Confused about Net Cals

DvineLvine
DvineLvine Posts: 12 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
Hi. My motivation is high and I'm exercising plus eating pretty darned well but I haven't been losing weight. I thought maybe I'd experiment with NOT adding in my exercise and nearly fainted the next morning, low blood sugar maybe. If I DO eat the extra calories that show as my net after subtracting the exercise, the approximation (for what it's worth) doesn't reflect much of any weight loss. So I decided I am confused. Say I'm supposed to eat 1200 cals. I burn 500. If I eat 1200, I faint the next morning! If I eat 1700, I don't lose weight. So how do you guys pitch it? Do you try to eat a percentage of the net, like in this example, 1450?

Replies

  • Lietchi
    Lietchi Posts: 6,840 Member
    edited July 2022
    My first question would be: not losing weight over what period? Are you giving it at least one month/menstrual cycle? You might just need to be patient. If the exercise is new, you might be retaining water, masking fat loss on the scale.

    But yes, eating back a percentage of exercise calories is definitely an option. Just make sure to give it enough time to evaluate if it's working 🙂
  • sijomial
    sijomial Posts: 19,809 Member
    Here's what I did....
    Set my goal to achieve a 3,500 weekly deficit (to lose 1lb a week), eating to my net calorie goal.

    Was consistent for 4 weeks but judging from my actual weight trend it appeared my true deficit was more like 2,500/week so I simply reduced my calorie goal accordingly and then lost at desired rate from that point onwards.

    Looking back the apparent discrepancy was partly exercise over-estimates but the majority was more likely sloppy (but consistent) food logging.
    Either or both of those issues could be your problem but as your profile is private can't see how you are logging your food or what you are actually doing to get a 500cal exercise burn.

    It's not really an eat exercise calories yes/no or percentage issue as those calories are just the same as your food intake, BMR, activity setting calories....
    Getting my CI and CO estimates to the point of being reasonable/fit for purpose and using the feedback loop of results over an extended period of time worked well.

    A timeline of your weight loss attempt would help as frequently on here people's decisions are based on very short timescales that may well not match actual fat loss.
  • cmriverside
    cmriverside Posts: 34,416 Member
    You'll hear all kinds of ideas, "Eat all of them. Eat a percentage. I don't eat them."

    Like sijomial said above - it's an experiment and it's based on time and consistency.

    So,
  • spiriteagle99
    spiriteagle99 Posts: 3,743 Member
    One issue also may be your size and age. As an older female, mostly sedentary, my maintenance calories are supposedly not that much (1400). The lowest MFP will give you as a female is 1200 calories to lose weight, since it is hard to get decent nutrition at a lower level. So when I was losing weight it would say 1200 to lose 1 lb. a week, and also 1200 to lose .5 a week. If I was actually only burning 1400 at maintenance, I would have been very frustrated at my incredibly slow weight loss. Fortunately, my actual burn is higher than that plus I exercise a lot, so I was able to eat more than 1200 calories and still lose weight. Now that I am maintaining that weight loss, I can net 1600-1800 calories or more and not gain. But, it is something to keep in mind. If you are smaller or older, your calorie need isn't that high unless you are doing a lot of exercise or burn hotter than the average.
  • cmriverside
    cmriverside Posts: 34,416 Member
    edited July 2022
    DvineLvine wrote: »
    Thank you very much for sharing your weight loss journeys with me. I will follow that link on measuring--that's always good to keep in check. Also will experiment with eating part, all, or none of the net. Consistency is a factor I haven't used yet. I believe MapMyWalk readings to be accurate because they also track my elevation gain which is often several hundred feet on most walks. And you are right to acknowledge my age, activity level, and impatience! I am only two weeks in (3 years off and on, but 2 weeks at this time). So I'll be more methodical and more patient. Age and experience are good for something!

    If you're logging food and exercising you're really doing great anyway, but the way to dial all this in is with consistency.

    I believed the exercise calculation. If you believe your MMW readings then start eating all of them and just tighten up your logging. It's exceptionally easy to log food incorrectly, especially if you don't use a digital food scale and/or if you frequently eat out. Being off by a couple hundred calories is really easy to do for anyone and is enough to halt weight loss if you have set your goals in a certain way. What I finally figured out is if I'm doing this, I'm going to get the most accurate data I'm capable of using.
    • Digital food scale for everything.
    • Logging every bit of food, even doing estimations on things like parties and buffets.
    • Vetting all my food entries that I use so I know they're correct.

    Then - time, patience and not making too many adjustments at one time or I don't know what data is correct. I would focus on correct food logging. That link I posted above will be a lot of help. Start there. Pick a percentage of your exercise calories and stick to that for a couple months. I'd use 100% of them, but then that's what worked for me like I already said. If you pick 50%, stick to that.

    Then, three weeks isn't nearly enough time to establish a data trend, especially for a woman who will have natural hormone cycles.

    Stay the course. Make this an experiment with the best data you can collect.
  • DvineLvine
    DvineLvine Posts: 12 Member
    I love my new digital scale for weighing food. I am really surprised at how much more an ounce of whatever is...I think I undercounted often, which, given that I am shooting for a minimum of 1200 calories, probably contributed to that fainting spell. Plus my walking, weight training and pilates. Don't over do, I know, get lots of rest. I eat anywhere between 1200-1300. (70 yr old female, half sedentary, half jumping up and down). Avid exerciser--when I get a chance. I lost another pound or two.

    What I learned from you all is to think of this as a feedback loop--which of course it is. And that the experiments are mine to control. I like the idea of giving a few months to test each factor, refining as I go. So thank you.

    One other question: what kind of body weight scale do you use and how often? Digital? What brand can you recommend? Or should it go back in the bottom of my linen closet? I'm not much into my weight but now that I am tracking my nutrition and exercise, it seems like a good thing to correlate/chart.
  • sijomial
    sijomial Posts: 19,809 Member
    I weigh daily with a simple digital scale.
    Interestingly when I was losing the majority of my weight I had two digital scales at home and when tested against a calibrated scale it was the £20 one that was perfectly accurate and the £80 that was out by 2lbs.

    Frequency of weighing is the subject on many threads on here!
    There is a phase "if you can't measure it you can't manage it" although rather over-stated does correlate to being a common factor for people maintatining long term at goal weight continue to monitor their weight.
    I weigh daily and have done that for the majority of my adult life - as I don't calorie count anymore it's my weight trend that is the primary feedback loop on how successful my mindful eating is.
    There are mathematical reasons to make frequent weigh ins better for trend analysis but some people get too invested in single readings rather than the trend, which is the really important thing.

    As I expect perfectly normal daily fluctuations they don't phase me at all and of course the reason is mostly perfectly obvious and understood. When it's a weird fluctuation for no apparent reason it's pretty insignificant (what does one day matter?) and easily shrugged off.
  • cmriverside
    cmriverside Posts: 34,416 Member
    Sijomial gives good insights above. He and I are both retired and at our weight maintenance weights and we are both regular exercisers so our experiences may or may not be all that helpful. I just have a $25 digital Taylor scale.

    When I was in Weight-Loss mode I weighed myself every day. Now, in Maintenance, I'm kind of a random weigher...I choose to focus more on regular exercise, food (calories,) and nutrition. My body-weight scale is just one of the ways I "check-in" if I've been over-eating for a period of time. I have pants that let me know, too. :lol:
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 34,225 Member
    edited July 2022
    DvineLvine wrote: »
    (snip)

    One other question: what kind of body weight scale do you use and how often? Digital? What brand can you recommend? Or should it go back in the bottom of my linen closet? I'm not much into my weight but now that I am tracking my nutrition and exercise, it seems like a good thing to correlate/chart.

    I have a relatively inexpensive digital scale. (I don't like the "internet of things" (IOT) much from an overall network security standpoint at this stage of its development, so emphatically wouldn't choose a networked scale, personally.) I don't think it matters what brand, as long it gives you a consistent reading. (I don't care which exact number I weigh, I care about how I feel, look, and where the weight trend is heading over time.) A thing to consider is "false consistency" - some scales will give you the same number if you step on them within a short time span, even if weight has changed.

    I weigh daily, first thing in the morning after bathroom before eating/drinking, in the same consistent state of (un)dress, and note the results. I've done that for years, even when not trying to lose weight (I'm a data geek, not weight obsessive). Every once in a while, I weigh during the day for some reason, such as before and after an outdoor workout in the heat as a check on hydration strategies.

    I used to note my AM weight on graph paper (date on X axis, weight on Y axis). Now, I put it in a weight trending app. I use Libra (for Android), but there's also Happy Scale (for Apple/iOS), Trendweight (requires a free Fitbit account, but you don't need a device), Weightgrapher, and probably others.

    I like having all the data points for trending, but agree that if someone has an unavoidable tendency to feel stressed about fluctuations or negatively obsessed by the numbers, they may be better served by weighing less frequently, or not at all (but using tape measure, fit of clothes, or some other check that helps avoid regain).

    ETA: The body fat estimates that some scales offer are not very accurate. They might be OK for trending, since we can ignore outlier readings, but the exact numeric value wouldn't likely be reliable.
  • rosebarnalice
    rosebarnalice Posts: 3,488 Member
    I eat about half of my exercise calories on average. Sometimes I eat them all, and sometimes I don't eat any of them, but it averages to about half.

    By borrowing a chest-strap style heart monitor, I also have found that MFP overestimates my calorie burn, so I reduce my swim minutes by about 25-30% of the actual time (e.g., if I swim 65 minutes, I enter 45).
  • csplatt
    csplatt Posts: 1,205 Member
    500 calories is a large burn for exercise. is that what you are estimating? after what kind of workout. that may be helpful to discuss.
  • DvineLvine
    DvineLvine Posts: 12 Member
    @ csplatt. I average @ 3.2 mph in my hilly neighborhood and I walk 3-5 miles each day that I can get out (shooting for 20 miles/week). For example, MapMyWalk told me today I walked 4.52 miles @ 18.4 minutes/mile average pace in 84:27 minutes, 10.2K steps, elevation gain 246, calories 424. If I get in my full 5 miles (sometimes 5.5) I log in somewhere between 480-511 calories, depending upon the terrain and actual course. I am not a runner, but this does the trick of clearing my head and giving me a good workout in the fresh air.
  • DvineLvine
    DvineLvine Posts: 12 Member
    Thanks again, everyone!
  • sijomial
    sijomial Posts: 19,809 Member
    FYI - MapMyWalk is giving you a gross calorie estimate and not a net calorie estimate so will be double counting what you would have burned anyway in that time period.

    This walking calculator gives you both options so you can see the difference.
    https://exrx.net/Calculators/WalkRunMETs
  • MichelleMcKeeRN
    MichelleMcKeeRN Posts: 450 Member
    To make it easier for me, I changed my settings to sedentary and maintenance calories. I wear my Fitbit to add in exercise calories. I like this because I can see how many calories it would require to maintain my weight. For example, to maintain my weight I need 1740 calories and I exercised an extra 500 calories… so now I need 2240 calories to maintain my weight. I am trying to lose weight so I just make sure I eat less than 2240 calories. If I am trying to lose 1 pound a week, I eat 500 calories less than my maintenance calories every day. If I am trying to lose 2 pounds a week, I eat 1000 calories less than my maintenance calories every day. 2 pound a week weight loss is pretty uncomfortable for me to sustain and takes a lot of effort.

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