, and what kind of fat, and how much muscle mass I have. I know it won't be precise, but it's worth a shot, especially as my employer is paying half of those scans. I can't go by sports performance as I have a whole pile of health problems, and chronic clumsiness. I can't even compare performance from one day to another, or might be out of training again due to an injury for a while. Especially with that in mind, which sometimes feels like one step ahead, two back it's nice to have some numbers to work with. My idea is to do the test fasting at the same time of the day by the same company. Not that I have any choice here anyway.
DEXA will give you as "precise" a BF measurement as modern technology can provide. The only more precise method requires an autopsy using scientific equipment in a lab.
Don't know who told you that you can't eat before DEXA scan but providers in the US say that what's in your stomach has no effect on a DEXA scan.
Lastly, a single scan w/o testing w/o at least 1 later measurement to gauge whether your fat loss efforts have been sucessful or not.
I use to get a DEXA scan and hydro test quarterly when I was actively attempting to lose fat and build muscle but now only do it annually while maintenance.
You have to decide how often you "should" retest but if you are doing things to actively attempting to lose fat and gain muscle, I'd suggest getting another scan at least every 6 months.
Good luck!
According to last years study, dexa is that inaccurate that the paper questions wether it should be used in any clinical research
If you don't like DEXA or any other BF measurement method, don't use it BUT, if you'd like to put a number on it, ss the OP does, then you really don't have much of a choice.
DEXA, hydro, calipers, or whatever.
Like your bathroom scale, which idn't a scientific instrument, f you use the same BF measurement method under the same conditions over time, it will give you a reasonable idea of how you are progressing and whether the data rendered is precise and/or reliable enough for clinical purposes is ENTIRELY irrelevant.0 -
The question is: How do I chose a good provider for this? What is important? One provider offers an I-DXA Total Body scan. They call it gold-standard to measure body fat. But then the further description only mentions differentiating between fat, bone and muscle per region of the body. No mention of differentiating between different types of fat. But like so often they might not want to confuse people with complicated things. Who knows... I looked at this also when I was in the US about two years ago, but the provider I looked at said one needs to be free of food for at least 4 hours, and only offered appointments in the afternoon. Not something I could do, especially not when on vacation, hiking and sightseeing. The Dutch providers don't mention this.
Dexascan generally measures fat % vs lean mass %. Note that "lean mass" is not the same as "muscle" though, since lean mass is the total of muscle + water weight + bones + organs. It's everything that isn't fat. Dexascan will also measure bone density as a separate measurement (in hospitals it's the main type of scan used these days for measuring bone density for folks who are concerned with that). In addition to the overall measurements you'll see the breakdown of fat vs. lean weight and percentage by area of the body, since they can vary greatly (for example, when I scanned in January my abdomen was 22% bf vs. my hips/thighs which were 37% - across all areas of my body it averaged out to 28% bf overall)
"Type of body fat" scan will generally only look at the abdomen to determine the total mass of VAT which is the specific type of fat associated with metabolic diseases. The lower the number the better, with the ideal being 0 lbs of VAT.
As for choosing a provider, considering you have limited options, I would recommend going with the company that you can access most easily and that seems like they will be around for a while and will store your data for comparison.
I don't think it's actually required to fast before a Dexascan - it will slightly impact your results just like weighing yourself in the afternoon vs first thing in the morning, but it would only be by a couple lbs. Whatever food and water you have in your system will be tracked as lean mass for the purpose of calculating body fat %. I've read that normal amounts of food and water before a scan would likely only impact your reading by a couple percent at most, which is pretty much the margin of error for a scan anyway. It is advised to try to match the scans to each other as much as possible though, similar to how you would weigh yourself at the same time of day across multiple days. So as long as you do all subsequent scans in the afternoon as well you should be able to draw the appropriate comparisons.
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Yikes! I know that impedance thingies are wrong but this is shocking! I just went to a health check at the office and the doc made me hold a bodyfat thingy; just two handgrips and nothing else. Bodyfat: 42% I have a bmi of 23 and have visible muscles!0
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No method is perfect but the bod pod is one of the leadt reliable methods of measuring BF. Hydrostatic testing (the "dunk tank") and DEXA are the best.
I use hydro and dexa. Hydo gives lower results than dexa but dexa gives you more data than hydro, most importantly a vat reading of your internal organ fat. Use 2 get both every 3 months but now do it just 1x/yr along w/my annual physical and blood tests.
While there is a margin of error in both methods, I prefer and think hydro is more accurate than dexa because it is based on a direct analog measurement of your wt under water while dexa is based on a digital algorithim that estinates your bf based on an xray scan of your body.
None of those exist here. Only dexa with what looks like Less than a handfull of providers. And would any bodypod etc measurement differentiate between underskin and organ fat or how it’s distributed? Do I need this anyway? As a data nerd just a total fat number sounds not that interesting tbo
They do exist here, but are not commercially available. I know there is a Dunk Tank at Maastricht University and I think Leiden has one as well1 -
Yes, it is simply curiosity! Wanting to know what the percentage of fat is, and what kind of fat, and how much muscle mass I have. I know it won't be precise, but it's worth a shot, especially as my employer is paying half of those scans. I can't go by sports performance as I have a whole pile of health problems, and chronic clumsiness. I can't even compare performance from one day to another, or might be out of training again due to an injury for a while. Especially with that in mind, which sometimes feels like one step ahead, two back it's nice to have some numbers to work with. My idea is to do the test fasting at the same time of the day by the same company. Not that I have any choice here anyway.
DEXA will give you as "precise" a BF measurement as modern technology can provide. The only more precise method requires an autopsy using scientific equipment in a lab.
Don't know who told you that you can't eat before DEXA scan but providers in the US say that what's in your stomach has no effect on a DEXA scan.
Lastly, a single scan w/o testing w/o at least 1 later measurement to gauge whether your fat loss efforts have been sucessful or not.
I use to get a DEXA scan and hydro test quarterly when I was actively attempting to lose fat and build muscle but now only do it annually while maintenance.
You have to decide how often you "should" retest but if you are doing things to actively attempting to lose fat and gain muscle, I'd suggest getting another scan at least every 6 months.
Good luck!
According to last years study, dexa is that inaccurate that the paper questions wether it should be used in any clinical research
link to article/study?0 -
Lolinloggen wrote: »No method is perfect but the bod pod is one of the leadt reliable methods of measuring BF. Hydrostatic testing (the "dunk tank") and DEXA are the best.
I use hydro and dexa. Hydo gives lower results than dexa but dexa gives you more data than hydro, most importantly a vat reading of your internal organ fat. Use 2 get both every 3 months but now do it just 1x/yr along w/my annual physical and blood tests.
While there is a margin of error in both methods, I prefer and think hydro is more accurate than dexa because it is based on a direct analog measurement of your wt under water while dexa is based on a digital algorithim that estinates your bf based on an xray scan of your body.
None of those exist here. Only dexa with what looks like Less than a handfull of providers. And would any bodypod etc measurement differentiate between underskin and organ fat or how it’s distributed? Do I need this anyway? As a data nerd just a total fat number sounds not that interesting tbo
They do exist here, but are not commercially available. I know there is a Dunk Tank at Maastricht University and I think Leiden has one as well
Yep. Comes down to the same for me as a consumer, though.0 -
In the US, it looks like some say to fast for 4 hours before the DEXA and others don’t care. I traveled 90 minutes one way to have my scan completed. I feel like I am a decently muscular woman. I can crush some pushups. I like to lift a few times a week. I am 5’2” and 145lbs. The DEXA scan doesn’t think I am as muscular as I thought! The scan put me at 41% body fat!!! Yikes. Oh well, it gives me something to make goals with!1
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I had to cancel my test due to Coronavirus. Oh well.. I'll be back.1
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That stinks. I am scheduled to have my next DEXA scan in June. I hope life is back to normal by then.0
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